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PAX Prime 2011 Suggestions Thread

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  • ZecroZecro Registered User
    edited September 2010
    Twitter is awesome for this event! The lines twitter was awesome!

    But, there need to be screens with twitter feeds and more updates to them.

    Streaming overflow video would have been awesome.

    Dropped the ball hardcore on the Acquisitions Incorporated panel. Why wasn't it in the main theater? It filled up literally as soon as the line was opened. Maybe WotC should consider shelling out more for this thing, it's not like it hasn't brought in a ton of new players.

    I don't know the extent of the technical issues for Anamanaguchi, but that part kind of sucked--along with them needing to be better showsmen. They shouldn't believe in themselves. They should believe in us who believe in them! (Note: I love Anamanaguchi. Gonna stick their sticker on my laptop.)

    Will there be a PAX DVD? There should be a PAX DVD. At least of all the panels, because it sucked having to miss that one you wanted to go to super-bad.

  • jivejeansjivejeans Registered User
    edited September 2010
    How about a bit of a dress code? I know cosplayers all love other cosplayers, but Im not one and I dont need to see an enormous fat guy without a shirt repeatedly through the weekend. At least a 'shirt requirement' would be appreciated.

  • JdNoaJdNoa Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    One problem my friends and I had was communicating with each other because of the problems with cell phone and wifi connections. (It's bad enough getting charged 50 cents in roaming fees to send "we're in the lineup, want to join us?", but it's just rubbing salt in your wounds when you find out your friend didn't get that message until 4 hours later).

    The idea of twitter screens for disseminating official info sounds great, but maybe we could also have messaging stations for attendee communications - a group of friends could all set up a code word and then search on that to quickly find messages sent within the group, or something like that...

  • Bear.NecessityBear.Necessity Registered User
    edited September 2010
    Had an AWESOME time.

    Seemed more crowded this year (to me) than last year, even with the expanded floor space. I'd suggest a) a bigger venue or b) less tickets sold (heh yeah, right).

    Also like the idea of a cosplay contest.

    Congrats & thanks to the staff of PAX for another great year.

  • SovietMudkipzSovietMudkipz Registered User
    edited September 2010
    To the people objecting to the Benaroya: kindly shut the hell up.

    Why should everyone who waits in line at least an hour for the concerts have to the stand on their feet for five straight hours so a few people can dance and some random guy can just casually walk in? In the years prior to 2010 if you wanted to use the washroom during the concerts, you would have to push past everyone and give up your spot. Some of us are shorter than others, and I would actually like to have a view of the people playing instead of having to watch the equivalent of a youtube video on the monitors, thank you very much. This year you could get up and buy a snack or go pee in between concerts and leave your bag at your seat so you wouldn't lose your spot. It made the whole experience a lot more comfortable.

    And it wasn't that long of a walk.

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  • Bear.NecessityBear.Necessity Registered User
    edited September 2010
    jivejeans wrote: »
    How about a bit of a dress code? I know cosplayers all love other cosplayers, but Im not one and I dont need to see an enormous fat guy without a shirt repeatedly through the weekend. At least a 'shirt requirement' would be appreciated.
    You could try this thing called "not looking". :)

    Also if you go for a "shirt" requirement, you might get push back from people who like to see a) buff guys shirtless and b) hot chicks nearly-shirtless.

  • BuraisuBuraisu Innovator Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Lining people up for that would be hell (and like East :P). Also, they only have what, 3-4 ballrooms?

    Expo hall space is not given away, companies have to pay to show. But Portal 2 could have used some more space (perhaps two demo rooms :3). It's not like they don't have the money :P.
    Well, their are only three theaters on the 6th floor so we would only need 4 ballrooms. Also, I never got the point of lining up for panels. Why not just let people wait in the ballroom in the chairs? Because it wouldn't be fair? I think it's fair, first one in the room gets the best seat for the rest of the day if they really wanna stay in that single room for all the panels in that ballroom. Panels should be open just like the consorts. If we are required to do a head count then do it after everyone takes their seats and anyone standing is kicked out; like musical chairs.

    Never said that it was given away. Though, I do think hot games should be given extra upgrades in expo space for the benefit of PAX goers. It all being based on benefits to us not the company. Maybe even give them extra space based on what happen on Friday for Saturday and Sunday.

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  • Andrew RyanAndrew Ryan Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Benaroya Hall ruined my PAX. Please don't go back.

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  • alegriaalegria Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Buraisu wrote: »
    Lining people up for that would be hell (and like East :P). Also, they only have what, 3-4 ballrooms?

    Expo hall space is not given away, companies have to pay to show. But Portal 2 could have used some more space (perhaps two demo rooms :3). It's not like they don't have the money :P.
    Well, their are only three theaters on the 6th floor so we would only need 4 ballrooms. Also, I never got the point of lining up for panels. Why not just let people wait in the ballroom in the chairs? Because it wouldn't be fair? I think it's fair, first one in the room gets the best seat for the rest of the day if they really wanna stay in that single room for all the panels in that ballroom. Panels should be open just like the consorts. If we are required to do a head count then do it after everyone takes their seats and anyone standing is kicked out; like musical chairs.

    There are a multitude of reasons for clearing out the theater space in between panels, including cleanup (yes, even PAX goers leave garbage), rescue of lost/left-behind items, resetting of the panel table, resetting the room if the requirements change, testing of the tech required for the next panel, giving the Enforcers a short break, and so on. There's probably fire code and other reasons that I don't know about, as well as being able to measure demand for a given panel/show so as to continue to improve PAX offerings in the future. Letting people sit in one seat all day means artificially inflated numbers for the panels that happen before a majorly popular one, which will not help anyone with improving scheduling or capacity for the next PAX.

    And not every panel NEEDS a 1200 person capacity, or would prefer to have a "more intimate" setting of just 300. The variety improves the experience for everyone. :)

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  • PlaneGuyPlaneGuy Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Great con overall. BUT this is the suggestions thread, so....

    I like the idea if a 24h board games room/area. I really do NOT like the rooms in the expo hall. It's hard to do a pickup game with new people because it's harder to find a ramdom lfg in the crowded chaos of the escalators or jumping room-to-room. In a single room, or larger combined library/lfg room it'd be easier to get a pickup games going. My boardgaming this year was always arranged over txt with my friends I had come over with - I met no new people doing board games. I did leave my number on the whiteboard in TTHQ, but who the hell's gonna txt a stranger long-distance, really.

    As a Canadian I had no data plan roaming, so could not check twitter for #ttlfg or pax_lines or any of that without trekking back to the hotel or hitting pc freeplay. Of course once you get to pc freeplay, you instinctively open cs:source and there goes checking twitter. I dunno what's a good solution to this, to be honest. I know we're the internet generation, but the reliance on internet for a lot pf PAX services and information gets tossed out the window if the network isn't available. The twitter screens seem like a decent alternative, but i dunno if it'd help for searching hashtags (not a twitter expert)

  • kiiilekiiile Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Benaroya was amazing. The Paramount would be even better. Please don't move the concerts back into the convention center: the acoustics were always terrible.

    The wifi in years past was always a bit sketchy but it was far and away better than this year's situation. Please look into setting that up again or working with the wireless carriers to set up antenna trucks around the convention center.

    Twitter monitors would be great. Twitter line updates from all key events (if not all panels entirely) would be great.

    I felt like it wasn't as crowded in the hallways as years before, the lines for events were waaaaay worse.

    Ways to manage line issues.

    1) Keep key events schedule opposite one another. Forcing attendees to choose one or the other will cut lines at both (but piss people off).
    2) Create some sort of system (maybe paid tickets?) for guaranteed seating for key events. This will allow people more flexibility in their scheduling time and not make people line up two hours early for a two hour event (but this will piss people off even more).
    3) Cut down on the number of attendees.
    4) Create and advertise devoted telecast rooms. Maybe ballrooms at the Sheraton could just be Key Event overflow...

  • MaxNVMaxNV Registered User
    edited September 2010
    A (probably horrible, not thought out) idea for addressing the Expo Hall line situation. Do you guys know the system they have at Disneyland where for rides you can either wait in line or just grab a ticket and come back at the indicated time and jump the line. I know the organizers have little say in how exhibitors run their booths but what if there we're some incentives (cheaper rent, better location) given to booths that agreed to do something like this. For example, imagine if the Portal 2 booth had done something like this.

    People can still line-up and slowly move through the line. Or people could grab a ticket for admission to the demo at 3:15, so just sow up at 3:10 and you get in. You could have each demo consists of 50/50 between people in line and people with tickets. And if their are some ticket no-shows you can just fill their spots with people from the line.

  • The_ReflectionThe_Reflection Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Ditch the Benaroya for Concerts. This can not be stressed enough.

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  • HeleorHeleor SeattleRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    To the people objecting to the Benaroya: kindly shut the hell up.

    There were advantages to the Benaroya, nobody's saying there weren't. There were many disadvantages too, which is what a lot of us are stressing.

    I repeat, I had a seat right next to the stage, in the first floor VIP balcony. I could not understand a word JoCo was singing if I didn't already know the song. I literally did not hear a single word Frontalot was singing. It may be an acoustic thing, it may be the audio was misconfigured, but that was a definite issue.

  • FellinaFellina Registered User
    edited September 2010
    1) Benaroya ~ A little far; sound needs work.

    Long version: Walk was not bad for the able-bodied, but I can definitely see how med badge people would have trouble. While the overall sound seemed ok, I also could -not- understand most lyrics. Like MC Frontalot seemed to have a pretty tough show because he's all about the word play, but it was completely lost on most of the crowd because they couldn't understand him at all. I never had a problem understanding him in the old crappy sounding expo hall.

    2) Pegasus Lines ~ sucked.

    Long version: About 75 people got shafted from the Acquisitions panel even though we waited in line for nearly two hours. The enforcers were very apologetic for the miscount, and offered priority seating for Kurtz or Wheaton panels... but those conflicted with the concerts. /sadface.

    3) Theater Seating ~ too close together.

    Long version: The seats in some of the theaters are way too close together (especially Pegasus). If the panel is full then you can expect to share not only some sweet cuddle time, but also stinky sweat with your neighbors. I understand that it's that way to let more people in, but seriously. The majority of people at PAX do not have 16" rears.

    5) Tabletop ~ Beginner rooms and looking for group rooms.

    Long version: For all I know these already existed, but I sure couldn't find them.

  • MerciMerci Registered User
    edited September 2010
    I hope my idea already exists and I'm just naive or someone has suggested this already, because its simple and very powerful.

    Links page. On the webs. For each of the panels. Nothing special. But just a place for the speakers to post links for things they talked about or afterthoughts. A search box on the main PAX site or even on these forums, type something along the lines of "paxprime2010_fri01"

    This would of course redirect to their specific page of more links.

    I only had the time to attend the child's play panel and the indie games showcase panel (both on sunday). During the duration of the event there was a constant plea from the speakers, "go to this link when your done here," "check out this website for more info," "you can download this ," ect. I think it would be cool to give the panelist and the audience the medium for direct interaction. This could also be used to add replay value to the PAX programs (as they would have the search codes for the specific panels). You could also give us the chance to do pre-panel studying via those same codes while we wait in the line.

    On mass transit...

    An online guide on how to best utilize the mass transit system and perhaps a (community driven?) listing of local attractions. I know many people did not have three-day passes so an open-to-all meeting area where we could go and tag on to a group of people leaving on adventures would be nice.

    On Benaroya...

    Maybe I got lucky, but I never had any acoustic issues. And maybe I'm a fitness nazi, but the walk was refreshing- Seattle is a nice place and it felt good to get out of the expo hall for a little bit. I was worried about it raining though, which would have been a deal breaker.

    On free shampoo...

    I think the free samples of personal cleaning product are tasteless, but 100% necessary - if for nothing other then a simple and subtle reminder. The expo hall stink is the worst part of PAX.

  • LoneGunmanLoneGunman Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    1: Cosplay Contest:
    DrBalls wrote: »
    There really should be a Cosplay contest or something of the sort. I'm not a cosplayer but I do appreciate the time and effort people put into their costumes and I never get to see them all.

    Don't know if anyone hear-here'd this but I had to hear-here it...

    I too am not a cosplayer but there were some great costumes out there. There definitely needs to be some sort of running contest that culminates in the top X (5? 10?) costumes duking it out on stage in front of a panel of guest judges. You can put something like 5-10 tokens in everyone's swag bag and let them dole it out. Or if you have people register for the contest maybe you can use Twitter like you did for the lines and have people vote by posting ID numbers or something...thoughts?

    2: Cell Signal
    Of course, this assumes you'll get the WSCC/AT&T/Verizon to fix the availability of cell signal in the expo hall and around the conference center. If it wasn't low signal, it was plenty of signal and an overloaded network. Honestly, the WSCC should fix that since I'm sure every conference has this problem (it's a problem at the GDC in SF every year too). If they decide to be assholes, then get AT&T and Verizon to do it in exchange for some sponsorship spots or something. They can roll mobile/temp cell tower hubs to help with both issues.

    3) I know this might be unrealistic but what about extending PAX by a day or two while keeping the expo open over the same Fri-Sat-Sun period? The GDC has its expo open for three days as well but there's a Tutorials and Summits period for two days before that. That way, assuming peeps are willing, you could have some of the panels and sessions run then (to spread them out and allow room for others if needed), still have the expo as it is (since I know a lot of vendors/exhibitors won't want to give up their employees for longer than they already are), and some other areas could be available (like tabletop freeplay and maybe others if sponsors like Intel are willing). That allows you to "expand" the expo without having to really try to find too many more venues.

    Oh, and yeah, Benaroya: nice place but it's definitely out of the way.

    And I have no solution for the lines...at GDC I've only ever had to wait at maybe two lines (one was the keynote but that was in a ridiculously huge room, the other was an ad hoc line that formed for no apparent reason). Then again, outside of adding a buffer between talks (like 30 minutes) and letting people stream in rather than line up (after all, some of us at least are lining up because we know there's going to be a line and...uh...we're lining up so we don't have to worry about others lining up...wait...this is an infinite loop). You'd just have Enforcers do a little crowd control and just get the word out: you cannot mill around an entrance if it blocks a path.

  • marusaiamarusaia Registered User
    edited September 2010
    A few more things I'd like to add and second based on what others have been saying:

    1) Arranging key panels opposite each other without overlapping is a fundamentally brilliant idea, and ought to be continued and expanded upon. My friend who I went with this year was very pleased to find that the Keynote, Gabe and Tycho's Q&A, and the Rooster Teeth panel were all held back to back to back, in a very neat row. This was a great thing to have, and in my opinion should continue and be expanded to other things. Obviously scheduling conflicts are going to crop up somewhere, but for the really big ticket, top billing panels (eyes on Will Wheaton and Acquisitions Inc.) you want to have them not conflicting with anything else, and in the biggest space humanly possible.

    2) Personally, I thought that holding the largest panels at Benaroya Hall was a brilliant idea, and fail to see what was wrong with it. Then again, I did not go there for any of the concerts. I can understand that a lot of people miss being able to stand, bang their heads, and mosh pit it up to their music of choice, but short of booking Seahawk Stadium for our concerts, I don't think that can feasibly happen, unless you really want to move the concerts back to the Expo Hall. A lot of people have complained about the acoustics, but I can't see how there could be anything wrong with the acoustics at Benaroya Hall, since the Seattle Symphony Orchestra (among many others) performs in it. I personally suspect that in a lot of cases, the accompanying music just drowns out the lyrics. In my opinion, the acoustics in the expo hall were not very good at all. @Fellina: you must have way better ears than I do, because I've been to MC Front's concerts for years past (not this year though), and I always had trouble making out what he was singing (then again, since I didn't go this year, it's possible that I would have found it even worse). That said, I think a good alternative to Benaroya Hall might be the Paramount Theater, as was suggested upthread. I'm not sure how it would shake out in comparison as far as maximum seating capacity goes, but it would certainly have good acoustics, and it would have the definite advantage of being less than two blocks from the convention center. So it is something worth considering, even though I personally see nothing wrong with the Benaroya.

    3) Assuming the return of the 24 hour dedicated tabletop room is not taken up (or even if it is), a good idea would be to have an L4G whiteboard in some central location, or possibly a couple spread out throughout the convention center. And in the event that we don't get a 24 hour tabletop room (preferably someplace big and quiet), a good thing to do would be to have more tables. Lots of them.

    4) Having some kind of cosplay contest, like DrBalls and LoneGunman suggested, sounds brilliant. I would be for this on all kinds of levels, both because I am a cosplayer and because I enjoy seeing cosplay at PAX, and would like to reward it.

    5) Also, something I remembered from years past: what happened to that contest where you got a bunch of buttons on your lanyard and you could wager them in games, and get some kind of prize out of it if you won enough of them? I don't know when that was discontinued, but it seemed really cool, and I'd like to see it make a comeback.

    That's my additional 2cp for right now. Cheers, and hats off to the Enforcers, the staff, Khoo, Kiku, and Gabe and Tycho for giving us an awesome convention.

  • SpawnOfCthulhuSpawnOfCthulhu Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I thought the whole Benaroya venue change worked really well, actually.
    I don't think it's a good venue for concerts, though, but it worked pretty well for panels/keynote/q&a.

    I do think that the concerts need to be in a place with more seats, or at least some standing room.
    I was pretty sad that some friends of mine didn't get to go to the concerts that they were really looking forward to, because the entire theater was full.

    Also, anything with Wil Wheaton, Scott Kurtz, or other "big names" needs to be in the main theater.
    I was lucky enough to get into the Acquisitions Inc. panel, but the seats were pretty meh, and i felt bad for the people getting turned away.
    I was kind of upset about the whole line system for that.
    I was with some other people, and we went straight from the make a strip to the pegasus theater (arrived at about 12:30).
    The enforcers politely let us know that they wouldn't begin lining people up until 1pm, due to fire hazard issues.
    So, we waited down in the Sheraton lobby for something like 15 minutes, and we got to the Pegasus at like 12:59, only to realize that they had been letting people in line for like 5 minutes, and we got shafted and got pretty shitty seats.

    If you say "we aren't lining up until 1", please don't let people line up earlier than that.

    Also, what happened to the "no boothbabes" policy?
    I saw a few wandering around, and I even saw some
    *shudder*
    Gamecrush babes walking around.


    Other than that though, for the most part, everything went smoothly.

    Wx8ay.png
  • FellinaFellina Registered User
    edited September 2010
    Also, what happened to the "no boothbabes" policy?
    I saw a few wandering around, and I even saw some
    *shudder*
    Gamecrush babes walking around.

    This.

    I did think it was classy of the Frag Dolls hosting the Just Dance 2 booth not to laugh in the faces of the Gamecrush girls in hot pants who showed up to dance awkwardly on their stage.

  • ElmoFuntzElmoFuntz Portland, ORRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Need more maps of the area posted up preferably a couple in each major section with a you are here sticker. I cannot tell you how often I got lost looking for specific booths and honestly not even sure if I saw everything. I did not even find the hidden level until the last day.

    Benaroya kinda a pain not sure what else to suggest though

    Really like the idea's posted about a live twitter stream going on some big screens randomly around the area. Also really like the idea of broadcasting the live stream of the main theater/concerts in the lounge areas. This may help keep people who can't attend for various reasons (panels directly before concernts, out of room, etc) happy.

    Hated the long lines for things like portal 2 and duke nukem in their super secret enclosed spaces. Really? I mean why allow this other than to endorse a have and have not's attitude. I can understand some companies not wanting filming of their product (good luck on that with cell phones, mini cam's, etc btw) so allow or encourage them to use some type of curtains or art deco structure to discourage it. Disney had a good example of that. Doing what Duke and Portal did just made it hard to enjoy the rest of the show. Yes there were several other really long lines (Fable 3, and Gears 3 for example) but at least I got to see those and have my curiosity sated without playing them.

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  • alegriaalegria Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Personally, I feel that the Paramount would be a horrid venue to use, because they likely have the same policy as Benaroya with regards to gathering in the aisle, and the seats are SUPER cramped. Like can't stand in front of your own seat sort of cramped, it's ridiculous, and it's why I've only been to that theater twice.

    The Moore Theater would likely be a great choice, but it's slightly further than Benaroya and would have no way to do lineups. I've gone to several alternative and folk rock concerts there (as well as w00tstock) and it's been fabulous, but I'm not sure what the max capacity is.

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  • faitsfaits a panda eating cake seattleRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Lynx_ wrote: »
    Get the Paramount. AT ALL COSTS. Although it sounds like they're a pain to negotiate with for an event like this, it would eliminate nearly all of the criticisms being levelled towards Benaroya. It really would be silly if they wouldn't bend their ticket sales/revenue policies at all in order to work with PAX.

    This. SO MUCH THIS. I know Khoo said that there is a problem with them wanting a cut of the gate and how do you figure that out for an event like this, but seriously, figure it out. It's bigger and it's closer to the convention center.

    If the only way to figure it out is to sell two types of passes (show floor+panels passes and show floor+panels+main theater passes) and to give the paramount a cut of the latter, then do it. In fact, it would probably be a good idea to do that anyway.

    You could probably get away with charging more for passes that guarantee access to the main theater events (especially concerts) without waiting in ridiculous lines. And this way you don't potentially have five or ten thousand people who wanted to (and expected to) get into an event that seats two thousand people.

    faits.png
  • DaveRHDaveRH Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Comments from a long time (5 years) PAX Attendee.

    Overall it makes me sad that PAX is growing beyond it's roots. Every year the booth babes get a bit trashier. Last year only got bumped by media once, this year happened at least a dozen times. PAX is sorta gaining a life of it's own, not really much can be done about that.

    Anywho, my suggestions:

    1. Concert Hall, this year = fail. For starters, let's call a spade a spade, it was moved off site so more expo hall space could be sold. (I say this as someone who's primary reason for pax is the expo hall, I don't really care much about the concerts, though some in my group do). Last year, pretty much any main theater event had room., you could walk in an out. Not so this year, also things were handled poorly this year (no counting of people leaving etc.) but I believe everyone is aware of that. A better solution needs to be found, perhaps redouble the efforts in getting that closer bigger theater who are difficult to deal with, I believe Khoo has the business acumen to make it happen!

    2. PAX needs to be four days. It has to happen, tickets are selling out earlier and earlier each year... the demand is there. The people running the booths will hate it, the marketing department will love it. However, PAX Prime is ready to go four days, and in another year or two it will likely get to the point where it has to go to four days.

    3. Help, along with the above suggestion, I think PAX Prime is growing beyond the point where volunteer help along with existing convention staff is enough. Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting the Enforcers are not needed, they are (99% of the time) absolutely awesome, but I've seen tons of these guys run absolutely ragged, addition of a fourth day will likely kill some of them.... I think it might be time to look at getting some additional paid help that you (PA) have control over (to avoid situations like the horrible 'white shirts' at this year's PAX). I have no idea of your financials, but surely you guys are making enough money on PAX to support this?

    4. A couple booths had a really good idea that I like, and I think helps preserve the "For the gamers, not media" environment of PAX: They had one or two media reserved stations in their booth that were specifically for media, in addition to all the other stations. You could line up for them but you were made aware that you might get bumped. I think this should become an official policy of PAX in terms of how media should be dealt with, cause it's getting worse each year, and I'd like to see PAX remain a convention for gamers not the media.

  • MaxNVMaxNV Registered User
    edited September 2010
    faits wrote: »
    This. SO MUCH THIS. I know Khoo said that there is a problem with them wanting a cut of the gate and how do you figure that out for an event like this, but seriously, figure it out. It's bigger and it's closer to the convention center.

    If the only way to figure it out is to sell two types of passes (show floor+panels passes and show floor+panels+main theater passes) and to give the paramount a cut of the latter, then do it. In fact, it would probably be a good idea to do that anyway.

    You could probably get away with charging more for passes that guarantee access to the main theater events (especially concerts) without waiting in ridiculous lines. And this way you don't potentially have five or ten thousand people who wanted to (and expected to) get into an event that seats two thousand people.

    I had an idea that if you used the Paramount you could charge a "concert levy" on passes. Maybe $5 on single days and $10 on three days. I know there may be some negative reaction to raising ticket prices but honestly, as it is PAX is a tremendous bargain and I don't think an extra 5 or 10 dollars would be too outrageous.

    Edit: Also while the topic of going to four days is being discussed one thing I'd suggest is to add the Monday but make Sunday sorta a half day. Maybe have the Expo Hall go from 1-6, that way people could get a morning to sleep in and recover from two busy days. But anyways at the very earliest this wouldn't come into play until at least PAX East 2012. So we got lots of time before we have to worry about that.

  • BuraisuBuraisu Innovator Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    alegria wrote: »
    There are a multitude of reasons for clearing out the theater space in between panels, including cleanup (yes, even PAX goers leave garbage), rescue of lost/left-behind items, resetting of the panel table, resetting the room if the requirements change, testing of the tech required for the next panel, giving the Enforcers a short break, and so on. There's probably fire code and other reasons that I don't know about, as well as being able to measure demand for a given panel/show so as to continue to improve PAX offerings in the future. Letting people sit in one seat all day means artificially inflated numbers for the panels that happen before a majorly popular one, which will not help anyone with improving scheduling or capacity for the next PAX.

    And not every panel NEEDS a 1200 person capacity, or would prefer to have a "more intimate" setting of just 300. The variety improves the experience for everyone. :)
    Clean up empty seats, full seats don't need to be cleaned. If you left something behind, I am sure it will turn up in the Lost and Found the same way as if they had a line. You can reset the panel table in front of us, we don't care. You can change the room around us, we don't care. Enforcers do more work organizing a line then they do watching people sit in chairs and we wouldn't need an "area" for lines if we had no lines. The Q room is a waste of space. If done right, their is no need for lines.

    Fire code, I am sure the building will burst into flames and that one extra person in the room will make it impossible for the rest to exit safely. Logically, fire code should be done by guessing not one by one counting; what a waste of time unless you have a fire marshal breathing down your neck. Also, does the fire code even take in size and height of people? I am sure it just gives you a well rounded flawed number. Of course, you can also guess lower then the number just to be safe. Not only that, like I said you could just play musical chairs and anyone not in a seat gets kicked out.

    How good a panel is shouldn't be measured by how many people find the title of the panel interesting and end up going to it, that is a flawed system. If you wanna improve PAX, ask people if they liked the panel.. don't count heads. Number of people have no true measurement in if the panel should be at PAX or not.

    Universal Username: Naivedo
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  • shugaraeshugarae Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    eye-shuh wrote: »
    Understand that this is not said in an angry voice, just a curious one: What happened to the whole no booth babes thing? If anything, there was the same amount of them this year as there was last year. Are the rules for that just not enforced at all? Again, don't care too much, just curious about it.

    I'm also curious about this.
    ______

    On Benaroya -- I didn't mind it too much, but I can see why it would be a hassle for many people. The ustream channel should have been better advertised. It would have saved me quite a bit of time and heartache on Saturday night if I'd known about it D:
    ______

    Cell/3G service -- I have verizon and didn't run into any problems, other than my phone battery dying each night from being used so much XD (more of a comment than a suggestion, since PA is unlikely to influence the cell companies)
    ______

    Bring back the World Maps! I kept losing my programs, so I was sooo lost all weekend D:
    ______

    Anything involving Wil Wheaton needs to be in the main hall.
    ______

    As others have said, lines at Pegasus sucked big time. Before some panels (Wil Wheaton, Scott Kurtz), we were actually forming lines for the lines because we weren't officially allowed to line up yet. If the line up area is cleared out as soon as one even is underway, we should be able to start the line for the next event.

    Overall, PAX was amazing again :D The exhibit hall was massive and fantastic, and the panels were interesting and entertaining. Good show! w00t!

    Omeganaut class of '08. Fuck Peggle.
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  • ManoaManoa Registered User
    edited September 2010
    Another suggestion comes to mind...

    Please, please, please get better proofreaders for the program next year. @Official_PAX announced several serious errors in the program (the dates for PAX Prime 2011 and the closing time for the Expo hall on Friday). In addition, there was an unannounced error with the "Game Mechanics and Mechanism Design" panel. The web page and program's events grid showed this panel's time correctly as Saturday at 7:30pm-8:30pm in Unicorn; however, the panel descriptions area of the program indicated that this panel was Sunday at 10:30am in Unicorn. Rather frustrating if you're relying on the info in the panel descriptions section and discover Sunday morning that the panel had already occured.

    I know we're all only human (including proofreaders), but that's quite a few significant errors in this year's program... D:


    Also, another vote for scheduling anything involving Wil Wheaton in the Main Theater.

  • tr0tskytr0tsky Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Buraisu wrote: »
    You can reset the panel table in front of us, we don't care. You can change the room around us, we don't care.

    You may not care, but the people doing the panel might, especially when they are revealing something for the first time or showing footage. They don't want people to be watching it while we set up the sound levels, etc. The rest of the stuff Alegria mentioned is also spot on.

    tr0tsky is correct.
  • SumiSumi Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Please have a bit of guidelines when it comes to cosplay. I don't care that you're not a booth babe, I still don't want to see your TnA. Underwear is not appropriate to be wearing in a public venue.

    (this wasn't a massive issue or anything, but it happend enough to make me uncomfortable.)

    Standard Action, it's a webseries.
  • trickycooljtrickycoolj Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Sumi wrote: »
    Please have a bit of guidelines when it comes to cosplay. I don't care that you're not a booth babe, I still don't want to see your TnA. Underwear is not appropriate to be wearing in a public venue.

    (this wasn't a massive issue or anything, but it happend enough to make me uncomfortable.)

    This came up in post-PAX dinner conversation in my group last night. PAX is an all ages event and some of the things we saw with cosplay were worthy of a strip club. There are quite a few children around, whether they be full attendees or tagging along with an exhibitor parent. The guys in my group admitted they didn't mind the view but that it was too much for the kids (under 13) we saw around.

    We joked there should be an Enforcer at the door turning away people in their skivvies (totally unrealistic). But maybe a reminder that it is all ages on the back of the badges?

  • meloncolliemeloncollie Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    PAX was great, but I'm echoing the sentiment of others on this thread that the expo is getting to be too large for its own good. Extending it a day or two would definitely be desirable!

    My suggestion is actually for BYOC: Apparently, the tourney pairings were not randomized, it was simply paired in the order of sign ups, forcing people who knew each other to play against each other. I really wish they'd at least cut the names out and picked out the pairings from a hat, or something.

    And, I was pretty disappointed to see the number of booth babes that I did. I was so happy when I saw the poll results, too. What happened there?

    Also, it might be heresy to break "canon," but I'd love it if the PAX t-shirts' design changed significantly every year. I think it'd give people more cause to buy them every year, especially for those (like myself) who continuously go every year. Not that the PAX logo is horrible, but you know, sprucing up the design of the tshirt to make it really special every year would be awesome.

    Finally, I have to agree about the freeplay Tabletop area. Needs moar tables!

    Love the Enforcers though!! Mostly can only speak for the BYOC ones, since I saw them the most, but thanks for all your hard work, nonetheless! <3

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  • marusaiamarusaia Registered User
    edited September 2010
    This came up in post-PAX dinner conversation in my group last night. PAX is an all ages event and some of the things we saw with cosplay were worthy of a strip club. There are quite a few children around, whether they be full attendees or tagging along with an exhibitor parent. The guys in my group admitted they didn't mind the view but that it was too much for the kids (under 13) we saw around.

    We joked there should be an Enforcer at the door turning away people in their skivvies (totally unrealistic). But maybe a reminder that it is all ages on the back of the badges?
    I see where you are coming from with this, but I disagree with it somewhat for the following reason. Sakuracon, which I have been going to since 2005, has increasingly billed itself as a "family friendly" convention, and the crowds in recent years have had large numbers of squealing adolescents under the age of 18. I'm not sure in retrospect if the convention always attracted such a young crowd and I just didn't notice it because I was younger then myself, but lately it seems that Sakuracon has had a large contingent of tweeny and teeny people, and the result in my own opinion hasn't been pretty. One of the results has been long and tortuous arguments over what level of "decency" should be enforced in cosplay, and to make matters worse the Enforcers at Sakuracon do not enforce those regulations evenly; some follow it to the letter, some let things slide, and some go out of their way to slam people for breaking it even when they approach the line but do not cross it. Granted our own Enforcers would probably do a much better job, but indecency is to a large extent in the eye of the beholder. I think it was Byron White who once observed that he could not describe obscenity in words, but knew it when he saw it. That is exactly the problem. Most of us can recognize obscenity and indecency when we see it, but not everyone has the same standards, and when we get to the point of trying to come up with a list of what can and cannot be worn, well, it just starts to become as ridiculous as high school dress codes.

    If it has come to the point that we cannot depend on good sense, then perhaps we should do away with Cosplay all together. That said, I do not want to do that at all. I enjoy cosplay myself, and dress up for conventions from time to time. If regulations must be issued, let them be as clear and plain as possible, such as "If we can see your crack, your tits, or your dick, then you can't get in." That should suffice. Anything more would be an exercise in ridiculousness.

    I am sorry. This is a touchy issue, I know. For my own part, I was offended by the idea of a rep from a strip club passing out advert cards, and I understand that there is a line in cosplay that should not be crossed in most if not all cases. However, in the case of Sakuracon at least, this movement seemed to go hand in hand with a decline of the convention as a whole, as it went from being a place to do and see a lot of interesting stuff towards being increasingly tame and boring. It is a conflicting impulse in my own self. Those under the age of 18 are people too, and are no less worthy of our attention and consideration than those over 18. I am offended at someone passing out adverts for strip clubs, and at what seems to be the increasing level of crudity in those younger than myself (makes me wonder if people my age were actually any better when we were that age). At the same time, I like conventions to be a little freewheeling, and tend to have a similar standard for such things as mildly questionable cosplay as Mark Twain had for swearing. Twain said that there should be a room in a man's house where he could swear, drink, and smoke with impunity; I enjoy there being a convention where, for a few days a year, I can let myself loose, act a little crazy, play a ton of cool games, and occasionally discreetly gawk at attractive cosplayers. Obviously there is a difference here; the room in Twain's house was much more private than a convention ever could be. I guess that's the curse of bigness.

  • Cultural Geek GirlCultural Geek Girl Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I'm going to have to reiterate the "If you have a set lineup time, please adhere to that lineup time" suggestion. I'd also like to see hard and firm "line start times" posted in the program for all to see, and use in their plans.

    The Aquisitions Incorporated panel was the reason I came to PAX-prime this year. Literally. I was sitting at home looking at my bank account and considering skipping the whole thing when I read about that panel and decided I HAD to come. I would have skipped the Make A Strip panel and lined up for four hours in advance if it had been allowed. I was somewhat glad that this wasn't allowed and thus I was able to go to the make a strip panel, but then when I checked back in and they said the line wasn't starting until 1pm I believed them and went back to my room. At 12:55 I made another pass and found that more than 2/3 of the capacity of the theater had already been filled. I'm very short and have back problems, so this resulted in a lot of neck craning and soreness for me, and very little "getting to see what was actually going on." If I'd been told "we'll open the line a little before 1 so keep checking back," I would have just kept making continuous circuits of the lobby and the line until it opened... by obeying the rules I got a worse result than those who broke them.

    That panel was still the best thing at PAX, but it would have been even better if there had been accurate information about when the line was opening.

    Buttoneer, Brigadeer, and Keeper of the Book of Wil Wheaton.
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  • faitsfaits a panda eating cake seattleRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Regarding tabletop freeplay. I had expected it to be in the (expansive) annex and was surprised to find it still in the (cramped, compartmentalized) second and third floors of the main hall again. Regardless of where it is in the future though, I think it might be a good idea to expand the space and the size of the lending library.

    Saturday night the lending library had so many games out (apparently two hundred?) that they wouldn't lend any more. Granted the pickings were a little slim at that point, but for the tabletop freeplay of all things to be AT CAPACITY was a little crazy. (Maybe it had something to do with the inability of people to get into the concerts? I know my friends and I would have been at the concerts by that point if it had actually been possible.)

    At any rate: love that tabletop freeplay appears to be getting more popular. Hope for more space and more games in the future. Also, it would be awesome if something was done to help facilitate the whole situation of finding larger groups to play with. The projector in the lending library was great, but didn't get set up until the second (?) day, and even then requires people even being able to twitter in the first place.

    faits.png
  • SumiSumi Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Sumi wrote: »
    Please have a bit of guidelines when it comes to cosplay. I don't care that you're not a booth babe, I still don't want to see your TnA. Underwear is not appropriate to be wearing in a public venue.

    (this wasn't a massive issue or anything, but it happend enough to make me uncomfortable.)

    I want to retract my statement.

    Wearing underwear is VERY appropriate in a public venue.... as long as it's under your clothing.

    Standard Action, it's a webseries.
  • kiiilekiiile Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Sumi wrote: »
    Please have a bit of guidelines when it comes to cosplay. I don't care that you're not a booth babe, I still don't want to see your TnA. Underwear is not appropriate to be wearing in a public venue.

    (this wasn't a massive issue or anything, but it happend enough to make me uncomfortable.)

    This came up in post-PAX dinner conversation in my group last night. PAX is an all ages event and some of the things we saw with cosplay were worthy of a strip club. There are quite a few children around, whether they be full attendees or tagging along with an exhibitor parent. The guys in my group admitted they didn't mind the view but that it was too much for the kids (under 13) we saw around.

    We joked there should be an Enforcer at the door turning away people in their skivvies (totally unrealistic). But maybe a reminder that it is all ages on the back of the badges?

    If you can wear it on a beach, you can wear it downtown or in PAX. People have bodies and while I don't want to see the giant dude in the medium t-shirt and you don't want to see the girl with the butt floss both of us will just have to suck it up and respect our fellow attendee's right to wear what they want.

  • aragorn18aragorn18 Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    To the people wanting the live stream from the concerts be better promoted, as I understand it they can't be. What I heard is that part of PAX's deal with Benaroya was to not do any broadcasts or streams of live events from the concert hall. This is almost certainly a music licensing issue, but that's just my guess. So, the streaming that they did do was all under the table and can't be better promoted.

    I would have liked to have seen the handing out of concert wristbands be done in a more transparent manner. The queue room was mighty confusing this year. Instead of a single, long, snaking line there were dozens of individual queues that were filled in a haphazard manner. I'm not sure that people who showed up after us didn't get wristbands whereas my friend and I missed out.

  • DrBallsDrBalls Registered User
    edited September 2010
    Sumi wrote: »
    Please have a bit of guidelines when it comes to cosplay. I don't care that you're not a booth babe, I still don't want to see your TnA. Underwear is not appropriate to be wearing in a public venue.

    (this wasn't a massive issue or anything, but it happend enough to make me uncomfortable.)


    As a parent I was bothered more by the booth girls. Especially the girls at the Trion booth. They were put on a pedestal LITERALLY. Worst of all were the Gamecrush girls who I don't even think had a booth. I saw them actively pursuing some underage guys in the handheld lounges in a way that I was very uncomfortable with...and this is coming from a guy whose forum name is DrBalls. The Gamecrush girls were alarmingly prostitute-like.

  • alegriaalegria Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Buraisu wrote: »
    Fire code, I am sure the building will burst into flames and that one extra person in the room will make it impossible for the rest to exit safely. Logically, fire code should be done by guessing not one by one counting; what a waste of time unless you have a fire marshal breathing down your neck. Also, does the fire code even take in size and height of people? I am sure it just gives you a well rounded flawed number. Of course, you can also guess lower then the number just to be safe. Not only that, like I said you could just play musical chairs and anyone not in a seat gets kicked out.

    Are you seriously suggesting that PAX break the law just so you don't have to get up out of your chair all day? REALLY? o_O

    Fire codes are not a suggestion. Fire codes are THE LAW and YES, I bet there was an inspection by the fire marshall at least once during the weekend. I have hosted a MUCH smaller event within the city limits and we were inspected before the event began and were informed that we could be surprise inspected at any point during the event, and I'm sure PAX is no different. In fact, due to the sheer size and number of people, it is MORE likely that PAX is held to a strict standard for the safety of all attendees.
    ~~~~~~~~~~

    I agree that the booth babes and some cosplayers were a little out of hand this year. I think a good guideline is that full buttock and breast coverage should be required, as well as adherence to public decency laws (i.e. no nipples, no genitals, etc.). The only costumes that really made me uncomfortable were those girls in buttfloss - the rest just made me snigger. For what it's worth, I find costumes like the gnome warlock and her voidwalker to be FAR more interesting than someone dressed as Leeloo in the white bandage outfit, but to each their own. At least the woman dressed as Leeloo had her whole butt covered. ;)
    ~~~~~~~~~~

    Rats. There was another good idea I saw last night but I can't find it right now to agree with it! Bah!

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