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Rocks Fall, Everyone Dies [Survival Thread]
Salvation122
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
It's 7AM. You wake up to find out really bad shit has gone down.
So, let's discuss how not to die.
The first part of not dying is what I refer to as "being ready to get the fuck out of dodge." In any of the above scenarios, things will probably go pretty badly for you if you're in a city. Well actually things will probably go pretty badly regardless of where you are, but cities are usually worse.
We'll assume that traffic hasn't come to complete gridlock by the time you decide to bug out. Gas stations will probably be completely mobbed, so you need to - and this will be a recurring theme - plan ahead. Top your gas tank off nightly; a full tank of gas will get most vehicles at least a couple hundred miles. Unfortunately everyone's going to run out of gas around that point, so you need to have a little more on you. Gas degrades over time, so you can't just buy a dozen 2gal gas cans and sit on them; a better idea is to buy, like, five, fill those, and then top off your tank with them nightly, refilling them when empty. (This will probably actually save you money, too; gas doesn't go down very often, so stocking up when it's cheap is better.)
From here our plans diverge between short- and long-term.
Short term, your goal is simply to hole up somewhere until crap calms down, or to get to your long-term staging area. For that, you'll need (roughly) the following:
This is probably too heavy; it was intended as a year-round, packed & ready to go bag, but it's probably a better idea to repack it seasonally to cut down on the weight and bulk of the clothing. I'd really like to have a pair of non-boot camp shoes in there, but they're heavy and bulky and you can do without them. The hatchet is also optional, though very useful in the event of zombies/robots/aliens/angels, or if there isn't a lot of convenient wood around for a fire and you need to hack some low branches off a tree or cut up fallen logs.
Most of this will suffice for two people. Obviously your partner will need their own pack, bag, clothes, water bottles, and food, but the rest of it can be easily split. And, nicely, this isn't too stupidly expensive - maybe $500-$600 all told (and that's with a pretty nice tent.)
Ideally, of course, you find somewhere with water - creek, pond, whatever - and live off that as your water source. If that's not doable, you can make a condenser out of the tarp and collect dew, snow, or rainwater. Hopefully, this provides you with enough resources to survive until FEMA sets up the concentration camps and relocates you for your own benefit.
You'll note a lack of insect repellent or deodorant. Avoid smelly things! Bears (and other predators) are attracted to stuff that smells weird, and both insect repellent and deodorant smell weird for a long-ass time. Waking up with a black bear licking your armpit is to be avoided.
Now, we cannot rule out the possibility that our new Glorious Robot/Insectoid/Angelic/Zombie/Communist Overlords will have defeated our ill-prepared Merikan military, making it necessary to settle in for the long haul. For this reason, you should have a storage unit on the outskirts of some podunk nowheresville town, containing, for starters:
All of the food should obviously be in dryboxes; you don't want mice screwing you over before you start.
So now you've got a ton of stuff to survive off of (BTW, you're going on a 1600-1800cal/day diet.) Where are you going to do it?
Although it's cliche, caves really do make damn good shelters. The interior temperature of a cave is generally the year-round mean of the external area, so they're usually somewhat cool without being straight-up frigid, depending on your location. Caves generally form near water sources. They keep the rain off, they require no construction and no maintenance, and as long as you don't piss off the bats, don't have a ton of wildlife problems.
Downsides: You really really don't want to be burning things in a cave, so your cooking will have to be done outside. Cave mouths are often really tight, so you may not be able to get your dryboxes, etc in. Caves tend to be somewhat humid, which together with the cold can lead to illness. Bats are super gross and crap on everything, although that crap can be used to make homemade black powder if you feel like blowing up a bunch of shit. Caves are really dark, so if you want to go further in than the entrance you'll need to constantly be using lights, depleting your batteries.
I have more I'd like to go into, but this is a good start. What's your [Generic Apocalypse] Survival Plan?
Maybe it's zombies!
Could be that our new robot overlords don't much like us.
Maybe ET can't phone home because he dropped his goddamn cell in the toilet and he's too drunk to drive and it costs too goddamn much to get an intergalactic taxi out here to the ass end of nowhere, fuck, why couldn't we have just thrown this party at their place like they asked screw it I'm crashing on your couch
For that matter maybe God's finally gotten pissed and decided to clean all you sinning scum off the face of the planet
Some say a comet will fall from the sky!
Or, you know, it could just be something mundane, like a bigass earthquake or a flood or global thermonuclear war.
In any case, it's important to be ready to, you know, not die.
Could be that our new robot overlords don't much like us.
Maybe ET can't phone home because he dropped his goddamn cell in the toilet and he's too drunk to drive and it costs too goddamn much to get an intergalactic taxi out here to the ass end of nowhere, fuck, why couldn't we have just thrown this party at their place like they asked screw it I'm crashing on your couch
For that matter maybe God's finally gotten pissed and decided to clean all you sinning scum off the face of the planet
just kidding I'm Catholic the Rapture is a metaphor
Some say a comet will fall from the sky!
Or, you know, it could just be something mundane, like a bigass earthquake or a flood or global thermonuclear war.
In any case, it's important to be ready to, you know, not die.
So, let's discuss how not to die.
The first part of not dying is what I refer to as "being ready to get the fuck out of dodge." In any of the above scenarios, things will probably go pretty badly for you if you're in a city. Well actually things will probably go pretty badly regardless of where you are, but cities are usually worse.
We'll assume that traffic hasn't come to complete gridlock by the time you decide to bug out. Gas stations will probably be completely mobbed, so you need to - and this will be a recurring theme - plan ahead. Top your gas tank off nightly; a full tank of gas will get most vehicles at least a couple hundred miles. Unfortunately everyone's going to run out of gas around that point, so you need to have a little more on you. Gas degrades over time, so you can't just buy a dozen 2gal gas cans and sit on them; a better idea is to buy, like, five, fill those, and then top off your tank with them nightly, refilling them when empty. (This will probably actually save you money, too; gas doesn't go down very often, so stocking up when it's cheap is better.)
From here our plans diverge between short- and long-term.
Short term, your goal is simply to hole up somewhere until crap calms down, or to get to your long-term staging area. For that, you'll need (roughly) the following:
- 1 set lightweight aluminum camping cookware
- 1 two-person backpacking tent
- 4 1-quart Nalgene bottles
- 1 water filtration system
- 2 bottles water purification tablets
- 2-3 weeks MREs/backpacking food
- 1 set lightweight rain gear
- 1 pair waterproof hiking boots (broken in)
- 3 sets lightweight hiking clothes
- 2 sets medium-weight camping clothes
- 1 set winter clothes
- 7 pairs socks/underwear
- 1 external frame backpack
- 80ft rope
- 1 bear bag
- 2 waterproof USGS topo maps of surrounding area, 1 high-res local, 1 low-res area
- 1 camping stove
- 2 bottles white gas
- 1 Compass
- 1 hatchet
- 1 multitool pocket knife
- 1 sleeping bag/ground pad
- 2 ziploc bags firestarters (dryer lint coated in paraffin)
- 2 rolls high-quality toilet paper
- 1 Box of 1 quart Ziploc bags
- 1 high-quality backpacking first aid kit
- 1 flare gun w/ flares
- 1 heavy-duty Maglite w/ 2 sets spare batteries
- 1 smallish, lightweight tarp
- 1 camp pillow
- 1 small, concentrated bottle of unscented antibiotic camp soap
Most of this will suffice for two people. Obviously your partner will need their own pack, bag, clothes, water bottles, and food, but the rest of it can be easily split. And, nicely, this isn't too stupidly expensive - maybe $500-$600 all told (and that's with a pretty nice tent.)
Ideally, of course, you find somewhere with water - creek, pond, whatever - and live off that as your water source. If that's not doable, you can make a condenser out of the tarp and collect dew, snow, or rainwater. Hopefully, this provides you with enough resources to survive until FEMA sets up the concentration camps and relocates you for your own benefit.
You'll note a lack of insect repellent or deodorant. Avoid smelly things! Bears (and other predators) are attracted to stuff that smells weird, and both insect repellent and deodorant smell weird for a long-ass time. Waking up with a black bear licking your armpit is to be avoided.
Now, we cannot rule out the possibility that our new Glorious Robot/Insectoid/Angelic/Zombie/Communist Overlords will have defeated our ill-prepared Merikan military, making it necessary to settle in for the long haul. For this reason, you should have a storage unit on the outskirts of some podunk nowheresville town, containing, for starters:
- 80gal distilled water in two 40gal bottles
- 280 quarts non-perishable food
- Canned fruit/veggies
- canned meat
- pasta/ramen
- hard cheese
- 70q staples - salt, pepper, flour, sugar, baking soda, bullion, oil, etc
- Axe, Shovel, pick mattock
- 2 hunting rifles, 8 boxes ammo
- Field Dressing kit
- Butchery tools
- Hide tanning equipment?
- 8 heavy-duty, largish tarps
- 200ft rope, various weights & lengths
- water filtration system & dozen spare filters
- 1 fuckton water purification tablets
- 80lb propane
- Propane stove
- Several bottles (each) OTC Medicine: asprin/ibuprofen, multivitamins, toothpaste, Robotussin, Pepto, etc
- Cigarettes (for trade)
- Hand-crank emergency radio
- Propane lanterns
- charcoal
- Heavyweight dutch oven
- Survival reading material
- Garden seeds & fertilizer
- 2 sets hand tools (screwdrivers, wrenches, hammer, crowbar, etc)
- 2 sets woodworking tools
- Bunch of screws & nails
- 1 set common car parts - spare tire, radiator hose, battery, couple quarts of oil
- 5gal Unscented antibacterial soap
- 2 sets adjustable crutches, splints, braces, etc
- Collapsible ladder
- Toilet paper. All of it. All the TP in the world.
- 100 batteries, each size
- High-detail USGS topo maps for surrounding 200 miles
- 2 Fishing poles w/spare tackle
- Booze
- Distilling equipment
- 3doz boxes Matches
All of the food should obviously be in dryboxes; you don't want mice screwing you over before you start.
So now you've got a ton of stuff to survive off of (BTW, you're going on a 1600-1800cal/day diet.) Where are you going to do it?
Downsides: You really really don't want to be burning things in a cave, so your cooking will have to be done outside. Cave mouths are often really tight, so you may not be able to get your dryboxes, etc in. Caves tend to be somewhat humid, which together with the cold can lead to illness. Bats are super gross and crap on everything, although that crap can be used to make homemade black powder if you feel like blowing up a bunch of shit. Caves are really dark, so if you want to go further in than the entrance you'll need to constantly be using lights, depleting your batteries.
I have more I'd like to go into, but this is a good start. What's your [Generic Apocalypse] Survival Plan?
Salvation122 on
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As are most people.
(Not that I disagree with the idea of this thread. I think it's really cool. But many folks seem to not realize how quickly they would die without modern society there to hold their hand.)
Let's not forget solar flares, EMPs, or the Yellowstone super volcano.
My generic survival plan is to sit on my stash of water, food, and guns that I have because I'm a nut, and wait things out. Not going anywhere unless I have to.
It's important to note that you can begin building your stash very cheaply. 280qt of food sounds like a lot, but it's really not. $50 a month adds up fast.
Takyris's point about prescription medication is a good one, and one I also worry about - without my Welbutrin I can get pretty unstable. Unfortunately I haven't thought of a good way to overcome that without the DEA getting all up in my business.
While a heavy duty maglite is an awesome idea (good source of light, some of the LED variations have incredible battery life expectancy, and in a pinch a D-Cell flashlight doubles as a weapon), I also like carrying around a smaller flashlight for when I don't want to lug a pound of aircraft aluminum wherever I'm going. You can get a quality LED flashlight for around $50-100 (check ebay) that will last for up to or over 24 hours of use on a pair of small batteries. The one I have is waterproof, pretty damned bright and lasted under irregular use on the same two batteries for 7 years until I accidentally left it tightened and drained the batteries over the course of a day or two.
I'm a smoker, so I pretty much always have a lighter on me and didn't think of it. Good catch, though.
Glowsticks also wouldn't be a bad addition; I avoided them specifically because they're disposable, and in THE APOCALYPSE I presume that disposable is bad. But for the short-term kit especially they're cheap and light.
I don't have much experience with LED flashlights, I'll look into it.
Do they even make flashlights with incandescent bulbs anymore? I thought even the new Maglights used LEDs.
Oh, and a surefire way to improve your chances of survival hundredfold is to disregard anything Bear Grylls says or does. Les Stroud and Ray Mears are good though(when it comes to tv survival types).
No shit. You could drop Bear Grylls in the middle of the Sahara and he would have gained weight by the time he got back to civilization.
In that kind of situation, like most of us here, I would be pretty fucked. None of my skills translate to survival in any meaningful way. I can light a fire... with a lighter, which is actually more than a lot of people can manage (aside: I once witnessed a group of teenagers trying to start a fire with 2 tins of lighter fluid and a packet of matches. They failed utterly. No kindling, just great big chunky sticks covered in lighter fluid). Of course there's no chance I could ever catch anything faster than a potato.
My main "strategy" is knowing a crazy survivalist bastard who's house I could crash at in the event of said apocalypse. He's been stashing food in a hidey-hole for a while now, and recently purchased a generator. His plan is basically to stay put, and turn his whole garden into a farm. And shoot anyone who tries to take his stuff with the de-commisioned shotgun he has which he could no doubt re-commision with a few days notice.
Hell, he's been in some of the same locations as other tv survival types, who end up finding stuff that tastes anywhere between okay and great, while Bear chews on a rat's testes or something.
Back in the topic, I'd expect the majority of people to be horribly prepared for any survival situation due to the lack of the most basic skills. I'm no survivalist, but I'd still expect to outlast a sizable portion of the population due to knowing how to do stuff with a knife and light a fire without matches/lighter.
Hell, I've had the pleasure of seeing people on a camping trip completely lost as to the purpose of tent poles, and have the same people balking at me gutting a fish as if I was butchering a child or something. It's pretty sad to be honest, to see how completely disconnected some people are from anything that doesn't work by a remote control.
I live in Central London. The closest I get to the wilderness is cleaning up after the dog in Hyde Park. From my perspective, a more neccesary skill for people would be how to read a tube map, or order coffee in less than 15 seconds.
I tried to clarify that point earlier, but what I meant is that knowing how to build a fire(using tinder, how to place firewood etc.) alone is starting to be a lost skill, not to mention starting a fire without matches/lighter. Ignoring making fire, knowing how to keep a fire going without lighter fluid is just plain sad, and something that I've seen far too often. Basic knife skills are also something that will always be useful, whether it comes to shaping wood, gutting fish or what have you. Even if we'll let making cordage slide, knowing how to tie some basic knots is also a surprisingly rare skill.
I consider these things, which are not really all that challenging(apart from firemaking, but we'll skip that from the very basic skill set), to be on par with being able to cook your own food. Granted, if you never ever move outside the cities you probably won't need most of these skills, but if your skill set consists of picking up dog shit and ordering from the counter in a Starbucks, you are really rather helpless in the grand scheme of things. The "you" in this case was of course a generic "you", and not you personally.
I know some people who are utterly useless when it comes to any sort of handicraft, and have had to aid people in situations where something has broken in order to make said items usable again. It seems that to an increasing degree people are getting more and more helpless when a solution doesn't come ready in a package, or they'd have to employ tools. I suppose the single greatest boon of having some basic skills down is, that it just feels good to know that if the need arises, you wouldn't be completely useless.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that I see these things to be as basic as knowing how to cook food or look after yourself overall, and you don't need to be some crazy super-survivalist, just a little less useless. Not to mention that these basic things do wonders to your sense of preparedness and confidence. It just means that no matter where you end up, you're never completely screwed.
Surely "survival" skills should represent "surviving" in situations that are likely to crop up? Well, in London I suppose the most likely disasters would be traffic accidents or a mugging gone wrong. So teaching people some basic first aid and triage makes sense, and knowing the procedure for contacting the emergency services seems important enough.
No, if one of those survival-nerd-fantasy disasters strikes I won't be doing too well. Very little room for digital researchers in the post apocalypse I'm sure. But y'know what? Nobody else will be doing much better. Luckily the chances are a trillion times slimmer than me being hit by a bus on the way to work tomorrow - something I'm actually prepared for.
It's not a case of one skill set changing to another, but more of skills being simply lost and not really getting replaced. As a whole people are becoming far less competent overall.
I agree with you about basic first aid being important, but that stuff is also a part of the basic skill set that people should have. Many people are surprisingly incompetent at that as well, missing such simple steps such as disinfecting a wound before applying a band-aid, saying nothing about the more serious wounds.
This is an end of the world survival thread though. Surviving daily life is a lot less interesting to talk about.
True, but irrelevant. I never said that people should have specialist knowledge. Just the basics. Using your reasoning I could just as well say that knowing how to cook is important - but just because I know how to slice bread doesn't mean I need to know how to bake it. The concept of cooking to some people consists of opening the ready-to-eat packet or microwaving the food for a few minutes.
Comparing the ability to gut fish or keep a fire going with the ability to farm wheat(which can be rather complex) is not exactly fair. You're equating basic skills with advanced ones. Just because a person doesn't know a basic skill doesn't mean it's an advanced one. It just reveals a gap in said person's competence.
I think you're making the mistake of thinking people that don't know how to make a fire or stop a bear are in the wrong, when the fact is they've simply prioritised what to learn and what to not bother with.
If I was told I had to survive a winter, I'd put even money on my survival, if I had a group of people. Maybe 10-20% by myself.
The thing about survival situations is any injury, even a scratch, is a potentially fatal event. A small scratch that gets infected wont kill you in of itself, but it will strain your body and could be the thing that pushes your small stash of food into the 'too little' category. Real wilderness survival requires years of instruction and very detailed local knowledge of what kind of shit you can eat, what foods can be grown, and where the game congregate. It also involves lots of people so that if you get sick or injured, someone can get you food such that you can take care of them when they inevitably get hurt (survival activities are dangerous yo)
-be in excellent shape. barring any physical disabilities, you should have healthy respiratory and cardiovascular systems. run, climb, and leap ably.
-possess the tools to defend yourself. a lot of this is packaged with the first item on the list- your most pressing asset in self-defense is mobility, and being able to remove yourself from a dangerous situation is priority one. in addition to fitness, examine what immediate resources you can muster to defend yourself if you can't escape. learn to fight or, if at all possible (financially, legally etc) carry a weapon and become conversant in its use.
-basic first aid and triage. whether an emergency occurs at home or in a location where you don't possess a first aid kit, there are rudimentary principles that are almost always applicable. does the sufferer have an unobstructed airway? are they breathing? do they have a pulse? are they bleeding profusely? lots of community colleges and centers have cheap or free cpr courses, and tuning in on even introductory lessons of aid is a necessity for a responsible adult, imo.
-a plan. the above points should, optimally, be incorporated into a plan meant to combat the range of problems you are most likely to encounter. have you been mugged? been in a house fire? it's sensible to have an escape route for your family from your home, for example.
there are a lot more niche examples that i guess the survivalist aficionados can cover (bug out bags, food gathering and preparation, shelter, etc) but the above is a set of things i think any adult should work on to face problems that might plague anyone in any locale (violent crime, fire, flooding, natural disasters, etc)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6H-w9Rm46o
Applicable bit-
2:38 to 8:47.
This was after the enormous power blackout of 1965 in New York. Power was lost to almost the entire Northeast for 12 hours due to improper maintenance of a single transmission line. I agree with Organichu; you need to have the ability (and strength of will) to defend yourself. You're going to be leaving dodge with a hell of a lot of people around you, and some of them might take a fancy to your dryboxes of emergency supplies.
No, it is super interesting. That is why the Worst Case Scenario show with Bear Grylls is much better than his stupid outdoor survival show.
He doesn't have to pretend to not sleep at the holiday inn every night on that one. Plus they don't make him eat some gross food every day. And it has actually useful content.
but they're listening to every word I say
Everyone has a part to play during the apocalypse!
Oh god, I fear Im going to end up the Sad Boy with the peanut butt.
I dont view it as preparing for the apocalypse, i view it as preparing for the unexpected. No i dont really think the russians or the chinese are going to invade, or zombies are going to break out. But a power outtage? That's plausable. A few months ago, i went over the highside on my bike, and ended up dislocating my shoulder, tearing up my hands, and some light road rash on my thighs, and twisting my ankle. I was miles away from the nearest house, disoriented, and my cellphone didnt have service. But because I had some basic navigation and survival skills, i was able to pop my shoulder back into place, brace my ankle, and walk back towards the highway.
Awesome site.
$3500.00 gets you a year's supply of freeze-dried food.
With a 20 year shelf-life.
Critical Failures - Havenhold Campaign • August St. Cloud (Human Ranger)
Yeah, we had an ice storm about 8 years ago that brought down power for a million or so people for about a week. For me it was only 3 days, but it was a real eye opener to not have any power or heat for 3 days when it was a frozen wasteland outside.
You've got some serious cash and space invested into this stuff, a year of food takes up considerable space.
I'd rather put that money into good living now personally, then you can draw on those happy memories for strength when the time comes.
EDIT wooow their ultimate first responder kit lacks a single airway... that's like the basics for real first response medicine
Dropping over 3 grand on freeze dried food? Not likely to be within most people's means. However, putting away even a couple litres of water and some ready to go food with a year or more on the shelf life is more than many people might have on hand. Buying hundreds or thousands of dollars in gear at once is unlikely, but hitting the local hardware store for a few odds and ends during a sale might put you a first aid kit and a warm sleeping bag closer to being able to flee in a moment's notice.
And I agree with others; the likelyhood of aliens invading or the Rapture occuring are pretty low, but a power outage like we had last decade, or a severe ice storm, or some other natural occurance (or outright disaster) might be a lot more survivable and/or comfortable.
Things like first aid, basic survival and even self defense are life skills that help prepare for the unforseeable. I'm planning on updating my St. John's Ambulance first aid and CPR certificates this year, and am pondering taking a martial art/self defense style, not because I plan on going all urban commando or becomming the god damned Batman, but because for a couple hundred bucks over the course of the year, I can improve my odds of surviving or even getting away unscathed from situations that might otherwise be dangerous or even life threatening.
If the dead arise from their graves and hunger for brains and that newfound skillset translates over well, then that's just a bonus.
That's something that is far, far, far more important then owning a full year's supply of freeze dried foods and enough ammunition to gun down half of LA
I've been in a few natural disasters (hurricanes, several major and several non) and having a good stock of non-perishable supplies that last at least a week is something just about everyone with sense has in their house/apartment/condo/etc. In terms of hurricanes in southern Florida, evacuation is extraordinarily difficult (there are really only three highways leading out, and odds are at least one of will do you no good when a storm is coming based on how it's bearing down on the state) making having supplies on hand a necessity. After the storm passes, usually you've got no power for a minimum of two days and most roads are at least partially impassable due to debris for a similar amount of time. City water usually still works, but needs to be boiled.
I have a more mundane piece of survival hardware to add to the list though (for short-term disasters at least): A standard propane barbecue. At least in Florida, rather than immediately switching to 100% non-perishable foods you use everything in your fridge & freezer that you can. Since the weather tends to be good enough to continue to use a barbecue for most of the year in Florida [and Hurricanes tend to hit in late summer], it's not unusual for people to have a fair amount of food on hand that can be cooked on a barbecue. This often allows people to extend their food supplies much further. You can also boil water for drinking, or simply heat water effectively 'for free': you can get a few gallons quite hot using nothing but waste heat if you set them in a metal pot inside the grill just after you turn it off.
The short-term list is focused more on being mobile (and does have a camp stove.) If you're remaining in place, yes, a propane grill is great, and you'll absolutely want to use it to cook up the rest of your meat.
Florida is sort of the best-case scenario, in these situations, precisely because you don't have to care about winter and can grill outside whenever.