How worthwhile is Rosetta Stone?

ShinyRedKnight

I started taking French recently and enjoyed learning the language. I learned the very basics, mainly light present tense conversation and self description. However, due to time constraints I am unable to take a course dedicated to it.

I am very interested in using Rosetta Stone on my free time to learn the language at my own pace, but of course I realize the difference between in class study and using a program myself. Keeping that in mind, I don't plan on using Rosetta Stone to
speak French casually immediately. I realize it could take years upon years to actually be able to speak it naturally, and years more to work on my accent.

I am willing to take that long to learn the language, so would Rosetta Stone be a smart investment? I guess its important to note that English was my second language, I also speak Serbo-Croatian. Over the past years I have become more adapt at English, but I still speak Serbo-Croatian daily.

Taya

No, Rosetta Stone really isn't worth it.

You won't really learn anything from it. It may help reinforce what you already know, but a pack of flashcards could do that just as easily.

urahonky

I took a French class at my university and I also tried Rosetta at the same time... And I have to say I was really, really underwhelmed by Rosetta Stone. It might be okay to use in addition to something else, but by itself I don't think I'd ever actually learn anything from it.

Esh

Outside of a class or immersion, you are not going to learn to speak French fluently. Ever. Unless you're some sort of idiot savant.

Try Livemocha.com

ShinyRedKnight

I guess its best for me to leave it for when I have time for actual study and classes with it. Right now I'm still focusing on doing well in classes aimed at my career goals.

Thanks for suggesting Livemocha, it should help me at least remember the basics I learned until I can go into French classes regularly again.

DekuStick

Rosetta Stone can be a decent learning aid but it isn't going to teach you a language.

edit - The problem I had with it was that it never seemed to tell me WHY a word changed, or went where it did. It just expects you to memorize that it does. It's like trying to figure out There Their They're with pictures.

curly haired boy

my mom likes rosetta stone well enough, but as soon as she lets it lapse for a while, poof! the knowledge goes away.

the problem with virtually all language programs/classes is you don't speak enough of it on a regular basis. nothing substitutes for immersion/and/or daily practice. your brain retains what it uses; if you don't modify your life to use the language you're trying to learn, you'll have a hard time learning it.

Lorahalo

If you're going to try using it, you should probably do it with somebody else. You can keep each other practised.

Daemonion

I use Rosetta Stone's online service, Totale, for Russian and enjoy it very much.

It is best used with a companion text, though, because it teaches you a language pretty much the same way your parent would if you were a little kid. Think of your mom pointing at man a man running and saying "running!" It will only ever speak to you in whatever language you are learning. So, it is nice to have a book that flat out tells me "Russian has six grammatical cases."

With Totale, you can play memorization games by yourself or with other students online, work with native speaking students, schedule as many live classroom sessions you want per week (one hour with a native speaker who has a webcam and mic), read dozens and dozens of stories at varying levels. Furthermore, you still get mailed the audio CDs to practice what you are learning in your car or whatever. I'm also getting better at typing in Cyrillic.

The great thing about the classroom sessions is that not too many students are taking Russian, so my sessions are usually one-on-one. Rosetta Stone's rules state that only one language my be spoken in the virtual classroom (the one you are learning), so it is a lot of fun to try and communicate with a native speaker using my not-so-great Russian. Often, they'll teach me things that aren't in the curriculum.

So, in short: I think it is great, but also get a companion text like you'd probably get in school.

jefe414

I took a conversational German class at the local high school (for when I go to Germany). I wasn't interested in learning how to read/write so much as stagger my way through a conversation. It was quite useful.

Kragun

I disagree with what was said above about the importance of classes. It is dedication and interest in a language that will help you achieve fluency. One method I have been messing around with lately is the SRS method for Russian.

Give AJATT a read some time. While it focuses on Japanese, the methods can be applied to other languages. It's also somewhat easier for you because you won't have to go through the initial steps of learning a new writing system.

Computer programs such as Anki can help. They are just flash cards on your computer, but I find them really useful. You can put a French sentence on one side and on the other put the grammar breakdown and individual vocabulary. You then rate how well you know the sentence which sets how often it will come up when you are running through your deck.

What kills people in languages is when they stop using it. So whatever method you end up using, just keep it up.

Drake Chambers

I have to disagree with the negative opinions on Rosetta Stone. I'll concede that its usefulness may vary depending on your situation / how else you're practicing, but my wife and I have been very impressed with it.

I took five years of Spanish in junior high / high school and then made the mistake of dropping it when I placed out of the language requirement in college. I've started picking it back up again using Rosetta Stone and the area where its done wonders for me is in listening. The biggest challenge for me and Spanish has always been understanding what other people say -- I can generally say what I need to but unless it's spoken extremely slowly I've always had a hard time keeping up. After about six weeks with Rosetta Stone I found I'm much more capable of following spoken Spanish than I ever was in school. Granted, I have a background in it, but it's still helped me a lot.

I think the more interesting example is how good it's been for my wife. She started in with zero experience in the language and after a few months is already well beyond where she'd be if she'd taken a college course. A big part of that is that we practice together at home but it's still much more convenient and accessible than taking a formal class somewhere else.

In short: Rosetta Stone alone is not going to teach you a language, but I think you could say that about any single source. As part of a larger learning process I think it can be very valuable.

Esh

Drake Chambers wrote: »

I have to disagree with the negative opinions on Rosetta Stone. I'll concede that its usefulness may vary depending on your situation / how else you're practicing, but my wife and I have been very impressed with it.

I took five years of Spanish in junior high / high school and then made the mistake of dropping it when I placed out of the language requirement in college. I've started picking it back up again using Rosetta Stone and the area where its done wonders for me is in listening. The biggest challenge for me and Spanish has always been understanding what other people say -- I can generally say what I need to but unless it's spoken extremely slowly I've always had a hard time keeping up. After about six weeks with Rosetta Stone I found I'm much more capable of following spoken Spanish than I ever was in school. Granted, I have a background in it, but it's still helped me a lot.

I think the more interesting example is how good it's been for my wife. She started in with zero experience in the language and after a few months is already well beyond where she'd be if she'd taken a college course. A big part of that is that we practice together at home but it's still much more convenient and accessible than taking a formal class somewhere else.

In short: Rosetta Stone alone is not going to teach you a language, but I think you could say that about any single source. As part of a larger learning process I think it can be very valuable.

I have a very hard time believing that a few months of Rosetta Stone could put someone above someone who has diligently studied it in college through several classes at the least. How much grammar does your wife know?

EggyToast

I think Drake's point comes back to the fact that it's going to be different for different people. Some people will learn better in a class, where you're exposed to things by a teacher. Others will respond well to self-teaching. And others simply have a hard time learning new languages.

He did also say that she's above where she'd be if she had taken a single spanish class (I assume he meant "offered by a local college" and not "someone who studied it in college").

For me, understanding grammar and structure for foreign languages has always been easy because I really enjoy that aspect of English. I took Spanish in high school and learned the grammar and structure easily -- what always got me was vocabulary. I'm the same now -- I'm way out of practice, but I can listen to someone speaking and hear "subject adjective verbed an object adjective appositive." I just don't know what they're actually talking about.

Which also means that if someone was going through Rosetta Stone (or similar) with me, they would probably get up to speed pretty fast too. His wife didn't just learn on her own -- he was there too.

Drake Chambers

Esh wrote: »

Drake Chambers wrote: »

I have to disagree with the negative opinions on Rosetta Stone. I'll concede that its usefulness may vary depending on your situation / how else you're practicing, but my wife and I have been very impressed with it.

I took five years of Spanish in junior high / high school and then made the mistake of dropping it when I placed out of the language requirement in college. I've started picking it back up again using Rosetta Stone and the area where its done wonders for me is in listening. The biggest challenge for me and Spanish has always been understanding what other people say -- I can generally say what I need to but unless it's spoken extremely slowly I've always had a hard time keeping up. After about six weeks with Rosetta Stone I found I'm much more capable of following spoken Spanish than I ever was in school. Granted, I have a background in it, but it's still helped me a lot.

I think the more interesting example is how good it's been for my wife. She started in with zero experience in the language and after a few months is already well beyond where she'd be if she'd taken a college course. A big part of that is that we practice together at home but it's still much more convenient and accessible than taking a formal class somewhere else.

In short: Rosetta Stone alone is not going to teach you a language, but I think you could say that about any single source. As part of a larger learning process I think it can be very valuable.

I have a very hard time believing that a few months of Rosetta Stone could put someone above someone who has diligently studied it in college through several classes at the least. How much grammar does your wife know?

To clarify, I didn't mean she's beyond a multi-year course of study in college classes, but she is more functionally capable than she'd be after two semesters. She took French in college and has stated that she's learned much more rapidly at home than in comparable college classes in French. Her grammar is further along than mine was after my first year in school.

Again, semi-immersion is key here. We speak Spanish to each other at home pretty constantly.

Edit: EggyToast's above post is spot-on.

Waldo

Honestly, esh, having just finished my fifth semester of french, I find what drake says pretty believable. When talking about achieving not fluency but good working proficiency, I think the will to learn and effort makes a big difference (as long as half-decent instruction or materials are available). Collegiate classroom instruction, to me, does not seem like some be-all end-all method of learning a new language (maybe full immersion is, but that's not so easy to do for most people).

If rosetta stone is what you've got, go for it, OP. But it is also very important to have someone to speak the language you're learning with, whether it be just one person or a classroom full of them.

Esh

Waldo wrote: »

Honestly, esh, having just finished my fifth semester of french, I find what drake says pretty believable. When talking about achieving not fluency but good working proficiency, I think the will to learn and effort makes a big difference (as long as half-decent instruction or materials are available). Collegiate classroom instruction, to me, does not seem like some be-all end-all method of learning a new language (maybe full immersion is, but that's not so easy to do for most people).

If rosetta stone is what you've got, go for it, OP. But it is also very important to have someone to speak the language you're learning with, whether it be just one person or a classroom full of them.

On a counter note, I'm in my sixth semester of French and am going to Poitiers next year, and I find the classroom to be the best way of learning. I tried for years before college through books and computer programs to achieve some degree of fluency to no avail. College is what made it click for me.

I agree with a lot of your points though. You HAVE to have someone to practice with. That's the #1 priority.

I don't think he has Rosetta Stone yet, and for the price point, he's better off with Livemocha or finding a French center in his city (while expensive, worth it) to take classes at.

Rankenphile

My wife listens to Coffee Break: Spanish podcast on her free time, and it's a nice way to supplement any language learning you may be doing. It is free, short, and teaches good conversational language, and they have some in French.

splash

As people have said using Rosetta Stone depends.

Since you said you have time constraints I would recommend it. The way it teaches is to get down to business right away. I also appreciate this particular method so it makes me enjoy dabbing into a language more. It uses a distinct teaching method as Daemonion described. It teaches language phrases well. It isn't intended for grammar or writing.

But I'd also caution it depends on what your ultimate goals are with French or if you have any concrete goals. It may simply not be about the "best way to learn" but if you want to pay for a program, etc. If you want to learn a language of course the best way is to live there, the second best is to take a class that includes language discussion. So what are you willing to pay for, for what you want to get out of it.

I'd add after the above post that a podcast is only okay as a supplement. With respect, I think a podcast is probably the worst way to learn a language, it's more for the entertainment value or supplement to things already learned. But using it as a supplement is slow. As the poster doesn't have a lot of time I'd steer way clear of podcasts as you can review the same amount of things in 5 minutes by yourself that you would get from listening to an hour-long podcast.

cooljammer00

I heard from the Giant Bombcast that the new Rosetta Stone has a subscription thing where you can video chat with a live person. It's not a classroom environment, but it's a start.

urahonky

cooljammer00 wrote: »

I heard from the Giant Bombcast that the new Rosetta Stone has a subscription thing where you can video chat with a live person. It's not a classroom environment, but it's a start.

That's a really nice idea.

ShinyRedKnight

Hmm lots of interesting ideas.

I do see the importance of having a live person to practice with and, thankfully, I have a close friend who speaks French at a much higher level and is still taking classes, so she can help me out.

As well, if I do get Rosetta Stone (or any such program) I also have my books, notes, and grammar guides from French class, so I'm definitely prepared.

I have noticed, as some have said, that learning with a teacher in a class is much harder for me in terms of grammar. Vocabulary is easier any way, but the grammar is really what holds me back.

But yeah, I'm going with Livemocha (or anything similar) simply because Rosetta Stone is insanely pricey until I know where I stand with extra help outside the program.

Awk

Personally I believe Rosetta Stone to be very helpful, especially with memory. I was able to learn some basic japanese very quickly, even the alphabet. It drills you. It might not work for some, but it works for me.

Its another tool for your belt, be it a shiny tool. You can spend 2 hours or a mere 10 minutes and still exercise your brain.

Daemonion

urahonky wrote: »

cooljammer00 wrote: »

I heard from the Giant Bombcast that the new Rosetta Stone has a subscription thing where you can video chat with a live person. It's not a classroom environment, but it's a start.

That's a really nice idea.

Yes. As I mentioned, it is pretty awesome. The instructor uses a virtual white board to interact with you - asking you about what she (my instructors have always been female) is pointing at in the photo, asking you to describe what she is wearing, asking you about the weather; all stuff that is tailored to your level. There are, I believe, 16 or 20 levels of class sessions.

Also, OP, you can be logged into Rosetta Stone Totale on several computers at the same time, each doing different stuff. This makes it easy to have someone to study with if you have a interested partner, roommate, etc.