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The Celebrated Jumping [chat] of Calaveras County

2456746

Posts

  • ArchArch HELLO YES THIS IS BUG Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Man that aint the theory, writing something other then what the author wrote in their own fucking book is just editing, you aren't adjusting shit to some true vision.

  • ArchArch HELLO YES THIS IS BUG Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
  • DaxonDaxon Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Arch wrote: »
    Eddy wrote: »
    Daxon wrote: »
    Preacher wrote:
    For books its intended when the race of the character isn't addressed. It's a writer technique to have you adjust the cast to your taste and connect with them better.

    But.. what makes it bad when Hollywood does it?

    Hollywood is after-all an American thing where the majority of the population is white.

    To me it's not really "bad" or anything. It's an easy way to make money, by assuming the majority of the movie-going public is a) mostly white, and/or b) used to seeing whites in leading roles. Catering to the demographic, and all that.

    However, you can see why people would get upset about it when it's a white person taking the lead role of "The Last of the Mohicans" or "The Last Samurai". While it does appeal to the correct demographics, it sacrifices quite a few things such as realism, historical accuracy, blah blah blah political correctness.

    But I understand why Hollywood does it. Visuals are much more impacting than reading a novel since you can go an entire book without ever thinking about the protagonist's face, whereas in a movie you see it like 100% of screentime.

    Not to completely disagree, but an appeal to the market doesn't make something "good".

    I mean your entire post is pretty much accurate, I disagree that it isn't "bad".

    I mean this isn't a binary though- it may not be "bad" per se, but it is certainly not good

    Well yeah, not good, but it's what happens for pretty understandable reasons.

    Man, I don't get people who get their knickers in a twist about whitewashed films. If you don't like it, don't watch it and hope it'll be a commercial failure so moviemakers might be a bit more careful about whitewashing in the future.

    Alternatively write in to your local newspaper or get movie critics to get annoyed at the whitewashing.

    Bitching about it online because it's some sort of perceived racism (which is generally wouldn't be unless you've got some strange KKK director in charge of the movie or something) is just dumb.

  • FeralFeral Who needs a medical license when you've got style? Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Arch wrote: »
    For context, I immensely enjoyed blue Avatar, even in spite of it being indicative of what I see as not necessarily a problem, but definitely an uncomfortable trend

    I don't think it's a moral failing on the part of the author/screenwriter/etc, but I think it's perfectly fair to point out when a book or movie offers a simplistic, superficial depiction of a different culture.

    It might not even be that damning. In the case of Avatar, the whole movie is simplistic. I don't expect anything more from it. And it's offering a simplistic view of a fantasy race; I don't think that the Navi are directly comparable enough to any one real Earth culture to be considered a veiled allegory.

    In the case of a movie like Dances With Wolves, though, it is a lot more damning. I don't think DWW survives as a story if you remove/ignore the Native American stereotypes, and I think a lot of its appeal at the time was it's well-meaning, but condescending, sensitivity towards Sioux.

    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
    the "no true scotch, man" fallacy.
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Arch wrote: »
    man shut up preacher what do you know

    what are you a writer

    huh

    huh???

    Actually...

    Sadly unpublished, but I think I'm awesome.

  • ArchArch HELLO YES THIS IS BUG Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Feral wrote: »
    Arch wrote: »
    For context, I immensely enjoyed blue Avatar, even in spite of it being indicative of what I see as not necessarily a problem, but definitely an uncomfortable trend

    I don't think it's a moral failing on the part of the author/screenwriter/etc, but I think it's perfectly fair to point out when a book or movie offers a simplistic, superficial depiction of a different culture.

    It might not even be that damning. In the case of Avatar, the whole movie is simplistic. I don't expect anything more from it. And it's offering a simplistic view of a fantasy race; I don't think that the Navi are directly comparable enough to any one real Earth culture to be considered a veiled allegory.

    In the case of a movie like Dances With Wolves, though, it is a lot more damning. I don't think DWW survives as a story if you remove/ignore the Native American stereotypes, and I think a lot of its appeal at the time was it's well-meaning, but condescending, sensitivity towards Sioux.

    Very well put.

    This is why I love you.

  • SenjutsuSenjutsu fiddy too Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Preacher wrote: »
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    Thunderheart came to mind as another movie

    I had a whole thing typed up about people reacting to Avatar more for the trope it seems to fit in rather than its specifics, but I lost it when the thread closed

    Wasn't thunderheart based on a real story? And I'm pretty sure that Kilmer was supposed to be part native american right?

    it's kind of loosely based on a real incident

    and yeah, his character is supposed to be half-indian and discovering his roots, IIRC

    So its more about Hollywood using Kilmer in the role? Or I'm at a loss why you pointed it out?

    Well, basically yeah. He's still kind of the white guy going into the other place and learning the thing and saving them, although at least with the whole it's-a-part-of-my-heritage-I'm-learning-about-now angle. No idea if that part is factual or was introduced in the movie-fication

    Sarksus wrote: »
    I'm gonna get a PhD in incest.
  • AriviaArivia Registered User
    edited January 2011
    Arch wrote: »
    Joker please tell me you aren't

    well

    joking

    what

    I thought all wars prior to ww1 were played out with little army men on a landscaped table

    wargaming is a timehonoured tradition handed down from our forefathers, paint jobs the work of honest, good men

    waterloo was won when the count of vichy accidentally went loo over the french forces and all that

    huntresssig.jpg
  • JokermanJokerman Love is careless in its choosing. Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Arch wrote: »
    Joker please tell me you aren't

    well

    joking

    Dead serious.

    grenade1.jpg
    That's what an 18th century hand grenade looked like. That's what a Grenadier threw.

    Chanus wrote: »
    the best asians are white people
    My blog about Beer!
  • matt has a problemmatt has a problem Six pack on a dick Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Avatar is racist against the Smurfs.

    h1DI1.jpg
    All my fuckin life I lived a normal fuckin life
  • ArchArch HELLO YES THIS IS BUG Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Preacher wrote: »
    Arch wrote: »
    man shut up preacher what do you know

    what are you a writer

    huh

    huh???

    Actually...

    Sadly unpublished, but I think I'm awesome.

    oh uh

    uh

    awwwwkwarrrddddddd

  • ArchArch HELLO YES THIS IS BUG Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
  • TarranonTarranon Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    i gave a copy of a book to a friend for christmas

    the book has the n-word in it

    at first i didn't think anything of it, but now i'm positive she's a horrible racist. i bet she looks at that word every time it comes up and thinks 'yeah, that's what I'M talking about'

  • EddyEddy pale Gengars I loved beside Cerulean CaveRegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Arch wrote: »
    Eddy wrote: »
    Daxon wrote: »
    Preacher wrote:
    For books its intended when the race of the character isn't addressed. It's a writer technique to have you adjust the cast to your taste and connect with them better.

    But.. what makes it bad when Hollywood does it?

    Hollywood is after-all an American thing where the majority of the population is white.

    To me it's not really "bad" or anything. It's an easy way to make money, by assuming the majority of the movie-going public is a) mostly white, and/or b) used to seeing whites in leading roles. Catering to the demographic, and all that.

    However, you can see why people would get upset about it when it's a white person taking the lead role of "The Last of the Mohicans" or "The Last Samurai". While it does appeal to the correct demographics, it sacrifices quite a few things such as realism, historical accuracy, blah blah blah political correctness.

    But I understand why Hollywood does it. Visuals are much more impacting than reading a novel since you can go an entire book without ever thinking about the protagonist's face, whereas in a movie you see it like 100% of screentime.

    Not to completely disagree, but an appeal to the market doesn't make something "good".

    I mean your entire post is pretty much accurate, I disagree that it isn't "bad".

    I mean this isn't a binary though- it may not be "bad" per se, but it is certainly not good

    Of course. I think it's a pretty clear-cut "hmm there's something manipulative about this whole thing" vibe going on, but as far as Hollywood is concerned, they do whatever has to be done to continue being successful.

  • EllieEllie Registered User
    edited January 2011
    Oh my dear God. I just heard Michele Bachmann is talking about running for president. If by some fluke that awful, crazy bitch gets elected, I swear to God I will flee to Canada, or just flat-out kill myself to avoid the consequences.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • ThomamelasThomamelas “Three films a day, three books a week and records of great music would be enough to make me happy to the day I die.” Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Feral wrote: »
    Arch wrote: »
    For context, I immensely enjoyed blue Avatar, even in spite of it being indicative of what I see as not necessarily a problem, but definitely an uncomfortable trend

    I don't think it's a moral failing on the part of the author/screenwriter/etc, but I think it's perfectly fair to point out when a book or movie offers a simplistic, superficial depiction of a different culture.

    It might not even be that damning. In the case of Avatar, the whole movie is simplistic. I don't expect anything more from it. And it's offering a simplistic view of a fantasy race; I don't think that the Navi are directly comparable enough to any one real Earth culture to be considered a veiled allegory.

    In the case of a movie like Dances With Wolves, though, it is a lot more damning. I don't think DWW survives as a story if you remove/ignore the Native American stereotypes, and I think a lot of its appeal at the time was it's well-meaning, but condescending, sensitivity towards Sioux.

    It doesn't work well with them either. But it is a pretty racist movie.

  • matt has a problemmatt has a problem Six pack on a dick Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Tarranon wrote: »
    i gave a copy of a book to a friend for christmas

    the book has the n-word in it

    at first i didn't think anything of it, but now i'm positive she's a horrible racist. i bet she looks at that word every time it comes up and thinks 'yeah, that's what I'M talking about'
    She has each page containing that word bookmarked, and the word highlighted. She's added the page number and word placement on the page to her huge Excel spreadsheet of books with the n-word in them. She can cross-reference by, author, publishing house, date...

    h1DI1.jpg
    All my fuckin life I lived a normal fuckin life
  • JokermanJokerman Love is careless in its choosing. Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Ellie wrote: »
    Oh my dear God. I just heard Michele Bachmann is talking about running for president. If by some fluke that awful, crazy bitch gets elected, I swear to God I will flee to Canada, or just flat-out kill myself to avoid the consequences.

    Suicide pact?

    Last one to die, please turn out the lights.

    Chanus wrote: »
    the best asians are white people
    My blog about Beer!
  • AriviaArivia Registered User
    edited January 2011
    Tarranon wrote: »
    i gave a copy of a book to a friend for christmas

    the book has the n-word in it

    at first i didn't think anything of it, but now i'm positive she's a horrible racist. i bet she looks at that word every time it comes up and thinks 'yeah, that's what I'M talking about'
    She has each page containing that word bookmarked, and the word highlighted. She's added the page number and word placement on the page to her huge Excel spreadsheet of books with the n-word in them. She can cross-reference by, author, publishing house, date...

    also how many times she audibly came.

    huntresssig.jpg
  • matt has a problemmatt has a problem Six pack on a dick Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Ellie wrote: »
    Oh my dear God. I just heard Michele Bachmann is talking about running for president. If by some fluke that awful, crazy bitch gets elected, I swear to God I will flee to Canada, or just flat-out kill myself to avoid the consequences.
    If her and Palin are the candidates for the Republican nom in 2012, I am watching the news 24/7 because that will be better than any movie.

    h1DI1.jpg
    All my fuckin life I lived a normal fuckin life
  • GalahadGalahad Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Arivia wrote: »
    New [chat].

    *sniff sniff*

    Looks alright.

    This [chat] is amphibious!

    I hear that if you lick it you'll have hallucinations.

  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    The new PATV thing is....bad, just bad.

    I wish I could give a more nuanced critique, but its just bad.

  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Senjutsu wrote: »

    Well, basically yeah. He's still kind of the white guy going into the other place and learning the thing and saving them, although at least with the whole it's-a-part-of-my-heritage-I'm-learning-about-now angle. No idea if that part is factual or was introduced in the movie-fication

    Quigley Down Under kind of had that, but I don't really put it in the same thing, because its not like he taught the aboriginees to fight, he was just more skilled at killing their actual oponents with his technology.

  • Donkey KongDonkey Kong Warning: Donkey Kong is not a real doctor Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Jokerman wrote: »
    Arch wrote: »
    Joker please tell me you aren't

    well

    joking

    Dead serious.

    grenade1.jpg
    That's what an 18th century hand grenade looked like. That's what a Grenadier threw.

    But these are so much smaller than the ones you see in cartoons!

    easy_tetris_sig.gifbubbulon3_sig.png
  • AriviaArivia Registered User
    edited January 2011
    I edited a dude once

    I edited his nose all broken, critically removed a few teeth to tighten the plot, and filled in the details of his black eyes

    huntresssig.jpg
  • EllieEllie Registered User
    edited January 2011
    Ellie wrote: »
    Oh my dear God. I just heard Michele Bachmann is talking about running for president. If by some fluke that awful, crazy bitch gets elected, I swear to God I will flee to Canada, or just flat-out kill myself to avoid the consequences.
    If her and Palin are the candidates for the Republican nom in 2012, I am watching the news 24/7 because that will be better than any movie.

    I know, right? I will not be able to get enough of Rachel Maddow if it's a Palin/Bachmann ticket of any sort. But I will still lose a lot of faith in my country if either of them manages to get elected. Not kidding.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • KalkinoKalkino Buttons Londres Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Tarranon wrote: »
    i gave a copy of a book to a friend for christmas

    the book has the n-word in it

    at first i didn't think anything of it, but now i'm positive she's a horrible racist. i bet she looks at that word every time it comes up and thinks 'yeah, that's what I'M talking about'
    She has each page containing that word bookmarked, and the word highlighted. She's added the page number and word placement on the page to her huge Excel spreadsheet of books with the n-word in them. She can cross-reference by, author, publishing house, date...

    You mean some sort of racist relational database?

    Freedom for the Northern Isles!
  • matt has a problemmatt has a problem Six pack on a dick Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Forget the LHC, put Palin and Bachmann in a room and make them duke it out for the Republican presidential nomination. Things will be colliding at the speed of light in no time.

    h1DI1.jpg
    All my fuckin life I lived a normal fuckin life
  • ArchArch HELLO YES THIS IS BUG Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
  • TarranonTarranon Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    The new PATV thing is....bad, just bad.

    I wish I could give a more nuanced critique, but its just bad.

    apparently it grows on you, according to robert khoo

    (like a brain tumor HEYOOOOO)

  • SenjutsuSenjutsu fiddy too Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Preacher wrote: »
    Senjutsu wrote: »

    Well, basically yeah. He's still kind of the white guy going into the other place and learning the thing and saving them, although at least with the whole it's-a-part-of-my-heritage-I'm-learning-about-now angle. No idea if that part is factual or was introduced in the movie-fication

    Quigley Down Under kind of had that, but I don't really put it in the same thing, because its not like he taught the aboriginees to fight, he was just more skilled at killing their actual oponents with his technology.

    oh man, that movie takes me back

    Sarksus wrote: »
    I'm gonna get a PhD in incest.
  • FeralFeral Who needs a medical license when you've got style? Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    I'm also not really sure that Huck Finn is suitable for middle school or high school, but even if that were the case, the answer isn't to Bowdlerize it, but to choose a different work.

    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
    the "no true scotch, man" fallacy.
  • JokermanJokerman Love is careless in its choosing. Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Jokerman wrote: »
    Arch wrote: »
    Joker please tell me you aren't

    well

    joking

    Dead serious.

    grenade1.jpg
    That's what an 18th century hand grenade looked like. That's what a Grenadier threw.

    But these are so much smaller than the ones you see in cartoons!

    Oversized for humor, ya know nothing is funnier then a bigger bomb.

    Chanus wrote: »
    the best asians are white people
    My blog about Beer!
  • JamesKeenanJamesKeenan Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Eddy wrote: »
    Also I've always enjoyed how people who edit old works pull out the "It's closer to what the author really meant" reasoning. You pretentious fuck, it's words written on paper by the author's actual hand. I'm pretty sure what the author meant is what they wrote down by using the writing implement in their hand that was attached to their body, being controlled by their brain.

    Welcome to the wild world of literary theory

    Careful you don't step in the bullllllshit

    Well sometimes I think it'd be ok. Like, I would be cool with retitling The Great Gatsby.



    Also, fuck me. I thought chat was just talking about n-words and Huck Finn for kicks. I didnt realize this stupid shit was happening for real.

    Also, is it illegal to enter the other gender's bathroom in a restaurant?

  • matt has a problemmatt has a problem Six pack on a dick Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Arch wrote: »
    Preacher

    Is quigley down under as hilarious as the wikipedia article for it sounds?
    It's pretty bad. Laura San Giacomo does not make a believable hooker.

    h1DI1.jpg
    All my fuckin life I lived a normal fuckin life
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Arch wrote: »
    Preacher

    Is quigley down under as hilarious as the wikipedia article for it sounds?

    I dunno what you mean by hilarious. Its a straight western with Tom Selleck as the lone Gunfighter come to town to take on the evil cattleman in Alan Rickman. Just instead of a pistol, he's packing a huge fucking rifle.

  • ArchArch HELLO YES THIS IS BUG Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Preacher wrote: »
    Arch wrote: »
    Preacher

    Is quigley down under as hilarious as the wikipedia article for it sounds?

    I dunno what you mean by hilarious. Its a straight western with Tom Selleck as the lone Gunfighter come to town to take on the evil cattleman in Alan Rickman. Just instead of a pistol, he's packing a huge fucking rifle.

    but that sounds hilarious

  • EllieEllie Registered User
    edited January 2011
    Tarranon wrote: »
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    The new PATV thing is....bad, just bad.

    I wish I could give a more nuanced critique, but its just bad.

    apparently it grows on you, according to robert khoo

    (like a brain tumor HEYOOOOO)

    You Grew On Me

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
This discussion has been closed.