I love the Metroidvanias on their own, but I'll always like the classic platformers more. Simon's Quest is an exception. Despite its flaws I consider it to be on par with the best in the series due to its atmosphere and actual exploration (that is to say, you've got very little direction to work with without it being TOO out there). If it didn't have a couple of "puzzles" that were physically impossible to figure out without help it'd be much better.
Neo Rasa on
"You know how Batman hangs people over the edge of buildings and gets them to spill information. That's Neo Rasa's way of it, but instead of information, he just likes to see people suffer." ~Senor Fish
I've recently come to the conclusion that the Metroidvania's would be a lot cooler if they stopped putting save points right before bosses. They should put them right after, so that each area of the castle feels more like a linear side-scrolling level. Best of both worlds.
I've recently come to the conclusion that the Metroidvania's would be a lot cooler if they stopped putting save points right before bosses. They should put them right after, so that each area of the castle feels more like a linear side-scrolling level. Best of both worlds.
This would be awesome.
You could have it suspend some save data at checkpoints throughout each block of castle so that death doesn't push you TOO far back, and you'd have a challenge that doesn't get frustrating.
It's something Symphony does well. You had save points NEAR bosses but you never have that really blatant one screen where each way goes to the boss, a save room, a teleporter, and the rest of the level.
Neo Rasa on
"You know how Batman hangs people over the edge of buildings and gets them to spill information. That's Neo Rasa's way of it, but instead of information, he just likes to see people suffer." ~Senor Fish
I've recently come to the conclusion that the Metroidvania's would be a lot cooler if they stopped putting save points right before bosses. They should put them right after, so that each area of the castle feels more like a linear side-scrolling level. Best of both worlds.
This would be awesome.
You could have it suspend some save data at checkpoints throughout each block of castle so that death doesn't push you TOO far back, and you'd have a challenge that doesn't get frustrating.
It's something Symphony does well. You had save points NEAR bosses but you never have that really blatant one screen where each way goes to the boss, a save room, a teleporter, and the rest of the level.
A bunch of ideas for CV games keep floating around my head, and it's almost enough to make me want to get some threadbare hold on elementary game design to throw something together with 8-bit tools.
Symphony of the Night had the cool option of branching out your exploration sometimes in the first castle, but none doing one before the other didn't really reflect anything on your overall experience. I wish that idea would get expanded on more with later games, instead of holding your hand like they tend to do. Like, say you're in the clock tower, but there's too legs to explore--one with a lot of treacherous pendulum-jumping platforming portions, and another with a bunch of orange medusa heads. You could do either one first, but needless to say, whichever one you do first is going to be very hard. Putting two real hard portions right after each other would be tiring--but that's where the incentive comes in. Going through the medusa head portion might give you, say, a Bat or Owl transormation that you need to get through the game, and would subsequently make the pendulum portion easier (since you could just fly past them). But if you go through the pendulums first, you get a better way to reap the benefits of the Mirror Cuirass that lay just past it, that makes getting the Bat a whole lot easier.
SotN seemed to toy with ideas like this, but the rewards for the more optional portions seemed to be little less than novelties or idle stat-boosters, like the Crystal Cloak or something.
It's because a big part of Castlevania's gameplay (even in the original) is based around destroying enemy projectiles. If you can whip in eight directions it's physically impossible to lose unless they redesign the platform/enemy/aggressiveness from the ground up.
It's pointless to give multiple attack directions for the special weapons and other melee weapons. Their whole purpose is that they're special, each one being ideal for a specific situation.
I do question this, given that even WITH the multi-directional whipping, it's still a harder game than I remember.
Didn't the Genesis game have some multi-directional weapons as well?
At the very least, I wish the dangling-whip moves in PoR and the like were more flexible, instead of him standing there and the whip moving like it's alive, like in Captain N...
It's because a big part of Castlevania's gameplay (even in the original) is based around destroying enemy projectiles. If you can whip in eight directions it's physically impossible to lose unless they redesign the platform/enemy/aggressiveness from the ground up.
It's pointless to give multiple attack directions for the special weapons and other melee weapons. Their whole purpose is that they're special, each one being ideal for a specific situation.
I do question this, given that even WITH the multi-directional whipping, it's still a harder game than I remember.
Didn't the Genesis game have some multi-directional weapons as well?
At the very least, I wish the dangling-whip moves in PoR and the like were more flexible, instead of him standing there and the whip moving like it's alive, like in Captain N...
I, uh, I died a lot in Portrait and Dawn. Especially on Hard.
And I wasn't even asleep!
Yeah, I found Portrait of Ruin pretty tough towards the end.
Nest of Evil is a bitch.
Now, main reason I wanted to post, and I hope people catch this, is...
Well, I forget where, but I read that the original Rondo was going to be an unlockable.
I imagine this isn't going to set well with a lot of people here.
Though I think the same thing cited the 3-D one as slightly different, as per its remix status.
...Why wouldn't it? That's the primary reason I want the game.
Oh, wait--you mean it's unlockable as in not available from the start. Yeah, I heard that too--it doesn't sting that much. The remake doesn't look so bad in motion that I'd hate playing it. It can only look better at its proper resolution.
I do question this, given that even WITH the multi-directional whipping, it's still a harder game than I remember.
Didn't the Genesis game have some multi-directional weapons as well?
I'm pretty specific about it requiring the game's enemies/etc. to be designed around it. This is obviously the case for SCVIV (though I do find it very easy even now until around level seven) Bloodlines (much better challenge).
I agree about the whip dangling. I don't understand how in SCV4 they had Simon's arm able to pop into whatever direction you waved the whip but in later games they have the characters' hand move like half a pixel but have the whip fly all over the place.
Neo Rasa on
"You know how Batman hangs people over the edge of buildings and gets them to spill information. That's Neo Rasa's way of it, but instead of information, he just likes to see people suffer." ~Senor Fish
I've recently come to the conclusion that the Metroidvania's would be a lot cooler if they stopped putting save points right before bosses. They should put them right after, so that each area of the castle feels more like a linear side-scrolling level. Best of both worlds.
This is a GREAT idea. I'd also say remove all the items that give life back.
Part of what made the old games so good is that you really had to conserve life for the boss fights. In the latest DS and GBA games you walk in with a full stack of health and loads of cure items. Talk about handing you victory.
Well, I forget where, but I read that the original Rondo was going to be an unlockable.
I imagine this isn't going to set well with a lot of people here.
If that's true there will be a lot of well deserved bitching.
I do question this, given that even WITH the multi-directional whipping, it's still a harder game than I remember.
CV4 is a cake walk in places because of the multi directional/limp whip. Unless there are multiple projectiles from multiple angles you pretty much have a shield in front of you. In the older games you'd have to time your strikes right and if you missed you got burned.
It's personal taste though on this. CV4 is a more run and gun style game, 1/3 were very strategic in how you approached the level.
Don't get me wrong CV4 in it's entirety is a very hard game. But the extra angles/limp whip let you coast through situations that would have made you cry in the earlier games. But to make up for it CV adds a lot of new elements in that add to the complexity of the game.
The further I get in Super IV, the more often that's how a boss battle ends for me... if I win.
CV4 is probably the ultimate CV game for the "it's easier to beat it on one life because of triple shot if not reset and start over" logic. From the water hydra on all the bosses go down almost instantly if you have triple shot and boomerangs.
That might be personal experience though. CV4 was the first one I beat in a single life, and is one of the few that I can still (even without practice) one life within 6 or so tries (rondo not counted since it's to easy).
well I would like to see a CV1 remake with 8 direction whipping. The game is fun, but a lot of the difficulty is like Ninja Gaiden where some enemy placed at the right place knocks you into the abyss and you instantly die. That starts to get frustrating and just outright irritating.
well I would like to see a CV1 remake with 8 direction whipping. The game is fun, but a lot of the difficulty is like Ninja Gaiden where some enemy placed at the right place knocks you into the abyss and you instantly die. That starts to get frustrating and just outright irritating.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
The only level this "get knocked into the pit and die" is really bad on is level 2, and only on a certain stage (I think it's the third floor which is the second level with the medusa heads and 3 small platforms you need to hop on, and you can use the knock back to get hit by a head and skip half the floor in speed runs). For the rest of the game it's not that bad.
If you can make it pass that gap CV1 can be aced, also remember NOT to pick up the clock in level 2 and just go tripple shot boomerang. You can always spam 3 rangs and not worry about getting knocked out of the air.
Part of what made the old games great was the fact that you had to conserve your jumps and attacks. You can't just bulldoze through everything and not care if you get hit or not.
If I were to comment on the 3d graphics, I would say the lighting and textures in the first level are a bit bland, but it still looks cool. Maybe other levels will look better?
well I would like to see a CV1 remake with 8 direction whipping. The game is fun, but a lot of the difficulty is like Ninja Gaiden where some enemy placed at the right place knocks you into the abyss and you instantly die. That starts to get frustrating and just outright irritating.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
The only level this "get knocked into the pit and die" is really bad on is level 2, and only on a certain stage (I think it's the third floor which is the second level with the medusa heads and 3 small platforms you need to hop on, and you can use the knock back to get hit by a head and skip half the floor in speed runs). For the rest of the game it's not that bad.
If you can make it pass that gap CV1 can be aced, also remember NOT to pick up the clock in level 2 and just go tripple shot boomerang. You can always spam 3 rangs and not worry about getting knocked out of the air.
Part of what made the old games great was the fact that you had to conserve your jumps and attacks. You can't just bulldoze through everything and not care if you get hit or not.
well other problems were that simon controlled outright terribly. It was a lot better in Super CV4 with air control.
I'm not getting what people mean by it looking bland. Looks fine to me. Are people downloading the video and watching it on a bigger screen? Keep in mind this is on the PSP folks.
well I would like to see a CV1 remake with 8 direction whipping. The game is fun, but a lot of the difficulty is like Ninja Gaiden where some enemy placed at the right place knocks you into the abyss and you instantly die. That starts to get frustrating and just outright irritating.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
The only level this "get knocked into the pit and die" is really bad on is level 2, and only on a certain stage (I think it's the third floor which is the second level with the medusa heads and 3 small platforms you need to hop on, and you can use the knock back to get hit by a head and skip half the floor in speed runs). For the rest of the game it's not that bad.
If you can make it pass that gap CV1 can be aced, also remember NOT to pick up the clock in level 2 and just go tripple shot boomerang. You can always spam 3 rangs and not worry about getting knocked out of the air.
Part of what made the old games great was the fact that you had to conserve your jumps and attacks. You can't just bulldoze through everything and not care if you get hit or not.
well other problems were that simon controlled outright terribly. It was a lot better in Super CV4 with air control.
It was the lack of air control that made the jump situations in the early games hard. The ability to float back and forth removed that.
Why not just come out and say "hey lets remove everything that made the first games hard and nerf the crap out of them". I don't think that anything is wrong with that since they were/are damn hard.
But if we are going to remove all the skill from them it just wouldn't be the same.
I have an idea for the newer Metroidvanias: let's have some real level design. It's all good and well to focus somewhat on the bigger picture, by giving the players a bunch of interesting abilities and a million types of enemies. However, I'd like to see level design on par with Symphony and CV4.
I think that too many developers focus on the big picture too much, instead of trying to create wonderful moments that punctuate the gameplay. This, in my opinion, is what makes Symphony better than all of these newer handheld vanias, despite the fact that the handhelds have better abilities and such.
Finally watched the video. Some of the graphics look okay, some look terrible; I just prefer the drawn look of the PCE version. I see they are also doing new voice work for SOTN, which is quite disappointing. I'd rather they created some kind of hybrid version of SOTN that incorporates the extras from the Saturn version into the PS1 game. I mean, if you could play as Maria in that thing, I'd be a lot more likely to buy a PSP and the game.
TroubledTom on
Wii friend code: 8704 3489 1049 8917
Mario Kart DS: 3320 6595 7026 5000
well I would like to see a CV1 remake with 8 direction whipping. The game is fun, but a lot of the difficulty is like Ninja Gaiden where some enemy placed at the right place knocks you into the abyss and you instantly die. That starts to get frustrating and just outright irritating.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
The only level this "get knocked into the pit and die" is really bad on is level 2, and only on a certain stage (I think it's the third floor which is the second level with the medusa heads and 3 small platforms you need to hop on, and you can use the knock back to get hit by a head and skip half the floor in speed runs). For the rest of the game it's not that bad.
If you can make it pass that gap CV1 can be aced, also remember NOT to pick up the clock in level 2 and just go tripple shot boomerang. You can always spam 3 rangs and not worry about getting knocked out of the air.
Part of what made the old games great was the fact that you had to conserve your jumps and attacks. You can't just bulldoze through everything and not care if you get hit or not.
well other problems were that simon controlled outright terribly. It was a lot better in Super CV4 with air control.
It was the lack of air control that made the jump situations in the early games hard. The ability to float back and forth removed that.
Why not just come out and say "hey lets remove everything that made the first games hard and nerf the crap out of them". I don't think that anything is wrong with that since they were/are damn hard.
But if we are going to remove all the skill from them it just wouldn't be the same.
actually now that I think about it more, whipping probably wasn't a problem so much as air control and getting set very far backwards when hit.
I've recently come to the conclusion that the Metroidvania's would be a lot cooler if they stopped putting save points right before bosses. They should put them right after, so that each area of the castle feels more like a linear side-scrolling level. Best of both worlds.
This is a GREAT idea. I'd also say remove all the items that give life back.
Maybe if they also switched that to old-school, and made them exclusive to hidden breakable objects. You could still find them but no enemy would ever drop them, and they'd never just be lying around parts of the castle (god, Harmony of Dissonance was notorious for that).
Also, on thinking on it, I think another reason that people think SotN is so much bigger than the more recent games is that you can explore the Inverted Castle in any way you see fit; it doesn't really have any new abilities in it. The fact that you're never met with a boundary per se makes the game feel more open-ended and thus gives it the illusion of seeming bigger.
And TelMarine: Man, stay away from my old-school CV. Putting jump-control and eight-directional whipping in the original NES game would be like putting the raccoon tail in the first Super Mario Bros.
More on-topic--I have to say, there is one thing I like about the new graphics, and it's that this is the first 2D Castlevania since Super CV4 that actually looks dark and gritty. It's just a question of whether or not it looks that way on purpose. :P
I really, really hope those Richter soundbytes are just placeholders, though (since I think they just took them from Portrait of Ruin). I mean, they have to be--he says "Divine Storm" when he does the axe Item Crush. I hope they use a different VA... He sounds obnoxious at this point. Fuck, this better not be who they plan to replace his voice-work from SotN with!
The difficulty in CV1 and 3 were a bit much for me. I never beat either.
I do love CV2, though, and that's part of what drew me back into playing with PoR with the paintings. More of that kind of stuff, in addition to a nice chunk of castle to explore, please. Maybe have it so that the castle has several exits that lead off into different parts of the countryside.
As far as the multi-directional whip goes, while I'd like to see it kept in 2-D, it doesn't hurt my feelings that it's gone so much. Besides which, I rarely use whips, anyway. But it'd be a nice distinguishing feature.
But really, if they did another 3-D Castlevania like Lament, then that's where the dangling REALLY belongs...
LBD_Nytetrayn on
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
I'm stuck on the mummies in CV1. I always die when I reach them, then die harder on the next attempt because there are barely any hearts or upgrades on the last stage of the level.
The more I read this thread the more I realize the original Castlevania gameplay is not for me. I hated the first game and pretty much all the ideas of Making It More Difficult proposed on the last page.
I just can't stand platformers that are challenging because the controls are clumsy, as opposed to, well, every other reason evar.
I'm glad that Igarashi doesn't seem as cynical about the Wii as he did at first. I know he's not quite smitten with it, but I would really like to see a 3D Castlevania with multi-directional whipping, and I couldn't imagine that working on anything but the Wii.
Maybe if they also switched that to old-school, and made them exclusive to hidden breakable objects. You could still find them but no enemy would ever drop them, and they'd never just be lying around parts dhearts or upgrades on the last stage of the level.
Agreed.
I'm stuck on the mummies in CV1. I always die when I reach them, then die harder on the next attempt because there are barely any hearts or upgrades on the last stage of the level.
heh, you need to ace the first 4 levels in CV1.
Level one doesn't matter. At level 2 keep the boomerang and get hit to pop up a level on the 3rd floor (medusa heads and trick jumps), then grab the double shot and don't get killed by the spike press. You beat the boss for free.
On level 3 avoid all the weapon power ups, and get the triple shot. When you face the mummies crack the bricks you will get a steak. Then hop down under it and pelt said rangs as fast as you can, you'll kill both before you get hit.
After that on L4 again walk through it and don't pick up a weapon, then spam rangs at the frankenstien from the corner, he will die before you get hit.
The more I read this thread the more I realize the original Castlevania gameplay is not for me. I hated the first game and pretty much all the ideas of Making It More Difficult proposed on the last page.
I just can't stand platformers that are challenging because the controls are clumsy, as opposed to, well, every other reason evar.
The controls are not clumsy. :roll: They are very good. You just can't make stupid jumps or stupid attacks, and if you do then you deserve the death and start over.
The issue is that you don't get "zomg stupid jump my bad let me adjust 10 times in mid air and adjust for a silly attack at thin air" that some people think is better.
And TelMarine: Man, stay away from my old-school CV. Putting jump-control and eight-directional whipping in the original NES game would be like putting the raccoon tail in the first Super Mario Bros.
I have no problem playing through the old ones, but I said it would be interesting to play them with the added conventions of air control and directional whipping.
And TelMarine: Man, stay away from my old-school CV. Putting jump-control and eight-directional whipping in the original NES game would be like putting the raccoon tail in the first Super Mario Bros.
I have no problem playing through the old ones, but I said it would be interesting to play them with the added conventions of air control and directional whipping.
It sounds neat on paper, but it would totally off-set the intended purpose for the placement of enemies and pits. I can see how it'd be an interesting novelty, but it would wreck parts of the game for some people.
Besides, the later linear games with more leniant controls borrowed enough level designs from the NES games already. :P
And TelMarine: Man, stay away from my old-school CV. Putting jump-control and eight-directional whipping in the original NES game would be like putting the raccoon tail in the first Super Mario Bros.
I have no problem playing through the old ones, but I said it would be interesting to play them with the added conventions of air control and directional whipping.
It sounds neat on paper, but it would totally off-set the intended purpose for the placement of enemies and pits. I can see how it'd be an interesting novelty, but it would wreck parts of the game for some people.
Besides, the later linear games with more leniant controls borrowed enough level designs from the NES games already. :P
Seriously. If you want to play the original Castlevania with 8 way whipping, we already have Castlevania 4 for exactly that reason.
I'm stuck on the mummies in CV1. I always die when I reach them, then die harder on the next attempt because there are barely any hearts or upgrades on the last stage of the level.
If this is true, it's because you've fallen prey to the biggest challenge in CV1: misinformation.
There's a ton of strategies and tips that exist for the game that are simply useless.
What you need to do in Castlevania is this: There's a point in the second level where you can get the Holy Water. It's inbetween the crushers towards the end of the level. Use the Holy Water for the remainder of the game.
You can also get the Holy Water at the very beginning of level 3.
Get this and use it constantly, you'll get the triple shot for it in no time.
If you have Holy Water you can kill the Mummies without even being hittable by them because you can get on the uppermost platform where they can't reach you (don't be a chump and break the lowest block for the meat or you're screwed).
Also don't be a chump and get the dagger they put right before the entrance to the Mummies' screen. :x
There are odds that you can get an Axe from a normal bat, the Rosary, Ghosts can drop money bags, etc. You need to ignore this and just remember which candles drop what weapon so you can avoid all of them except for the ones that drop Holy Water (if you already have it they give you a big heart or a 300 point money bag).
Neo Rasa on
"You know how Batman hangs people over the edge of buildings and gets them to spill information. That's Neo Rasa's way of it, but instead of information, he just likes to see people suffer." ~Senor Fish
Maybe if they also switched that to old-school, and made them exclusive to hidden breakable objects. You could still find them but no enemy would ever drop them, and they'd never just be lying around parts dhearts or upgrades on the last stage of the level.
Agreed.
I'm stuck on the mummies in CV1. I always die when I reach them, then die harder on the next attempt because there are barely any hearts or upgrades on the last stage of the level.
heh, you need to ace the first 4 levels in CV1.
Level one doesn't matter. At level 2 keep the boomerang and get hit to pop up a level on the 3rd floor (medusa heads and trick jumps), then grab the double shot and don't get killed by the spike press. You beat the boss for free.
On level 3 avoid all the weapon power ups, and get the triple shot. When you face the mummies crack the bricks you will get a steak. Then hop down under it and pelt said rangs as fast as you can, you'll kill both before you get hit.
After that on L4 again walk through it and don't pick up a weapon, then spam rangs at the frankenstien from the corner, he will die before you get hit.
The more I read this thread the more I realize the original Castlevania gameplay is not for me. I hated the first game and pretty much all the ideas of Making It More Difficult proposed on the last page.
I just can't stand platformers that are challenging because the controls are clumsy, as opposed to, well, every other reason evar.
The controls are not clumsy. :roll: They are very good. You just can't make stupid jumps or stupid attacks, and if you do then you deserve the death and start over.
The issue is that you don't get "zomg stupid jump my bad let me adjust 10 times in mid air and adjust for a silly attack at thin air" that some people think is better.
Think before you act and plan each move.
Most of your posts in the last few pages I could tell were made by you prior to actually seeing who had written the post. You're perhaps the only person here who would roll their eyes at someone who disagreed with them, showing such little respect for them you might as well be spitting on them in person.
It's been quite a while since I've played the first Castlevania, but from Castlevania 3 I'd advise that you never pass up any candlesticks in a portion you're stuck on. I died a lot of times on CV3's second-to-last level before I bothered to jump on top of one of the spike sheets and smashed one of the candles for an axe. Then I finally got to the boss on a consistent basis! And I died there a bunch of times too. Fucking Doppelganger.
But I still absolutely adore that level for the sense of accomplishment I got in finally beating it. Hardest in the whole game.
It's been quite a while since I've played the first Castlevania, but from Castlevania 3 I'd advise that you never pass up any candlesticks in a portion you're stuck on. I died a lot of times on CV3's second-to-last level before I bothered to jump on top of one of the spike sheets and smashed one of the candles for an axe. Then I finally got to the boss on a consistent basis! And I died there a bunch of times too. Fucking Doppelganger.
But I still absolutely adore that level for the sense of accomplishment I got in finally beating it. Hardest in the whole game.
Fantastic level. It also helped that the song for it (Riddle) isn't reused from previous levels.
Neo Rasa on
"You know how Batman hangs people over the edge of buildings and gets them to spill information. That's Neo Rasa's way of it, but instead of information, he just likes to see people suffer." ~Senor Fish
It's been quite a while since I've played the first Castlevania, but from Castlevania 3 I'd advise that you never pass up any candlesticks in a portion you're stuck on. I died a lot of times on CV3's second-to-last level before I bothered to jump on top of one of the spike sheets and smashed one of the candles for an axe. Then I finally got to the boss on a consistent basis! And I died there a bunch of times too. Fucking Doppelganger.
But I still absolutely adore that level for the sense of accomplishment I got in finally beating it. Hardest in the whole game.
Fantastic level. It also helped that the song for it (Riddle) isn't reused from previous levels.
Yeah, that really disappointed me about the last stage.
That's because a lot of the game unfortunately does take place in some underground area depending on the route you take. While it has a great variety of levels I remember this was a criticism of the game even when it was brand new. Both Dracula's Curse and Simon's Quest were said to have areas that were a double edged sword since the games were huge compared to the original, but the original has six very different feeling areas.
The reused songs are some of the slower ones in the game too which hurts this. You have some of the more claustrophobic tracks in the game reused for, say, that one level that involves taking falling blocks up about seven screens. It feels like you're in a cave the whole time even though the background/etc. clearly has you ascending the mountainside.
Blitz: Yeah not even the original did that. They wisely only reused Stalker for 4-2 and 4-3 where it made sense since you were entering the second castle.
Neo Rasa on
"You know how Batman hangs people over the edge of buildings and gets them to spill information. That's Neo Rasa's way of it, but instead of information, he just likes to see people suffer." ~Senor Fish
Maybe Dracula was more clever about barricading his castle back in the day.
The only part that might have bugged me was the falling-block portion. It was an easy pattern; it just took a while to stack high enough.
I just flew up. :P
Neo Rasa on
"You know how Batman hangs people over the edge of buildings and gets them to spill information. That's Neo Rasa's way of it, but instead of information, he just likes to see people suffer." ~Senor Fish
Maybe Dracula was more clever about barricading his castle back in the day.
The only part that might have bugged me was the falling-block portion. It was an easy pattern; it just took a while to stack high enough.
I just flew up. :P
Was there any other way?
I...kept using Trevor. It was an easy pattern to recognize, so I would just stand on a safe column before a block fell on it, move out of the way in time, and then jump right back to the same column. I repeated that for about seven minutes. :P
Posts
I love the Metroidvanias on their own, but I'll always like the classic platformers more. Simon's Quest is an exception. Despite its flaws I consider it to be on par with the best in the series due to its atmosphere and actual exploration (that is to say, you've got very little direction to work with without it being TOO out there). If it didn't have a couple of "puzzles" that were physically impossible to figure out without help it'd be much better.
I've only played the metroidvanias:
-Circle of the Moon
-Harmony of Dissonance
-Aria of Sorrow
-Dawn of Sorrow
-Portrait of Ruin
I vaguely remember playing a castlevania when I was really young on some nintendo system (I want to say NES).
Pokeymanz: 0002-2940-9674
This would be awesome.
You could have it suspend some save data at checkpoints throughout each block of castle so that death doesn't push you TOO far back, and you'd have a challenge that doesn't get frustrating.
It's something Symphony does well. You had save points NEAR bosses but you never have that really blatant one screen where each way goes to the boss, a save room, a teleporter, and the rest of the level.
Symphony of the Night had the cool option of branching out your exploration sometimes in the first castle, but none doing one before the other didn't really reflect anything on your overall experience. I wish that idea would get expanded on more with later games, instead of holding your hand like they tend to do. Like, say you're in the clock tower, but there's too legs to explore--one with a lot of treacherous pendulum-jumping platforming portions, and another with a bunch of orange medusa heads. You could do either one first, but needless to say, whichever one you do first is going to be very hard. Putting two real hard portions right after each other would be tiring--but that's where the incentive comes in. Going through the medusa head portion might give you, say, a Bat or Owl transormation that you need to get through the game, and would subsequently make the pendulum portion easier (since you could just fly past them). But if you go through the pendulums first, you get a better way to reap the benefits of the Mirror Cuirass that lay just past it, that makes getting the Bat a whole lot easier.
SotN seemed to toy with ideas like this, but the rewards for the more optional portions seemed to be little less than novelties or idle stat-boosters, like the Crystal Cloak or something.
I do question this, given that even WITH the multi-directional whipping, it's still a harder game than I remember.
Didn't the Genesis game have some multi-directional weapons as well?
At the very least, I wish the dangling-whip moves in PoR and the like were more flexible, instead of him standing there and the whip moving like it's alive, like in Captain N...
The further I get in Super IV, the more often that's how a boss battle ends for me... if I win.
Nest of Evil is a bitch.
Now, main reason I wanted to post, and I hope people catch this, is...
Well, I forget where, but I read that the original Rondo was going to be an unlockable.
I imagine this isn't going to set well with a lot of people here.
Though I think the same thing cited the 3-D one as slightly different, as per its remix status.
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
Oh, wait--you mean it's unlockable as in not available from the start. Yeah, I heard that too--it doesn't sting that much. The remake doesn't look so bad in motion that I'd hate playing it. It can only look better at its proper resolution.
I'm pretty specific about it requiring the game's enemies/etc. to be designed around it. This is obviously the case for SCVIV (though I do find it very easy even now until around level seven) Bloodlines (much better challenge).
I agree about the whip dangling. I don't understand how in SCV4 they had Simon's arm able to pop into whatever direction you waved the whip but in later games they have the characters' hand move like half a pixel but have the whip fly all over the place.
This is a GREAT idea. I'd also say remove all the items that give life back.
Part of what made the old games so good is that you really had to conserve life for the boss fights. In the latest DS and GBA games you walk in with a full stack of health and loads of cure items. Talk about handing you victory.
If that's true there will be a lot of well deserved bitching.
CV4 is a cake walk in places because of the multi directional/limp whip. Unless there are multiple projectiles from multiple angles you pretty much have a shield in front of you. In the older games you'd have to time your strikes right and if you missed you got burned.
It's personal taste though on this. CV4 is a more run and gun style game, 1/3 were very strategic in how you approached the level.
Don't get me wrong CV4 in it's entirety is a very hard game. But the extra angles/limp whip let you coast through situations that would have made you cry in the earlier games. But to make up for it CV adds a lot of new elements in that add to the complexity of the game.
CV4 is probably the ultimate CV game for the "it's easier to beat it on one life because of triple shot if not reset and start over" logic. From the water hydra on all the bosses go down almost instantly if you have triple shot and boomerangs.
That might be personal experience though. CV4 was the first one I beat in a single life, and is one of the few that I can still (even without practice) one life within 6 or so tries (rondo not counted since it's to easy).
and since i finished PoR before ever seeing SotN, i had some fun at the beginning of SotN with the "final stage"
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
The only level this "get knocked into the pit and die" is really bad on is level 2, and only on a certain stage (I think it's the third floor which is the second level with the medusa heads and 3 small platforms you need to hop on, and you can use the knock back to get hit by a head and skip half the floor in speed runs). For the rest of the game it's not that bad.
If you can make it pass that gap CV1 can be aced, also remember NOT to pick up the clock in level 2 and just go tripple shot boomerang. You can always spam 3 rangs and not worry about getting knocked out of the air.
Part of what made the old games great was the fact that you had to conserve your jumps and attacks. You can't just bulldoze through everything and not care if you get hit or not.
If I were to comment on the 3d graphics, I would say the lighting and textures in the first level are a bit bland, but it still looks cool. Maybe other levels will look better?
well other problems were that simon controlled outright terribly. It was a lot better in Super CV4 with air control.
Mind you, I may just not be picky.
It was the lack of air control that made the jump situations in the early games hard. The ability to float back and forth removed that.
Why not just come out and say "hey lets remove everything that made the first games hard and nerf the crap out of them". I don't think that anything is wrong with that since they were/are damn hard.
But if we are going to remove all the skill from them it just wouldn't be the same.
I think that too many developers focus on the big picture too much, instead of trying to create wonderful moments that punctuate the gameplay. This, in my opinion, is what makes Symphony better than all of these newer handheld vanias, despite the fact that the handhelds have better abilities and such.
You mess with the dolphin, you get the nose.
Mario Kart DS: 3320 6595 7026 5000
actually now that I think about it more, whipping probably wasn't a problem so much as air control and getting set very far backwards when hit.
Also, on thinking on it, I think another reason that people think SotN is so much bigger than the more recent games is that you can explore the Inverted Castle in any way you see fit; it doesn't really have any new abilities in it. The fact that you're never met with a boundary per se makes the game feel more open-ended and thus gives it the illusion of seeming bigger.
And TelMarine: Man, stay away from my old-school CV. Putting jump-control and eight-directional whipping in the original NES game would be like putting the raccoon tail in the first Super Mario Bros.
More on-topic--I have to say, there is one thing I like about the new graphics, and it's that this is the first 2D Castlevania since Super CV4 that actually looks dark and gritty. It's just a question of whether or not it looks that way on purpose. :P
I really, really hope those Richter soundbytes are just placeholders, though (since I think they just took them from Portrait of Ruin). I mean, they have to be--he says "Divine Storm" when he does the axe Item Crush.
I do love CV2, though, and that's part of what drew me back into playing with PoR with the paintings. More of that kind of stuff, in addition to a nice chunk of castle to explore, please. Maybe have it so that the castle has several exits that lead off into different parts of the countryside.
As far as the multi-directional whip goes, while I'd like to see it kept in 2-D, it doesn't hurt my feelings that it's gone so much. Besides which, I rarely use whips, anyway. But it'd be a nice distinguishing feature.
But really, if they did another 3-D Castlevania like Lament, then that's where the dangling REALLY belongs...
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
I just can't stand platformers that are challenging because the controls are clumsy, as opposed to, well, every other reason evar.
Agreed.
heh, you need to ace the first 4 levels in CV1.
Level one doesn't matter. At level 2 keep the boomerang and get hit to pop up a level on the 3rd floor (medusa heads and trick jumps), then grab the double shot and don't get killed by the spike press. You beat the boss for free.
On level 3 avoid all the weapon power ups, and get the triple shot. When you face the mummies crack the bricks you will get a steak. Then hop down under it and pelt said rangs as fast as you can, you'll kill both before you get hit.
After that on L4 again walk through it and don't pick up a weapon, then spam rangs at the frankenstien from the corner, he will die before you get hit.
The controls are not clumsy. :roll: They are very good. You just can't make stupid jumps or stupid attacks, and if you do then you deserve the death and start over.
The issue is that you don't get "zomg stupid jump my bad let me adjust 10 times in mid air and adjust for a silly attack at thin air" that some people think is better.
Think before you act and plan each move.
I have no problem playing through the old ones, but I said it would be interesting to play them with the added conventions of air control and directional whipping.
Besides, the later linear games with more leniant controls borrowed enough level designs from the NES games already. :P
Seriously. If you want to play the original Castlevania with 8 way whipping, we already have Castlevania 4 for exactly that reason.
If this is true, it's because you've fallen prey to the biggest challenge in CV1: misinformation.
There's a ton of strategies and tips that exist for the game that are simply useless.
What you need to do in Castlevania is this: There's a point in the second level where you can get the Holy Water. It's inbetween the crushers towards the end of the level. Use the Holy Water for the remainder of the game.
You can also get the Holy Water at the very beginning of level 3.
Get this and use it constantly, you'll get the triple shot for it in no time.
If you have Holy Water you can kill the Mummies without even being hittable by them because you can get on the uppermost platform where they can't reach you (don't be a chump and break the lowest block for the meat or you're screwed).
Also don't be a chump and get the dagger they put right before the entrance to the Mummies' screen. :x
There are odds that you can get an Axe from a normal bat, the Rosary, Ghosts can drop money bags, etc. You need to ignore this and just remember which candles drop what weapon so you can avoid all of them except for the ones that drop Holy Water (if you already have it they give you a big heart or a 300 point money bag).
Most of your posts in the last few pages I could tell were made by you prior to actually seeing who had written the post. You're perhaps the only person here who would roll their eyes at someone who disagreed with them, showing such little respect for them you might as well be spitting on them in person.
But I still absolutely adore that level for the sense of accomplishment I got in finally beating it. Hardest in the whole game.
Fantastic level. It also helped that the song for it (Riddle) isn't reused from previous levels.
I felt as though too much of it took place in some kind of underground area.
The reused songs are some of the slower ones in the game too which hurts this. You have some of the more claustrophobic tracks in the game reused for, say, that one level that involves taking falling blocks up about seven screens. It feels like you're in a cave the whole time even though the background/etc. clearly has you ascending the mountainside.
Blitz: Yeah not even the original did that. They wisely only reused Stalker for 4-2 and 4-3 where it made sense since you were entering the second castle.
The only part that might have bugged me was the falling-block portion. It was an easy pattern; it just took a while to stack high enough.
I just flew up. :P
Was there any other way?