This show is awesome and everyone in this thread saying it isn't awesome totally sucks.
I hated it the first season, but finally gave in and watched season two...and ended up going through the whole season 2 and season 3 so far in the span of a few days.
I still can't figure out what exactly changed between s1 and s2, but something did, and it fucking works.
It stopped trying to be The Office: Government Edition.
I think part of the difference was character-wise, especially a) making Leslie her own character instead of a female Michael Scott, and b) making Andy a lovable goof instead of a lazy slob mooching off Ann.
The other part was making the tone of the show more positive. In the beginning when the lot project was starting, the running theme seemed to be that the department was pathetic and never really accomplished anything useful. But as Leslie changed to become hyper-competent, the department became an overlooked but vital part of the community, one of the few parts of Pawnee's government that actually got things done and improved people's lives.
This show is awesome and everyone in this thread saying it isn't awesome totally sucks.
I hated it the first season, but finally gave in and watched season two...and ended up going through the whole season 2 and season 3 so far in the span of a few days.
I still can't figure out what exactly changed between s1 and s2, but something did, and it fucking works.
It stopped trying to be The Office: Government Edition.
I think part of the difference was character-wise, especially a) making Leslie her own character instead of a female Michael Scott, and b) making Andy a lovable goof instead of a lazy slob mooching off Ann.
The other part was making the tone of the show more positive. In the beginning when the lot project was starting, the running theme seemed to be that the department was pathetic and never really accomplished anything useful. But as Leslie changed to become hyper-competent, the department became an overlooked but vital part of the community, one of the few parts of Pawnee's government that actually got things done and improved people's lives.
Edit: I was eating dinner, you beat me to the punch!
The show also dumped mean spirited sarcasm and cynicism. It's like the writers listened to Conan O'Brian's exit speech on his last Tonight Show, took it to heart, and started to write a show overflowing with good nature, hope and celebration of doing your job to the best of your abilities. The exact opposite traits of most sitcoms.
I think it has to do with the character of Mark Brendanawicz being put on the bus and sent off.
This show is awesome and everyone in this thread saying it isn't awesome totally sucks.
I hated it the first season, but finally gave in and watched season two...and ended up going through the whole season 2 and season 3 so far in the span of a few days.
I still can't figure out what exactly changed between s1 and s2, but something did, and it fucking works.
It stopped trying to be The Office: Government Edition.
I think part of the difference was character-wise, especially a) making Leslie her own character instead of a female Michael Scott, and b) making Andy a lovable goof instead of a lazy slob mooching off Ann.
The other part was making the tone of the show more positive. In the beginning when the lot project was starting, the running theme seemed to be that the department was pathetic and never really accomplished anything useful. But as Leslie changed to become hyper-competent, the department became an overlooked but vital part of the community, one of the few parts of Pawnee's government that actually got things done and improved people's lives.
Edit: I was eating dinner, you beat me to the punch!
The show also dumped mean spirited sarcasm and cynicism. It's like the writers listened to Conan O'Brian's exit speech on his last Tonight Show, took it to heart, and started to write a show overflowing with good nature, hope and celebration of doing your job to the best of your abilities. The exact opposite traits of most sitcoms.
I think it has to do with the character of Mark Brendanawicz being put on the bus and sent off.
Which didn't happen until way after the show had hit its stride, there's only like ten episodes he's not in. Not even in the sense of him being written to a lesser role.
Never got the hate on him, he was not a big problem when the show was good, he sucked when it sucked because the show sucked.
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"Grip 'em up, grip 'em, grip 'em good, said the Gryphon... to the pig."
I didn't mind Mark, but I think it's telling that I didn't even remember or notice that he was gone until I read something online about it after we were already well into this season.
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DHSChase lizards.....bark at donkeys..Registered Userregular
I didn't mind Mark, but I think it's telling that I didn't even remember or notice that he was gone until I read something online about it after we were already well into this season.
I wouldn't say I was a huge fan either, but his presence wasn't always a drag or boring to me like some people make it out to be. Him being the Only Sane Man was a bad idea, and tainted the character a little from the get go, but when they stopped emphasizing that I didn't notice him as a huge negative or even bad at all. Some moments like him trying to help Ron with getting his shop up to code are as funny as anything on the show.
DHS on
"Grip 'em up, grip 'em, grip 'em good, said the Gryphon... to the pig."
I didn't mind Mark, but I think it's telling that I didn't even remember or notice that he was gone until I read something online about it after we were already well into this season.
I wouldn't say I was a huge fan either, but his presence wasn't always a drag or boring to me like some people make it out to be. Him being the Only Sane Man was a bad idea, and tainted the character a little from the get go, but when they stopped emphasizing that I didn't notice him as a huge negative or even bad at all. Some moments like him trying to help Ron with getting his shop up to code are as funny as anything on the show.
I guess I like Ben's "fish out of water with baggage" character better.
For example his reaction to Lil' Sebastian was great, as was throwing the cologne into the guy's car. You wouldn't get that with Mark.
Plus the Ben character just works better with Leslie's. The character of Mark just came off as a date rapist asshole to me for some reason.
What's weird with this show is the more over the top they try to make Ron Swanson and Tom the more grounded I think they become. And they finally found the right balance with April and make better use of Ann.
I didn't mind Mark, but I think it's telling that I didn't even remember or notice that he was gone until I read something online about it after we were already well into this season.
I wouldn't say I was a huge fan either, but his presence wasn't always a drag or boring to me like some people make it out to be. Him being the Only Sane Man was a bad idea, and tainted the character a little from the get go, but when they stopped emphasizing that I didn't notice him as a huge negative or even bad at all. Some moments like him trying to help Ron with getting his shop up to code are as funny as anything on the show.
I guess I like Ben's "fish out of water with baggage" character better.
For example his reaction to Lil' Sebastian was great, as was throwing the cologne into the guy's car. You wouldn't get that with Mark.
Plus the Ben character just works better with Leslie's. The character of Mark just came off as a date rapist asshole to me for some reason.
What's weird with this show is the more over the top they try to make Ron Swanson and Tom the more grounded I think they become. And they finally found the right balance with April and make better use of Ann.
I agree with you about all of this except Ann.
It feels like they don't really know what to do with her this season because of Leslie's growth and newfound confidence. Ann served as a really good foil for Leslie early on but now is kind of stumbling and trying on different personalities and it feels like the writers need to sit down and figure out what to do with her.
Andy has grown as a character immensely since the beginning, but Ann is just treading water and it's starting to show. Other than the Flu episode she hasn't really done anything in quite a while.
Mark was just kinda...there. He didn't offend me or drag the show down, but I never actively thought anything else positive or negative about him either. The only plotline involving him I can remember is the woodshop storyline that DHS mentioned, and that he dated Ann (I...think. I don't remember anything specific about them dating).
Ben is pretty much Mark after the writers learned that a "outside the crazy group looking in" character only works if you give him a personality, issues, and characteristics besides "he's not like them".
Also:
"Andy and April are getting married."
"Wow, my Britta filter is older than their relationship. Wait... should I change my Britta filter?"
That line nearly killed me.
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Donkey KongPutting Nintendo out of business with AI nipsRegistered Userregular
edited April 2011
Depends on how much you use it.
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Thousands of hot, local singles are waiting to play at bubbulon.com.
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AtomikaLive fast and get fucked or whateverRegistered Userregular
edited April 2011
I loved how much Chris scared the creepy emo kid through sheer interest and positivity.
I submit that this show became amazing for three reasons.
1) They turned Leslie from Season 1 Michael Scott (incredibly unlikeable and uninteresting and incompetent) to later seasons of Michael Scott (loveable and cute and regularly does great things).
2) They got rid of Mark, whose job apparently was to make fun of everyone else for being kooky because he was the only normal guy.
3) Ron fucking Swanson. They let the Swanson loose and it is amazing.
I don't think Leslie shifted from one form of Michael Scott to another - I think they've almost completely left the comparison behind. At this point she's smarter and more competent then Michael; her biggest problem being that she's at times a bit overly optimistic and naive about what she/the government can do and to the public's response. Also, the people around her are more genuinely her friends than the people Michael works with.
Leslie's definitely hyper-competent in a way Michael Scott never has been. There's been quite a few episodes where they've shown just how hard she works and how things fall apart without her around. She's also become a bit less naive, like in season one in the one episode with the mannish hairdo, I feel like season two Leslie wouldn't be quite that oblivious. She definitely handled her relationship with Officer Louis C.K. way better than she handled her weird crush on Mark in season one.
Rob Lowe continues to play the straight man to ... everybody and he's great at it! How can this show be so fucking funny week after week? I love NBC Thursdays!
Rob Lowe continues to play the straight man to ... everybody and he's great at it! How can this show be so fucking funny week after week? I love NBC Thursdays!
I know. It really bothers me that NBC can have 4-ish (for those who don't like Office or 30 Rock or whatever) shows that are consistently funny, yet they're apparently generally on the low end of the basic network ratings.
I thought Andy and April's lifestyle was a little outrageous, but then I looked around my room and noticed Empty Beer Carton Mountain in the corner near Plateau de Dirty Laundry.
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I submit that anyone who is unmoved by April and Andy's relationship is not in possession of a soul.
I think part of the difference was character-wise, especially a) making Leslie her own character instead of a female Michael Scott, and b) making Andy a lovable goof instead of a lazy slob mooching off Ann.
The other part was making the tone of the show more positive. In the beginning when the lot project was starting, the running theme seemed to be that the department was pathetic and never really accomplished anything useful. But as Leslie changed to become hyper-competent, the department became an overlooked but vital part of the community, one of the few parts of Pawnee's government that actually got things done and improved people's lives.
Edit: I was eating dinner, you beat me to the punch!
The show also dumped mean spirited sarcasm and cynicism. It's like the writers listened to Conan O'Brian's exit speech on his last Tonight Show, took it to heart, and started to write a show overflowing with good nature, hope and celebration of doing your job to the best of your abilities. The exact opposite traits of most sitcoms.
I think it has to do with the character of Mark Brendanawicz being put on the bus and sent off.
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Which didn't happen until way after the show had hit its stride, there's only like ten episodes he's not in. Not even in the sense of him being written to a lesser role.
Never got the hate on him, he was not a big problem when the show was good, he sucked when it sucked because the show sucked.
I wouldn't say I was a huge fan either, but his presence wasn't always a drag or boring to me like some people make it out to be. Him being the Only Sane Man was a bad idea, and tainted the character a little from the get go, but when they stopped emphasizing that I didn't notice him as a huge negative or even bad at all. Some moments like him trying to help Ron with getting his shop up to code are as funny as anything on the show.
I guess I like Ben's "fish out of water with baggage" character better.
For example his reaction to Lil' Sebastian was great, as was throwing the cologne into the guy's car. You wouldn't get that with Mark.
Plus the Ben character just works better with Leslie's. The character of Mark just came off as a date rapist asshole to me for some reason.
What's weird with this show is the more over the top they try to make Ron Swanson and Tom the more grounded I think they become. And they finally found the right balance with April and make better use of Ann.
I agree with you about all of this except Ann.
It feels like they don't really know what to do with her this season because of Leslie's growth and newfound confidence. Ann served as a really good foil for Leslie early on but now is kind of stumbling and trying on different personalities and it feels like the writers need to sit down and figure out what to do with her.
Andy has grown as a character immensely since the beginning, but Ann is just treading water and it's starting to show. Other than the Flu episode she hasn't really done anything in quite a while.
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Ben is pretty much Mark after the writers learned that a "outside the crazy group looking in" character only works if you give him a personality, issues, and characteristics besides "he's not like them".
I love this show so much.
Also:
"Andy and April are getting married."
"Wow, my Britta filter is older than their relationship. Wait... should I change my Britta filter?"
That line nearly killed me.
Whaa? Where do you get this specifically?
1) They turned Leslie from Season 1 Michael Scott (incredibly unlikeable and uninteresting and incompetent) to later seasons of Michael Scott (loveable and cute and regularly does great things).
2) They got rid of Mark, whose job apparently was to make fun of everyone else for being kooky because he was the only normal guy.
3) Ron fucking Swanson. They let the Swanson loose and it is amazing.
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I call noodles "long-ass rice".
Man, now I want to make up random names for stuff, too.
I know. It really bothers me that NBC can have 4-ish (for those who don't like Office or 30 Rock or whatever) shows that are consistently funny, yet they're apparently generally on the low end of the basic network ratings.
I don't understand it at all.
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"I'm just making sure no one ever has to eat this." That line just killed me.
I'll watch it again just for the Ron Swanson art opening speech.
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