Our new Indie Games subforum is now open for business in G&T. Go and check it out, you might land a code for a free game. If you're developing an indie game and want to post about it, follow these directions. If you don't, he'll break your legs! Hahaha! Seriously though.
Our rules have been updated and given their own forum. Go and look at them! They are nice, and there may be new ones that you didn't know about! Hooray for rules! Hooray for The System! Hooray for Conforming!

[Dead Island] Please post in new thread

1235797

Posts

  • RoyceSraphimRoyceSraphim Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I thought it was the zombies hungering for flesh and the disease piggy backing on their saliva. Zombies sate their hunger and disease moves on to new host, win/win....except for the host.

  • KlashKlash Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    It depends on what kind of zombie/who's writing. Max Brooks would tell you it's a virus, and the bite is to continue infection, by over charging a desire to eat, or so those in his zombie-verse conjecture it might be. Romero would say "because", Return of the Living Dead says its because brains contain endorphins which easy the pain of being walking rot. The only zombies that ever actually said brains were the Return of the Living Dead zombies and that was a comedy, with invincible zombies (even cutting them into separate limbs and pieces doesn't stop the individual parts from moving), and every other zombie from any other media has always been "eat entire body". 'Cept old school voodoo zombies, but they don't count because they're boring and not fun to hit with stuff.

    Basically "just because".

    We don't even care... whether we care or not...
  • Mr PinkMr Pink Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I just watched that trailer with the sound off at work and DAMN.

    Not sure I want to watch it with audio.

    Also, I agree about the respawn thing. Have a set number of zombies. A horde is scary in one way, but knowing that there is one zombie hiding somewhere in the building you are exploring is an entirely different scare.

  • ChanceChance Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Kaseius wrote: »
    I personally thought it was pretty cool, but it didn't really make me sad and I cry like a bitch at really silly things. Just didn't do anything for me other than make me want to see gameplay and watch it in reverse-reverse

    Yep. I assume everyone's already seen the reverse-reversed cut already, yeah? I don't have to post that?

    Ah, third page. Good.

    Oh, and it did make me a little sad. That was a said trailer. And I too well up for weird things. The end of Okami/Prince of Persia: The Sands of Time/BioShock 2, for example.

    OuFrYk0.jpg
    'Chance, you are the best kind of whore.' -Henroid
  • KageraKagera Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    A zombie's first concern is getting a chunk of flesh. His next concern is consuming as much of that flesh as possible (which is funny concern a dead person's esophagus shouldn't even work but HAHA DISBELIEF). If it gets a big enough chunk they will even lose interest in the owner of that chunk until their hands no longer have flesh to consume. It's like a plate full of burgers you only take as much as your hands can carry and return for more later if there is any left.

    “This is America. We’re entitled to our opinions.”
    “Wrong. This is Texas. And my opinion is the only one that counts."
  • DunxcoDunxco Should get a suit Never skips breakfastRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I thought it was the zombies hungering for flesh and the disease piggy backing on their saliva. Zombies sate their hunger and disease moves on to new host, win/win....except for the host.

    Well in some fiction corpses are too badly damaged by zombies chowing down on them to reanimate. The corpse at the top of the stairs in Night of the Living Dead, Kenneth in Resident Evil etc. I don't think anyone's ever gone into whether or not zombies have an instinct to spread the infection? But yeah it wouldn't matter because that's piggybacking on the far more important instinct to feed.
    Kagera wrote: »
    A zombie's first concern is getting a chunk of flesh. His next concern is consuming as much of that flesh as possible (which is funny concern a dead person's esophagus shouldn't even work but HAHA DISBELIEF).

    Didn't Brooks go into this as well? Like, a zombie will eat, even though the digestive track is non-functional, so it'll just fill up with flesh and then eventually burst out? D:

  • KageraKagera Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Also that cut on the kid's neck does not seem to have a source I can find. It just kinda appears.

    “This is America. We’re entitled to our opinions.”
    “Wrong. This is Texas. And my opinion is the only one that counts."
  • MagicPrimeMagicPrime "We're ready to believe you..." FireSideWizardRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I think the problem with this is that, while it sounds amazing and eerie and thematic on paper, the absolute worst element of sandbox gameplay is that stretch of time when you're wandering around in the middle of nowhere, getting nothing interesting done, wondering "what the fuck is there to do around here?"

    It would be extremely difficult, I would imagine, to walk that fine line between quiet, eerie tension, and utter boredom. After a while the world would just empty out and there would have to be something there to keep players playing.

    Isn't this normally when the Military shows up?

    55uviDS.png
    This neo-feudalism would be more tolerable if our betters had fancy titles.
  • DanHibikiDanHibiki Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    i have a general question about zombies

    is the point to eat someone entirely? or do they bite merely to infect?

    both methods kill, but only one results in +1 to the zombie population. they do seem to be competing goals.

    well they only get the chance to munch on a person when they've swarmed the target so they already reached the critical mass that goes from the mild threat of one shambling corpse to OMG there's no where to run.

    At which point adding more zombies is not a necessity and they can just munch down on who ever.

    The better question is where does all the stuff they eat go?
    They don't have any functioning organs, so they must eat until they burst or something.
    Or maybe the meat just goes right through them... Might explain why they all shamble as if there's a load in their pants.

    sig_zpsf0994cbd.jpg
  • POKÉMON MASTER WT SHERMANPOKÉMON MASTER WT SHERMAN She said, "What? Is this about my ass?" and I said, "No. Kind of." rockville, mdRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Sorenson wrote: »
    One thing that's also going to be great, provided they actually go through with it, is how players are going to react to other players getting killed and then reanimating later on in co-op. Like Honky and some other dudes getting ambushed and Honky gets his balls bitten off and dies or whatever, but then later on as the survivors are dealing with another group he and his damn hat show up in the midst of a horde. Will they be able to deal with him and push through whatever attachments they had for him, or will the shock of seeing him and the natural instincts to work with and defend your fellow survivors be enough to screw them up for the brief window needed for them to get overrun?

    This thing NEEDS some kind of input and video recording and stuff, this could be just as much academic as entertaining.
    quoting this from pages and pages ago, but I think you're reading way too much into this

    When I play zombies gametypes in Halo I will shoot my former teammates. I don't see any reason to think that I would hesitate to beat them to redeath in this just because they're using a character model that looks a bit like their old one. The goal is to win

    JlpWrqS.png
    steam | xbox live: IGNORANT HARLOT | psn: MadRoll | nintendo network: spinach
    3ds: 1504-5717-8252
  • MachismoMachismo Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Why do I keep think Just Cause 2 with Zombies?

    The island looks like it is straight out of JC2. Honestly, I worry that I will be disappointed if I don't have a grappling hook and 100 meters long with infinite parachutes.

    steam_sig.png
  • curly haired boycurly haired boy Your Friendly Neighborhood Torgue Dealer Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    i only ask because in the old RE games the zombies would definitely kill you and then kneel down and start feeding on your body

    then in L4D they only seem interested in killing you and then they lose interest.

    to extrapolate: zombie 1 wants human flesh, bites person 2. person 2 mebbe gets an arm divot or loses a finger or two. later person 2 becomes zombie 2. process repeats.

    assuming zombies don't like the flesh of their own, the only time zombies actually get to FEED is when they corner someone who can't get away. it's like there's this limited window of opportunity where they can eat someone without the flesh turning enough to be unpalatable.

    mebbe this is why zombies are always hungry.

    RxI0N.png
    Registered just for the Mass Effect threads | Steam: click ^^^ | Origin: curlyhairedboy | blog
  • GreenGreen Stick around. I'm full of bad ideas.Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Kagera wrote: »
    Also that cut on the kid's neck does not seem to have a source I can find. It just kinda appears.

    The father also hits the bellhop zombie in the neck with the axe to get him off of her, but there's no wound until the second axe hit that almost decapitates him

    IsaacSig.png
    3DS: 3007 8087 2767 | Nintendo ID: AngryFrog
  • DunxcoDunxco Should get a suit Never skips breakfastRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    What's also weird in like, most zombie films/games I've seen/played is that zombies will gnaw on a fresh corpse, and then see someone else walking round, stop eating, get up, and go chasing after them instead. They have a perfectly good food source on the ground in front of them and yet they'll ditch it for something "fresher". Why is this?

    Like, say you were at a restaurant and ordered beef, and it's delicious, then someone at another table orders duck and you think "Fuck this, I'm going to get some of that duck".

    Zombies are picky fuckers.

  • KageraKagera Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Dunxco wrote: »
    What's also weird in like, most zombie films/games I've seen/played is that zombies will gnaw on a fresh corpse, and then see someone else walking round, stop eating, get up, and go chasing after them instead. They have a perfectly good food source on the ground in front of them and yet they'll ditch it for something "fresher". Why is this?

    Like, say you were at a restaurant and ordered beef, and it's delicious, then someone at another table orders duck and you think "Fuck this, I'm going to get some of that duck".

    Zombies are picky fuckers.

    They like it when they're still struggling.

    “This is America. We’re entitled to our opinions.”
    “Wrong. This is Texas. And my opinion is the only one that counts."
  • JintorJintor Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    All the people saying the trailer was trying too hard remind me of the crab bucket. Games try and escape this place where they can't do jack shit but everybody hauls them back in. "GAMES CAN'T DO THAT".

    Why can't this trailer and possibly game do to me what World War Z did to me? Why is one a try-hard attempt to invoke emotion and the other an acceptably freaky novel about zombies?

    Fuckin' crab bucket.

  • IcemopperIcemopper Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I don't know about a crab bucket but I think I agree with you.

    Watching the trailer, my emotions went all over the place.

    Reading a good Zombie book, it does the same.

    Watching good horror movies, I'm scared shitless half the time.

    These aren't enjoyable or fun, but they get my adrenaline going, my mind confused, and my thoughts challenged, and I like it.

    7nUkagJ.png
    SteamID:Icemopper PSN:Icemopper
  • Bacon-BuTTyBacon-BuTTy Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I don't get the crab bucket thing, but I am with you.

    I watched this again today when I got home from work and tiny bits of Jankiness aside, I love this trailer.

    Automasig.jpg
  • JintorJintor Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    If you put a bunch of crabs in a bucket, none of them will escape, because they continually grab one another and pull them back down.

  • ElvenshaeElvenshae Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I don't get the crab bucket thing, but I am with you.

    Put a bunch of live, otherwise-edible crabs in a bucket, and fill it almost up to the top with them.

    Working together, they could easily push most of themselves out of the bucket, to freedom.

    Even without working together, a particularly enterprising crab could hop on the backs of his co-prisoners and escape.

    However, the other crabs won't let him do this. Instead, they'll spend a lot of effort pulling the other crab down, back into the bucket.

    It's all metaphorical and shit.

  • Big ClassyBig Classy Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Y'all be watching too much Romeo Must Die.

    camo_sig2.png
    My Backloggery PSN: Bigisy24
  • POKÉMON MASTER WT SHERMANPOKÉMON MASTER WT SHERMAN She said, "What? Is this about my ass?" and I said, "No. Kind of." rockville, mdRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Jintor wrote: »
    All the people saying the trailer was trying too hard remind me of the crab bucket. Games try and escape this place where they can't do jack shit but everybody hauls them back in. "GAMES CAN'T DO THAT".

    Why can't this trailer and possibly game do to me what World War Z did to me? Why is one a try-hard attempt to invoke emotion and the other an acceptably freaky novel about zombies?

    Fuckin' crab bucket.
    Because WWZ was an allegory about various manifestations of societal myopia and this is, from the trailer, about a guy chopping up zombies with an axe, putting it at best at violent and all-encompassing revenge story

    Max Payne did the upset-dad thing quite a few years ago

    JlpWrqS.png
    steam | xbox live: IGNORANT HARLOT | psn: MadRoll | nintendo network: spinach
    3ds: 1504-5717-8252
  • Bacon-BuTTyBacon-BuTTy Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Right ... ok ...

    That seems like maybe an antiquated and overly elaborate metaphor, but having said that I can't think of a better one.

    Again though, I agree. Even if this isn't the best example of Video Games trying to get out of the metaphorical bucket, I am still glad that someone is trying.

    I also fully accept that this may not be an accurate indication of the finished product. But even if it isn't, it's a fucking good trailer.

    Automasig.jpg
  • IcemopperIcemopper Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Jintor wrote: »
    All the people saying the trailer was trying too hard remind me of the crab bucket. Games try and escape this place where they can't do jack shit but everybody hauls them back in. "GAMES CAN'T DO THAT".

    Why can't this trailer and possibly game do to me what World War Z did to me? Why is one a try-hard attempt to invoke emotion and the other an acceptably freaky novel about zombies?

    Fuckin' crab bucket.
    Because WWZ was an allegory about various manifestations of societal myopia and this is, from the trailer, about a guy chopping up zombies with an axe, putting it at best at violent and all-encompassing revenge story

    Max Payne did the upset-dad thing quite a few years ago

    I didn't connect the dad with any part of the main story. Is the Dad going to be the main character? Do we know if he is out for revenge?

    I just thought he was some vacationer.

    7nUkagJ.png
    SteamID:Icemopper PSN:Icemopper
  • GreenGreen Stick around. I'm full of bad ideas.Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Icemopper wrote: »
    Jintor wrote: »
    All the people saying the trailer was trying too hard remind me of the crab bucket. Games try and escape this place where they can't do jack shit but everybody hauls them back in. "GAMES CAN'T DO THAT".

    Why can't this trailer and possibly game do to me what World War Z did to me? Why is one a try-hard attempt to invoke emotion and the other an acceptably freaky novel about zombies?

    Fuckin' crab bucket.
    Because WWZ was an allegory about various manifestations of societal myopia and this is, from the trailer, about a guy chopping up zombies with an axe, putting it at best at violent and all-encompassing revenge story

    Max Payne did the upset-dad thing quite a few years ago

    I didn't connect the dad with any part of the main story. Is the Dad going to be the main character? Do we know if he is out for revenge?

    I just thought he was some vacationer.
    Yeah I don't get the impression that the guy in the trailer is the game protagonist, or even present in the game itself

    The trailer is a mood-setting piece

    IsaacSig.png
    3DS: 3007 8087 2767 | Nintendo ID: AngryFrog
  • DanHibikiDanHibiki Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Icemopper wrote: »
    Jintor wrote: »
    All the people saying the trailer was trying too hard remind me of the crab bucket. Games try and escape this place where they can't do jack shit but everybody hauls them back in. "GAMES CAN'T DO THAT".

    Why can't this trailer and possibly game do to me what World War Z did to me? Why is one a try-hard attempt to invoke emotion and the other an acceptably freaky novel about zombies?

    Fuckin' crab bucket.
    Because WWZ was an allegory about various manifestations of societal myopia and this is, from the trailer, about a guy chopping up zombies with an axe, putting it at best at violent and all-encompassing revenge story

    Max Payne did the upset-dad thing quite a few years ago

    I didn't connect the dad with any part of the main story. Is the Dad going to be the main character? Do we know if he is out for revenge?

    I just thought he was some vacationer.

    Clearly WWZ is about a bloody letter Z written on some old paper as shown by the book's cover.

    sig_zpsf0994cbd.jpg
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    If the RPG mechanics and story driven stuff materialize, it's possible we're seeing one possible ending for the protagonists.

    If this game is a 20 hour long choice-fest with multiple endings (most of which involve being eaten) that would be awesome.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. On Hiatus!

    Any gamers in the Danville, PA area? PM me if you're interested in some tabletop gaming.
  • TurkeyTurkey Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    This trailer is like the original Bioshock trailer. It's all about showing the mood the game will strive to achieve.

    zkVyf.png
  • TrippyJingTrippyJing Moses supposes his toeses are roses. But Moses supposes erroneously.Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Icemopper wrote: »
    Jintor wrote: »
    All the people saying the trailer was trying too hard remind me of the crab bucket. Games try and escape this place where they can't do jack shit but everybody hauls them back in. "GAMES CAN'T DO THAT".

    Why can't this trailer and possibly game do to me what World War Z did to me? Why is one a try-hard attempt to invoke emotion and the other an acceptably freaky novel about zombies?

    Fuckin' crab bucket.
    Because WWZ was an allegory about various manifestations of societal myopia and this is, from the trailer, about a guy chopping up zombies with an axe, putting it at best at violent and all-encompassing revenge story

    Max Payne did the upset-dad thing quite a few years ago

    I didn't connect the dad with any part of the main story. Is the Dad going to be the main character? Do we know if he is out for revenge?

    I just thought he was some vacationer.

    I thought it was a family meeting a horrible fate.

    mosesupposes.gif
  • DashuiDashui Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I think the announcement trailer might be getting more attention than it needs, compared to the game itself. I doubt the actual game is going to have children getting murdered, but instead the trailer was saying, "This is going to be a serious zombie game." That was my interpretation, anyway.

    I'm just really excited about a four-player co-op zombie game in a sandbox world with a darker atmosphere than the jovial Left 4 Dead or Dead Rising games we've played thus far. This also has neat damage modeling, level ups with skill trees, very few firearms in the game, and a storyline focus if you probably want to follow it. There should be lots of "oh shit" moments as you try to escape the zombie horde with your friends with nothing more than a plank of wood, running through resort rooms and restaurant lobbies trying to escape the horde.

    Xbox Live, PSN & Origin: Vacorsis

    steam_sig.png
  • TrippyJingTrippyJing Moses supposes his toeses are roses. But Moses supposes erroneously.Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Those zombies have some pretty good coordination. I mean, some other franchise's zombies would've just left the axe embedded in themselves, but the one in the trailer just pulled it right out.

    I wonder if they can climb things.

    mosesupposes.gif
  • DrakeDrake Blow it all up ForeverRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Hey, I'm totally hopeful that this is an amazing, genre defining game.

    But this is Techland we are talking about. The best we can hope for is competent and fun gameplay.

  • SorensonSorenson Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    When I play zombies gametypes in Halo I will shoot my former teammates. I don't see any reason to think that I would hesitate to beat them to redeath in this just because they're using a character model that looks a bit like their old one. The goal is to win
    Yeah, but that's also radically different since you're a gun-toting plexiglass-visored supersoldier who in most game circumstances respawns after like 10 seconds or so.

    In something like what Dead Island's aspiring for it's you and a scant few other dudes, all of whom are unique to some extend by appearance or audio or whatever, armed with shit like machetes and fire axes and whatever. I'm not thinking that players're gonna' be PARALYSED or whatever, but it'd just be real interesting to watch player behavior and stuff like input language and the like when they round a corner and right in front of them is Undead Honky in all of his crotchless, festive-as-shit glory, seeing if the mechanics that make you try your damndest not to shoot Bill or whomever in L4D kick in and how quick the player's able to kick them back out, and if said mechanics going into action are enough to mess the players up where normally they might've been just fine.

    Gamertag, Crackdown metatag, and other interesting stuff below!
    Join the Wang Defense Force and help stop the insect menace!
    Help a poor bastard out! Read (or at least visit) my Bright Hub articles!
    Spoiler:
  • DrakeDrake Blow it all up ForeverRegistered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I'm pretty sure I could pull the trigger on Urahonky.

    Zombie or not.

  • stopgapstopgap Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    i have an idea... and i think it would be interesting. have the infected character keep controlling the dude who got bit, right up to the point were he goes zombie. what would make it interesting would be if the could then control his "zombie self and start trying to munch on some brains.

    steam_sig.png
  • KlashKlash Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    DanHibiki wrote: »
    i have a general question about zombies

    is the point to eat someone entirely? or do they bite merely to infect?

    both methods kill, but only one results in +1 to the zombie population. they do seem to be competing goals.

    well they only get the chance to munch on a person when they've swarmed the target so they already reached the critical mass that goes from the mild threat of one shambling corpse to OMG there's no where to run.

    At which point adding more zombies is not a necessity and they can just munch down on who ever.

    The better question is where does all the stuff they eat go?
    They don't have any functioning organs, so they must eat until they burst or something.
    Or maybe the meat just goes right through them... Might explain why they all shamble as if there's a load in their pants.

    Most zombie stories end up with old zombies having distended, bloated bodies, half-eaten bones puncturing their throats and such on the way down. WWZ did a pretty snazzy job at describing and addressing the nonsense of them eating without needing it, to the point where their bowels rupture.
    i only ask because in the old RE games the zombies would definitely kill you and then kneel down and start feeding on your body

    then in L4D they only seem interested in killing you and then they lose interest.

    to extrapolate: zombie 1 wants human flesh, bites person 2. person 2 mebbe gets an arm divot or loses a finger or two. later person 2 becomes zombie 2. process repeats.

    assuming zombies don't like the flesh of their own, the only time zombies actually get to FEED is when they corner someone who can't get away. it's like there's this limited window of opportunity where they can eat someone without the flesh turning enough to be unpalatable.

    mebbe this is why zombies are always hungry.

    The L4D zombies aren't zombies, is mostly why. They're living human beings infected with a rage virus, which just means they're pissed off and attack anything not scented with the virus stuff. They bite, the virus gets in, they might lose interest if they aren't busy fervently rending you apart. Think 28 Days Later, except with some mutant/Resident Evil shit going on.

    So damned glad to have properly undead dead things to kill with a big metal rod. Dead Rising looks good, but it doesn't let me get all Condemned on the zombies.

    We don't even care... whether we care or not...
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Drake wrote: »
    I'm pretty sure I could pull the trigger on Urahonky.

    Zombie or not.

    Man I didn't know there was this much hostility towards me! :P

    Games completed recently: Resident Evil 4: HD Edition, Typing of the Dead: Overkill, Sleeping Dogs, Dishonored, On the Rain Precipice of Darkness 1-4.
  • SteevLSteevL What can I do for you? Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I saw this yesterday; that was a great trailer.

    Amusingly, Vinny from Giant Bomb declared "Can't waste anymore time waiting for someone else to mash the Dead Island trailer with Mad World. MAD ISLAND" and Ice-T snagged it and uploaded it to his youtube account:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQBJZhK5rp8

    I look forward to hearing how the actual game is too.

  • EchoEcho very gravitas Super Moderator, Moderator mod
    edited February 2011
    Color me very intrigued. I've been wishing for a game with focus on the survival aspect.

  • Lt. FraggLt. Fragg Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    i only ask because in the old RE games the zombies would definitely kill you and then kneel down and start feeding on your body

    then in L4D they only seem interested in killing you and then they lose interest.

    to extrapolate: zombie 1 wants human flesh, bites person 2. person 2 mebbe gets an arm divot or loses a finger or two. later person 2 becomes zombie 2. process repeats.

    assuming zombies don't like the flesh of their own, the only time zombies actually get to FEED is when they corner someone who can't get away. it's like there's this limited window of opportunity where they can eat someone without the flesh turning enough to be unpalatable.

    mebbe this is why zombies are always hungry.

    Max Brooks World War Z and Zombie Survival Guide has a great way of rationalizing it for my liking - basically if the flesh is alive, they will eat. They cannot get full because their is no signal to the (dead) brain to say it's full, so if another living snack runs past while a group is feeding, they will certainly give chase if their attention is pulled away from thier current meal.

    So unless a body has time to die, you're what's for dinner.

    Very pumped for this game, it's a must buy for me even if it's a semi-competant serious zombie game. I love games where you have to scratch out survival, make every bullet/weapon count. Same reason I enjoyed the first half of Fallout, but once I had armour, tons of guns and ammo the game lost all appeal to me.

    I want a challenge. I want to stumble into a shed at dusk with a dented shovel and survive the night while 5 or 6 zombies are sluggishly walking around outside, hoping they don't get the scent. And limited saves. I WANT TERROR :)

This discussion has been closed.