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Cyber/Bio punk

ninjaininjai Registered User regular
edited March 2011 in Graphic Violence
So I've posted a few times on this subforum looking for suggestions on what to read, and have gotten positive results.

This time I'm coming to you all looking for some good cyber/bio punk, future post apocalyptic, often with negative connotations directed at human modification via cybernetics, transhumanism, and "The Net" (cyberpunk), or the same negative connotations directed at nuclear waste and/or pollution, and genetic manipulation/viruses/infections.

Ones I have read recently

Cyber:
Akira
Blame! (manga)
Neuromancer
Syntax (one shot)
Old City Blues (web)
Ghost in the Shell (manga)


Bio:
French one, can't remember the name
Abara
Biomega
Zeb Noid

I can't really find any other comic of these two genre's that stick to the bleak dark mood of cyberpunk. And wind up looking too cartoony, or too colorful.

Suggestions?

ninjai on
Mice scratching at the walls inside of your head.
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Posts

  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    The original marvel Boy miniseries by Grant Morrison had corporate super-soldiers, aliens with nanotech and all manner of cool shit which is pretty close to cyber/biopunk, that with a modern day setting more than an entirely futuristic one.

  • AntimatterAntimatter if you want to talk to me look elsewhere.Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    why in the fuck isn't Akira listed on there

  • DouglasDangerDouglasDanger Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Akira (I need to read it)
    Pluto
    Hard Boiled
    Transmetropolitan has some trappings of each subgenre.

    I play games on ps3 and ps4. My PSN is DouglasDanger.
  • TexiKenTexiKen Was it Kierkegaard or Dick Van Patten who said, Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
  • WiseManTobesWiseManTobes Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Philip k. Dick's Electric Ant was done as a 5-part mini recently ( trade hits soon too, but I know all 5 issues easily findable still at my LCS)

    Is about a Human Replicant discovering he's a Replicant.

  • BigDesBigDes Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Biomega is by the Blame! guy and is pretty good

    Also a Deus Ex comic just started up

    steam_sig.png
  • HadjiQuestHadjiQuest Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Philip k. Dick's Electric Ant was done as a 5-part mini recently ( trade hits soon too, but I know all 5 issues easily findable still at my LCS)

    Is about a Human Replicant discovering he's a Replicant.

    I second this. It was a really, really great book.

  • HenslerHensler Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    BigDes wrote: »

    Also a Deus Ex comic just started up

    Has anybody read this? DC/Wildstorm have had some surprisingly good video-game licensed books, and some truly awful ones.

  • DelduwathDelduwath Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Yeah, I grabbed the first issue. I'd say that I haven't seen much to sway me either way. It's not, like, terrible or anything (the only obviously-jarring part was when a guy uses the phrase "Deus Ex!" as like a battle-cry/declaration of intent at the end of the issue), but I haven't seen much that'd make me recommend this comic to someone. I'm going to pick up the next issue, as well, but that probably has more to do with my considering Deus Ex to be the most important game I've ever played. I may be an impartial reader.

    Edit: To be fair, I think the parts that have to do with the actual cybertech are pretty neat, and the art is fine. It also gives insight into characters of Deus Ex 3: human Revolution, which has value (if you care about the game). That being said, the characterization is just a hair above two-dimensional (I feel), and I'm not particularly engrossed by the story or the writing.

    weapon_rex.jpg
  • MushroomStickMushroomStick Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Battle Angel and Battle Angel Last Order.

  • iguanacusiguanacus Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    There was an one comic I had when I was a kid, that I've never been able to figure out what it was. It was about some future sports team, played sorta like the game in Blood of Heroes, except this wasn't post apocalyptic, more future bio-science. All the players wore bio-engineered kit, and had to place some ocotopoid thing on a spike to score. Never been able to track it down, but I kinda liked it.

    I dunno, I take you seriously on some topics and dick rider is your profession
  • ninjaininjai Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Antimatter wrote: »
    why in the fuck isn't Akira listed on there


    Ha Ha, sorry forgot about akira. I have only finished the 3rd book :P Just haven't gotten around to the others

    Mice scratching at the walls inside of your head.
    This is a warning that my sig was too tall.
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  • AntimatterAntimatter if you want to talk to me look elsewhere.Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
  • ninjaininjai Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    BigDes wrote: »
    Biomega is by the Blame! guy and is pretty good

    Also a Deus Ex comic just started up


    Pretty much everything he's done is great, except for his most recent ongoing one "knights of cedonia". Its really. frikkin. lame.

    I heard there was a graphic novelization of the Cyberpunk classic Neuromancer, but only got 2 issues in. Anyone seen those?

    Mice scratching at the walls inside of your head.
    This is a warning that my sig was too tall.
    You could have sent me a PM or something.
  • liquiddarkliquiddark St. John's, NLRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Have you tried Judge Dredd? Ignore the movie, the comic book is at least a very much more interesting piece of work.

    Current project: Old Man Hero, a graphic novel in three parts
    @oldmanhero .tumblr .programming
  • HenslerHensler Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Delduwath wrote: »
    Yeah, I grabbed the first issue. I'd say that I haven't seen much to sway me either way. It's not, like, terrible or anything (the only obviously-jarring part was when a guy uses the phrase "Deus Ex!" as like a battle-cry/declaration of intent at the end of the issue), but I haven't seen much that'd make me recommend this comic to someone. I'm going to pick up the next issue, as well, but that probably has more to do with my considering Deus Ex to be the most important game I've ever played. I may be an impartial reader.

    Edit: To be fair, I think the parts that have to do with the actual cybertech are pretty neat, and the art is fine. It also gives insight into characters of Deus Ex 3: human Revolution, which has value (if you care about the game). That being said, the characterization is just a hair above two-dimensional (I feel), and I'm not particularly engrossed by the story or the writing.

    Thanks for the heads up - I'm a pretty big fan of the games, too, so I'll probably like it.

  • ninjaininjai Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    So many of these recommendations have been exactly what I have found, and did not like (art direction) :( I am sad. Is this all there is? All of them except pluto I found in a google search. And nothing about huge shnoz's and feet scream "edgy" and "dark". I mean, I like his works, but they never seem to fit into this category because of the art. Like metropolis. Smaller feet, smaller honkers, and you have yourself a dark edgy cyberpunk... Nothing PUNK about his art style.


    It is disheartening to me that there is so little cyberpunk. I mean, how is this not a thing yet? Its the only great sci fi genre to emerge since the space opera.

    Mice scratching at the walls inside of your head.
    This is a warning that my sig was too tall.
    You could have sent me a PM or something.
  • kfroosterkfrooster Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Hmm, good art and cyberpunk elements. I am going to suggest Madame Mirage.

  • The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    liquiddark wrote: »
    Have you tried Judge Dredd? Ignore the movie, the comic book is at least a very much more interesting piece of work.

    Whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa now

    You ain't smack talkin' the Stallone movie and gettin' away with it.

    The Judge Dredd movie is fantastic.

  • DouglasDangerDouglasDanger Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    ninjai wrote: »
    So many of these recommendations have been exactly what I have found, and did not like (art direction) :( I am sad. Is this all there is? All of them except pluto I found in a google search. And nothing about huge shnoz's and feet scream "edgy" and "dark". I mean, I like his works, but they never seem to fit into this category because of the art. Like metropolis. Smaller feet, smaller honkers, and you have yourself a dark edgy cyberpunk... Nothing PUNK about his art style.


    It is disheartening to me that there is so little cyberpunk. I mean, how is this not a thing yet? Its the only great sci fi genre to emerge since the space opera.

    Cyberpunk is nearly 30 years old. Different aspects of the genre have been in comics for just as long. DKR and DKSA have cyberpunk elements. Frank Miller's Ronin had some cyberpunk stuff in it. Miller and Darrow's Hard Boiled was based on the Phillip K Dick's Electric Ant story, and and has a lot of cyberpunk elements.

    I play games on ps3 and ps4. My PSN is DouglasDanger.
  • WildcatWildcat Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    liquiddark wrote: »
    Have you tried Judge Dredd? Ignore the movie, the comic book is at least a very much more interesting piece of work.

    Whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa now

    You ain't smack talkin' the Stallone movie and gettin' away with it.

    The Judge Dredd movie is fantastic.

    TLB this is the correct answer.

  • DelduwathDelduwath Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    ninjai wrote: »
    It is disheartening to me that there is so little cyberpunk. I mean, how is this not a thing yet? Its the only great sci fi genre to emerge since the space opera.

    I'm reasonably sure that it's not a thing anymore, not "not a thing yet". Let's be perfectly honest: cyberpunk is a product of the 80s, of their greatest fears, and in many ways it's just not as relevant anymore to the culture at large. I mean, it's kind of a shame, as cyberpunk is my favoritest sci-fi sub-genre, but it's not the way culture generally leans anymore. Cyberpunk's whole thing is basically bleakness and hopelessness. "What can be done to a rat can be done to a human", and all that. The central, defining feature is that the protagonist(s) cannot make a change to the world at large. They might be able to improve their immediate lives, or, I don't know, defeat a bad guy, but they will never topple the socio-economic order that allows for megacorps to run people's lives; never bridge the vast gulf between the haves and the have-nots; never circumvent the fact that technology dehumanizing people. It seems like these themes aren't as attractive now as they were twenty, thirty years ago.

    I feel like now what I see more of is what can be loosely referred to as post-cyberpunk. It's like cyberpunk, but with half the depression! It still focuses on the same sci-fi themes - megacorps, ubiquitous data tech, cybernetics, etc. - but drops the dystopian social themes. If cyberpunk is defined by the protagonist's inability to change the world, then post-cyberpunk is defined by the exact opposite of that; heroes can and do change the world for the better.

    I didn't recommend Transmetropolitan earlier because to me it seems like a pretty clear example of post-cyberpunk: the whole point of the series is how Spider Jerusalem improves quality of life for people, and that's not what ninjai wanted to see. On the other hand, I'll say this: I cannot imagine a person more punk than Spider Jerusalem.

    Hy ninjai, I'm curious, what do you consider to be a punk art-style? Pink mohawks and mirrorshades?

    weapon_rex.jpg
  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Yeah cyberpunk as it was in the eightiest isn't really around these days.

    Probably into transhumanist fiction. Guys like Richard Morgan who would have been writing cyberpunk twenty years ago are no writing about re-sleeving and body swapping and farcasting and so on. It's a different genre which seems to have evolved out of cyberpunk.

  • BigDesBigDes Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Yeah, the genre evolved.

    Also I think what hurt cyber punk the most as a genre is that most of it has actually happened in real life and has largely (for the western world anyway) been benevolent.

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  • DelduwathDelduwath Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Yeah, that's kinda what I meant when I said that it grew out of the fears of the 80s. Like, the whole megacorp stuff comes out of Japan having a super-strong economy back then, and the fear being that they would come into the States and just buy up all the other companies. Then Japan's bubble economy burst.

    weapon_rex.jpg
  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Also the establishment which cyberpunk was very much a rebellion against no longer exists in the same way that it did back in the eighties where you had Reagan and Thatcher in government, neoliberal economics, greed is good etc. That was the mega-corporation filled dystopia that cyberpunk railed against and to some extent it doesn't exist anymore.

  • Just_Bri_ThanksJust_Bri_Thanks Seething with rage from a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited March 2011
    Battle Angel and Battle Angel Last Order.

    Agreed.

    Some days I just want to smack people with a rolled up newspaper. Or a phone book.
    A folding chair is looking like an attractive option right now too...
  • DelduwathDelduwath Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Solar wrote: »
    Also the establishment which cyberpunk was very much a rebellion against no longer exists in the same way that it did back in the eighties where you had Reagan and Thatcher in government, neoliberal economics, greed is good etc. That was the mega-corporation filled dystopia that cyberpunk railed against and to some extent it doesn't exist anymore.

    Which brings up an interesting question: what would today's cyberpunk analogue rail again?

    Greg Pak's Vision Machine is basically all about questions of copyright, about a corporation taking all content that people created just because they created it with their tools. It's about ubiquitous surveillance, it's about tailored, targeted ads, and so on. In other words, it's about what quite a few people are concerned about now. Facebook privacy concerns, corporations using their lawyers to quash derived content created by Average Joes, etc. That probably qualifies as modern day ______punk.

    Hmm. This needs a catchy name. Contenpunk? Copypunk? I kinda like "copypunk".

    weapon_rex.jpg
  • CJGCJG Registered User
    edited March 2011
    Of course, this isn't a comic, but I think it matches all the OP's criteria. The RPG Eclipse Phase is all about Transhumanism and how things go very, very wrong with nanoplagues, viruses and unfathomable AI's taking over the earth and humanity banished to the stars.

    It's a free download under Creative Commons from the web if you're interested.

  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Eclipse Phase is a sweet game

    love it love it love it

  • ninjaininjai Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I understand that it is a movement of the 80's but cyberpunk as it is today, examples being The Matrix, Ghost in the Shell, and Blame!, this style of fiction hasn't even begun to be tapped. I'll look into eclipse phase and that mirage one.

    Mice scratching at the walls inside of your head.
    This is a warning that my sig was too tall.
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  • liquiddarkliquiddark St. John's, NLRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I think if you're rejecting all of these amazing titles because of art direction you may have missed most of what was good about cyber, punk and cyberpunk. No offense intended, but really. Cyberpunk wasn't a thing, it was a reaction to a lot of shitty things in science fiction and an attempt to establish a connection with the things that people were actually seeing and imagining themselves coming out of science and technology. That's what most visual artists are doing - they are drawing the world in a way that tries to tie itself to the reality the art depicts. If you find yourself throwing away good graphic novels because the art doesn't fit into a narrow definition of appropriate, then you need to go back to text, because you're missing the point.

    Current project: Old Man Hero, a graphic novel in three parts
    @oldmanhero .tumblr .programming
  • ninjaininjai Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Its not that I would read them at another time, but at the moment thats what I'm looking for... To be honest what I'm looking for is more along the lines of inspiration rather than a good read AT THE MOMENT

    I'll probably get all of these recommendations at some point, I've added them to my amazon wish list, but the fact of the matter is that along with the new interpretations of cyberpunk is a very seamless art style. If you google "cyberpunk fashion" you'll see what exactly I'm getting at.

    The problem is that I can't find any of this in graphic form. There are few animated series, the RARE cyberpunk film that comes out is stripped of all character, and as we've discovered here, there aren't all that many graphic novels to speak of.

    Mice scratching at the walls inside of your head.
    This is a warning that my sig was too tall.
    You could have sent me a PM or something.
  • CrimsondudeCrimsondude Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Solar wrote: »
    Also the establishment which cyberpunk was very much a rebellion against no longer exists in the same way that it did back in the eighties where you had Reagan and Thatcher in government, neoliberal economics, greed is good etc. That was the mega-corporation filled dystopia that cyberpunk railed against and to some extent it doesn't exist anymore.

    Shadowrun's latest corporate book has a concept of post-capitalism where the machinery of corporations and governments reinforce a particular orderthat reflects how economies can be directed by political decisions to undermine or corrupt market capitalism combined with corporate anticompetitive behavior, e.g. collusion, price-fixing.

    If you accept the premise of people like Matt Taibbi this is basically the system in place, really originating in post-Soviet Russia and now a system where the largest state economies underwrite politically powerful businesses and industries even if those industries undermine those states' populations through transnational business practices that propel the per capita GDP while creating underclasses in the states that previously never existed.

    Put another way, cyberpunk's problem is that the future it feared came so quickly that in spite or because people thought they knew better now we live in what was considered a dystopian, dark future. However, the good news is that basic international economic theory held and global standard of living is improving and leveling out. The problem is that if you live in the richest country on Earth leveling out means you get fucked economically. People have been dogging on CNN for today's article on whether white people are being prejudiced against. It makes a fair point that this country began to see in the '70s and '80s people who had never known what it was like being on the wrong end of economics and politics are now faced with that fact in their lives, and they are confused and pissed.

    Tl;dr cyberpunk can pretend reality is what cp was, it can focus on developing states like the author of Wind-up Girl and others do, or it can move onto post-cp genres like transhuman.

    My last tumblr was reblogged by dystopiantimes. It's about FF and how life can be seen as swell even in the dark future.

  • ninjaininjai Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I don't see VR and cybernetics having "come to pass" as you guys are saying. Its not a thing yet. That future hasn't arrived and likely won't in my lifetime.

    In any case, it is a form of fiction one way or another. How can that be restricted based solely on the fact that it has already transpired? There are historical fictions that are published all the time. I honestly don't understand how this doesn't appeal to a wider audience.

    Mice scratching at the walls inside of your head.
    This is a warning that my sig was too tall.
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  • CrimsondudeCrimsondude Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Because it tends to appeal to the same people who ask Grant Morison how old Bruce and Dick are supposed to be.

    The issue of VR and augmented reality is one we discuss regularly. One can say that VR isn't around because it is a horribly inefficient interface in practice. I mean there is a reason you don't see sites using VRML. But we do have some swell VR entertainment. Augmentations will probably bypass cyber for bionics, cloning, and nanotech. DNI and neuroscience comes in leaps. Supposedly there is a boy who can play Mario with his brain now.

    Usually when I say it came to pass I mean socioeconomically and politically.

  • ninjaininjai Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Doesn't make it any less an interesting and unique visual and narrative style, as well as a RARELY used plot device. Just because its happening to a degree doesn't mean that its LESS viable, that should make it MORE viable. I mean, people leverage real world events for fiction all the time. Blood diamond, black hawk down, phone booth...

    I'm certain the fact this remains an obscure and relatively unkown subgenre is a direct result of a majority of people not knowing what the hell it is.

    I mean, they're coming out with another Blade Runner for christ's sake. (its about time)

    Mice scratching at the walls inside of your head.
    This is a warning that my sig was too tall.
    You could have sent me a PM or something.
  • WiseManTobesWiseManTobes Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    That's cause Philip k. Dick's sci fi is timeless and awesome tho!

  • RingoRingo Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Iron Man: Hypervelocity

    there's a bunch of cyberpunk stuff out there that isn't labeled as such anymore. And the reason (to completely disagree with Solar's analysis) is that the cyberpunk future as envisioned 30 years ago has come to pass. We are living it.

    Look at Web 2.0 and the Obama campaign's success. Then Citizens United made corporate entities direct contributers to the American political process above and beyond what any single actual living human being could hope to accomplish. And then Bradley Manning, Julian Assuange and Wikileaks started an avalanche that has toppled governments.

    Anyway, there's a bunch more stuff out there like Hypervelocity that is extremely cyberpunk but no longer labeled as such, and I'll tell you about it as soon as I remember the names....

    ceres wrote: »
    I'm just going to go ahead and lock this thread before I feel any worse about humanity.
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  • DouglasDangerDouglasDanger Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Yeah, we are living in a cyberpunk world. The huge divide between the haves and the have-nots, smartphones are augmented reality...

    I play games on ps3 and ps4. My PSN is DouglasDanger.
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