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Possibly getting two job offers? [Update: Got an offer!]

urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
edited March 2011 in Help / Advice Forum
Hi all,

First of all: ceres I'm sorry for making so many threads as of late. I promise all advice given in the threads has been taken into consideration!

Second: I have been interviewing with two companies for the past few weeks. Job A is with a large company, and I've had two interviews, two tests, and a drug test already. Job B is with a small company (15 or so people) and I've had two interviews. All the interviews have gone well... Well Job B says that they will have a decision Friday or Monday, whereas Job A won't know until next week.

So what's the protocol here? If Job B calls me and offers me a job... Does it look bad if I ask them when they need an answer by? See, to me, it seems like at that point I'm not excited to join that company. On the other hand if Job A offers more money and benefits... You get what I'm saying?

How would you handle this? I'm hoping that someone with hiring experience will speak here.

urahonky on
Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
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Posts

  • CooterTKECooterTKE Registered User
    edited March 2011
    Just say that you would like to a few days to discuss it with your sig other or just to think it over. Than you can call the other place that you have received an offer from another company but your more interested in working for them.

  • DerrickDerrick Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    CooterTKE wrote: »
    Just say that you would like to a few days to discuss it with your sig other or just to think it over. Than you can call the other place that you have received an offer from another company but your more interested in working for them.

    I tried that once. The offering company got very offended and insinuated I was wasting their time.

    Personally I would take the job, and if the other company offers you a better deal just tell Job A that you got a better offer and can they match it?

    "The welfare of each of us is dependent fundamentally upon the welfare of all of us."
    Spoiler:
    -Theodore Roosevelt
  • UsagiUsagi WOMP WOMPRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I have never had anyone refuse me when I've asked for a few days to mull over my decision

    Personally, if HR pressed me for a decision that instant it would be a huge turnoff and a possible sign that I wouldn't want to work there at all

    Jormungandr? Damn near killed 'er!
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Usagi wrote: »
    I have never had anyone refuse me when I've asked for a few days to mull over my decision

    Personally, if HR pressed me for a decision that instant it would be a huge turnoff and a possible sign that I wouldn't want to work there at all

    Have you gotten the job after you waited a few days? I'm just worried that they'll think that I don't actually want the job. You know?

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • EshEsh Sunshine! Kittens! Rainbows! Smiles! Portland, ORRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Derrick wrote: »
    CooterTKE wrote: »
    Just say that you would like to a few days to discuss it with your sig other or just to think it over. Than you can call the other place that you have received an offer from another company but your more interested in working for them.

    I tried that once. The offering company got very offended and insinuated I was wasting their time.

    Personally I would take the job, and if the other company offers you a better deal just tell Job A that you got a better offer and can they match it?

    By the time you've heard back from the second company, you'll probably have not even started for the first company besides signing some paperwork.

    "At first he thought it might be a natural occurrence - maybe a rabbit. But upon closer inspection, it was clear a knife had been used. And rabbits don't carry knives."
  • VisionOfClarityVisionOfClarity Registered User
    edited March 2011
    Usagi wrote: »
    I have never had anyone refuse me when I've asked for a few days to mull over my decision

    Personally, if HR pressed me for a decision that instant it would be a huge turnoff and a possible sign that I wouldn't want to work there at all

    This. Usagi is a smart lady.

  • EshEsh Sunshine! Kittens! Rainbows! Smiles! Portland, ORRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Usagi wrote: »
    I have never had anyone refuse me when I've asked for a few days to mull over my decision

    Personally, if HR pressed me for a decision that instant it would be a huge turnoff and a possible sign that I wouldn't want to work there at all

    This. Usagi is a smart lady.

    Sometimes companies need people immediately.

    "At first he thought it might be a natural occurrence - maybe a rabbit. But upon closer inspection, it was clear a knife had been used. And rabbits don't carry knives."
  • VisionOfClarityVisionOfClarity Registered User
    edited March 2011
    Esh wrote: »
    Usagi wrote: »
    I have never had anyone refuse me when I've asked for a few days to mull over my decision

    Personally, if HR pressed me for a decision that instant it would be a huge turnoff and a possible sign that I wouldn't want to work there at all

    This. Usagi is a smart lady.

    Sometimes companies need people immediately.

    And sometimes they don't. And taking a job and then not long later saying goodbye because you got something better is kind of unprofessional and depending on the field it can come back to bite you in the ass.

  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    So you guys think it would be alright if I tell them something like:

    "Oh that's fantastic! Could you give me a few days to think about it, and talk about it with my wife?" Something to that effect?

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • UsagiUsagi WOMP WOMPRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I would be more specific, such as

    "This is great! If you don't mind, I'd like to talk this over with my wife/husband/dog/cat. I'll get back to you by DATE/TIME."

    Jormungandr? Damn near killed 'er!
  • KakodaimonosKakodaimonos Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Esh wrote: »
    Usagi wrote: »
    I have never had anyone refuse me when I've asked for a few days to mull over my decision

    Personally, if HR pressed me for a decision that instant it would be a huge turnoff and a possible sign that I wouldn't want to work there at all

    This. Usagi is a smart lady.

    Sometimes companies need people immediately.

    I've never hired anyone who was even close to being up and productive at a new job in less than two weeks from their first day in any sort of professional career.

    Company B is just going to be able to move faster because they're a smaller company and don't have the layers of HR and hiring managers to get through to get you an offer. Let them know you'd like a couple of days to consider it and go back to company A. It may not make Company A move any faster, depending on how entrenched the whole hiring process is. Though if they've had you take the drug test, I would imagine you're getting an offer unless you failed the test.

    Congrats and good luck with whichever one you decide on.

  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Hmm. My wife keeps worrying me saying that I'll tell Company B to wait a few days for a response, then Company A decides that I don't fit with them; Then when I contact Company B again, they already filled the position. But you guys are removing some of that concern.

    The reason why Company A is taking so long (now) is because their hiring manager was out of town for the week... But I talked with the company's recruiter and she told me to let her know if I get an offer and she'll see what she can do about expediting the process if possible.

    Usagi I will use that exact line (not including DATE/TIME. :P ) if I decide to wait for the other one as well. I'm just worried they'll move on to the next person...

    And thanks Kakodaimonos :) I hope this is a start of a wonderful career either way. Or at least some experience.

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • KakodaimonosKakodaimonos Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Well, which company would you prefer to work for?

  • schussschuss Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Esh wrote: »
    Usagi wrote: »
    I have never had anyone refuse me when I've asked for a few days to mull over my decision

    Personally, if HR pressed me for a decision that instant it would be a huge turnoff and a possible sign that I wouldn't want to work there at all

    This. Usagi is a smart lady.

    Sometimes companies need people immediately.

    Maybe if it's construction. Everything else needs ramp-up, and if it's IT/biz/gov related at all, your ID's won't work the first few weeks anyway.

  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    That's the problem... It's about even as far as goods/bads.

    Company A:
    Large company, very reputable. Uses C#, .NET programming. Good benefits? (I've not seen their benefits yet, but I assume they will be good)

    Company B:
    Small company. Uses Teradata, some Java, WebSphere. Decent benefits (no dental/vision); paid once a month.

    I guess I feel like I should wait out Company A because I took two of their tests (1 hour a piece) and holy hell were they difficult.

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • UsagiUsagi WOMP WOMPRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Not knowing what industry you're in I can't honestly reassure you too much that they don't have a laundry list of applicants, however if they're offering you the job I wouldn't expect them to retract it short of some catastrophic and unforseen circumstance. So, don't worry too much.

    Also keep in mind that if you get an offer letter, like actually written and mailed/emailed to you, they typically have a Use By date on them.

    Jormungandr? Damn near killed 'er!
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    This is the Computer Programming field (sorry, should have mentioned that). So I assume they have a lot of applicants for both jobs. And I do believe they will be calling me, but I think they said "contact".

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • KakodaimonosKakodaimonos Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    urahonky wrote: »
    That's the problem... It's about even as far as goods/bads.

    Company A:
    Large company, very reputable. Uses C#, .NET programming. Good benefits? (I've not seen their benefits yet, but I assume they will be good)

    Company B:
    Small company. Uses Teradata, some Java, WebSphere. Decent benefits (no dental/vision); paid once a month.

    I guess I feel like I should wait out Company A because I took two of their tests (1 hour a piece) and holy hell were they difficult.

    You'd be surprised. I've worked at large companies that have some pretty poor benefits packages.

    You should also think about which direction you want to go in your career technically. Are you interested in moving more towards the Windows/.Net side or more of the Java/Websphere stuff? Would you prefer a more structured environment with more clearly articulated responsibilities? Or more of a free-form environment with less structure and possibly more responsibility?

    As a developer in a large company, you have a lot less leeway in what you're allowed to do and what you're allowed to change. Smaller companies usually let you get involved in more of the overall process, from development to possibly customer rollouts.

  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I guess I've never been very good at web design, but from what I can tell they aren't actually developing in WebSphere, but rather using it to deploy web applications. Teradata is a SQL language, and I've got some experience in that...

    Bah. Why is this decision so hard?

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • LavaKnightLavaKnight Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I did this, told the job that offered me a position on the spot that I had to think it over, and then was offered a higher paying job from a company that I had applied to a few days before within a day or two. Which I accepted.

    This was my situation, obviously, but it's fairly normal for us working stiffs to need some time to make the decision. If they did get all weird and had their feelings hurt by it, then like Usagi said, it's probably a bad sign.

    The only risk you would probably be running is if they had someone else in mind already, but if they have already offered you the job then it's pretty clear that you are the person that they want to hire.

  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Does it help if I say that these are both entry-level positions, and I have 0 experience in my field? I'm also graduating in about two days. :P

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • FagatronFagatron Registered User
    edited March 2011
    Smaller company is probably a better career move, although the lack of dental/vision is a huge turnoff. You never realize how valuable dental insurance is until you really need it. Trust me.

    How does the pay between the two compare?

  • DeebaserDeebaser Alpha Teemo Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Derrick wrote: »
    Personally I would take the job, and if the other company offers you a better deal just tell Job Athat you got a better offer and can they match it?

    Jesus Christ don't do this. It is very rude, and on the extremely off chance his current employer (of maybe a week) actually agrees to this, he will have a massive target on his back for pulling this move. Never ever accept an offer and then almost immediately try to renegotiate it.

    If you decide to go with the other offer just tell them a long shot came down the pipe and while you appreciate the opportunity, Company B seems like a better fit. No bridges burned, they won't even remember you in a month.

  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Fagatron wrote: »
    Smaller company is probably a better career move, although the lack of dental/vision is a huge turnoff. You never realize how valuable dental insurance is until you really need it. Trust me.

    How does the pay between the two compare?

    The pay will be about the same, 35K - 40K. And I know what you mean about the dental... I just had a root canal done without insurance: $1700. Our tax return had to pay for it.

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Still not sure what I'm going to do..... I think I'm going to eat breakfast, work out, and take a nice hot shower and just think about it all day.

    I'm still leaning on waiting on the other offer before I decide... I mean, if the other place offers more than Company B, why not go with that?

    (Heard that Company A has a free gym membership, and a full cafeteria.)

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • DeebaserDeebaser Alpha Teemo Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    urahonky wrote: »
    I mean, if the other place offers more than Company B, why not go with that?

    You don't owe Company B anything, mang. If they call you up today, they'll probably say congratulate you and Fed Ex you an offer letter. It's likely that they won't even ask for a yes/no on the spot.

    If something comes down the pipeline that is a better fit, there aint no shame in taking it.

  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I guess that's true. I've had 3 or 4 jobs and all of them have offered to me over the phone so I assumed that's what was going to happen here.

    Thanks :)

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • spool32spool32 Contrary Library Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    urahonky wrote: »
    Hmm. My wife keeps worrying me saying that I'll tell Company B to wait a few days for a response, then Company A decides that I don't fit with them; Then when I contact Company B again, they already filled the position. But you guys are removing some of that concern.

    You get an offer letter in hand, on paper, from Company B. No verbal offer - you get it on paper. Then you give them the "I need to discuss this with my family, and I'll reply on DATETIME" line. This way, they will not have filled the position if/when you return to them.

    If it's not on paper, IT DID NOT HAPPEN. What people say to you is worth exactly nothing.

    Successful Kickstarter get! Drop by Bare Mettle Entertainment if you'd like to see what we're making.
  • Modern ManModern Man Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    urahonky wrote: »
    I guess that's true. I've had 3 or 4 jobs and all of them have offered to me over the phone so I assumed that's what was going to happen here.

    Thanks :)
    You should always ask them to send you the offer in writing. It's pretty standard, since it protects both sides by eliminating any ambiguity regarding salary, benefits and the like. The offer letter will probably include an expiration date.

    This should give you a few days to figure out if the second place wants you. If you call the second place and tell them you've got an offer in hand, they'll either have to fish or cut bait at that point.

    Aetian Jupiter - 41 Gunslinger - The Old Republic
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  • bowenbowen Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    urahonky wrote: »
    Still not sure what I'm going to do..... I think I'm going to eat breakfast, work out, and take a nice hot shower and just think about it all day.

    I'm still leaning on waiting on the other offer before I decide... I mean, if the other place offers more than Company B, why not go with that?

    (Heard that Company A has a free gym membership, and a full cafeteria.)

    Always look at the entirety of the benefits. Money is good, but access to stuff like that is also good.

    If Company A offers you a lot of money, good benefits, and so on, go with them. Small companies are usually not even worth your time as they will actively fuck you in the ass.

    This is my additional friendly advice for you, one of your negotiating things should be overtime, I see that you're listing your pay as below $45,000 a year:
    Keep in mind, you're not "exempt" even if you're salaried as a software engineer unless you make around $43,000, so, overtime is owed and they can get in deep serious shit with DoL and the government if they don't pay overtime. It's something like anything less than $23/hr (even if you're salaried) makes you non-exempt in terms of, at least, overtime pay. This is a huge piece of your benefits and one you should negotiate with. Tell them you're more than willing to go exempt with the right salary.
    Spoiler:

  • UsagiUsagi WOMP WOMPRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Ah yes the FLSA

    Urahonky, what Bowen is referring to is the Fair Labor Standards Act, which you can educate yourself about here if you're unfamiliar, along with computer work specific info here

    There should be an indication of which status the jobs you've applied for are on the listing

    edit: also, the salary test is either $23,600/year salary OR $27.63/hour non-salary, so if you're salaried above $35-40k you'll probably be exempt

    Jormungandr? Damn near killed 'er!
  • CroakerBCCroakerBC YorkRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I admit, my experience is uK based, so it may be slightly different, but:

    1. If they offer you Job 1 on the phone, certainly don't accept immediately. Do ask if they can send you an offer letter.

    2. You may also be able to ask for a draft contact - these tend to be where all our benefits/hours are worked out, but given you're US based, these may already be in the offer letter.

    3. Someone mentioned that small firms are better for career prospects; I'm not sure if this si true in your area of the US, but I've found that working at a big firm, if it has brand recognition, has been very helpful career-wise. YMMV. Now if this is a small start up, you have the potential to make a fortune and retire at 25, but the risk is commensurate.

    4. That said, do think about your career direction language/protocol-wise. Web dev and backend dev can become categories it's easy to be pigeon-holed into...

    5. Think about the environment - as mentioned above, how exactly do you want to be working, what is the company like to work for? I once worked somewhere with excellent salary/benefits, but the environment was sufficiently toxic that I was looking again in the first three months; if you think you will enjoy one of these jobs, that is a factor to consider.

    Finally, as has been said repeatedly already: Don't commit yourself until you've seen both offers; certainly not until you have seen the first in writing, and had *at least* a verbal from the second. Personally, I'd want both offers in writing before committing to either.

    It is acceptable, professionally, to wait a few days to review offers (as Usagi said). Accepting an offer and then reneging looks far worse.

    steam_sig.png
  • bowenbowen Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Yeah and that weekly pay thing I don't think applies for salaried either, at least not in my state (it was just the easiest one I could pull).

  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    And with that my concern is washed away. Thank you guys! What I'll do (if they call me today or Monday) is request that the offer is sent to me on paper, and that way I have time to discuss it with my wife; also wait on the other offer from the larger company.

    With that we should be able to compare salary/benefits and other such things that we come to an informed decision.

    This is, of course, all dependent on if they call me.

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • VisionOfClarityVisionOfClarity Registered User
    edited March 2011
    You should join us in th SE job thread now!

  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I haven't ventured into SE before... I'm scared.

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • UsagiUsagi WOMP WOMPRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    We're a friendly folk, I promise!

    Jormungandr? Damn near killed 'er!
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Just got offered the job!! Starting pay is 40K a year! She is going to email me all the information necessary and she said they'd like to have an answer by Tuesday of next week! So I just sent an email to Company A letting them know of this.

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
  • DeebaserDeebaser Alpha Teemo Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    urahonky wrote: »
    Just got offered the job!! Starting pay is 40K a year! She is going to email me all the information necessary and she said they'd like to have an answer by Tuesday of next week! So I just sent an email to Company A letting them know of this.

    Ugh... You might have just majorly shanked that one, bro. But whatevs, congrats on the new job!

  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Deebaser wrote: »
    urahonky wrote: »
    Just got offered the job!! Starting pay is 40K a year! She is going to email me all the information necessary and she said they'd like to have an answer by Tuesday of next week! So I just sent an email to Company A letting them know of this.

    Ugh... You might have just majorly shanked that one, bro. But whatevs, congrats on the new job!

    Well The other day I asked them if I would know an answer by Tuesday (just curious on what's going on with the hiring process) and she asked me if I had received an offer yet and that if I did to let her know so she could talk to the hiring manager and hopefully expedite the process for me.

    Games completed recently: Dragon's Crown, Knights of Pen and Paper, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (20th time), Defender's Quest, The Witcher
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