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[WARMACHINE & HORDES] Now with even GIANTEST robots

NechriahNechriah Registered User regular
edited February 2012 in Critical Failures
Welcome to the world of the Iron Kingdoms!

The steampunk fantasy continent of Immoren, created by PRIVATEER PRESS, is the setting for two tabletop miniatures games: WARMACHINE and HORDES.

WARMACHINE and HORDES are played on a 4' by 4' gaming table, usually with some terrain - forests, trenches, rock walls and so forth - dotted about the battlefield. The players deploy their armies of miniatures across the board, roll dice and have at each other with gusto.

While each is counted as a separate game in its own right, WARMACHINE and HORDES use a compatible rules set and can be played against each other. The key differences between the two systems are warjacks/warbeasts, warlocks/warcasters, and FOCUS/FURY.

Warjacks are the eponymous WARMACHINES: giant steampunk robots which the armies of the Iron Kingdoms use to wage war, controlled by powerful battle-wizards known as warcasters. In HORDES, warriors from the wild places of the world fight alongside hulking monsters called warbeasts, whose savage instincts are held in check by warlocks.

Lastly, FOCUS and FURY is the most glaring difference. Warcasters possess a magical energy called FOCUS, which they can use to cast spells, increase their armour, or allocate to their warjacks to grant them an increased chance of hitting/damaging stuff and perform a variety of devastating power attacks. On the other hand, warlocks use stuff called FURY. FURY is similar to FOCUS in that it allows warlocks to cast spells, but instead of giving it to their warbeasts to increase their performance, warbeasts generate their own FURY when they are forced to boost dice rolls or perform power attacks. During his or her next turn, the warlock will drain off the fury from his warbeasts and use it for spells and whatnot, and the cycle repeats.

The problem is, if your warlock doesn’t drain all the fury from his or her beasts, there’s a good chance the monsters will hulk out and mindlessly attack those around them, friend or foe. So we like to say that while Warmachine is a game of resource management (deciding where to spend your limited pool of FOCUS), Hordes is a game of risk management (can I afford to leave FURY on that beast this turn?).

Hopefully that all makes sense. Now, let’s meet the inhabitants of the Iron Kingdoms.

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The playable WARMACHINE factions include:

CYGNAR
Cygnar.jpg

A wealthy, populous, and advanced nation, Cygnar are known as “the crown jewel of the Iron Kingdoms”. They are well known for their advanced technology which has ensured their place as one of the major powers in Immoren. Cygnar are very much the 'combined arms' faction in Warmachine, able to field a variety of troops and warjacks that fill all rolls - ranged combat, melee combat, support, etc. - reasonably well. If phrases like "Gun Mage", "Chain Lightning", "Rapid Fire", and "Storm Glaive" make you sexually excited, you might be a Cygnar player in your heart of hearts.

Unfortunately for Cygnar, their success and wealth has earned them the animosity of most of their neighbours, such as...

KHADOR
Khador.jpg

Khador is a large, wintery nation which bears an uncanny similarity to stereotypical depictions of Russia. The harsh and icy climate has produced a tough, rugged people who are fiercely patriotic and filled with disdain for the weak southern nations. The Khadoran military is characterised by huge, ponderous warjacks with nigh-impenetrable armour and which hit like a ton of bricks; supported by infantry ranging from massed Winter Guard conscripts to elite infantry like the deadly Widowmaker Snipers and the mighty Man-O-Wars. Khador have also recently made strides to modernise their military with more long ranged (if somewhat inaccurate) firepower.

United by the dream of a new Khardic Empire, the Khadoran people have embraced a policy of aggressive expansionism, which unsurprisingly brings them into frequent conflict with the other nations of Immoren.

THE PROTECTORATE OF MENOTH
protectorate.jpg

Formed out of a civil war with Cygnar, the Protectorate of Menoth is the youngest of the Iron Kingdoms. Essentially, the fanatical devotees of Menoth, the creator of man, were exiled to a barren wasteland to the east of Cygnar. There they found oil, diamonds, savage tribes to convert, and built up an army to crush their heathen enemies. Praise Menoth! Protectorate warjacks (and many of their troops) are individually weaker than those of the other factions, but by buffing their armies with their warcaster's spells and key support pieces, the Protectorate become exponentially more powerful. They also favour denying their enemies the ability to shoot or cast spells, thus throwing carefully laid plans into disarray.

Also, fire. Fire everywhere.

CRYX
cryx.jpg

The Nightmare Empire of Cryx is a series of islands off the western coast of mainland Immoren, and home to the immortal dragonfather Toruk. In addition to hordes of mindless undead thralls, Toruk's vassals include the Satyxis, a race of vicious warrior-women who practice blood rituals, the twelve Lich Lords, and a variety of other lifeforms corrupted and twisted by the dragon's blight. In battle, Cryx are fast, stealthy, and have a huge array of dirty tricks and debuffs up their rotting undead sleeves.

THE RETRIBUTION OF SCYRAH
Retribution.jpg

The Retribution of Scyrah is WARMACHINE's newest faction. Formerly a fringe radical group hailing from the secluded elven nation of Ios, the Retribution has recently gained heavy political ground and acceptance in its homeland. They now have access to and support from some of Ios's greaet Military Houses, including the ranks of the fearsome Dawnguard and the power of Myrmidon Warjacks. They are technologically advanced. They have force fields. They hate you.

They're out for blood and revenge. They are fighting the good fight for the survival of their species. Their last remaining Gods are dying, and they blame human magic use for it. They are damn good at what they do.

Solid units. Some absurdly powerful solos. Well-rounded if focus-hungry Warjacks. The Retribution plays differently and can be rather rewarding for those willing to put some effort into them. They shoot harder than most factions though aren't necessarily as accurate. They are potent in melee, but lack Warcaster support to the degrees most other factions enjoy. Their Warjacks are few in variety but can all do their task well. Take care of them, because they crumple like paper once their force fields are gone. Did I mention mage hunters? Oh yes. Mage hunters.

MERCENARIES
mercs.jpg

This is a world where conflict rules and wars are always ready to flare up. What kind of moron could pass up a chance to make a buck? Mercenaries come in all shapes and sizes. Some are exiles from their own land, called traitors by those they once called brother. Some are pirates sailing on the high seas. Others are freedom fighters working to save their ruined nation. Others are short bearded fellows who like money. It takes all kinds, right?

What do YOU fight for?

Nechriah on
Dating is like playing Snake, you keep accumulating emotional baggage that trails after you and it never goes away and sooner or later you just plough head first into it and die
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Posts

  • TheConstantWayTheConstantWay Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Carnarvon wrote: »
    Hell, a unit of Longunners should be able to take out a War Engine in an activation.

    Personally, I can't wait to see what Khador's Engine will do with Occultation from Strakhov.
    It was not kind with elevation and Sentry. 3 rough terrain templates is...rough.

  • RynaRyna Registered User
    edited March 2011
    I'm thinking of starting up a small group of short people..

    What do you think:

    Highborn Covenant army with,
    Durgen Madhammer ('cause he seems the most fun)
    Avalancher
    Basher (So Durgen can Redline it)
    Reinholdt (So Durgen can shoot his beautiful gun twice)

    I've got Reinholdt, so I just need Durgen and the two 'jacks..

  • OtakuD00DOtakuD00D Too stupid to feel pain. San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    My extent of this would involve Ashlynn and a Nomad, plus Gun Mages marshalling two Mules. Forge Guard would be the melee troops. But... that's not entirely short people, if that's what you're aiming for.

    Durgen's damn fun, though.

    makosig.jpg
  • tzeentchlingtzeentchling Dr. Doctor Oakland, CARegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I almost think it might be worth giving up Reinholt to play it as Searforge. Maybe if you had Gorten as the caster.

    Speaking from experience, the Driller is pretty nasty, and Thor Steinhammer provides a great Drive, should you want to expand.

  • SJSJ Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    the searforge benefits are really fucking good

  • JerickJerick Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    OK guys, I think I need to crowd source this. I'm having a lot of issues beating the local Cryx player with my circle army. We normally play 35 or 50 points, can you guys give me some tips and or lists that are good against Cryx, becuase honestly at this point I feel like there is pretty much nothing I can do. Thanks in advance.

  • susansusan Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Jerick wrote: »
    OK guys, I think I need to crowd source this. I'm having a lot of issues beating the local Cryx player with my circle army. We normally play 35 or 50 points, can you guys give me some tips and or lists that are good against Cryx, becuase honestly at this point I feel like there is pretty much nothing I can do. Thanks in advance.

    Who are his/her casters, and what units does he/she play? What's your list like, for that matter? And what kind of playstyle and tactics are you facing?

    2010 PAX DM Challenge Grand Champion
    2011 PAX Warmachine/Hordes Champion
  • JerickJerick Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    I mainly run Baulder and eKaya t4 lists, and he runs a bunch of different casters, but the ones I've been having issues with lately are Mortenebra, Goreshade, eGoreshade, Asphyxious, and Terminus. He seems to run either real jack heavy w/ units like the deathjack, stalkers, harrowers, seethers, and ripjaws. Or he can go completely the other way and run very jack light and focus on spamming out the Banes Thralls & Bane Knights as well as the supporting solos like, Tartarus and Gerlak.

  • OtakuD00DOtakuD00D Too stupid to feel pain. San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Jerick wrote: »
    I mainly run Baulder and eKaya t4 lists, and he runs a bunch of different casters, but the ones I've been having issues with lately are Mortenebra, Goreshade, eGoreshade, Asphyxious, and Terminus. He seems to run either real jack heavy w/ units like the deathjack, stalkers, harrowers, seethers, and ripjaws. Or he can go completely the other way and run very jack light and focus on spamming out the Banes Thralls & Bane Knights as well as the supporting solos like, Tartarus and Gerlak.

    Mortenebra: Ahahahaha oh god I can't help you there. Bring beasts?

    eGoreshade: Druids. You want druids to block some of his nastier spells. The ability to deal with swarms of bane thralls. Cassius could be good here with a few well-placed Hellmouths, using a normal unit of Shifting Stones (As in, no UA. The UA gives them stealth, defeating the purpose of using them this way) as your Hellmouth targets.

    Asphyxious: Druids. Some ranged troops to deal with arc nodes and low-def undead troops. If he bring Satyxis... Hope you have Ravagers and the like.

    Tarminus: If he spams 30 Mechanithralls I can't really help you there. pKreuger, perhaps?

    makosig.jpg
  • General NemoGeneral Nemo Grand Poobah of Ancient Lurkers In the jungle the mighty jungleRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    OtakuD00D wrote: »
    Jerick wrote: »
    I mainly run Baulder and eKaya t4 lists, and he runs a bunch of different casters, but the ones I've been having issues with lately are Mortenebra, Goreshade, eGoreshade, Asphyxious, and Terminus. He seems to run either real jack heavy w/ units like the deathjack, stalkers, harrowers, seethers, and ripjaws. Or he can go completely the other way and run very jack light and focus on spamming out the Banes Thralls & Bane Knights as well as the supporting solos like, Tartarus and Gerlak.

    Mortenebra: Ahahahaha oh god I can't help you there. Bring beasts?

    eGoreshade: Druids. You want druids to block some of his nastier spells. The ability to deal with swarms of bane thralls. Cassius could be good here with a few well-placed Hellmouths, using a normal unit of Shifting Stones (As in, no UA. The UA gives them stealth, defeating the purpose of using them this way) as your Hellmouth targets.

    Asphyxious: Druids. Some ranged troops to deal with arc nodes and low-def undead troops. If he bring Satyxis... Hope you have Ravagers and the like.

    Tarminus: If he spams 30 Mechanithralls I can't really help you there. pKreuger, perhaps?
    Won't Psychic Vampire kill druids?

  • PMAversPMAvers You wouldn't have heard of it, anyway...Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    My brother has been swearing by Mohsar to fuck with Cryx, since out of ten players in his local meta 6 are Cryx players. Don't have his stats in front of me, but by going off the BattleCollege entry I can see that. Especially with those free sprays from Crevasse, that can chew through a bunch of infantry.

    His current list he's been working on:
    50+5 points, 22 models

    Mohsar the Desertwalker +5 points
    * Gorax 4 points
    * Megalith 11 points
    * Pureblood Warpwolf 9 points
    * Woldwarden 9 points

    Blackclad Wayfarer 2 points
    Druids of Orboros 7 points
    * Druid of Orboros Overseer 2 points
    Shifting Stones 2 points
    * Stone Keeper 1 point
    5 Warpborn Skinwalkers 8 points

    persona4celestia.jpg
    COME FORTH, AMATERASU!
  • JerickJerick Registered User regular
    edited March 2011
    OtakuD00D wrote: »
    Jerick wrote: »
    I mainly run Baulder and eKaya t4 lists, and he runs a bunch of different casters, but the ones I've been having issues with lately are Mortenebra, Goreshade, eGoreshade, Asphyxious, and Terminus. He seems to run either real jack heavy w/ units like the deathjack, stalkers, harrowers, seethers, and ripjaws. Or he can go completely the other way and run very jack light and focus on spamming out the Banes Thralls & Bane Knights as well as the supporting solos like, Tartarus and Gerlak.

    Mortenebra: Ahahahaha oh god I can't help you there. Bring beasts?

    eGoreshade: Druids. You want druids to block some of his nastier spells. The ability to deal with swarms of bane thralls. Cassius could be good here with a few well-placed Hellmouths, using a normal unit of Shifting Stones (As in, no UA. The UA gives them stealth, defeating the purpose of using them this way) as your Hellmouth targets.

    Asphyxious: Druids. Some ranged troops to deal with arc nodes and low-def undead troops. If he bring Satyxis... Hope you have Ravagers and the like.

    Tarminus: If he spams 30 Mechanithralls I can't really help you there. pKreuger, perhaps?

    Yeah with eGoreshade psychic vampire murders the druids, but yeah I basically feel like all of his units just flat out counter everything I have.

  • tzeentchlingtzeentchling Dr. Doctor Oakland, CARegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    Kromac's Bestial and the Woldwyrd's animus could take the place of the Druid's counter-magic, though both might require you to get somewhat close. A Baldur construct list might help against Bane spam, as they're not living so no Death Toll. Nyss Hunters or Bloodtrackers also outrange/out-threat-range Banes and have a good chance of killing them.

  • OtakuD00DOtakuD00D Too stupid to feel pain. San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited March 2011
    You can at least have counter-magic defend you from arc nodes until they enter his control area.

    I kinda actually forgot about that ability. Well, hope you can kill his banes en masse before anything too bad happens. Gogo chain lightnin gand pKreuger!

    makosig.jpg
  • MortenebraMortenebra Registered User
    edited April 2011
    Greetings, filthy beasts of meat and hair! I have lurked this board for years now but decided to post so I can help escalate things to further heights of slaughter and madness. A few inane words to introduce myself: I am a PP Press Ganger (amongst other things that we don't talk about, that's code for those who know). I started playing sometime between the Warmachine preview/presale at its first GenCon, and when the book actually came out in stores in Seattle (a bit before they shipped nationally). I was bribed into it by the original Steam Dogs, the first WM demo team/ playtester team. I think that was 2005? I also have painted miniatures since I was a teenager and have played most all the "big" minis games over the years, and have been a miniatures painter professionally (as in, paid all the bills that way w/o any other job, income, or roommate, very overrated sanity-snapping "career" actually). I play all the factions except Mercs and Cygnar but have been most dedicated to Cryx, and then also Skorne when Hordes was in the works.

    Right now I am working on painting some Khador stuff for my signifigant other along with building her Tharn mob and also some of my Farrow backlog. So that's me.

    I also wanted to point out, I often see the Bane Thrall UA being considered an auto-include with Terminus using certain builds. What some might consider to be redundant Tough access is actually often more like "double reinforced" Tough access. Normally one of the weaknesses T-Bone has, is that he has to clump up, and this can be your downfall (especially in certain scenarios). If you have the UA, you can flank with Banes or at least break up your frontage, still be Tough, and of course the REAL perk is that they get Rise, which means the ones that survive due to Tough can now activate normally rather than being knocked down and being worthless. That wins a lot of games. Also just having 3 more attacks with Bane Axes is worth a couple points just in itself. They aren't exactly a must-have but you will never, ever think "that was a sub-par use of points" once you have used them well.

  • RainfallRainfall Don't lose your WAAAAAAAYRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Maan. Terminus lists. Just take no models with souls and you're fine! I find my Zaal Immortals list and my Legion beast-heavy stuff does fine, as well as eNemo jackswarms!

  • OtakuD00DOtakuD00D Too stupid to feel pain. San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Back when Mk II started, my friend and one our best players, who has since taken a break from WM/H, would bust out Terminus with 30 mechanithralls and max Necrosurgeons.

    So painful.

    makosig.jpg
  • admanbadmanb the bored genie Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    OtakuD00D wrote: »
    Back when Mk II started, my friend and one our best players, who has since taken a break from WM/H, would bust out Terminus with 30 mechanithralls and max Necrosurgeons.

    So painful.

    You know something's gone terribly wrong with you can say "pCaine" and "hard counter" in the same sentence.

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  • OtakuD00DOtakuD00D Too stupid to feel pain. San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    I've tried that. It doesn't work. You can only catch so much with his feat, then there's tough rolls. In a timed tournament it's very impractical.

    Terminus can then just charge in, reap a ton of souls, and walk all over your flimsy army that was focused on taking down his horde, finding itself short on actual hitting power.

    makosig.jpg
  • SJSJ Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    terminus is such an asshole :(

  • MortenebraMortenebra Registered User
    edited April 2011
    Caine is nothing near a counter for Terminus. It's a crapshoot at best (see what I did there) with you praying to Morrow that enough Tough rolls get failed and that it was a game-winning move, or else if you got enough thralls in Caine's CTRL to bother using his feat, you are about to get rolled if you didn't just win the game.

    On the contrary, Caine just means Terminus needs to keep a handful of thralls back behind him to either bait a foolish attempt where Caine tries to feat on them, which results in Caine becoming a soul token, or else just rush forward and force the feat, which results in the same thing anyway. It's also super simple to just throw more at him than he can kill quickly, and if one thrall gets close enough (which the Caine player will not feel too threatened by and usually ignores), you just have to slam that thrall into him (super reliably easy to do) and his only defense, his high DEF stat, is worthless and he's done. I've managed to kill him with Termy's breath weapon after the POW 7 collateral damage...Caine is just that fragile. And this is against players who win Gen Con events, not people who shouldn't see it coming.

  • admanbadmanb the bored genie Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    OtakuD00D wrote: »
    I've tried that. It doesn't work. You can only catch so much with his feat, then there's tough rolls. In a timed tournament it's very impractical.

    Terminus can then just charge in, reap a ton of souls, and walk all over your flimsy army that was focused on taking down his horde, finding itself short on actual hitting power.

    It's not that bad if you can feat turn 2 (18" down the board on turn one makes it not too hard) and teleport behind a terrain feature. Your army doesn't need to be anywhere near that.

    If you're playing a center control scenario you're still pretty much boned, but in most everything else you should be able to (assuming very good positioning) pick apart his army long enough to force him into a crappy feat turn, then kill him (assuming you have Eiryss.)

    twitter, github, resume/portfolio, if you like to play or host boardgames online, check out handtracker
  • themocawthemocaw Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    http://privateerpress.com/community/privateer-insider

    Privateer Insider for 4-1-11 has the initial sculpt of the Celestial Fulcrum. It looks gorgeous.

  • admanbadmanb the bored genie Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    themocaw wrote: »
    http://privateerpress.com/community/privateer-insider

    Privateer Insider for 4-1-11 has the initial sculpt of the Celestial Fulcrum. It looks gorgeous.

    Niiiice.

    Will is a regular at my LGS. He's a cool guy.

    twitter, github, resume/portfolio, if you like to play or host boardgames online, check out handtracker
  • PMAversPMAvers You wouldn't have heard of it, anyway...Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    More importantly, the Heavy Rifle Team models went up.

    persona4celestia.jpg
    COME FORTH, AMATERASU!
  • ArcturasArcturas Registered User
    edited April 2011
    So I finally played my first game of hordes, using the battle box sets. Good times! My friend and I didn't have much in the way of terrain, so we used some settlers hexagons to put things together. Forests for forests, clay for rough terrain, and mountains for impenetrable/LoS blocking stuff.

    How in the blazes is Circle Orboros supposed to deal with Legion of Everblight? I'm hoping options open up when you get more casters or models, but in the battle boxes, my Legion seemed to do pretty well.

    Battle Rep:
    We started off on opposite sides of the table - I didn't really know what he could do, and vice versa. So he moved up about as far as he could with his 2 Argus's, placing Kaya behind them, with the Warpwolf just to the side of Kaya.

    I moved Lylyth up 6 inches, and tagged the first Argus with her bow, boosting the attack roll. I connected (RAT 7 + 3d6 vs. Def 15 seemed pretty good), dealt a few damage, and then did the spike explosion spell for 3 fury. Since her bow's special ability lets her ignore range and LoS limitations, it auto-connected and dealt a few more damage, and on the d6 roll I tagged all of her other models. I dealt 3-ish damage to both arguses, 2 to the Warpwolf, and then boosted my damage roll against Kaya, dealing 7 damage that he transferred to the Warpwolf as well. I moved my Carnivean in front of Lylyth, shredders to the side, slapping the Shredders' +1 armor animus on Lylyth, the Carnivean, and the 2 forward Shredders. Spiky armor as well on the Carnivean.

    On my friend's second turn, he was out of range for any charges or attacks (10-ish inches from the Carnivean, plus a few inches of which were through rough terrain, and I don't recall what the threat range on the Argus was, but the other two warbeasts would have been out of range). Instead, he fell back behind a rock wall that blocked movement + LoS, hoping to hide as well as possible and forcing the Warpwolf to regenerate.

    My turn I swung to the side of the rock wall with Lylyth, again finding myself 11-12 inches from an Argus. Connected on a boosted attack roll, another explosion of spikes doing enough damage to kill an Argus after he transferred surplus damage off of Kaya. One of my shredders frenzied but missed another shredder, and then I ran three shredders up in front of Lylyth to screen her and planted the Carnivean nearby.

    On his turn, he moved as far forward as he could with his remaining Argus, Warpwolf and Kaya. He couldn't charge with the Warpwolf, so ran it into pretty close proximity to my guys. The argus caught all three shredders and Lylyth in its spray, but only managed to connect against the forward shredder. Then Kaya moved up and almost killed that shredder (it was at 1 health left), floating 3-4 fury for transfers.

    On my turn, I popped my feat, slid Lylyth around to shoot Kaya. Feat + boost = 4d6+7 on a ranged attack. Once i connected I hit her with parasite. Next I failed to hurt the Warpwolf with a charging shredder. Then I charged the Argus with the Carnivean and sprayed fire over it and Kaya. Kaya transferred and killed the Argus. Then I was able to move and attack Kaya with a pair of rabid shredders. (I figured I didn't have to charge since rabid already boosted their attack rolls, and they were inside range) At this point she was out of fury for transfers, and got eaten.

    Rules question - does a charging Carnivean that makes a ranged attack use the spray template, or just hit the charged model?

    So what should my friend have done?

    Eyeless sight on all my models, plus pathfinder on most of them (and rabid giving Shredders pathfinder) meant the terrain was pretty useless in helping him hide from me. Eyeless sigh also directly counters one of Kaya's biggest strengths, granting stealth to her units, and Legion has it everywhere.

    While he's a touch faster than I was, I could kite with Lylyth to get at least one 12" shot + spikesplosion, possibly 2 because she has that shoot & fall back option. Plus a 12" distance between us lets me attack without him being able to get into melee range. His only ranged options are on Kaya herself (and the Argus's, but those ranged attacks don't do damage - they just make my dudes easier to hit). Are Kaya's ranged attacks, even on a feat turn, really able to put out that much damage? It feels like if he moved up and attacked with her ranged + spirit fang, he'd only be able to kill one, perhaps two of my shredders, and then my Carni, shredders, and Lylyth would be able to get a charge + feat turn off in retaliation, doing a hell of a lot of damage.

    In essence I'm confused, because Legion seems directly designed to counter Circle's advantages, and so I should get at least one free turn of shooting/spells off from Lylyth, plus the charge if he tries to move up and prevent her from running away, and that seems like a really huge advantage.

  • OtakuD00DOtakuD00D Too stupid to feel pain. San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Yeah, Circle v Legion is a sore spot for me. We can come up with crazy ways to hide ourselves and bog the enemy down.

    Legion don't give a flying fuck.

    makosig.jpg
  • admanbadmanb the bored genie Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Arcturas wrote: »
    Rules question - does a charging Carnivean that makes a ranged attack use the spray template, or just hit the charged model?

    Spray template aimed from the center of the Carnivean's base down the center of the target's.
    In essence I'm confused, because Legion seems directly designed to counter Circle's advantages, and so I should get at least one free turn of shooting/spells off from Lylyth, plus the charge if he tries to move up and prevent her from running away, and that seems like a really huge advantage.

    There's a general rule that applies nicely here: when something seems unbeatable, stop playing the Battle Boxes*. They are good ways to get introduced to the game, but they are not balanced in the slightest. Kaya, in particular, is straight-up awful. She used to be viable Battle Box caster who fell apart at normal game sizes, but then they nerfed the spell that made her a viable Battle Box caster.

    *A twist on the usual rule of Warmachine: when something seems unbeatable, it isn't.

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  • OtakuD00DOtakuD00D Too stupid to feel pain. San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Except, in general, Circle really is at a terrible disadvantage against Legion most of the time. Circle's good at making rules up. Legion's good at ignoring them.

    At least Baldur's feat provides cover and an army of durable beasts. Don't ever bother relying on Stealth to fight off Legion lest the player actually focuses on troops. Never build a list that relies on forest generation and the hilarity that comes from it (Unless you're Morv.)

    makosig.jpg
  • SJSJ Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    PMAvers wrote: »
    More importantly, the Heavy Rifle Team models went up.

    this sucks, because now I have to start a retribution army just for these

  • OtakuD00DOtakuD00D Too stupid to feel pain. San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Save yourself the trouble and play Cygnar instead. You get something that's one POW less, has a decent melee weapon, and has a RAT of 7. It can also move and shoot. It can also boost.

    It's called the Hunter.

    makosig.jpg
  • admanbadmanb the bored genie Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    doesn't that thing cost like 3 points?

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  • OtakuD00DOtakuD00D Too stupid to feel pain. San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Light artillery's rarely worth it.

    makosig.jpg
  • admanbadmanb the bored genie Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Well... sure, but most artillery weapons would still be bad if you put them on a 'jack.

    I dunno if it'll end up being viable in the long run -- it would need a buff like FFE or S&P (lol Mortars) to get there -- but I'd rather have three of those than a Hunter.

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  • SJSJ Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    OtakuD00D wrote: »
    Save yourself the trouble and play Cygnar instead. You get something that's one POW less, has a decent melee weapon, and has a RAT of 7. It can also move and shoot. It can also boost.

    It's called the Hunter.

    Uhm, I already have like 200 points of Cygnar, but thanks for your advice that has nothing at all to do with what I like about that model

    I guess

  • OtakuD00DOtakuD00D Too stupid to feel pain. San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Seriously. That's all the Heavy Rifle is. It's a POW 7 Hunter. It's in the new NQ.

    Oh, and it's 2 points. Not bad, I guess. Helps Ret focus their firepower in better ways.

    (EDIT: BAAH I meant Hunter. Not charger.)

    makosig.jpg
  • susansusan Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Question: How well does the Reaper work with pSkarre, and Cryx in general? I've been playing Skarre heavy for a couple weeks now and I'm loving her, but I'm always finding myself just out of charge range to really bring the pain down on the bad guys. Would inclusion of a Reaper synergize well with her infantry, bringing a heavy in range for them to beat to death?

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  • OtakuD00DOtakuD00D Too stupid to feel pain. San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    If you can somehow get a good bead on an enemy 'Caster or other really important piece, go for it, especially since it can pull in equal-sized models in Mk II.

    In Mk I, it could only reel in smaller-sized bases.

    makosig.jpg
  • tzeentchlingtzeentchling Dr. Doctor Oakland, CARegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Reaper works decently well with pSkarre, assuming she can feed it (and with a Scarlock casting the Dark Ritual spell or whatever it's called that sac's a creature for focus, she can feed it relatively well). Withershadow would be a good combo too with the Reaper, to get a free Seether after hit+drag, at least at 50 points. Malice might be a really good option for pSkarre, actually - needs less focus and can hit things better, plus soul collection options and taking control of warjacks.

  • admanbadmanb the bored genie Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    susan wrote: »
    Question: How well does the Reaper work with pSkarre, and Cryx in general? I've been playing Skarre heavy for a couple weeks now and I'm loving her, but I'm always finding myself just out of charge range to really bring the pain down on the bad guys. Would inclusion of a Reaper synergize well with her infantry, bringing a heavy in range for them to beat to death?

    If you can afford Malice he does the Reaper thing, except better, and he generates his own focus.

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