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[TV] Game of Thrones, presented by HBO - NO BOOK DISCUSSION.

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Posts

  • TastyfishTastyfish Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    There's lots of Tyrion ones, it just takes a while for you to realise that he's not on "the bad guy's side", and that there isn't really that clear cut a line between 'good' and 'bad'. Likewise with Daenrys, it just takes a while for us to get to know her properly as a character rather than a plot point.
    Spoiler:

    Probably more a case of pacing, working out where to end a particular episode to emphasise triumphs on one side or the other. Just because one side doesn't get away cleanly doesn't mean they've lost - I've a feeling that a lot of us here read to fast and might get their opinions coloured by whatever the last thing that happened.

  • metaghostmetaghost Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    And at this point in the story, realistically what opportunities could there be for "small victories" other than Tyrion/Arya making Joffrey cry like the sniveling punk he is?

    Mad Men, in particular, had an obligation to portray Don as something of an advertising genius from the start in order for much of his dramatic arc to work. Game of Thrones doesn't have a comparable Main Character, as much as some may become attached to one individual or another, so the positive progressing elements become even more diffuse and minor.

  • TaramoorTaramoor Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    metaghost wrote: »
    And at this point in the story, realistically what opportunities could there be for "small victories" other than Tyrion/Arya making Joffrey cry like the sniveling punk he is?

    Mad Men, in particular, had an obligation to portray Don as something of an advertising genius from the start in order for much of his dramatic arc to work. Game of Thrones doesn't have a comparable Main Character, as much as some may become attached to one individual or another, so the positive progressing elements become even more diffuse and minor.

    Especially given the rapid pace at which shit goes down.

  • TarantioTarantio Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Balefuego wrote: »
    ...why? I thought that scene was fantastic.

    I hated it for different reasons than I've heard (Cersei more sympathetic, etc.)

    Book 1/Major series spoilers
    Spoiler:
    Spoiler:


    And to make this post not entirely composed of book spoilers in the show thread- Ilyn Payne is scary enough for me. He didn't look too physically imposing in the last episode, but he was standing next to the Hound. And he had a very creepy stare.

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  • KalTorakKalTorak Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Payne looked exactly the way I imagined him, if a bit shorter.

  • TaramoorTaramoor Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Tarantio wrote: »
    Balefuego wrote: »
    ...why? I thought that scene was fantastic.

    I hated it for different reasons than I've heard (Cersei more sympathetic, etc.)

    Book 1/Major series spoilers
    Spoiler:
    Spoiler:


    And to make this post not entirely composed of book spoilers in the show thread- Ilyn Payne is scary enough for me. He didn't look too physically imposing in the last episode, but he was standing next to the Hound. And he had a very creepy stare.

    I hear his name in my mind as "Ill and Pain".

    I keep thinking he's a Captain Planet villain or something.

  • Kate of LokysKate of Lokys Registered User
    edited April 2011
    KalTorak wrote: »
    I think the only thing missing from the show (and the books too, at this point) is some kind of small victory for the characters we're rooting for. Bad shit happens to characters in Mad Men and The Wire, sure, but interspersed with that we get to see Don put a golden campaign out of thin air and sell it to Lucky Strike, or McNulty put one over on Rawls. Little victories like that don't really make up for the bigger issues at stake, but they give the viewer a little pump up when something good happens for the characters they're rooting for.

    Like I said, at this point there isn't that much opportunity for this sort of thing in the story so far. About the only little victorious moment I can think of is Tyriod bitchslapping Joffrey, which is less about a character victory and more about "somebody should slap that kid."

    Yeah, I think this is Pixels' objection to the show: there's just nothing good. The book, I think, did a much better job of making characters likable. Take for instance Jon giving Arya her sword: it happens in the show, yeah, but there's not much to it. Jon hands her a sword, they hug, it's over in about a minute of total screen time. In the book, on the other hand,
    Spoiler:

    Right now, the single most likable character in the show, by far, is Tyrion. And for people who have read the books,
    Spoiler:
    But for the purposes of the show, I feel like he's just *too* charismatic - he's stealing the affection of the audience, and making the Starks look like a bunch of gloomy stick-arsed sad sacks instead of a proud house of honorable nobles.

    I'm here to tell you about voting. Imagine you're locked in a huge underground nightclub filled with sinners, whores, freaks and unnameable things that rape pit bulls for fun. And you ain't allowed out until you all vote on what you're going to do tonight [. . .] So you vote for television, and everyone else, as far as your eye can see, votes to fuck you with switchblades. That's voting. You're welcome.
  • schussschuss Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    But for the purposes of the show, I feel like he's just *too* charismatic - he's stealing the affection of the audience, and making the Starks look like a bunch of gloomy stick-arsed sad sacks instead of a proud house of honorable nobles.

    Their family motto is "Winter is coming", so I think among the nobles, they ARE the gloomy-stick arses. That's part of why they're the masters of the North/Wall. They get shit done, but they aren't sunshine and flowers.

  • ParadisoParadiso Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    I found the scene in the Godswood in episode 2 to be a bit awkward. If you haven't read the book how on earth would you know or care why that quiet dude says he'll support Robb if it comes to war? He's not one of Ned's sons but seems to be lurking around a lot. I'm curious what someone who has fresh eyes from only watching the series thought of that. Was it confusing or did you just trust that it would be explained eventually?

    Regarding Theon in the book:
    Spoiler:

  • TlexTlex Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Yeah I think Theon should be more aloof from the family, he seems too much like one of the brothers, and (Book 2/3 Spoilers!)
    Spoiler:

  • Alucard6986Alucard6986 Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Tlex wrote: »
    Yeah I think Theon should be more aloof from the family, he seems too much like one of the brothers, and (Book 2/3 Spoilers!)
    Spoiler:
    Spoiler:

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  • JenosavelJenosavel Registered User
    edited April 2011
    LaOs wrote: »
    I think that it would probably be easier for non-readers to watch the show if the readers did not explain the significance of things and people to them. Let the show play itself out, just like the books did when we read them. I think the explanations draw attention to the "lack" of explanations in the show, even though those unexplained things might not have needed to be explained at that point.

    As a non-reader myself, I agree with this.

    The show is a little overwhelming in the amount of information it presents already, and adding extra explanation from an outside source (books) could quickly push it over the line to where its so complex that you just you throw up your hands and give up.

    Currently the show is striking a good balance for me. There's quite the overload of characters and settings and histories at first, to the point that I had only the vaguest idea of who was who and what was really going on after my first watching of ep 1. There was just too much info to soak in immediately. Where there is obviously more explanation missing, it just tells me interesting things are coming if I hang around.

    In fact, the curiosity triggered by the things the show is deliberately withholding is what caused me to go back and re-watch episode 1 three more times interspersed between obsessive bouts of checking out the HBO spoiler-free history page. After all that and then watching episode 2 I'm pretty confident I know exactly who all the characters are now and where they're coming from.

    However, if someone had just tried to dump all that information on me while I was watching the show for the first time, especially if it meant pausing the show repeatedly, I can say with a great deal of confidence that I would have found it overwhelming to the point of not being fun, and may very well have lost interest entirely.

    I think the writers of the show seem to know what they're doing by only giving us the background information we absolutely need at any one point in time. It breaks things down into more digestible chunks, and where it leaves an obvious hole in the background/history, it just serves as tantalizing bait for future episodes.

  • TlexTlex Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Kinda, but (same book spoilers as above)
    Spoiler:

  • MadpandaMadpanda Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Have they mentioned if the season/book pacing will be 1:1?

    Also can't wait to see some of the casting choices


    Mainly

    book 3-4? spoilers
    Spoiler:

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  • Big DookieBig Dookie Smells great! Houston, TXRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Tlex wrote: »
    Kinda, but (same book spoilers as above)
    Spoiler:

    Who cares? So he's different in the show than he is in the books. I'm sure they'll make it work.

    Jeez, I've read the books and even I'm getting tired of all the comparisons between the two.

  • TlexTlex Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    I'm sure they can work it out and present it well, (same spoilers)
    Spoiler:

  • TomantaTomanta Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    minor Theon spoilers for a future episode:
    Spoiler:

    camo_sig2.png
  • Reverend_ChaosReverend_Chaos Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Madpanda wrote: »
    Have they mentioned if the season/book pacing will be 1:1?

    Also can't wait to see some of the casting choices

    So far the only thing that's been announced is the first two seasons, each will span it's respective book title, so this season should wrap up all of Game of Thrones, and the next one should encompass Clash of Kings

    Also, would you guys stop dropping book spoilers in the thread specifically for the TV show....I know it's hard not to take what's on the show and move forward from there, but there is an entire thread for those of us who have read the novels, so if you want to discuss the show espeically in relation to the books, take it over there and let's leave this thread *book spoiler* free which was it's intended purpose.

    “Think of me like Yoda, but instead of being little and green I wear suits and I'm awesome. I'm your bro—I'm Broda!”
  • JohannenJohannen Registered User
    edited April 2011
    My girlfriend, who hasn't read the books, absolutely loves the show. She says that it's interesting instead of just being based on "good things happen to good people who always win". She likes the characters and is really looking forward to finding out more about the background of everyone.

    Also, I'll ask again but isn't Jon Snows hair blonde/white in the books?

  • LaOsLaOs Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Johannen wrote: »
    My girlfriend, who hasn't read the books, absolutely loves the show. She says that it's interesting instead of just being based on "good things happen to good people who always win". She likes the characters and is really looking forward to finding out more about the background of everyone.

    Also, I'll ask again but isn't Jon Snows hair blonde/white in the books?

    No. I, like whomever answered a similar question earlier, believe that he and Arya are typically described as the only two who look like Starks while the other children look similar to Tullys.

  • JohannenJohannen Registered User
    edited April 2011
    LaOs wrote: »
    Johannen wrote: »
    My girlfriend, who hasn't read the books, absolutely loves the show. She says that it's interesting instead of just being based on "good things happen to good people who always win". She likes the characters and is really looking forward to finding out more about the background of everyone.

    Also, I'll ask again but isn't Jon Snows hair blonde/white in the books?

    No. I, like whomever answered a similar question earlier, believe that he and Arya are typically described as the only two who look like Starks while the other children look similar to Tullys.

    Isn't that because he has facial features much like Ned and has quite pale skin like ned.
    I thought it said he had light colored hair
    Spoiler:

    I may be wrong.

    However, I think casting is pretty great anyway.

  • LaOsLaOs Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Johannen wrote: »
    LaOs wrote: »
    Johannen wrote: »
    My girlfriend, who hasn't read the books, absolutely loves the show. She says that it's interesting instead of just being based on "good things happen to good people who always win". She likes the characters and is really looking forward to finding out more about the background of everyone.

    Also, I'll ask again but isn't Jon Snows hair blonde/white in the books?

    No. I, like whomever answered a similar question earlier, believe that he and Arya are typically described as the only two who look like Starks while the other children look similar to Tullys.

    Isn't that because he has facial features much like Ned and has quite pale skin like ned.
    I thought it said he had light colored hair
    Spoiler:

    I may be wrong.

    However, I think casting is pretty great anyway.

    I don't remember and my books are at home, but I don't think you're right... like, that's just my gut memory talking. Those theories in your spoiler (spoilers for all the books, really, for those unaware) are supported by much, much more compelling evidence.

  • OrganichuOrganichu Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    re: jon's appearance
    Spoiler:

    XMSODhjrer45.gif
  • JohannenJohannen Registered User
    edited April 2011
    Organichu wrote: »
    re: jon's appearance
    Spoiler:

    Huh.

    I should stop picturing him as a young Geralt.

  • DecoyDecoy Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    I'm not much of a reader, but due to loving the fantasy world setting and Sean Bean, I tuned in. Like most who hadn't read the books, I was a bit overwhelmed, but am quickly catching on.

    In regards to the "depressing" and "nothing good ever happens" quality, I can see why that would push people away. It's not bothering me too much.

    camo_sig2.png
  • Fizban140Fizban140 Registered User, __BANNED USERS
    edited April 2011
    I always assumed John's hair was black
    Spoiler:

    533570-1.png
  • MagellMagell Sphinx! Parts UnknownRegistered User regular
    edited April 2011
    People who have read the book and are explaining shit to people who are just watching the show are doing it wrong. If you just read the books there is a lot of shit you don't know until later in the book. Your explanations are going to ruin later episodes as the explanation would have ruined later chapters in the books.

    I do love the show so far, and I like Arya especially.

  • BalefuegoBalefuego Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    his hair is black but it dosen't make that ridiculous at all considering the overwhelming amount of evidence in favor of it


    thats a conversation for the book thread though

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  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Super Moderator, Moderator mod
    edited April 2011
    Johannen wrote: »
    Organichu wrote: »
    re: jon's appearance
    Spoiler:

    Huh.

    I should stop picturing him as a young Geralt.

    That's actually how I pictured him the first time through as well - almost a bit albino-y. My friend said he pictured Jon looking like David Bowie. I wonder what it is in the text that gave us that impression?

  • CabezoneCabezone Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    It's because his name is Snow.

  • Wandering IdiotWandering Idiot Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    His comments after the second episode:
    "That was just the most emotionally draining hour of television I've ever watched, it was miserable."
    He should, uh, probably never watch season 4 of The Wire. Or any of it, really.

    Johannen wrote: »
    My girlfriend, who hasn't read the books, absolutely loves the show. She says that it's interesting instead of just being based on "good things happen to good people who always win".
    Marry this woman.

    Magell wrote: »
    People who have read the book and are explaining shit to people who are just watching the show are doing it wrong.
    I'd have to agree with this. I feel like the majority of the book readers watching it with non-readers and complaining that they were confused by it is because said non-readers asked "who's that guy again?" and got a paragraphs-long explanation instead of waiting for the show to explain/reiterate the information naturally. I think I was halfway through the first season of The Wire before I knew everyone's name, and I liked that show just fine. In this, I felt like Ned Stark had 3 or 4 samey looking dark-haired prettyboy sons in the scene where they found the direwolves, and a full explanation would probably have been hard to keep track of at that point (I found out I was wrong because of the second episode and glancing at the HBO viewers guide, but I don't think the latter would have been necessary).

  • BalefuegoBalefuego Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    yeah, even as a reader of the books I am finding the way some of the other people familiar with the source material are trying to explain everything to the neophytes fairly grating

    also I am pretty sure I did not know Kima's name until halfway through season 2 of The Wire

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Kate of LokysKate of Lokys Registered User
    edited April 2011
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    Johannen wrote: »
    Organichu wrote: »
    re: jon's appearance
    Spoiler:

    Huh.

    I should stop picturing him as a young Geralt.

    That's actually how I pictured him the first time through as well - almost a bit albino-y. My friend said he pictured Jon looking like David Bowie. I wonder what it is in the text that gave us that impression?

    There's a passage about halfway through the first book:
    Spoiler:

    I'm here to tell you about voting. Imagine you're locked in a huge underground nightclub filled with sinners, whores, freaks and unnameable things that rape pit bulls for fun. And you ain't allowed out until you all vote on what you're going to do tonight [. . .] So you vote for television, and everyone else, as far as your eye can see, votes to fuck you with switchblades. That's voting. You're welcome.
  • Fizban140Fizban140 Registered User, __BANNED USERS
    edited April 2011
    Balefuego wrote: »
    yeah, even as a reader of the books I am finding the way some of the other people familiar with the source material are trying to explain everything to the neophytes fairly grating

    also I am pretty sure I did not know Kima's name until halfway through season 2 of The Wire

    Because everyone called her Gregs.

    I do like the way Game of Thrones introduces chracters though, like the scenes with Jaime before he was relevant to the plot, builds him up and then he does something to remember him by. They also made sure to mention that his sister is the queen, all of it came out nicely for an episode I think. No idea how it flowed for people who didn't read the books.

    533570-1.png
  • ShadowenShadowen Snores in the morning Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Madpanda wrote: »
    Have they mentioned if the season/book pacing will be 1:1?

    So far the only thing that's been announced is the first two seasons, each will span it's respective book title, so this season should wrap up all of Game of Thrones, and the next one should encompass Clash of Kings[/U]

    I think Martin has said he hopes that they do 1:1 for GoT and CoK, and then SoS and FFC get three seasons between them.

  • MayGodHaveMercyMayGodHaveMercy Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Rodrik's "side whiskers" are ridiculous in the show. That's ... not how I imagine them at all. That's not even how they are described, really. Also, I hope they do a good job with Tywin's armor.

    ArcherEyes2.jpg
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  • override367override367 Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    Johannen wrote: »
    Organichu wrote: »
    re: jon's appearance
    Spoiler:

    Huh.

    I should stop picturing him as a young Geralt.

    That's actually how I pictured him the first time through as well - almost a bit albino-y. My friend said he pictured Jon looking like David Bowie. I wonder what it is in the text that gave us that impression?
    Spoiler:

    XBLIVE: Biggestoverride
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  • AurinAurin Registered User
    edited April 2011
    I felt bad for my non-book reading hubby during episode 2...
    Spoiler:

    And, by the way, my husband is enjoying the hell out of the series so far, even though he only read the first chapter or so of GoT. So it can be interesting to those who haven't read the books. ;-)

  • BalefuegoBalefuego Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Shadowen wrote: »
    Madpanda wrote: »
    Have they mentioned if the season/book pacing will be 1:1?

    So far the only thing that's been announced is the first two seasons, each will span it's respective book title, so this season should wrap up all of Game of Thrones, and the next one should encompass Clash of Kings[/U]

    I think Martin has said he hopes that they do 1:1 for GoT and CoK, and then SoS and FFC get three seasons between them.

    Actually what he said was 1:1 for GoT and Clash, then 2 for Storm, then 3 for Feast/Dance

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • BluntlyBluntly Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Balefuego wrote: »
    Shadowen wrote: »
    Madpanda wrote: »
    Have they mentioned if the season/book pacing will be 1:1?

    So far the only thing that's been announced is the first two seasons, each will span it's respective book title, so this season should wrap up all of Game of Thrones, and the next one should encompass Clash of Kings[/U]

    I think Martin has said he hopes that they do 1:1 for GoT and CoK, and then SoS and FFC get three seasons between them.

    Actually what he said was 1:1 for GoT and Clash, then 2 for Storm, then 3 for Feast/Dance

    Yeah. Which is kinda ridiculous. I suspect that if the show even gets that far, they'll start making seasons long and cutting things.

This discussion has been closed.