Mass 3ffect: 2012

Dragkonias

Yeah, while I like Miranda, having a Cerberus squaddie like Kai Leng would have been interesting.

Iceman.USAF

My girlfriend is playing through the suicide mission right now. I'm so pumped, it'll be fun to see her reaction as she's not a "gamer".

Also curious to see who she sends through the vents.

EDIT: She sent Tali.

chiasaur11

SoundsPlush wrote: »

I wish Miranda was more terrorist-y. After the intro she seemed more like a lightside character oblivious to Cerberus's misdeeds - she waved off all the ones with abuses as rogue events or perfectly acceptable, didn't she? Pragia was a fluke, the husks were already dead and creepers mindless, so clearly no ethical questions, the rachni were abandoned once they realized how dangerous they were (read: lost all their bases to them). She does say, "we cross the line all the time," but that's right before explaining why it was all okay.

I'd like her more if she was just like, "yeah, we tortured some people and experimented on kidnapped civilians. And you know what? It felt good. It felt good because every one of your so-called 'victims' was a martyr for humanity, every death saving a million more. Don't tell me that's not worth it. Don't try to sermonize me. In the face of Armageddon, your absolutist ethic is just another disastrous zealotry."

I'd still get to tell her off, but she'd be more of a committed, high-tier operative instead of a confused subordinate.

Agreed.

Also, would have made subverting her feel like a triumph, rather than the obvious course of events.

curly haired boy

i'm looking forward to killing kai leng in ME3

-Tal

Miranda is described as a loyalist and I always got the impression that she was more working for TIM because he helped her out in a tough spot than really being a pro-human zealot

in fact that's how I'd describe most of Cerberus, they're all kind of "haha, ok TIM" for some kind of ulterior motive

Synthesis

Who got the impression Miranda was evil?

She's not evil. ME has basically made clear that condoning kidnap, torture, and murder is not evil. Hell, even doing those things might not be evil.

She is, however, stupid, like 99% of the the suicidal lemmings who share her affiliation. And something of a bitch. The big difference is that she's lucky. So when she suggests some stupid thing like, "Technically, any biotic could do it," she gets off without a scratch.

Dragkonias

chiasaur11 wrote: »

SoundsPlush wrote: »

I wish Miranda was more terrorist-y. After the intro she seemed more like a lightside character oblivious to Cerberus's misdeeds - she waved off all the ones with abuses as rogue events or perfectly acceptable, didn't she? Pragia was a fluke, the husks were already dead and creepers mindless, so clearly no ethical questions, the rachni were abandoned once they realized how dangerous they were (read: lost all their bases to them). She does say, "we cross the line all the time," but that's right before explaining why it was all okay.

I'd like her more if she was just like, "yeah, we tortured some people and experimented on kidnapped civilians. And you know what? It felt good. It felt good because every one of your so-called 'victims' was a martyr for humanity, every death saving a million more. Don't tell me that's not worth it. Don't try to sermonize me. In the face of Armageddon, your absolutist ethic is just another disastrous zealotry."

I'd still get to tell her off, but she'd be more of a committed, high-tier operative instead of a confused subordinate.

Agreed.

Also, would have made subverting her feel like a triumph, rather than the obvious course of events.

Actually. I would have like a super pro-Cerberus person who you couldn't subvert.

Would have been interesting.

chiasaur11

Dragkonias wrote: »

chiasaur11 wrote: »

SoundsPlush wrote: »

I wish Miranda was more terrorist-y. After the intro she seemed more like a lightside character oblivious to Cerberus's misdeeds - she waved off all the ones with abuses as rogue events or perfectly acceptable, didn't she? Pragia was a fluke, the husks were already dead and creepers mindless, so clearly no ethical questions, the rachni were abandoned once they realized how dangerous they were (read: lost all their bases to them). She does say, "we cross the line all the time," but that's right before explaining why it was all okay.

I'd like her more if she was just like, "yeah, we tortured some people and experimented on kidnapped civilians. And you know what? It felt good. It felt good because every one of your so-called 'victims' was a martyr for humanity, every death saving a million more. Don't tell me that's not worth it. Don't try to sermonize me. In the face of Armageddon, your absolutist ethic is just another disastrous zealotry."

I'd still get to tell her off, but she'd be more of a committed, high-tier operative instead of a confused subordinate.

Agreed.

Also, would have made subverting her feel like a triumph, rather than the obvious course of events.

Actually. I would have like a super pro-Cerberus person who you couldn't subvert.

Would have been interesting.

Also agreed.

Of course, it would end with a bullet.

Or being kicked into an engine.

Z0re

chiasaur11 wrote: »

Dragkonias wrote: »

chiasaur11 wrote: »

SoundsPlush wrote: »

I wish Miranda was more terrorist-y. After the intro she seemed more like a lightside character oblivious to Cerberus's misdeeds - she waved off all the ones with abuses as rogue events or perfectly acceptable, didn't she? Pragia was a fluke, the husks were already dead and creepers mindless, so clearly no ethical questions, the rachni were abandoned once they realized how dangerous they were (read: lost all their bases to them). She does say, "we cross the line all the time," but that's right before explaining why it was all okay.

I'd like her more if she was just like, "yeah, we tortured some people and experimented on kidnapped civilians. And you know what? It felt good. It felt good because every one of your so-called 'victims' was a martyr for humanity, every death saving a million more. Don't tell me that's not worth it. Don't try to sermonize me. In the face of Armageddon, your absolutist ethic is just another disastrous zealotry."

I'd still get to tell her off, but she'd be more of a committed, high-tier operative instead of a confused subordinate.

Agreed.

Also, would have made subverting her feel like a triumph, rather than the obvious course of events.

Actually. I would have like a super pro-Cerberus person who you couldn't subvert.

Would have been interesting.

Also agreed.

Of course, it would end with a bullet.

Or being kicked into an engine.

End? It would begin with a bullet.

Half the crew would have legitimate cause to off an actual pro-Cerberus person if they defended the shit Cerberus did. Off the top of my head; Jack, Tali, Shepard, Samara, Garrus, Jacob and Mordin would have some serious issues with it and half of them were nearly killed by Cerberus experiments.

Synthesis

Z0re wrote: »

chiasaur11 wrote: »

Dragkonias wrote: »

chiasaur11 wrote: »

SoundsPlush wrote: »

I wish Miranda was more terrorist-y. After the intro she seemed more like a lightside character oblivious to Cerberus's misdeeds - she waved off all the ones with abuses as rogue events or perfectly acceptable, didn't she? Pragia was a fluke, the husks were already dead and creepers mindless, so clearly no ethical questions, the rachni were abandoned once they realized how dangerous they were (read: lost all their bases to them). She does say, "we cross the line all the time," but that's right before explaining why it was all okay.

I'd like her more if she was just like, "yeah, we tortured some people and experimented on kidnapped civilians. And you know what? It felt good. It felt good because every one of your so-called 'victims' was a martyr for humanity, every death saving a million more. Don't tell me that's not worth it. Don't try to sermonize me. In the face of Armageddon, your absolutist ethic is just another disastrous zealotry."

I'd still get to tell her off, but she'd be more of a committed, high-tier operative instead of a confused subordinate.

Agreed.

Also, would have made subverting her feel like a triumph, rather than the obvious course of events.

Actually. I would have like a super pro-Cerberus person who you couldn't subvert.

Would have been interesting.

Also agreed.

Of course, it would end with a bullet.

Or being kicked into an engine.

End? It would begin with a bullet.

Half the crew would have legitimate cause to off an actual pro-Cerberus person if they defended the shit Cerberus did. Off the top of my head; Jack, Tali, Shepard, Samara, Garrus, Jacob and Mordin would have some serious issues with it and half of them were nearly killed by Cerberus experiments.

Plus, Dr. Chakwas got "scrape the Cerberus emblems off the walls with a paint scraper" on the chore wheel, so you know they've got it in for her.

chiasaur11

Z0re wrote: »

chiasaur11 wrote: »

Dragkonias wrote: »

chiasaur11 wrote: »

SoundsPlush wrote: »

I wish Miranda was more terrorist-y. After the intro she seemed more like a lightside character oblivious to Cerberus's misdeeds - she waved off all the ones with abuses as rogue events or perfectly acceptable, didn't she? Pragia was a fluke, the husks were already dead and creepers mindless, so clearly no ethical questions, the rachni were abandoned once they realized how dangerous they were (read: lost all their bases to them). She does say, "we cross the line all the time," but that's right before explaining why it was all okay.

I'd like her more if she was just like, "yeah, we tortured some people and experimented on kidnapped civilians. And you know what? It felt good. It felt good because every one of your so-called 'victims' was a martyr for humanity, every death saving a million more. Don't tell me that's not worth it. Don't try to sermonize me. In the face of Armageddon, your absolutist ethic is just another disastrous zealotry."

I'd still get to tell her off, but she'd be more of a committed, high-tier operative instead of a confused subordinate.

Agreed.

Also, would have made subverting her feel like a triumph, rather than the obvious course of events.

Actually. I would have like a super pro-Cerberus person who you couldn't subvert.

Would have been interesting.

Also agreed.

Of course, it would end with a bullet.

Or being kicked into an engine.

End? It would begin with a bullet.

Half the crew would have legitimate cause to off an actual pro-Cerberus person if they defended the shit Cerberus did. Off the top of my head; Jack, Tali, Shepard, Samara, Garrus, Jacob and Mordin would have some serious issues with it and half of them were nearly killed by Cerberus experiments.

Did I say the ending wouldn't be the beginning?

Would be a very short subplot.

Zombiemambo

The last two loyalty missions I've been really conflicted

Spoiler:

During Mordin's I wasn't really sure what to think. Yeah genophage was a dick move but if Krogan were going to rule the universe it was the right decision. Paragon Shep was intent on making him feel ashamed, though

regarding Garrus':

Spoiler:

Is there a way to save Sidonis and also get loyalty from Garrus? Talk him down after or something?

chiasaur11

Zombiemambo wrote: »

The last two loyalty missions I've been really conflicted

Spoiler:

During Mordin's I wasn't really sure what to think. Yeah genophage was a dick move but if Krogan were going to rule the universe it was the right decision. Paragon Shep was intent on making him feel ashamed, though

regarding Garrus':

Spoiler:

Is there a way to save Sidonis and also get loyalty from Garrus? Talk him down after or something?

Spoiler:

I went renegade all the way on Mordin's. He's right. Uncontrolled Krogan birth rates are downright Malthusian.

And Garrus is a pal. He'll stay loyal if you spare Sidonis, no special persuasion required, since it's his decision in the end not to take the shot. And the news report after supports your decision. More or less

Synthesis

For Garrus...

Spoiler:

You can go all tut tut at Sidonis and still get Garrus' loyalty. Shepard basically reminds him that every day after this is a favor, and reveals how miserable Sidonis is to Garrus since the betrayal.

HappylilElf

Eh, Miranda having daddy issues is pretty jusitifed. Actually, it's kind of ridiculously justified.

But yeah, it would have been nice if they'd put a little more nuance into her character.

There's a little post loyalty mission with her sister but I consider it kind of a shame they boiled her down to "Yeah, so I'm awesome but god damn my dad was a fucking freak. How much of a freak? Let me answer that with one sentence: I don't even have a mother. That's how much of a freak."

Z0re

HappylilElf wrote: »

Eh, Miranda having daddy issues is pretty jusitifed. Actually, it's kind of ridiculously justified.

But yeah, it would have been nice if they'd put a little more nuance into her character.

There's a little post loyalty mission with her sister but I consider it kind of a shame they boiled her down to "Yeah, so I'm awesome but god damn my dad was a fucking freak. How much of a freak? Let me answer that with one sentence: I don't even have a mother. That's how much of a freak."

Well, Shadow Broker gave her more depth.

Spoiler:

Ridiculously terrible social skills. And infertility. Just to sort of drive the point to China.

I mean, I felt sympathic towards her but christ did the dossier go over the top in how bad she was at interacting with people

President Rex

I can't imagine that infertility is much of a roadblock on the streets of "my father created me in a test tube to be 'perfect.'"

HappylilElf

Just killed Saren for the third time in a row with my ME1 vanguard run and still don't have a save that I can import to ME2.

The hell?

Synthesis

President Rex wrote: »

I can't imagine that infertility is much of a roadblock on the streets of "my father created me in a test tube to be 'perfect.'"

But it's just so hard being so perfect.

Seriously, if she wanted a kid, she could probably have herself cloned or one engineered from herself her choice of unsuspecting donors. She might miss out on the nine months of pregnancy and the miracle of childbirth, but she'd still get to be a mother.

Shepard should be careful, nonetheless. For some reason, the Badspot.us comic seems particularly relevant.

Spoiler:

HappylilElf

President Rex wrote: »

I can't imagine that infertility is much of a roadblock on the streets of "my father created me in a test tube to be 'perfect.'"

The flip side to which might be "I can't imagine why someone who has felt like hell their entire life because of being created in a test tube might not want to go that route in order to procreate"

Synthesis

HappylilElf wrote: »

President Rex wrote: »

I can't imagine that infertility is much of a roadblock on the streets of "my father created me in a test tube to be 'perfect.'"

The flip side to which might be "I can't imagine why someone who has felt like hell their entire life because of being created in a test tube might not want to go that route in order to procreate"

At the same time, regardless of how "al natural" your conceptions was, I can't imagine a child having anything remotely resembling a normal, non-hellish life while having Miranda as a mother and primary caregiver.

Z0re

Synthesis wrote: »

HappylilElf wrote: »

President Rex wrote: »

I can't imagine that infertility is much of a roadblock on the streets of "my father created me in a test tube to be 'perfect.'"

The flip side to which might be "I can't imagine why someone who has felt like hell their entire life because of being created in a test tube might not want to go that route in order to procreate"

At the same time, regardless of how "al natural" your conceptions was, I can't imagine a child having anything remotely resembling a normal, non-hellish life while having Miranda as a mother and primary caregiver.

Well, people live to like 150 on average now and with Omni-gel and the kind of funds she totally has available Miranda has a good shot of extending that. I mean, she led a team that brought a spaced and exploded corpse back to life. She could settle down in a century or two once all the silly Reaper business is done. And she learns some social skills.

Or have a kid with an Asari. Preferably one who wasn't a mercenary/stripper in her youth to give the kid some semblance of stability.

Synthesis

Emphasis on it being up to the other parent.

SoundsPlush

I think we're being charitable in imagining any fledgling creature under Miranda's care would survive past infancy.

chiasaur11

SoundsPlush wrote: »

I think we're being charitable in imagining any fledgling creature under Miranda's care would survive past infancy.

Maybe a Krogan could.

A tank grown Krogan. With a claymore.

Kainy

As much as I don't really like Miranda, she does take pretty good care of her sister, so I wouldn't be that worried.

Shen

Z0re wrote: »

Or have a kid with an Asari. Preferably one who wasn't a mercenary/stripper in her youth to give the kid some semblance of stability.

Ahahahahaha

Kainy

Shen wrote: »

Z0re wrote: »

Or have a kid with an Asari. Preferably one who wasn't a mercenary/stripper in her youth to give the kid some semblance of stability.

Ahahahahaha

Yeah, basically all asari except Liara were mercenaries/strippers in their maiden years. Or mercenary strippers, ready to seduce any target to death - for the right price.

This might explain why Liara is so much more boring than any other asari in ME1, but becomes an actual character in ME2 after she starts getting her hands dirty a bit. Misdeeds are apparently some sort of asari growing-up requirement.

Dox the PI

Bioware Marketing Director
chiasaur, this is your chance!

Daris

I can't twitter, but damnit....


I WANT FEMSHEP AT E3!!!!

Kainy

Curses, my refusal to get a twitter account finally has a single disadvantage!

Those of you with accounts, get on it!

DHS

Nah.

Synthesis

I've got a twitter account. Somewhere.

What do I do?

evilthecat

canon shep = male.
canon shep = male.
canon shep = male.
canon shep = male.
canon shep = male.
canon shep = male.

Sekxtion

Canon Shep is FemShep. Bioware finally recognizes their most egregious of errors in only showing the non-canon MaleShep.

Jennifer Hale does better voice acting. Mark Meer sounds bored half the time.

DHS

Sekxtion wrote: »

Canon Shep is FemShep. Bioware finally recognizes their most egregious of errors in only showing the non-canon MaleShep.

Jennifer Hale does better voice acting. Mark Meer sounds bored half the time.

And Jennifer Hale sounds like "I'm Trying to do Female Military Voice".

The dark truth is they both kind of suck a little.

jefe414

Sekxtion wrote: »

Canon Shep is FemShep. Bioware finally recognizes their most egregious of errors in only showing the non-canon MaleShep.

Jennifer Hale does better voice acting. Mark Meer sounds bored half the time.

To be fair, by ME2 Shepard is like Jack O'Neil from SG-1. "Yeah yeah, imminent doom, hopeless odds, invulnerable enemy. Let's just get this over with so I can fill your minions full of lead and ruin your "unstoppable" plans."

Shepard SHOULD be bored 1/2 the time.

Synthesis

I need my Shepard to have more emotional investment than a bewildered toaster.

(We are, of course, treading old ground. But, like quads, it must be returned too.)

Zzulu

I want a maleshep trailer

But them refining the look of standard femshep would be sweet. She looks so generic

Skull2185

Canon Shep is male Shep.

He gets the box art, he gets the trailers. That's just how it is. That being said, the number of femSheps I have created far outweighs the number of maleSheps.