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[E3 2011] MICROSOFT - Post-keynote wrap-up and discussion here!
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Isn't is possible that their shift in marketing is being done with the knowledge, or hope, that the core audience is pleased enough and doesn't respond to marketing anyhow?
Just as long as its not completely obvious that we're being pandered to.
Steam PSN: DerWaffleMous Origin: DerWaffleMous Bnet: WaffleMous#1483
They announced those a long awhile back actually. Hell, they were even available during the beta.
That's entirely what they're banking on.
You've already got an 360.
Or all of your friends already have 360s.
You've got a persistent "Gamer Score" to worry about.
You've got hundreds/thousands of achievements.
You just paid for a year of Live.
Your entire library of games is for the 360.
Few people own more than one console. Microsoft has the lead in the US when it comes to "hardcore" gamers and they're still competitive in Europe (japan is a lost cause though). There's nothing Nintendo or Sony can do to change the 360's position in the US market this generation. Pretty much all multiplatform titles sell more on the 360, a trend likely to continue for a while.
Why do they need to cater to the hardcore again? As Henroid is saying, their Kinect strategy is a very conscious one.
Steam: CarbonFire MWO, Planetside 2, Origin: Carb0nFire
I hadn't heard about it, sorry if it's not really news but it is still pretty cool.
Microsoft showed the product that has made me most excited so far from E3 keynotes, which is the new Tomb Raider game. Her voice sounded a bit forced and not as interesting as Nathan Drake's "oh shit, oh shit, oh shit" but it still looked pretty amazing. I mean sure there are other amazing games shown all around, but all of them were known quantities. Uncharted 3 looked super amazing, as did Gears of War 3, the Halo Remake, and Mass Effect 3.
I think I enjoyed Microsoft's keynote the most so far, despite all the Kinect nonsense, it was still an entertaining showing. Excited to see what Nintendo shows off in ~10 hours.
Oh good, I'm glad I was here to catch that pearl of wisdom as it dropped from your ruby lips.
The Kinect is amazing for kids to use, it really is quite incredible to see how interactive kids get with games when they move around like that. It's kind of like how they react/respond to Dora the Explorer.
I like the idea of using the voice portion and a few other things as an option in games. I also like that they aren't forcing it into games so much. Not that they have much of a choice there with third party games like Mass Effect, but it's nice to see the Kinect won't be required for things like that (so far) and is more of just a neat value add.
I do believe the phrase uttered here was Epic "FLail". Still was meant to be derogatory, but at least it was punny
Steam: CarbonFire MWO, Planetside 2, Origin: Carb0nFire
In my opinion it is a strategy with short term gain but the potential to lose the 'hardcore' in the future. By the time the next generation comes round if Sony and Microsoft's consoles are equal in nearly every aspect I would be more inclined to go with the one that has been directing their attention towards my demographic and not the one that has been focusing elsewhere for the past 3-4 years.
I also consider it a bit dishonest to create product with a certain appeal, develop a fanbase then once they are locked in move on and look for new consumers. I'm sure Microsoft know very well that they're doing this and will probably spend the 6 months to a year before their new console focusing directly on core games, wait for people to buy the console then move straight back to minigame collections.
Thank you, Henroid, for putting it much more clearly than I would have, and for saying what needed to be said. Also, good work on the OP, it was pretty informative for those of us who were unable to catch any of E3.
Cloud storage is definitely a plus, it's one of the things keeping me from migrating my profile--basically forcing my friends to do come to my place instead of vice versa (I have the big TV as well). Very, very much looking forward to this, as well as Sony and Nintendo co-opting/whatever it. It's not unified online service, but it's a big deal.
Still don't know what to make of the new Tomb Raider. I doesn't look like they're going the whole "gun down millions of stupid dudes with a machinegun", which is always a plus, so I'm not unhappy about it. I'm always a sucker for detail, and while I'm not proud to say that includes "how a game character experiences and reacts to pain", that is an area of detail that is hilariously overlooked frequently, when most games are fine with a bar or a damn number.
I've got the Hague on speed dial. Justice will be served.
I hope the Kinect Labs thing will be easy for indie developers to access and develop for. Something cool could come out of that.
All the people I know who play RTS thought Halo Wars was a bit silly. RTS just isn't meant to be played on a console. That said, I don't really know the company that's handling Halo 4 - so it could be excellent. We'll just have to wait and see.
What is really pissing me off is what MS is doing to their Age of Empire series. AoE was the whole reason I got into RTS in the first place and "Age of Empires Online" looks like the worst game I've ever seen. Ever. Like, worse than worse aspects of grinding in WoW with horrible multiplayer imbalance based on $$$ and time played and... just.... WHY???
The new tomb raider has a great aesthetic, but hopefully they move away from this horrible interactive cutscene gameplay the trailer implies is central to the Lara Croft experience. I want to see the great GAMEPLAY that their supposed influence from Half-Life 2 and Assassin's Creed should be bringing to the table. Not this God of War and Wet style bologna.
Not all RTS, as they are, are suited for consoles. No surprise. At the same time, a few PC RTS would actually work just fine on consoles with minimal modification. World in Conflict's gameplay mechanics would actually make it work fine on consoles as it is. And, surprise surprise, purpose-designed console RTS like Halo Wars actually turn out to work fairly well, provided they aren't bad games to start with. I bought the game after finding every single person I knew who played it (which was not a lot of them), thought it was an overall good game. Not my cup of tea, but it's certainly not unworkable.
I haven't played AoE since the second game (it was always way at the bottom of my RTS list, behind Warcraft, Command & Conquer, Total Anhilation and a few others), so don't really care what happens with the game. As for Tomb Raider, if it's being influenced by HL2--which I'm not really seeing, since HL2 didn't invent "isolation/exploration" gameplay, I hope they don't copy that games gunfights. A TR game shouldn't have that many gunfights, and even then, it doesn't need HL2's weak feeling weapons. Take the good things from HL2--there's plenty to look at.
http://www.leftmousebutton.net/?p=1822
Overall though I thought it was a bit dull affair. Halo and Gears of War don't interest me, and the Kinect stuff was a mixed bag. I'm not sure what to think about the Mass Effect stuff. I was sort of more impressed by the Future Soldier footage as it seemed to use the Kinect for something interesting, even if its a simple gameplay mechanic.
It was a pretty meh experience really, though from what i'm watching of the Sony conference, Sony actually managed to be worse! :lol:
You're right that I'm over-generalizing about RTS. Perhaps what I should have said is that traditional RTS games (think AoE, Warcraft and Starcraft) don't port well to consoles. I played Halo Wars a bit and it was okay, but I don't think it has the same appeal that made Starcraft (and SC2) and AoE such big hits in the PC world.
I read an interview where one of the designers of the Tomb Raider reboot said that they were being influenced by HL2 and Assassin's Creed. Personally, I think HL2 is a near-perfect game and I've never felt like the weapons were weak (something I did feel with Crysis, for example). However, I do agree, Tomb Raider should not have as much combat as HL2 - they're definitely not the same game. But, in regards to pacing, story, and game play mechanics they should eat up as much as possible. Also, while Lara shouldn't be a totally silent protagonist, they should take a hint from Valve's games that silence often works better than saying too much. It IS encouraging that they're really thinking about the character now and working the series from a story based angle. Hopefully, hopefully, good things to come.
Instead of making CE's multiplayer online capable they're just adding new maps for Reach multi. So, so disappointed. No point in me even getting it.
Aside from that Microsoft's conference didn't really have anything of interest to me aside from Mass Effect.
Dom! I've got a jar of dirt!
Counterpoint 1: Masterchief's story was over. The trilogy was wrapped up by the end of Halo 3. He literally said 'wake me when you need me', and apparently when they need him is the Q4 sales rush. There is nowhere to take the narrative that wouldn't be forced or a contrivance. Not only is the original developer not making it, but it wasn't called for or wanted outside of a business perspective.
Counterpoint 2: While they have not had annual sequels, they have been ramping up the flood of content far beyond what any other series would do.
2001: Halo Combat Evolved
2004: Halo 2
2007: Halo 3
2009: Halo ODST
2009: Halo Wars
2010: Halo Reach
Not to mention the Halo brand has gone into overdrive. Seven novels, five comic book series, seven animated shorts, three live action shorts, nine series of figurines, Halo action clix, a Halo board game, three development books and a cat helmet.
Frank O'Connor has literally compared the Halo franchise to the Star Wars franchise, 'keeping it alive' long after the main games are finished. That's a fucking quote for the ages.
So yes, you're right. Halo 4 is not necessarily a cash-grab because it's simply the fourth in a series. And is not a cash-grab because Halo has lots of games. But look at the specific content of this media, look at how diluted the Halo brand has become, so played out and overwrought.
To say that anything Halo at this point is not a cash-grab is madness. That series' artistic integrity died between 2 and 3.
Man, you really don't like that price. And what do you mean "push the Kinect"? They already pushed 10 million of those things into homes and people didn't seem to be off-put by the price. Now they're supporting the device instead of going the Nintendo route (balance board, internet voice chat, thing on the bottom of the controller). I don't understand how you think a device that has been selling like mad and has been out a year needs to be cheaper than a system that has been out for 4 years whose sales are dipping.
Thing is, speaking for myself, I am not pleased enough. Not even close. There is only 1 game coming out this year that I am even slightly interested in (Gears 3 - and even that I am only slightly interested in, I could really care less if I play it) that is exclusive to the 360. It's at a point right now where all the exclusives I want are on PS3, and everything else can either be gotten on my PS3 or my PC and I am seriously considering selling my 360 just to get some money for it since I don't play it anymore and looks like I won't be playing it for at least a long while.
Supporting it, my ass. It's got the same shit as the Wii's had to put up with - developers shoehorning shitty motion gimmicks into regular games and kiddie shovelware shit.
Yep, as a former 360 owner the only game I am missing out on this year is Gears 3 and I only feel that way because I finished the previous two just to see what all the fuss was about. I think the series is kind of meh really.
I think Master Chief's awakening would have felt a lot more significant for a game on their next console but as long as they can get Marty doing the music it will be a good game. Without him it's just not Halo.
3DS FC: 5129-0946-8305
counterpoint: at least the kinect games are something new. a new gaming experience, for better or for worse, it's something you've never done before.
Halo 4 I can already predict almost everything. because it's followed the same formula since day one, fucking mission one. except over time it has added gizmos to that core and has improved the graphics on level four. or whatever.
I'd say if you're a gamer, Halo 4 is tried and tested. Already. It's not going to be a fucking sandbox Godsim game, it's going to be an FPS with vehicles. That's all. Now that formula is fun, but if you want to see what games will be like in twenty years, look to something like kinect. while the games dont appeal right now, that technology is pushing gaming forwards, while the Halo 4s of this world are moving it sideways.
And then there's no matter what you do a totally controller free system isn't going to work as well for a game as a mix. But MS is pushing controller free games because that's what the Kinect is for. If they start doing more stuff like Mass Effect 3 where it's cool optional tricks hooray. But optional probably isn't going to catch fire. Or we'll all be playing the Xbox 1080 with built-in Kinect 3.0's and well then, hope that game problem is solved. That be awesome.
Pretty much. MS wouldn't dare upset their fanbase by trying anything different with Halo. ODST was the most creative they got. I'm more interested in spin-offs than the main games now.
But they also came out strong for the Kinect, not just with party game shovelware, but with a clear message that they are putting their full weight behind it.
I CAN understand people who aren't interested in the Kinect being disappointed, but I think this is what they had to do. Hardcore 3rd party games like Assassin's Creed will continue to come out for the 360, so there is no real need for them to work hard in that area. Instead, they are letting the millions of Kinect owners know they didn't waste their money, and are focusing on what sets the system apart, and trying to pull in more users.
What Microsoft is doing is trying to make the 360 something that a gamer with a whole family can justify putting on the main TV, instead of keeping it in the basement, or wherever. They are trying to take hold of the living room.
TAKE ME BACK DOC!
Nyko recently announced at E3 that they'll be making something they call the 'Zoom for Kinect', a clip-on lens for the device that they claim reduces space requirements up to 40%. For someone like me living in a cramped apartment, if they deliver on this, I may actually buy a Nyko peripheral for the first time... Assuming it doesn't damage anything.
First of all, cloud computing in general is a bad idea. Let's just say for the sake of saying it, yes it will make your life easier...for a while. Until you realize that bandwith will be an issue. Single point of failure becomes an issue. And last but certainly not least, what happens when i don't have internet. God damn if i'm not going to be pissed off the first time i want to play a game and can't afford internet this month with all my shit out saved out somewhere else. Maybe this isn't a problem for other people, but I live in oklahoma, the wind knocks out internet all the time...
Second of all, the kinect....whatever...get over it. if it's not for you great, don't use it like me. If you want it...go get it. Most hardcore gamers don't need to be advertised to as they get their sources from better places, ign, kotaku, etc. HOWEVER, how many families sat down and watched e3 keynotes. How many people that they spoke too actually even know that e3 exists. Under that guise, why would you play to them....I guess i see both sides...
Finally, the over all, it sucked. Yes, that's my opinion. I'm amercian i'm allowed. I really didn't see anything i liked there. I've never been a big fan of MS, mostly cause their money grubing whores. But i can't say i blame them, given the chance i'd do it too...and so would you.
Post thought, minecraft with kinect...yea, i have no intention of swinging my pick axe (litterally you know, with my arms and shit) 10 billion times just to find enough gold for a good booster track. If i wanted to swing a pick axe 10 billion times i'd be a m fing miner...not a lazy computer repair man. Just a thought.
Speech recognition is also nice, but it's still not accurate enough to account for everyone's individual speech idiosyncrasies, so it will, at least for the foreseeable future, continue to be pretty destructive to the overall immersion of many games.
I'm really curious how the 'TV over Xbox Live' thing is going to work though, as I've been waiting for an excuse to cut my cable and this might be it. And UFC is just gravy.
"Be who you are and say what you feel, as those that matter don't mind and those who mind don't matter."
-Dr Seuss.
In regards to Minecraft it is looking more and more likely that MS just threw money at Notch and the 360 development is being done by a completely separate studio. I wonder if they are just going to convert the stuff that is already in the game or if they will add stuff as Notch adds it.
In Australia we have had a tv over xbox live thing for the past 6 months or so. It gets rid of your cable box but that seems to be the only difference. The cost is similar to the lowest cable package because the channel selection isn't stellar. And all the TV you watch goes towards your download limit which can be a serious problem if you have a limit. I can't imagine HD TV would help that much either. The way some people watch TV, they could easily download hundreds of gigabytes a month on tv alone.