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Why is Apple not a "good" company?

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Posts

  • spacekungfumanspacekungfuman Poor and minority-filled Registered User regular
    bowen wrote:
    Idk how worker interviews will go, I'd imagine they're all told to tell everyone Foxconn is super happy fun time #1

    This is how I imagine the interviews going as well.

    Same. Lest they get beat or don't get their food allowance this week.

    I give my employer the highest marks in every employee survey, because it is in my self interest to have my firm keep its high rankings.



    "There are no necessary evils in government. Its evils exist only in its abuses. If it would confine itself to equal protection, and, as Heaven does its rains, shower its favors alike on the high and the low, the rich and the poor, it would be an unqualified blessing." -- Andrew Jackson
  • bowenbowen Registered User regular
    Wouldn't it be something if they had to move labor back to the US... hidden costs of using labor outside the US right there.

  • DanHibikiDanHibiki Registered User regular
    a5ehren wrote:
    shryke wrote:
    Hahahahahahahahaha:
    http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/trademark-row-could-lead-to-ipad-shortages-6917477.html
    A Chinese firm which claims that it owns the iPad trademark in China is to ask customs officials to block shipments of Apple's iconic device in a move that could potentially disrupt the technology giant's supply chain.

    If Shenzhen-based Proview succeeds, it would be a major blow to the Californian company's sales, as all of its worldwide supplies of iPads come from the country. The move could, in theory, lead to serious shortages of iPads around the world.

    It would also be a major blow for the company in what is Apple's fastest-growing market. Earlier this week, there were media reports of retailers in some Chinese cities removing iPads from their shelves after local authorities banned their sale.

    This is probably a somewhat orchestrated response to Obama's threats to crack down on Chinese IP violations. Kind of a "do you really want to play this game with us?" type-thing.

    Obama's a BlackBerry man himself, so that doesn't scare him any.

    Sig.jpg
  • redxredx Dublin, CARegistered User regular
    a5ehren wrote:
    shryke wrote:
    Hahahahahahahahaha:
    http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/trademark-row-could-lead-to-ipad-shortages-6917477.html
    A Chinese firm which claims that it owns the iPad trademark in China is to ask customs officials to block shipments of Apple's iconic device in a move that could potentially disrupt the technology giant's supply chain.

    If Shenzhen-based Proview succeeds, it would be a major blow to the Californian company's sales, as all of its worldwide supplies of iPads come from the country. The move could, in theory, lead to serious shortages of iPads around the world.

    It would also be a major blow for the company in what is Apple's fastest-growing market. Earlier this week, there were media reports of retailers in some Chinese cities removing iPads from their shelves after local authorities banned their sale.

    This is probably a somewhat orchestrated response to Obama's threats to crack down on Chinese IP violations. Kind of a "do you really want to play this game with us?" type-thing.

    But... that's fucking suicidal. No one needs to make shit in china. They have attractive labor costs, and pretty amazing logistics and infrastructure, but no one needs to make shit in china. Globalism and economic weather are why things are being made in china. If they are going to threaten the supply chains of their companies, if through government malfeasance, incompetence or political ridiculousness, Chinese companies can't reliably deliver products, their clients are going to take their business elsewhere.

    Not like an instant thing. It would take time to disentangle their supply chains, and find suitable production in other countries, but you can't fuck around with a company's ability to sell products. With the effects of the stock market, even a potential threat to distribution is going to cost Apple money. It's basically the job of every C*O to make sure exactly this type of disruption doesn't occur.

    Like, the additional cost of producing products in Not-China will very rapidly be outweighed by the cost of not getting those products to market.

    redx on
    RedX is taking a stab a moving out west, and will be near San Francisco from May 14 till June 29.
    Click here for a horrible H/A thread with details.
  • enc0reenc0re Registered User regular
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

  • spacekungfumanspacekungfuman Poor and minority-filled Registered User regular
    enc0re wrote:
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

    Go Africa or go home. You can't get better supply chain integration than having the conflict minerals you need right on your compenent maker's doorsteps.



    "There are no necessary evils in government. Its evils exist only in its abuses. If it would confine itself to equal protection, and, as Heaven does its rains, shower its favors alike on the high and the low, the rich and the poor, it would be an unqualified blessing." -- Andrew Jackson
  • DanHibikiDanHibiki Registered User regular
    the iPad segment isn't that big, most of the factory is from other manufacturers. In the long run they'll make much more money selling a state sponsored uPad to the Chinese and cheap/ignorant consumers else where then by manufacturing iPads.

    Plus moving shop is tough. You gotta build facilities, hire henchmen, instal sniper nests... it's a real pain.

    DanHibiki on
    Sig.jpg
  • adytumadytum Registered User regular
    Foxconn is already building facilities in other countries. Moving production might become as simple as placing a call.

    etxvv5.jpg
  • spacekungfumanspacekungfuman Poor and minority-filled Registered User regular
    adytum wrote:
    Foxconn is already building facilities in other countries. Moving production might become as simple as placing a call.

    Does anyone else remember the days when the only meaning Foxconn had in America was as a third tier motherboard manufacturer?



    "There are no necessary evils in government. Its evils exist only in its abuses. If it would confine itself to equal protection, and, as Heaven does its rains, shower its favors alike on the high and the low, the rich and the poor, it would be an unqualified blessing." -- Andrew Jackson
  • PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    enc0re wrote:
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

    Go Africa or go home. You can't get better supply chain integration than having the conflict minerals you need right on your compenent maker's doorsteps.

    You also have the warlords and child soldiers who make money from those conflict minerals. A major reason that the world hasn't invested heavily in African labor is that the cost of security from the local rebel armies are extremely high. It's only really worth it for resource extraction.

  • spacekungfumanspacekungfuman Poor and minority-filled Registered User regular
    enc0re wrote:
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

    Go Africa or go home. You can't get better supply chain integration than having the conflict minerals you need right on your compenent maker's doorsteps.

    You also have the warlords and child soldiers who make money from those conflict minerals. A major reason that the world hasn't invested heavily in African labor is that the cost of security from the local rebel armies are extremely high. It's only really worth it for resource extraction.

    I was thinking that the end result could be a regime that is favorable to you, since you paid them so much for their conflict minerals.



    "There are no necessary evils in government. Its evils exist only in its abuses. If it would confine itself to equal protection, and, as Heaven does its rains, shower its favors alike on the high and the low, the rich and the poor, it would be an unqualified blessing." -- Andrew Jackson
  • PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    enc0re wrote:
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

    Go Africa or go home. You can't get better supply chain integration than having the conflict minerals you need right on your compenent maker's doorsteps.

    You also have the warlords and child soldiers who make money from those conflict minerals. A major reason that the world hasn't invested heavily in African labor is that the cost of security from the local rebel armies are extremely high. It's only really worth it for resource extraction.

    I was thinking that the end result could be a regime that is favorable to you, since you paid them so much for their conflict minerals.

    "Rebels" is the key word here.

  • tinwhiskerstinwhiskers Registered User regular
    enc0re wrote:
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

    Go Africa or go home. You can't get better supply chain integration than having the conflict minerals you need right on your compenent maker's doorsteps.

    Yeah but Africa doesn't have the 200k people with the very special skills that don't exist in the US that forced Apple to build its stuff in E Asia.

  • syndalissyndalis Nature Boy WoooooooRegistered User regular
    enc0re wrote:
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

    Go Africa or go home. You can't get better supply chain integration than having the conflict minerals you need right on your compenent maker's doorsteps.

    Yeah but Africa doesn't have the 200k people with the very special skills that don't exist in the US that forced Apple to build its stuff in E Asia.

    2072040-not_sure_if_serious.jpg

    I mean, what skills do the chinese workers have that workers anywhere else in the world cannot be trained to have?

    ric-flair.jpg
  • spacekungfumanspacekungfuman Poor and minority-filled Registered User regular
    enc0re wrote:
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

    Go Africa or go home. You can't get better supply chain integration than having the conflict minerals you need right on your compenent maker's doorsteps.

    Yeah but Africa doesn't have the 200k people with the very special skills that don't exist in the US that forced Apple to build its stuff in E Asia.

    How long will it be before Foxconn just buys an island and imports people to do its work unencumbered from any laws or restrictions?



    "There are no necessary evils in government. Its evils exist only in its abuses. If it would confine itself to equal protection, and, as Heaven does its rains, shower its favors alike on the high and the low, the rich and the poor, it would be an unqualified blessing." -- Andrew Jackson
  • tinwhiskerstinwhiskers Registered User regular
    We took all the good slave material out of Africa already.


    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/22/business/apple-america-and-a-squeezed-middle-class.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1&hp
    Apple had redesigned the iPhone’s screen at the last minute, forcing an assembly line overhaul. New screens began arriving at the plant near midnight.

    A foreman immediately roused 8,000 workers inside the company’s dormitories, according to the executive. Each employee was given a biscuit and a cup of tea, guided to a workstation and within half an hour started a 12-hour shift fitting glass screens into beveled frames. Within 96 hours, the plant was producing over 10,000 iPhones a day.

    “The speed and flexibility is breathtaking,” the executive said. “There’s no American plant that can match that.”
    “They could hire 3,000 people overnight,” said Jennifer Rigoni, who was Apple’s worldwide supply demand manager until 2010, but declined to discuss specifics of her work. “What U.S. plant can find 3,000 people overnight and convince them to live in dorms?”

    tinwhiskers on
  • PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    We took all the good slave material out of Africa already.


    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/22/business/apple-america-and-a-squeezed-middle-class.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1&hp
    Apple had redesigned the iPhone’s screen at the last minute, forcing an assembly line overhaul. New screens began arriving at the plant near midnight.

    A foreman immediately roused 8,000 workers inside the company’s dormitories, according to the executive. Each employee was given a biscuit and a cup of tea, guided to a workstation and within half an hour started a 12-hour shift fitting glass screens into beveled frames. Within 96 hours, the plant was producing over 10,000 iPhones a day.

    “The speed and flexibility is breathtaking,” the executive said. “There’s no American plant that can match that.”
    “They could hire 3,000 people overnight,” said Jennifer Rigoni, who was Apple’s worldwide supply demand manager until 2010, but declined to discuss specifics of her work. “What U.S. plant can find 3,000 people overnight and convince them to live in dorms?”

    I have a feeling that Apple's PR and marketing teams would like to ship Rigoni off to a "dorm" right now.

  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    The DoJ announces plans to file suit against Apple and several publishing houses over ebook price fixing:
    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203961204577267831767489216.html?mod=WSJ_hp_LEFTTopStories

    XBL: Nox Aeternum / PSN: NoxAeternum / NN:NoxAeternum
    Spoiler:
  • bowenbowen Registered User regular
    adytum wrote:
    Foxconn is already building facilities in other countries. Moving production might become as simple as placing a call.

    Does anyone else remember the days when the only meaning Foxconn had in America was as a third tier motherboard manufacturer?

    Sorry couldn't hear you over the voices telling me to kill supermicro's execs.

  • themightypuckthemightypuck Registered User regular
    The DoJ announces plans to file suit against Apple and several publishing houses over ebook price fixing:
    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203961204577267831767489216.html?mod=WSJ_hp_LEFTTopStories

    Reading that sure makes it seem like bald faced price fixing but I figure things are more complicated. The argument seems to be that if they didn't price fix to keep prices high Amazon would bury them which seems like both a good practical argument and an admission of guilt.

  • AtomikaAtomika (citation needed)Registered User regular
    Apple is not a "good" company because the New iPad (ugh) is utterly underwhelming.


    Way to knock it out of the park on your first at-bat, Tim Cook. :v:

  • themightypuckthemightypuck Registered User regular
    Apple is genius in holding a bit back for the next time. That's been pretty good for stockholders in the last decade.

  • AtomikaAtomika (citation needed)Registered User regular
    Apple is genius in holding a bit back for the next time. That's been pretty good for stockholders in the last decade.

    So does Apple have a "every other generation is going to be great" policy or something?

    There's really nothing about the iPad 3 that makes me want to give up my iPad 2, and I had my cash in my hand before yesterday, ready to go full-Phillip J. Fry.

    Spoiler:


    There quite literally isn't anything remarkable on the new iPad other than better screen resolution (yay?) and a processor based on the same tech they put in a phone a year ago.

    Really underwhelming.

  • KalTorakKalTorak Registered User regular
    What other tech were you expecting?

  • AtomikaAtomika (citation needed)Registered User regular
    KalTorak wrote: »
    What other tech were you expecting?

    Honestly, not a ton of new stuff, but more than we got. Each generation of tech has a tendency to be less collectively bettered than the last, that's just how things roll.

    But off the top of my head, I'd be sitting here with a confirmation e-mail for my new iPad order if:
    - They had the Retina display (as it does).
    - It had a quad-core processor. This was one just about every rumormonger had as a given, and probably the most surprising omission.
    - The camera was worth half a shit. Improving the camera to 5mp when competitors already have 8mp or better on the market is just bad. I don't need a 5mp camera. I need a good camera, or a cheap camera, but not a middle-of-the-road camera. Worse, their own iPhone has a better camera, and it's a year old. Also, no camera flash, despite again being standard on their phones.
    - And a better front-facing camera. 0.3MP? What is this? The nineties?
    - E-Ink or some other form of glare proofing. Even if it's just for iBooks.
    - Improved battery life.


    Past that, any lagniappe would have been attractive, such as some new video/photo/messaging application would have been nice, but not necessary. Something. A little flourish to grab my attention beyond, "Hey, it's got a pretty nice screen now! And some . . uh . . other stuff."


    As it stands, I'd still suggest this product to someone without an iPad or even someone with an iPad 1, but there's no way I'd suggest this product to an iPad 2 owner.

    Atomika on
  • KalTorakKalTorak Registered User regular
    Fair enough - I find it's rare for new Apple products to justify a purchase when you own the previous generation; iPhone 3GS -> 4 was probably the biggest jump, but as an iPhone 4 owner, the cost/benefit of upgrading to a 4S seemed silly.

  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    enc0re wrote:
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

    Go Africa or go home. You can't get better supply chain integration than having the conflict minerals you need right on your compenent maker's doorsteps.

    Isn't African even more fucked up than China? China isn't a paradise by any means by they don't have regimes that encourage cannibalism, like Joseph Kony's. Don't forget the blood diamond debacle, either.

    Harry Dresden on
  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    enc0re wrote:
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

    Go Africa or go home. You can't get better supply chain integration than having the conflict minerals you need right on your compenent maker's doorsteps.

    You also have the warlords and child soldiers who make money from those conflict minerals. A major reason that the world hasn't invested heavily in African labor is that the cost of security from the local rebel armies are extremely high. It's only really worth it for resource extraction.

    I was thinking that the end result could be a regime that is favorable to you, since you paid them so much for their conflict minerals.

    Corporations working with corrupt regimes should not be encouraged IMO. Where does ethics come into these decisions?

  • DarlanDarlan Registered User regular
    Apple is not a "good" company because the New iPad (ugh) is utterly underwhelming.


    Way to knock it out of the park on your first at-bat, Tim Cook. :v:
    To be fair, his first-at-bat was the iPhone 4S.

    Which was arguably a little underwhelming since it wasn't the iPhone 5 people were expecting, so maybe the sentiment isn't so far off.

    Darlan on
  • KalTorakKalTorak Registered User regular
    Darlan wrote: »
    Apple is not a "good" company because the New iPad (ugh) is utterly underwhelming.


    Way to knock it out of the park on your first at-bat, Tim Cook. :v:
    To be fair, his first-at-bat was the iPhone 4S.

    Which was arguably a little underwhelming since it wasn't the iPhone 5 people were expecting, so maybe the sentiment isn't so far off.

    I still don't get why everyone was clamoring for an iPhone 5, or what they were hoping to get out of a new form factor. They'd been alternating between small upgrades and big upgrades for a while.

  • AtomikaAtomika (citation needed)Registered User regular
    KalTorak wrote: »
    Fair enough - I find it's rare for new Apple products to justify a purchase when you own the previous generation; iPhone 3GS -> 4 was probably the biggest jump, but as an iPhone 4 owner, the cost/benefit of upgrading to a 4S seemed silly.

    That's the way it goes, though.

    Improvements become more and more minimal and incremental until some new paradigm comes along.

    Which means unless something really great comes along, I have no idea what an iPad 4 would have.

  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    bowen wrote:
    Idk how worker interviews will go, I'd imagine they're all told to tell everyone Foxconn is super happy fun time #1

    This is how I imagine the interviews going as well.

    Same. Lest they get beat or don't get their food allowance this week.

    I give my employer the highest marks in every employee survey, because it is in my self interest to have my firm keep its high rankings.

    How does it benefit you? Would you do this if your employers were terrible?

  • DarlanDarlan Registered User regular
    KalTorak wrote: »
    Darlan wrote: »
    Apple is not a "good" company because the New iPad (ugh) is utterly underwhelming.


    Way to knock it out of the park on your first at-bat, Tim Cook. :v:
    To be fair, his first-at-bat was the iPhone 4S.

    Which was arguably a little underwhelming since it wasn't the iPhone 5 people were expecting, so maybe the sentiment isn't so far off.

    I still don't get why everyone was clamoring for an iPhone 5, or what they were hoping to get out of a new form factor. They'd been alternating between small upgrades and big upgrades for a while.
    Yeah, I don't mean to say that the 4S is a bad phone at all, I think the disappointment is more a function of how much an EVENT an Apple keynote has to be on the internet than there being anything wrong with incremental upgrades here and there. It was just unfortunate timing for Tim Cook.

  • AtomikaAtomika (citation needed)Registered User regular
    Darlan wrote: »
    KalTorak wrote: »
    Darlan wrote: »
    Apple is not a "good" company because the New iPad (ugh) is utterly underwhelming.


    Way to knock it out of the park on your first at-bat, Tim Cook. :v:
    To be fair, his first-at-bat was the iPhone 4S.

    Which was arguably a little underwhelming since it wasn't the iPhone 5 people were expecting, so maybe the sentiment isn't so far off.

    I still don't get why everyone was clamoring for an iPhone 5, or what they were hoping to get out of a new form factor. They'd been alternating between small upgrades and big upgrades for a while.
    Yeah, I don't mean to say that the 4S is a bad phone at all, I think the disappointment is more a function of how much an EVENT an Apple keynote has to be on the internet than there being anything wrong with incremental upgrades here and there. It was just unfortunate timing for Tim Cook.

    Well, that was very much Steve Jobs' thing. He loved being the center of attention and making a spectacle, and now that's the company's thing. So every new thing has to be a event.

    However, Apple seems to be able to refresh their computer and software and peripheral lineup without having to rent out the Staples Center, so many they should rethink their approach to these things if they aren't going to do more than what they did here.

  • OrganichuOrganichu Registered User regular
    i dunno, it doesn't really seem like it's harming them. new products sell very well. plenty of people (like me) enjoy the spectacle. the number of people who think apple is being uppity or self-congratulatory about their presentations and then decide to disassociate themselves from the company... it doesn't seem like a huge quantity of people.

    i dunno.

    i like the keynotes!

    i like it even more when it's a leapfrog product release that i want very much... but i like all of them, regardless.

  • AtomikaAtomika (citation needed)Registered User regular
    Organichu wrote: »
    i dunno, it doesn't really seem like it's harming them. new products sell very well. plenty of people (like me) enjoy the spectacle. the number of people who think apple is being uppity or self-congratulatory about their presentations and then decide to disassociate themselves from the company... it doesn't seem like a huge quantity of people.

    i dunno.

    i like the keynotes!

    i like it even more when it's a leapfrog product release that i want very much... but i like all of them, regardless.

    I like the Keynotes too! I just hate the month-long teasing run-up when it results in a wet fart like the iPad 3. It's like getting socks at Christmas, except at least at Christmas the socks are free.

  • SynthesisSynthesis Registered User regular
    enc0re wrote:
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

    Go Africa or go home. You can't get better supply chain integration than having the conflict minerals you need right on your compenent maker's doorsteps.

    Isn't African even more fucked up than China? China isn't a paradise by any means by they don't have regimes that encourage cannibalism, like Joseph Kony's. Don't forget the blood diamond debacle, either.

    An heavily (though not wholly) industrialized nation with the same government for the last +60 years probably shouldn't be compared with a continent of governments that were colonial possessions 60 years ago.

    Just putting that out there.

    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Synthesis wrote: »
    enc0re wrote:
    Absolutely. If an IP suit in China prevents Apple from exporting and selling iPads, literally every supply chain manager with operations in China will take note and start exploring alternative production locations. I hear Indonesia has lovely beaches.

    Go Africa or go home. You can't get better supply chain integration than having the conflict minerals you need right on your compenent maker's doorsteps.

    Isn't African even more fucked up than China? China isn't a paradise by any means by they don't have regimes that encourage cannibalism, like Joseph Kony's. Don't forget the blood diamond debacle, either.

    An heavily (though not wholly) industrialized nation with the same government for the last +60 years probably shouldn't be compared with a continent of governments that were colonial possessions 60 years ago.

    Just putting that out there.

    The primary reason I was comparing them was because Space mentioned Africa and someone else was already talking about China in the thread. They're both logical to compare since companies can operate there if they choose to. Africa being in worse shape is why I was bringing up the fact China is a better "lesser evil" to do business with.

  • JarsJars Registered User regular
    and now china is taking over africa too

  • SynthesisSynthesis Registered User regular
    Well, they saw what the United States did with the rest of the hemisphere and went, "You know, we would like that, I bet."

    EDIT: Specific to Apple, have they set it up so their various iDevices that have wifi support wirelessly sync on their own after they charge a bit? That's one thing the new iPad needs to have if it doesn't already.

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
This discussion has been closed.