I'll co-sign that. The metro did get repetitive, but at worst they were a brief obstacle on the way to something more interesting; hardly a deal breaker for me, and I did enjoy exploring if I wasn't in a hurry. And honestly, given that skill books were spread out more in F3, I found poking into random locations more rewarding there than in NV.
went back to my parked new vegas mega mod install to finish off dlc (owb and lr i still have to do, and some mod bounties and then the final few quests again) and im trapped inside some weird yet awesome redoubt teleporter system where each teleporter sends me to insane death from various monsters, my fav being the abandon enclave base with all the fucking deathclaws let loose, complete with 2 mothers and 3 alpha males.
shit got real fast.
Sounds like A World of Pain mod? If not, I'd love to find out which one that is. Sounds entertaining.
If it's AWOP, go look for the Emergency Railyard Station for more fun.
....bring lots of bullets.
yeah i think it is awop, i couldnt remember the name and havent looked my mod list since earlier in the year. discovered the redoubt stuff after wading through a rad/ghoul infested bunker at the side of the divide entrance, its next to the green goo crater and little shack called hell's something or some other.. at least thats one of the teleport locations.
where is the railyard station?
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KadokenGiving Ends to my Friends and it Feels StupendousRegistered Userregular
I'll co-sign that. The metro did get repetitive, but at worst they were a brief obstacle on the way to something more interesting; hardly a deal breaker for me, and I did enjoy exploring if I wasn't in a hurry. And honestly, given that skill books were spread out more in F3, I found poking into random locations more rewarding there than in NV.
The only time I hated the Metro was when I was trying to figure out how to get to quest locations, like the museum or Three Dog's Radio place. Other times it was effective at being dark and creepy.
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mrt144King of the NumbernamesRegistered Userregular
I'll co-sign that. The metro did get repetitive, but at worst they were a brief obstacle on the way to something more interesting; hardly a deal breaker for me, and I did enjoy exploring if I wasn't in a hurry. And honestly, given that skill books were spread out more in F3, I found poking into random locations more rewarding there than in NV.
The only time I hated the Metro was when I was trying to figure out how to get to quest locations, like the museum or Three Dog's Radio place. Other times it was effective at being dark and creepy.
The worst was the the messed up map in FO3 where one waypoint most certainly wasn't where it indicated was and you had to wiggle through some subway to get to it.
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KadokenGiving Ends to my Friends and it Feels StupendousRegistered Userregular
I'll co-sign that. The metro did get repetitive, but at worst they were a brief obstacle on the way to something more interesting; hardly a deal breaker for me, and I did enjoy exploring if I wasn't in a hurry. And honestly, given that skill books were spread out more in F3, I found poking into random locations more rewarding there than in NV.
The only time I hated the Metro was when I was trying to figure out how to get to quest locations, like the museum or Three Dog's Radio place. Other times it was effective at being dark and creepy.
The worst was the the messed up map in FO3 where one waypoint most certainly wasn't where it indicated was and you had to wiggle through some subway to get to it.
Man, I know that point so damn well. I dreaded that point when I replayed it and had to go back. Why can't doors we need to go out of glow or have some hud over it when we approach them?
went back to my parked new vegas mega mod install to finish off dlc (owb and lr i still have to do, and some mod bounties and then the final few quests again) and im trapped inside some weird yet awesome redoubt teleporter system where each teleporter sends me to insane death from various monsters, my fav being the abandon enclave base with all the fucking deathclaws let loose, complete with 2 mothers and 3 alpha males.
shit got real fast.
Sounds like A World of Pain mod? If not, I'd love to find out which one that is. Sounds entertaining.
If it's AWOP, go look for the Emergency Railyard Station for more fun.
....bring lots of bullets.
yeah i think it is awop, i couldnt remember the name and havent looked my mod list since earlier in the year. discovered the redoubt stuff after wading through a rad/ghoul infested bunker at the side of the divide entrance, its next to the green goo crater and little shack called hell's something or some other.. at least thats one of the teleport locations.
where is the railyard station?
East of Primm, the vanilla location is Emergency Service Railyard, but AWOP expands it into an actual dungeon. If you're running Rumble Zones or Monster Mod + AWOP Monster Patch, that place is even crazier.
I'll co-sign that. The metro did get repetitive, but at worst they were a brief obstacle on the way to something more interesting; hardly a deal breaker for me, and I did enjoy exploring if I wasn't in a hurry. And honestly, given that skill books were spread out more in F3, I found poking into random locations more rewarding there than in NV.
The only time I hated the Metro was when I was trying to figure out how to get to quest locations, like the museum or Three Dog's Radio place. Other times it was effective at being dark and creepy.
The worst was the the messed up map in FO3 where one waypoint most certainly wasn't where it indicated was and you had to wiggle through some subway to get to it.
Man, I know that point so damn well. I dreaded that point when I replayed it and had to go back. Why can't doors we need to go out of glow or have some hud over it when we approach them?
The pipboy map, in general, was a duplicitous skullfucker whose sole purpose in life was to lead me astray and get me killed. Following markers and metro maps was more useful, which isn't saying much. Interior maps with compressed floors still rile up the urge to punch someone or something.
unless the co-op player gets to be the dog, I'm just not feeling this
Wasn't the original fallout like one of the first games that had companion characters be actual characters, rather than just another voiceless PC made bag of stats and skills?
I still contend that isolation and/or open world exploration were core parts of fallout, as opposed to the communities. It invented the black isle/bioware school of "talkie" RPGs, and is the freaking originator of the idea of conversation battles being a legitimate part of RPG gameplay
Edit: oh yeah, the metro thing. That might have made sense if the game took place in the 2030s, but Bethesda moved the timeline up a little bit
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chiasaur11Never doubt a raccoon.Do you think it's trademarked?Registered Userregular
unless the co-op player gets to be the dog, I'm just not feeling this
Wasn't the original fallout like one of the first games that had companion characters be actual characters, rather than just another voiceless PC made bag of stats and skills?
I still contend that isolation and/or open world exploration were core parts of fallout, as opposed to the communities. It invented the black isle/bioware school of "talkie" RPGs, and is the freaking originator of the idea of conversation battles being a legitimate part of RPG gameplay
unless the co-op player gets to be the dog, I'm just not feeling this
Wasn't the original fallout like one of the first games that had companion characters be actual characters, rather than just another voiceless PC made bag of stats and skills?
They ARE a bag of stats and skills. In Fallout 1 as well as 3 they were an afterthought at most.
Yeah, but with the whole jrpg thing, they didn't really have any reactivity, which is (theoretically) the cornerstone of bioware/black isle games, da2/me3 ending nonwithstanding. Again, conversation battles
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chiasaur11Never doubt a raccoon.Do you think it's trademarked?Registered Userregular
I was thinking more in terms of companions having some kind of character (as well as being bags of stats)
Hmm.
Okay, they definitely had personalities in Ultima 6 (1990), and the first Final Fantasy with predefined party members was II, in December 1988. So it all depends on if Iolo did anything in 5 (October 1988) to define himself.
OrcaAlso known as EspressosaurusWrexRegistered Userregular
Fallout's companions aren't that reactive. Once you acquire them, there's only a few areas where they actually react in a way worth noting, unless you go childkiller in front of them. In Fallout 2, the big thing is selling them into slavery, and the big conversation Vic has with his daughter. There's some areas where their skills can be handy (earning you an "I'll take care of that"), but nothing really major that I can recall.
They're roughly on par with Mass Effect 1 and 2's level of in-mission squad interaction--enough to let you know they're alive, but little beyond that.
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OrcaAlso known as EspressosaurusWrexRegistered Userregular
As for Final Fantasy, I remember them having personality in FF3, 4, and certainly by 6 (1994) and all subsequent games the personalities were well defined. Final Fantasy Adventure's characters were well-defined and interacted with you a fair bit as well (I played that on my original grey-screen Gameboy...released in 1991).
Betrayal at Krondor was out in 1993. I seem to recall party members having opinions in that game as well.
holy crap, i went to the lucky 38 to get cass and someone else since i had sent everyone to the lucky 38 the other night.
i go there and noone is around at all, im like wtf? they are not even at their normal home locations.. i find rex just standing at the back end of the strip (this might be that mod that makes the strip one cell thats fucking things up) and i couldnt find anyone else..
so i use the console commands, teleport myself to their location and what the flying fuck, all of them are just hanging around in the areas outside the map stuck up a huge textureless mountain way way waaaaaay north of the northern passage, just chilling, drinking my nuka cola, like nothing is wrong.
Isolation was a big deal in the first Fallout because without save-scumming it was essentially impossible to keep your lightly armed and armored NPCs alive once you started fighting super mutants.
In FO2, you could give your followers armor and weapons just as powerful as your own.
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mrt144King of the NumbernamesRegistered Userregular
Isolation was a big deal in the first Fallout because without save-scumming it was essentially impossible to keep your lightly armed and armored NPCs alive once you started fighting super mutants.
In FO2, you could give your followers armor and weapons just as powerful as your own.
Nothing better than your entire NPC squad becoming dust in the wind thanks to a minigun.
The first fallout to really emphasize isolation (or at least where I felt it) was fallout 3, I never got that sense at all from the earlier ones - but that's partly just a result of the structure of the game. In the first 2 you don't really notice all the time you spend between cities, and can gather a huge party (like I always did). 3 is the first one where you really notice how vast the world is, and how few people there are in it.
I can't say I ever felt cripplingly isolated in Fallout. After a bad experience with Ian I had a tendency to avoid companions in that game. I definitely went into the Cathedral as alone as when I started.
But I *can* understand what is meant by the feeling of isolation. The Glow was one location that turned the isolation to 11. It was quite literally a descent into a Pit of Death. No settlements around for miles, nobody to give you Rad-Away before you turn to dust. I've lost many a good character to the Glow. I definitely felt it there.
Of course, ending on this note didn't make me feel like a social pariah either:
Ian wasn't shooting you in the back with fully automatic abandon, He was doing you a favor.
You are walking the desolate husk of civilization, its hot..He was just giving your body ventilation to cool you off.
Because Ian cares about you.
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OrcaAlso known as EspressosaurusWrexRegistered Userregular
Oh, and don't ever give the brainbot an automatic shotgun.
Little fucker doesn't know how to do anything but empty it towards the enemy, regardless of how far away they are, regardless of who is in front of him.
Unless your science is like 140 or something silly-high.
Even in Fallout 2, give Sulik a P90 and he will shred enemies.
If you happen to be on the other side of the enemy, he'll cheerfully shred you too.
Everybody else gets Gauss Rifles.
Everytime, and I mean everytime, I try to do the "save Neil" quest in Junktown it inevitably goes to shit because Tycho clips a customer, or Ian takes a round from a Junktown guard and goes absolutely apeshit and we end up killing everyone at the bar.
And then we have to sneak out because I don't want to kill Mayor Richard Dean Anderson.
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OrcaAlso known as EspressosaurusWrexRegistered Userregular
Even in Fallout 2, give Sulik a P90 and he will shred enemies.
If you happen to be on the other side of the enemy, he'll cheerfully shred you too.
Everybody else gets Gauss Rifles.
Everytime, and I mean everytime, I try to do the "save Neil" quest in Junktown it inevitably goes to shit because Tycho clips a customer, or Ian takes a round from a Junktown guard and goes absolutely apeshit and we end up killing everyone at the bar.
And then we have to sneak out because I don't want to kill Mayor Richard Dean Anderson.
My experience hasn't been quite that bad.
Usually requires a few reloads, but dang, man.
Things usually go completely to shit for me during "Free Adytum from the Regulators" though unless I leave everyone behind.
Too many good guys mixed up with too many bad guys; it's inevitable that a friendly on one side or the other will take a bullet and I'll have to just exterminate everyone.
Kane, Decker's bodyguard. He is a drugged out, spiked knuckled murder machine. He is Brock Samson in video game form.
I gave up 'arresting' Decker without specifically assassinating Kane beforehand because he's that powerful.
How powerful you say?
He took down Ian, Tycho and myself in three turns. Solo. I had 90% damage resistance after taking psycho. Desert Eagles, sawed-off shotgun rounds point blank. Did not matter. He gets to attack, I kid you not, up to 8 times per turn. His criticals do around 40 damage points which seem to trigger all the time. He also has around 100 hit points, and unless you get very lucky with an eye shot, it is nearly impossible to kill him without losing an NPC at an early level (around 5 for most players by the time you reach the Hub).
He gives me more trouble than the final boss, he's worse than a Deathclaw.
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OrcaAlso known as EspressosaurusWrexRegistered Userregular
I remember just eye-shotting that dude first thing after getting torn a new one by him.
Then again I don't remember what level I was, and it's been a few years since I last played Fallout.
Like anything in the first two Fallouts, its up to those eye criticals and random numbers god.
Let's just say I never went with a 'fast shot' build in Fallout 1 again...
According to Fallout wiki he has 9 strength, 10 luck, and 1-14 unarmed damage. Not sure if that calculates in the spiked knuckle damage or not.
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OrcaAlso known as EspressosaurusWrexRegistered Userregular
Ahhh.
I've only tried a fast shot build once.
I also tried a lowish luck build the first time, not knowing how vital it was.
After those few runs, it's been all about the perception, agility, luck, and eye-shots with the most powerful armor piercing weapons I can get my hands on.
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I dont deny it but cmon, you'd probably like my 80s metal band "More is More."
I'll co-sign that. The metro did get repetitive, but at worst they were a brief obstacle on the way to something more interesting; hardly a deal breaker for me, and I did enjoy exploring if I wasn't in a hurry. And honestly, given that skill books were spread out more in F3, I found poking into random locations more rewarding there than in NV.
Now playing: Teardown and Baldur's Gate 3 (co-op)
Sunday Spotlight: Horror Tales: The Wine
yeah i think it is awop, i couldnt remember the name and havent looked my mod list since earlier in the year. discovered the redoubt stuff after wading through a rad/ghoul infested bunker at the side of the divide entrance, its next to the green goo crater and little shack called hell's something or some other.. at least thats one of the teleport locations.
where is the railyard station?
The only time I hated the Metro was when I was trying to figure out how to get to quest locations, like the museum or Three Dog's Radio place. Other times it was effective at being dark and creepy.
The worst was the the messed up map in FO3 where one waypoint most certainly wasn't where it indicated was and you had to wiggle through some subway to get to it.
Man, I know that point so damn well. I dreaded that point when I replayed it and had to go back. Why can't doors we need to go out of glow or have some hud over it when we approach them?
East of Primm, the vanilla location is Emergency Service Railyard, but AWOP expands it into an actual dungeon. If you're running Rumble Zones or Monster Mod + AWOP Monster Patch, that place is even crazier.
The pipboy map, in general, was a duplicitous skullfucker whose sole purpose in life was to lead me astray and get me killed. Following markers and metro maps was more useful, which isn't saying much. Interior maps with compressed floors still rile up the urge to punch someone or something.
Now playing: Teardown and Baldur's Gate 3 (co-op)
Sunday Spotlight: Horror Tales: The Wine
Wasn't the original fallout like one of the first games that had companion characters be actual characters, rather than just another voiceless PC made bag of stats and skills?
I still contend that isolation and/or open world exploration were core parts of fallout, as opposed to the communities. It invented the black isle/bioware school of "talkie" RPGs, and is the freaking originator of the idea of conversation battles being a legitimate part of RPG gameplay
Edit: oh yeah, the metro thing. That might have made sense if the game took place in the 2030s, but Bethesda moved the timeline up a little bit
Ultima.
Why I fear the ocean.
Eh. I think Ultima's more of an influence on the whole BG school up to the present.
It's definitely the grandfather of all open world games.
You could murder people, use their blood to make bread, and then feed the bread to their families!
Why I fear the ocean.
They ARE a bag of stats and skills. In Fallout 1 as well as 3 they were an afterthought at most.
Hmm.
Okay, they definitely had personalities in Ultima 6 (1990), and the first Final Fantasy with predefined party members was II, in December 1988. So it all depends on if Iolo did anything in 5 (October 1988) to define himself.
I think he did something. Not sure.
Why I fear the ocean.
They're roughly on par with Mass Effect 1 and 2's level of in-mission squad interaction--enough to let you know they're alive, but little beyond that.
Betrayal at Krondor was out in 1993. I seem to recall party members having opinions in that game as well.
Fallout came out in 1997.
i go there and noone is around at all, im like wtf? they are not even at their normal home locations.. i find rex just standing at the back end of the strip (this might be that mod that makes the strip one cell thats fucking things up) and i couldnt find anyone else..
so i use the console commands, teleport myself to their location and what the flying fuck, all of them are just hanging around in the areas outside the map stuck up a huge textureless mountain way way waaaaaay north of the northern passage, just chilling, drinking my nuka cola, like nothing is wrong.
fuckers.
In FO2, you could give your followers armor and weapons just as powerful as your own.
Nothing better than your entire NPC squad becoming dust in the wind thanks to a minigun.
Seriously, give Ian a SMG. Now try to play the whole game without wanting to murder him at every opportunity.
"YOU JUST KILLED MY DOG IAN, WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU!"
Now playing: Teardown and Baldur's Gate 3 (co-op)
Sunday Spotlight: Horror Tales: The Wine
It was. Like its specifically mentioned multiple times by the developers. Not to mention the point of the "You have to leave the Vault" ending.
If you happen to be on the other side of the enemy, he'll cheerfully shred you too.
Everybody else gets Gauss Rifles.
But I *can* understand what is meant by the feeling of isolation. The Glow was one location that turned the isolation to 11. It was quite literally a descent into a Pit of Death. No settlements around for miles, nobody to give you Rad-Away before you turn to dust. I've lost many a good character to the Glow. I definitely felt it there.
Of course, ending on this note didn't make me feel like a social pariah either:
You are walking the desolate husk of civilization, its hot..He was just giving your body ventilation to cool you off.
Because Ian cares about you.
Little fucker doesn't know how to do anything but empty it towards the enemy, regardless of how far away they are, regardless of who is in front of him.
Unless your science is like 140 or something silly-high.
"Those are speed holes. Makes you go faster."
Now playing: Teardown and Baldur's Gate 3 (co-op)
Sunday Spotlight: Horror Tales: The Wine
Everytime, and I mean everytime, I try to do the "save Neil" quest in Junktown it inevitably goes to shit because Tycho clips a customer, or Ian takes a round from a Junktown guard and goes absolutely apeshit and we end up killing everyone at the bar.
And then we have to sneak out because I don't want to kill Mayor Richard Dean Anderson.
My experience hasn't been quite that bad.
Usually requires a few reloads, but dang, man.
Things usually go completely to shit for me during "Free Adytum from the Regulators" though unless I leave everyone behind.
Too many good guys mixed up with too many bad guys; it's inevitable that a friendly on one side or the other will take a bullet and I'll have to just exterminate everyone.
Kane, Decker's bodyguard. He is a drugged out, spiked knuckled murder machine. He is Brock Samson in video game form.
I gave up 'arresting' Decker without specifically assassinating Kane beforehand because he's that powerful.
How powerful you say?
He took down Ian, Tycho and myself in three turns. Solo. I had 90% damage resistance after taking psycho. Desert Eagles, sawed-off shotgun rounds point blank. Did not matter. He gets to attack, I kid you not, up to 8 times per turn. His criticals do around 40 damage points which seem to trigger all the time. He also has around 100 hit points, and unless you get very lucky with an eye shot, it is nearly impossible to kill him without losing an NPC at an early level (around 5 for most players by the time you reach the Hub).
He gives me more trouble than the final boss, he's worse than a Deathclaw.
Then again I don't remember what level I was, and it's been a few years since I last played Fallout.
Let's just say I never went with a 'fast shot' build in Fallout 1 again...
According to Fallout wiki he has 9 strength, 10 luck, and 1-14 unarmed damage. Not sure if that calculates in the spiked knuckle damage or not.
I've only tried a fast shot build once.
I also tried a lowish luck build the first time, not knowing how vital it was.
After those few runs, it's been all about the perception, agility, luck, and eye-shots with the most powerful armor piercing weapons I can get my hands on.