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The cultural permeation of athletes

245

Posts

  • OnTheLastCastleOnTheLastCastle sometimes a boy just needs to get out of the house and meet some girls Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote:
    Jordan on top, absolutely. Tiger Woods as well, or perhaps Arnold Palmer. Probably Tiger.

    I can't get drunk on a Tiger Woods!

    I'm a published writer and have a very unique and interesting writing style. I'm also sharp and witty. My profile is well-written and hilarious. My messages are likewise brilliant. And I've been doing this stuff for...four or five years. I know what "works" in terms of good internet dating writing. "Works" in the sense of leading to a "date" with a human female.
  • OnTheLastCastleOnTheLastCastle sometimes a boy just needs to get out of the house and meet some girls Registered User regular
    Chanus wrote:
    Organichu wrote:
    Well, I guess there are no hard and fast rules. It's a big cocktail of

    -modernity
    -how much they're on television
    -how good they were at their sport
    -whether they're still alive
    -whether they're still playing
    -whether they were well liked
    -whether they have any products (Foreman Grill, Air Jordans, Tigers' face on Gatorade, etc)

    There's definitely no right or wrong answer, though I think the one definite is that Michael Jordan is either at or very near to the top of the list.

    I don't see how anyone could dispute Jordan, no.

    Except maybe with Kobe... being that he's sort of this generation's Jordan.

    Jordan is still this generations Jordan, IMO. :D

    I'm a published writer and have a very unique and interesting writing style. I'm also sharp and witty. My profile is well-written and hilarious. My messages are likewise brilliant. And I've been doing this stuff for...four or five years. I know what "works" in terms of good internet dating writing. "Works" in the sense of leading to a "date" with a human female.
  • ChanusChanus Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote:
    Jordan on top, absolutely. Tiger Woods as well, or perhaps Arnold Palmer. Probably Tiger.

    Arnold Palmer if you're over 60, maybe. :P

  • spool32spool32 Contrary Library Registered User regular
    Chanus wrote:
    Organichu wrote:
    Well, I guess there are no hard and fast rules. It's a big cocktail of

    -modernity
    -how much they're on television
    -how good they were at their sport
    -whether they're still alive
    -whether they're still playing
    -whether they were well liked
    -whether they have any products (Foreman Grill, Air Jordans, Tigers' face on Gatorade, etc)

    There's definitely no right or wrong answer, though I think the one definite is that Michael Jordan is either at or very near to the top of the list.

    I don't see how anyone could dispute Jordan, no.

    Except maybe with Kobe... being that he's sort of this generation's Jordan.

    When you're "this generation's version of someone more famous" you haven't made it high enough yet. In 15 years if people are calling some player "this generation's LaBron James", then you know Bron Bron has staying power.

    Successful Kickstarter get! Drop by Bare Mettle Entertainment if you'd like to see what we're making.
  • DeebaserDeebaser At the corporate garage sale This is cheap and plentifulRegistered User regular
    emnmnme wrote:
    Sports memes that grab even the non-sports people, huh? I just bought All-Star Pro Football from Gamestop yesterday for $1. This is an XBOX 360 football game where all the legends of the sport, the best of the best, are selectable and can be mixed and matched in any way you see fit. Despite having a huge stable of well-known Hall of Famers, the game sold poorly. This makes me think that even though you're a household name, it doesn't mean the average Joe cares about you ... that's kind of bizarre if you think about it.

    I already have Madden. My Friends have Madden. I can play Madden with my friends online. Why would I want to play All Star Pro Football?

  • DoctorArchDoctorArch Curmudgeon Registered User regular
    Chu, I wonder if asking ourselves the question "Will people remember this man/woman as the prime example of their sport for decades/centuries after they retire?" helps.

    Going off your list, I would definitely keep Tiger Woods where he is now, but I think he probably replaced Arnold Palmer or Jack Nicklaus.

    Michael Jordan belongs there, so does Gretzky. Favre isn't a bad example of football at all, but Joe Namath may be up there. Baseball has a long-ass history with luminaries like Babe Ruth, Mickey Mantle, Joe DiMaggio, Lou Gehrig, and that's just a start. It is hard to limit baseball down to one legend because it has had so many legendary players. Beckham is probably a good pick for the US due to the limited exposure of soccer, and while I am unsure about tennis, but the Williams sisters are probably a good pick.

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  • OnTheLastCastleOnTheLastCastle sometimes a boy just needs to get out of the house and meet some girls Registered User regular
    I love me some John Madden so maybe!

    “If the quaterback throws the ball in the endzone and the Wide Receiver catches it……. It’s a touchdown.”

    I'm a published writer and have a very unique and interesting writing style. I'm also sharp and witty. My profile is well-written and hilarious. My messages are likewise brilliant. And I've been doing this stuff for...four or five years. I know what "works" in terms of good internet dating writing. "Works" in the sense of leading to a "date" with a human female.
  • Robos A Go GoRobos A Go Go Registered User regular
    DoctorArch wrote:
    I wonder if Kobe Bryant ever sits awake at night with the knowledge that regardless of how good he is, he will never be loved like Michael Jordan.

    I sit awake with that knowledge every night.

  • emnmnmeemnmnme Heard about this on conservative radio:Registered User regular
    I don't follow pro football. How do I know who Johnny Unitas is? How did this name get planted in my brain when I don't even know what he accomplished as a quarterback? His career was over before I was born.

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  • OnTheLastCastleOnTheLastCastle sometimes a boy just needs to get out of the house and meet some girls Registered User regular
    It's funny how some sports are still generating what I consider "legends" and some aren't. Fuck baseball. Seriously, who will remember any of the baseball players in 50 years like they do Ruth, Mantle, Robinson and Gehrig. I may be wrong, it's just a feeling. I feel like that game has lost whatever majesty it once had on the American psyche.

    I'm a published writer and have a very unique and interesting writing style. I'm also sharp and witty. My profile is well-written and hilarious. My messages are likewise brilliant. And I've been doing this stuff for...four or five years. I know what "works" in terms of good internet dating writing. "Works" in the sense of leading to a "date" with a human female.
  • ChanusChanus Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote:
    Chanus wrote:
    I don't see how anyone could dispute Jordan, no.

    Except maybe with Kobe... being that he's sort of this generation's Jordan.

    When you're "this generation's version of someone more famous" you haven't made it high enough yet. In 15 years if people are calling some player "this generation's LaBron James", then you know Bron Bron has staying power.

    While I agree, I don't know how many of this generation would call Kobe Bryant "my generation's Michael Jordan".

    Like... how it's relevant to the current generation is part of the equation... which is why someone like Joe Montana probably doesn't apply, even though he was arguably the best quarterback of a generation that fielded most of the best quarterbacks in the history of the game. That guy in the underwear ads?

  • OnTheLastCastleOnTheLastCastle sometimes a boy just needs to get out of the house and meet some girls Registered User regular
    emnmnme wrote:
    I don't follow pro football. How do I know who Johnny Unitas is? How did this name get planted in my brain when I don't even know what he accomplished as a quarterback? His career was over before I was born.

    It is a cool name. I know the name too but not what he played.

    I'm a published writer and have a very unique and interesting writing style. I'm also sharp and witty. My profile is well-written and hilarious. My messages are likewise brilliant. And I've been doing this stuff for...four or five years. I know what "works" in terms of good internet dating writing. "Works" in the sense of leading to a "date" with a human female.
  • YougottawannaYougottawanna Registered User regular
    We should try and figure out what characteristics all the people on the list have in common. For instance athletic dominance is not one of them - Beckham's the most famous face in soccer, but he was never the best player in the sport.

    In some cases it's down to the team or situation: Jeter wouldn't be on this list if he'd played for the Florida Marlins, for instance. The Williams sisters probably wouldn't be so famous if there were only one of them.

  • matt has a problemmatt has a problem Six pack on a dick Registered User regular
    DoctorArch wrote:
    Chu, I wonder if asking ourselves the question "Will people remember this man/woman as the prime example of their sport for decades/centuries after they retire?" helps.

    Going off your list, I would definitely keep Tiger Woods where he is now, but I think he probably replaced Arnold Palmer or Jack Nicklaus.

    Michael Jordan belongs there, so does Gretzky. Favre isn't a bad example of football at all, but Joe Namath may be up there. Baseball has a long-ass history with luminaries like Babe Ruth, Mickey Mantle, Joe DiMaggio, Lou Gehrig, and that's just a start. It is hard to limit baseball down to one legend because it has had so many legendary players. Beckham is probably a good pick for the US due to the limited exposure of soccer, and while I am unsure about tennis, but the Williams sisters are probably a good pick.

    I think Andre Agassi will probably have more staying power than the Williams Sisters. Beckham is more well known in the US for marrying one of the spice girls and for commercials than soccer though. If you're going purely on "why" someone is known, I'd say Pele would have more soccer-based name recognition here than Beckham.

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  • ChanusChanus Registered User regular
    emnmnme wrote:
    I don't follow pro football. How do I know who Johnny Unitas is? How did this name get planted in my brain when I don't even know what he accomplished as a quarterback? His career was over before I was born.

    He was like the Peyton Manning of the 1950s.

  • DoctorArchDoctorArch Curmudgeon Registered User regular
    It's funny how some sports are still generating what I consider "legends" and some aren't. Fuck baseball. Seriously, who will remember any of the baseball players in 50 years like they do Ruth, Mantle, Robinson and Gehrig. I may be wrong, it's just a feeling. I feel like that game has lost whatever majesty it once had on the American psyche.

    There are a few players who will remain popular because they are throwbacks to that classic era. Cal Ripken Jr. really comes to mind.

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  • spool32spool32 Contrary Library Registered User regular
    edited September 2011
    How about Michael Phelps (swimming) and Apolo Ohno (speed skating)?

    Edit: Arch, see also: Nolan Ryan

    spool32 on
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  • OnTheLastCastleOnTheLastCastle sometimes a boy just needs to get out of the house and meet some girls Registered User regular
    We should try and figure out what characteristics all the people on the list have in common. For instance athletic dominance is not one of them - Beckham's the most famous face in soccer, but he was never the best player in the sport.

    In some cases it's down to the team or situation: Jeter wouldn't be on this list if he'd played for the Florida Marlins, for instance. The Williams sisters probably wouldn't be so famous if there were only one of them.

    Like I said earlier it is enmeshment with popular culture OR a narrative that is heroic or infamous. Usually both.

    Tiger Woods is an amazing golfer, a million product placement, likeable and black. The last part is unique. Then he had a scandal.

    Michael Jordan was among the best players ever, so was Larry Bird and Magic Johnson, but he did more products AND a fucking cartoon movie!

    Tyson combined extreme talent and winning with a downward personal trajectory.

    I'm a published writer and have a very unique and interesting writing style. I'm also sharp and witty. My profile is well-written and hilarious. My messages are likewise brilliant. And I've been doing this stuff for...four or five years. I know what "works" in terms of good internet dating writing. "Works" in the sense of leading to a "date" with a human female.
  • YougottawannaYougottawanna Registered User regular
    emnmnme wrote:
    I don't follow pro football. How do I know who Johnny Unitas is? How did this name get planted in my brain when I don't even know what he accomplished as a quarterback? His career was over before I was born.

    Do you watch the Simpsons? I know people who know the name "Johnny Unitas" just because of that one Simpsons joke.

  • OnTheLastCastleOnTheLastCastle sometimes a boy just needs to get out of the house and meet some girls Registered User regular
    Michael Phelps and OJ Simpson should be on my list.

    I'm a published writer and have a very unique and interesting writing style. I'm also sharp and witty. My profile is well-written and hilarious. My messages are likewise brilliant. And I've been doing this stuff for...four or five years. I know what "works" in terms of good internet dating writing. "Works" in the sense of leading to a "date" with a human female.
  • spool32spool32 Contrary Library Registered User regular
    And of course Lance Armstrong has transcended. He's right up there with Tiger IMHO.

    Successful Kickstarter get! Drop by Bare Mettle Entertainment if you'd like to see what we're making.
  • ChanusChanus Registered User regular
    DoctorArch wrote:
    It's funny how some sports are still generating what I consider "legends" and some aren't. Fuck baseball. Seriously, who will remember any of the baseball players in 50 years like they do Ruth, Mantle, Robinson and Gehrig. I may be wrong, it's just a feeling. I feel like that game has lost whatever majesty it once had on the American psyche.

    There are a few players who will remain popular because they are throwbacks to that classic era. Cal Ripken Jr. really comes to mind.

    Cal Ripken Jr. is kind of all by himself.

    He's seriously one of the last truly great players of the game from a bygone era. Like... I'm not saying he's better than Jeter... I'm saying you can't even really compare them... and he only retired, what? 15 years ago?

  • OnTheLastCastleOnTheLastCastle sometimes a boy just needs to get out of the house and meet some girls Registered User regular
    But Michael Phelps will be replaced by whatever next great Olympic athlete we have. It happens so infrequently that they can't stay mythic forever.

    I'm a published writer and have a very unique and interesting writing style. I'm also sharp and witty. My profile is well-written and hilarious. My messages are likewise brilliant. And I've been doing this stuff for...four or five years. I know what "works" in terms of good internet dating writing. "Works" in the sense of leading to a "date" with a human female.
  • emnmnmeemnmnme Heard about this on conservative radio:Registered User regular
    emnmnme wrote:
    I don't follow pro football. How do I know who Johnny Unitas is? How did this name get planted in my brain when I don't even know what he accomplished as a quarterback? His career was over before I was born.

    It is a cool name. I know the name too but not what he played.

    This is what I mean. I just picked this name up without knowing anything about him. The same goes with Jeff Gordon, Anna Kournikova, and Sean White. I don't know these people other than the sports they play! Why are they in my brain!?

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  • YougottawannaYougottawanna Registered User regular
    Might be worth establishing a time limit - like, who was the last athlete to achieve that universal recognition? Ali is bigger than Tyson, but Tyson was the last boxer to capture the public's attention in a way comparable to Ali. Same with the Beckham vs. Pele comparison.

  • DoctorArchDoctorArch Curmudgeon Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote:
    How about Michael Phelps (swimming) and Apolo Ohno (speed skating)?

    Edit: Arch, see also: Nolan Ryan

    Nolan Ryan has always been one of my favorite players, but I think he, like Ripkin, probably belong more to fans of baseball than to everybody like Ruth/Gehrig/Robinson etc. My guess is that the early players maintain their cultural dominance in our collective psyches because they came about during a time with little competition (i.e., from other sports or distractions) and were subsequently held up as symbols of a different time and place.

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  • OnTheLastCastleOnTheLastCastle sometimes a boy just needs to get out of the house and meet some girls Registered User regular
    edited September 2011
    My list of the most "recognized" sports figures:
    1. Michael Jordan
    2. Tiger Woods
    3. Muhammad Ali
    4. Wayne Gretsky
    5. Babe Ruth (still want Jackie Robinson but whatever)
    6. OJ Simpson
    7. Lance Armstrong
    8. Mike Tyson
    9. Billie Fuckin' Jean King except everyone will think I mean the song
    10. Mickey Mantle

    OnTheLastCastle on
    I'm a published writer and have a very unique and interesting writing style. I'm also sharp and witty. My profile is well-written and hilarious. My messages are likewise brilliant. And I've been doing this stuff for...four or five years. I know what "works" in terms of good internet dating writing. "Works" in the sense of leading to a "date" with a human female.
  • matt has a problemmatt has a problem Six pack on a dick Registered User regular
    Might be worth establishing a time limit - like, who was the last athlete to achieve that universal recognition? Ali is bigger than Tyson, but Tyson was the last boxer to capture the public's attention in a way comparable to Ali. Same with the Beckham vs. Pele comparison.

    It's harder now because athletes personal lives are so much more in the public eye too. I mean, even just 20 years ago, nobody knew what Joe Montana ate for breakfast. It's become a blend of being famous because they're an athlete, and famous because they're famous.

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    All my fuckin life I lived a normal fuckin life
  • DoctorArchDoctorArch Curmudgeon Registered User regular
    But Michael Phelps will be replaced by whatever next great Olympic athlete we have. It happens so infrequently that they can't stay mythic forever.

    But that raises the question of Olympic legends. We certainly have some, regardless of whether or not their records have been broken.

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  • ChanusChanus Registered User regular
    My list of the most "recognized" sports figures:
    1. Michael Jordan
    2. Tiger Woods
    3. Muhammad Ali
    4. Wayne Gretsky
    5. Babe Ruth (still want Jackie Robinson but whatever)
    6. OJ Simpson
    7. Lance Armstrong
    8. Mike Tyson
    9. Billie Fuckin' Jean King except everyone will think I mean the song
    10. Mickey Mantle

    Haha... i was going to say earlier, "When I think tennis, I think Jimmy Connors and Billie Jean King!" :P

  • ChanusChanus Registered User regular
    DoctorArch wrote:
    But Michael Phelps will be replaced by whatever next great Olympic athlete we have. It happens so infrequently that they can't stay mythic forever.

    But that raises the question of Olympic legends. We certainly have some, regardless of whether or not their records have been broken.

    Dan and Dave!

  • spool32spool32 Contrary Library Registered User regular
    Chanus wrote:
    DoctorArch wrote:
    But Michael Phelps will be replaced by whatever next great Olympic athlete we have. It happens so infrequently that they can't stay mythic forever.

    But that raises the question of Olympic legends. We certainly have some, regardless of whether or not their records have been broken.

    Dan and Dave!

    Carl Lewis.

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  • OnTheLastCastleOnTheLastCastle sometimes a boy just needs to get out of the house and meet some girls Registered User regular
    I hope you mean Dan Gable. Love that guy.

    I'm a published writer and have a very unique and interesting writing style. I'm also sharp and witty. My profile is well-written and hilarious. My messages are likewise brilliant. And I've been doing this stuff for...four or five years. I know what "works" in terms of good internet dating writing. "Works" in the sense of leading to a "date" with a human female.
  • ChanusChanus Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote:
    Chanus wrote:
    DoctorArch wrote:
    But Michael Phelps will be replaced by whatever next great Olympic athlete we have. It happens so infrequently that they can't stay mythic forever.

    But that raises the question of Olympic legends. We certainly have some, regardless of whether or not their records have been broken.

    Dan and Dave!

    Carl Lewis.

    Yes, but I was joking :P

    Jackie Joyner-Kersee

  • ChanusChanus Registered User regular
  • DoctorArchDoctorArch Curmudgeon Registered User regular
    Oh how I loved Dan & Dave!

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  • OrganichuOrganichu Registered User regular
    I wonder if Ron Jeremy is an athlete.

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  • matt has a problemmatt has a problem Six pack on a dick Registered User regular
    Organichu wrote:
    I wonder if Ron Jeremy is an athlete.

    Only if he has a lisp.

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  • ChanusChanus Registered User regular
  • OrganichuOrganichu Registered User regular
    SOMEONE EXPLAIN TO ME THE JOKE.

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