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Diplomacy: Spring map 1911 on page 17. Down to E/F/T for the win

AssuranAssuran Is swinging on the SpiralRegistered User regular
edited April 2012 in Critical Failures
Diplomacy is my favorite board game of all time, but I usually only get to play at most one game a year in person. Just wondering if anyone would be interested in a game here at PA?

I know I could probably get some games via a few other websites, but why not take a shot here first?

Assuran on
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Posts

  • jakobaggerjakobagger Registered User regular
    I might be interested.

    bgg / steam / goodreads / Origin: Bygasto /Bnet: Bygasto#2537 /iOS Game Center: Bygasto Amazon wishlist
  • texasheattexasheat Registered User regular
    I know nothing about diplomacy. But i'd take a crack at just about any board game.

  • TmoiyTmoiy Registered User
    I might be interested as well.

  • stever777stever777 AFK most Saturdays Registered User regular
    Oh yeah! Germany!

    Dracula in Daemonis' Fury of Dracula
    Hosting Android: Netrunner - Thread 2: The Revenge

    The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
  • TmoiyTmoiy Registered User
    ...But I always play Germany! :shock:

  • stever777stever777 AFK most Saturdays Registered User regular
    Umm, OK, umm,

    England?
    Russia?
    (Just not Italy!)

    Dracula in Daemonis' Fury of Dracula
    Hosting Android: Netrunner - Thread 2: The Revenge

    The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
  • 38thDoe38thDoe lets never be stupid again wait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered User regular
    I'm interested. We can't play this in real life. We got 7 people once and played for 12 hours and had to call it. We take a bit too long in the diplomacy only to inevitable betray you phase.

  • Dongs GaloreDongs Galore Sweet mother Make it happenRegistered User regular
    Ooooh! I would be interested in this thing!

  • AssuranAssuran Is swinging on the Spiral Registered User regular
    edited October 2011
    Awesome, glad to see some interest. So, I suppose we should start setting about some ground rules, like which site we're gonna use to store game moves and such?

    It has been a long time since I played online, over at the diplo-pouch there's some good links if anyone has a suggestion.

    Re: Turn limits

    Now, here's the real issue with PBP or PB-email games. Obviously, I'd say we'd do most talking via PMs, but given how the website has been having issues of late, I'd say we make the first turn take a week, and every week after that we do another turn. I'm willing to listen to any other suggestions for time.

    Re: real life games

    The key to finishing quickly (or, at least quicker than 12 hours) is to really stick to the book's suggested time limit. 30 minutes for the first turn, then 15 every phase after. When I played at Gen Con a couple years ago, we actually managed to finish in 4 hours with a Russia victory. Granted 6-8 hours is more likely, but it is possible to stick to a quick game.

    Assuran on
  • Dongs GaloreDongs Galore Sweet mother Make it happenRegistered User regular
    edited October 2011
    I'm pretty sure I've seen PbP Diplomacy games run on this forum before, maybe search for those threads for ideas on how to run it?

    Edit: Here's one http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/49708/diplomacy-jpp01-game-called-italy-wins/p1

    Dongs Galore on
  • AssuranAssuran Is swinging on the Spiral Registered User regular
    Holy crap, Italy won that game. Nice job!

    I hadn't really thought about the GM position, but I suppose it makes sense to have one. I was hoping that one of the programs would have a way to post your orders and automatically take care of that end of things.

    Will do more research about this thought. Definately still want to try if we get enough interest.

  • stever777stever777 AFK most Saturdays Registered User regular
    edited October 2011
    Did I say "Just not Italy"?
    Hmm...

    Let's do open diplomacy!
    Here's my first post -
    "Sure, Russia. You can trust me."
    Hehe. Sucker. Little does he know I'll back-stab him the first chance I get!

    Oops. Probably shouldn't have posted that last part.

    stever777 on
    Dracula in Daemonis' Fury of Dracula
    Hosting Android: Netrunner - Thread 2: The Revenge

    The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
  • jakobaggerjakobagger Registered User regular
    By the way, I've never played before, so uh go easy on me? Or not, probably. No real preferences regarding country.

    bgg / steam / goodreads / Origin: Bygasto /Bnet: Bygasto#2537 /iOS Game Center: Bygasto Amazon wishlist
  • FunkyWaltDoggFunkyWaltDogg Registered User regular
    Assuran wrote:
    I hadn't really thought about the GM position, but I suppose it makes sense to have one. I was hoping that one of the programs would have a way to post your orders and automatically take care of that end of things.

    This makes it sound like like being the GM in Diplomacy would mostly be a matter of bookkeeping and wouldn't require a lot of effort. I know basically nothing about the game, but assuming I'm understanding things right, I wouldn't mind being the guy everyone sends their orders to so you can be sure no one's a filthy cheater.

    Burnage wrote:
    FWD is very good at this game.
  • TmoiyTmoiy Registered User
    I ran a game over email once. It took a bit of image manipulation to move the units around, but it's quite doable.

  • stever777stever777 AFK most Saturdays Registered User regular
    Tmoiy wrote:
    ...But I always play Germany! :shock:

    That's what my friends always say to me.
    If it's Frederick The Great or Space Nazis, I'm always Germany.

    Dracula in Daemonis' Fury of Dracula
    Hosting Android: Netrunner - Thread 2: The Revenge

    The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
  • 38thDoe38thDoe lets never be stupid again wait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered User regular
    Perhaps countries should be random?

  • stever777stever777 AFK most Saturdays Registered User regular
    RNG is probably best.

    Dracula in Daemonis' Fury of Dracula
    Hosting Android: Netrunner - Thread 2: The Revenge

    The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
  • AssuranAssuran Is swinging on the Spiral Registered User regular
    Yep, RNG is the fairest way to draw countries. The GM should probably know a bit about Diplomacy, so if you don't mind learning, it would be great to have one.

    Busy few days, I'll try to make another post probably Tuesday.

  • FunkyWaltDoggFunkyWaltDogg Registered User regular
    Assuran wrote:
    The GM should probably know a bit about Diplomacy, so if you don't mind learning, it would be great to have one

    I don't suppose anyone has a link or three lying around?

    Burnage wrote:
    FWD is very good at this game.
  • jakobaggerjakobagger Registered User regular
    There's also this site which I guess we might use? Found it reading the game's forum on BGG. There might be other similar options. Any of you experienced diplomats tried this?

    bgg / steam / goodreads / Origin: Bygasto /Bnet: Bygasto#2537 /iOS Game Center: Bygasto Amazon wishlist
  • stever777stever777 AFK most Saturdays Registered User regular
    Nope. Actually, I haven't played Diplomacy for 20 years.
    Just fond memories of screwing over friends at the Gates of Moscow.
    Our group isn't big or patient enough for this kinda game anymore.

    Dracula in Daemonis' Fury of Dracula
    Hosting Android: Netrunner - Thread 2: The Revenge

    The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
  • AssuranAssuran Is swinging on the Spiral Registered User regular
    edited October 2011
    Yeah, I haven't played Diplomacy online in about 7 years, so I'm not up to date on which program works best. I'm thinking about PMing Jus Plain Pavlok to see which program he used, because that seemed to work well (and the maps were a great touch). The only problem is that his profile says he hasn't logged on in over a month, so we'll see if he gets back with me.

    Seeing as I'm the one who suggested the game, if we get enough interest, I'd be willing to GM and manage it, on the hopeful promise that the next game we played (if we played a second) I got to be a player.

    Besides, it'd be great to see new people getting into this great game. The rules are fairly simple, most of the game is about interacting with the other players.

    Assuran on
  • stever777stever777 AFK most Saturdays Registered User regular
    Couldn't Walt GM, as we only have 7 players anyway, the right #?

    Dracula in Daemonis' Fury of Dracula
    Hosting Android: Netrunner - Thread 2: The Revenge

    The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
  • AssuranAssuran Is swinging on the Spiral Registered User regular
    edited October 2011
    JPP hasn't reached back out to me yet, and I'm not sure if/when that is going to happen, so I'm going to wait for another couple days, then formulate a plan on which program to use, etc, etc.

    If Walt wants to GM, and let me play, that would be great, but there is some degree of work that he would have to put in, unless the programs are fully self-sufficient.

    Anyways, I don't want to wait to long for this, so we don't lose interest.

    Assuran on
  • jakobaggerjakobagger Registered User regular
    Well, playdiplomacy.com seems to be fully automatic. I'd be inclined to say we just use that.

    bgg / steam / goodreads / Origin: Bygasto /Bnet: Bygasto#2537 /iOS Game Center: Bygasto Amazon wishlist
  • 38thDoe38thDoe lets never be stupid again wait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered User regular
  • AssuranAssuran Is swinging on the Spiral Registered User regular
    Ok, so it's been a few days and I still haven't heard back from JPP; I would venture I'm not going to hear back at this point.

    Looking around, I would say the play-diplomacy.com site does seem to be an easy to use site. The question is do we all want to sign up for the site, or just have our GM sign up and upload the moves?

    Normal diplomacy time from online seems to be once a week, that seems fair. Say we set the date as all moves need in by Saturday night at 11:59 EST?

    I'm down with any other suggestion.

    Also, we'll need someone to randomly draw for countries once everyone confirms they're still in.

    Anyone else have any questions or suggestions?

  • stever777stever777 AFK most Saturdays Registered User regular
    Oh I'm still in!
    I'm willing to go either way on the site.

    Hmm. I'm usually at my ftf game group Sats.
    Could we make it Friday night or Sunday night?

    Dracula in Daemonis' Fury of Dracula
    Hosting Android: Netrunner - Thread 2: The Revenge

    The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
  • AssuranAssuran Is swinging on the Spiral Registered User regular
    I'm ok with either one, I don't really care which day we pick.

  • stever777stever777 AFK most Saturdays Registered User regular
    Wouldn't want any last-minute phalla-like shenanigans to mess up my master plan.

    Dracula in Daemonis' Fury of Dracula
    Hosting Android: Netrunner - Thread 2: The Revenge

    The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
  • TmoiyTmoiy Registered User
    edited October 2011
    Having a GM upload our orders on that site would be silly (and I'm doubtful whether the site even supports such a functionality). Playing the game over there should be fine, just like Puerto Rico or TTA.

    I've gone ahead and created game number 32995 over at playdiplomacy.com. The password is wang. I couldn't find a way to specify a day of the week as a deadline, but 7-day movement turns and no deadlines on weekends should mimic a Sunday deadline reasonably well.

    Tmoiy on
  • AssuranAssuran Is swinging on the Spiral Registered User regular
    Cool, signed up as well.

    So, should we have a random forum user draw for countries?

  • TmoiyTmoiy Registered User
    I believe the site already handles that.

  • jakobaggerjakobagger Registered User regular
    I've joined.

    bgg / steam / goodreads / Origin: Bygasto /Bnet: Bygasto#2537 /iOS Game Center: Bygasto Amazon wishlist
  • texasheattexasheat Registered User regular
    I'd love to play. Still interested. However this site is blocked at work for me. So i'll have to join at home. Anyone gonna give a one over on the rules as i still have not played yet?

  • jakobaggerjakobagger Registered User regular
    texasheat wrote:
    I'd love to play. Still interested. However this site is blocked at work for me. So i'll have to join at home. Anyone gonna give a one over on the rules as i still have not played yet?

    I think the site has an overview, but if not they should be at BGG. The actual rules are very simple, like I think they could fit in a single page.

    Here's the 'extensive' write-up of the rules pasted from playdiplomacy:
    by Robert Spratt AKA Frigidus

    The objective of the game is to hold a simple majority of the major cities, the supply centers (marked in the online version as black and white squares) at the end of a Fall turn (each year has a Spring and a Fall turn).

    Aside from negotiating with other countries there are 4 things you can do:

    Hold
    Move
    Support
    Convoy
    Hold basically means that you defend the area you're already in. This is the equivalent of telling the unit to stay where it is.

    Move is a combination of two possible actions. First, and most simple, you are moving from one territory to an unoccupied one. Second, and more complicated, you are moving into a territory that your opponent either has an army or navy in or will attempt to move into as well. If a unit moves into a space already occupied by another unit then it fails in moving and remains where it came from. If two units attempt to move into the same area they both fail. They remain in the same spot they started in. If two enemy units attempt to invade past each other (switch places) they both fail and remain where they started.

    Support is used to make a hold or move option stronger. If a holding unit is attacked, then the supporting unit can help defend. If a moving unit meets resistance, the supporting unit can help push them back. In order to support, the unit must border the objective area (the country that's either being moved into or defended).

    If a unit is attacked while it's supporting, its support is taken away and it attempts to defend. The attacker carries on with the attack minus the support.

    Any nation can support any other nation. Support can not be refused, but it does not force the supported unit to do anything.

    Convoy is used by naval units on the water to transport armies to different areas. If you have a chain of naval units convoying over multiple spaces you can convoy the army through the chain in one turn. If you convoy into an occupied space then the battle is treated like any other one. Other nations can assist in a convoy.

    Rules on combat
    While there are a lot of complexities to the system, the basic idea is that each unit has a strength of 1. Every supporting unit adds 1 to the total strength. So, for example, if one army with one unit supporting it (total strength of 2) attacked one army without support (total strength of 1) the defending unit would be driven out. That unit will retreat to an unoccupied border country of the nation's choice. If there is no unoccupied border then that unit is destroyed. As another example, if the army driven out in the last example had support (a strength of 2 to oppose the invaders strength of 2) then the invader would be driven back.

    If a unit is attacked while it's supporting, its support is taken away and it attempts to defend. The attacker carries on with the attack minus the support.

    Any nation can support any other nation. Support can not be refused, but it does not force the supported unit to do anything.

    Naval Movement
    Moving armies is pretty simple. They can move into any bordering territory or be convoyed across a body of water. However, there are a bunch of special scenarios that apply to navies.

    A navy can either be on a body of water or in a coastal country. If it is in a coastal country it covers the entire coast line. However, there are some special cases where they only cover part of the coast.

    For example, look at Spain on the map. As you can see, it has a North coast and a South coast. A unit that entered on the North coast can't, then, leave by the South coast. However, the unit is still considered to defend the entire country, even if attacked by a navy from the South.

    If a navy is on a coast, it can move to any other coastal country it borders. A navy can support land units and vice versa, but land units (obviously) can't help with a battle in open water and naval units can't help with an inland country.

    Sweden and Denmark are considered bordering coastal countries. You can move navies directly from one to the other other you can pass between them.

    Adding and removing units
    A country is allowed to have as many units as it has major cities. That is why all the countries start with 3 units (except for Russia which has 4). At the end of every Fall turn the number of cities each nation has is counted. If it has more units than it does cities then enough will need to be disbanded to make the numbers even.

    You are allowed to choose which units to disband. If you have more cities than units then are allowed to place new units on any of your unoccupied 3 (or 4 if you're Russia) starting cities. You are allowed to choose which of the two types of units you wish to create if you are placing them in a coastal area. If all your starting cities are occupied you will have to wait until the end of next Fall to place new units.

    If a country has taken some or all of your starting cities they can not be used to produce new units. In the scenario that all of your starting cities are taken you will have to work with the units you have left. If you retake the starting cities they are treated like they normally would be.

    For a full set of rules, see: http://www.diplomacy-archive.com/diplomacy_rules.htm

    bgg / steam / goodreads / Origin: Bygasto /Bnet: Bygasto#2537 /iOS Game Center: Bygasto Amazon wishlist
  • AssuranAssuran Is swinging on the Spiral Registered User regular
    http://www.wizards.com/avalonhill/rules/diplomacy.pdf

    That's a link to the rulebook; it's a free pdf. It's also a lot better than what I can do, especially since most of the stuff has diagrams beside it so you can follow what they're talking about.



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