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Community: Season 4 Premiere February 7, Old Timeslot

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  • CambiataCambiata Social Justice Vanguard of Your Destruction Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    Spoit wrote:
    Didn't he get a recurring role on some other show? The name of which is on the tip of my tongue?

    Ha, while being reminded of that did make me smile, I don't think that reminding people of that particular connection would have been a good joke - that actually would have been one that took me out of the show for a second, so I'm glad they didn't make any reference to it. That would have been a cheap joke, and I'm glad they avoided it.

    Cambiata on
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  • PantsBPantsB Registered User regular
    Abed and Shirley made a guest appearance on Chuck today.

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    Spoiler:
  • VariableVariable Ted Hitler Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    useless4 wrote: »
    Wow I can't believe how many people's top ten slots Remedial Chaos Theory hits on.
    Not the biggest fan of that episode though it was good. But remember I am going to defend Mixology Certification til the end of time as some of the finest half hours of television comedy or drama ever.

    I would probably rank both of those among the best

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  • VariableVariable Ted Hitler Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited December 2011
    Cambiata wrote:
    So, apparently some people hated the glee episode? I thought it was one of the more hilarious and spot-on episodes, close to the D&D episode for awesomeness. It may be a thing where you have to have watched a few episodes of the TV show Glee to get how perfect this episode was, I'm not sure.

    Also Britta is amazing. I used to hate her, but the more inept she becomes, the more lovable she is.

    When they did the D&D episode, they said that one of their goals was that they didn't want to make cheap jokes at people who play the game, because that's an easy laugh and it's been done before. I didn't like this episode for the same reason I don't like "Scary Movie." I get what they're trying to do. I just don't see the point. For instance, mocking Glee Club in "Modern Warfare" was funny. But in this episode, the mockery was very, very superficial level. What exactly was the joke, other than "Glee is stupid"?

    The other problem is that Community shines when they take something really petty and inconsequential and elevate it. For instance, a lunch time snack becomes a mafia movie. Priority registration becomes a John Woo film. A missing pen causes a total group breakdown. etc.

    This episode went the opposite direction. The characters learn that they've been celebrating with a mass murderer. They learn that there's a good chance that they themselves would have been murdered if Britta didn't ruin the show. And then rather than processing "Holy shit, I can't believe how close we came to being murdered," they quickly change the subject and add a weak Aesop. The murderer gets away, and there's no followup.

    they didn't elevate a christmas show in this episode? or draw a lot of out the concept of getting people to join glee club?

    also it's not a superficial parody, it was excellent. I'm realizing you probably just didn't get a lot of the jokes that were going on.


    edit - your bit about it being personal is really meaningless

    and the execution remains not-sloppy. you might as well say none of them had a reason to change.

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  • PodlyPodly good moleman to youRegistered User regular
    mixology certification is my least favorite

    ughhh it was community at its preachy worst

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  • VariableVariable Ted Hitler Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    that's troy's birthday right?

    I should actually rewatch it. I've been going through the commentaries since I got s2 last week but I haven't actually seen these episodes in ages

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  • SchrodingerSchrodinger Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    Variable wrote:
    they didn't elevate a christmas show in this episode? or draw a lot of out the concept of getting people to join glee club?

    also it's not a superficial parody, it was excellent. I'm realizing you probably just didn't get a lot of the jokes that were going on.

    Really dude? Wow. Yes, everyone who doesn't laugh at the same jokes that you laugh at must be too stupid to get them. That's the only possible explanation.
    edit - your bit about it being personal is really meaningless

    Let's say you're in a bar and you make friends with a veteran. Then one day he gleefully talks about the women he raped and killed in Vietnam. You would probably back away from him and feel terrified afterwards. You would probably avoid him from that point forward. The man is clearly a monster, but he's not a direct threat to you or anyone you've known. And there's nothing you can do about making him get punished for his past actions. So your only option is to stay away, which is what the characters did.

    Now, let's say that you join a club, and you start worshipping the guy in charge. And then you found out that the previous team for not being good enough. And then he threatens to murder you. And then he runs away. You're not going to feel concerned over the fact that the guy murdered people in your exact same situation?

    And in the war criminal episode, Abed/Troy/Britta were horrified. The only acknowledgement we get from Jeff is, "Wow, did he say he killed the old team?" (Change subject).

    Schrodinger on
  • VariableVariable Ted Hitler Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited December 2011
    if you think it was a poorly done parody there are jokes you missed. that wasn't a knock at you and not because you didn't think they were funny. multiple people here have said that.

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  • CambiataCambiata Social Justice Vanguard of Your Destruction Registered User regular
    Variable wrote:
    they didn't elevate a christmas show in this episode? or draw a lot of out the concept of getting people to join glee club?

    also it's not a superficial parody, it was excellent. I'm realizing you probably just didn't get a lot of the jokes that were going on.

    Really dude? Wow. Yes, everyone who doesn't laugh at the same jokes that you laugh at must be too stupid to get them. That's the only possible explanation.

    Honestly, I don't think that was a dig at your intelligence. He was just pointing out that the parody is more nuanced to people who are actual fans of Glee. I agree with him. It's like watching the episode Critical Film Studies without ever having seen Pulp Fiction or My Dinner with Andre. You're going to get the jokes that don't rely on knowledge of those films, but you're going to miss the more subtle stuff. It has nothing to do with your intelligence.

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  • VariableVariable Ted Hitler Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited December 2011
    it was the end of the episode. you would rather a serious discussion over how to track this guy down than a nice wrap up where everyone makes abed happy?

    "no no no no no no no no no. this show is supposed to be gleeful and bright and fun and you can let me do that or there can be another bus crash!"

    seriously, that's the threat they are supposed to be cowering over instead of wrapping up the episode? after the guy runs away having admitted his guilt in front of a large group of people, any of whom would have called the cops?


    oh my god the audio at the end, they say regionals! how would the writers for the inspector space time special know about regionals! WHAT A BAD SHOW!

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  • CambiataCambiata Social Justice Vanguard of Your Destruction Registered User regular
    The only acknowledgement we get from Jeff is, "Wow, did he say he killed the old team?" (Change subject).

    Well, this would be one of the more vicious (and precision accurate) swipes at Glee. Maybe they shouldn't have 'gone there' for the sake of a joke, but they've gone to some pretty dark places for jokes before.

    -Tal wrote:
    If you don't develop Stockholm Syndrome, it's not a real RPG.
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  • AnteCantelopeAnteCantelope Registered User regular
    Variable wrote:
    they didn't elevate a christmas show in this episode? or draw a lot of out the concept of getting people to join glee club?

    also it's not a superficial parody, it was excellent. I'm realizing you probably just didn't get a lot of the jokes that were going on.

    Really dude? Wow. Yes, everyone who doesn't laugh at the same jokes that you laugh at must be too stupid to get them. That's the only possible explanation.
    edit - your bit about it being personal is really meaningless

    Let's say you're in a bar and you make friends with a veteran. Then one day he gleefully talks about the women he raped and killed in Vietnam. You would probably back away from him and feel terrified afterwards. You would probably avoid him from that point forward. The man is clearly a monster, but he's not a direct threat to you or anyone you've known. And there's nothing you can do about making him get punished for his past actions. So your only option is to stay away, which is what the characters did.

    Now, let's say that you join a club, and you start worshipping the guy in charge. And then you found out that the previous team for not being good enough. And then he threatens to murder you. And then he runs away. You're not going to feel concerned over the fact that the guy murdered people in your exact same situation?

    And in the war criminal episode, Abed/Troy/Britta were horrified. The only acknowledgement we get from Jeff is, "Wow, did he say he killed the old team?" (Change subject).

    You seem really devoted to this episode being bad. Since so many other people enjoyed it, it must have been doing something right. Did you expect an incredible send-off that would get hundreds of millions of viewers so the show would stay on?

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  • SchrodingerSchrodinger Registered User regular
    Variable wrote:
    it was the end of the episode. you would rather a serious discussion over how to track this guy down than a nice wrap up where everyone makes abed happy?

    Or they could, you know, not include that joke in the first place.

    i.e., the reason the writers didn't have Ned Ryerson shoot himself isn't because it was dark (NBC might have intervened for that reason, but not the writers). It's because it would be totally out of character for someone like Abed not to react to that. And because being responsible for another person's suicide would likely scar Abed for life. It would have been hilarious as a scene, but the implications would have been terrible. At the end of this episode, Abed makes a weak Aesop and then heads home. They don't just cut away, Abed leaves. Even though, among other things, he would be the most qualified to give the police details on what happened, how to track down the teacher, insights on the teacher's psychology, etc.

    The war criminal episode was dark, but the reactions were realistic. In this episode, the reactions weren't realistic.
    "no no no no no no no no no. this show is supposed to be gleeful and bright and fun and you can let me do that or there can be another bus crash!"

    seriously, that's the threat they are supposed to be cowering over instead of wrapping up the episode? after the guy runs away having admitted his guilt in front of a large group of people, any of whom would have called the cops?

    The guy murdered an entire team of students because he wasn't happy with their performance. And the team allowed themselves to be brainwashed by him. Yes, that's pretty terrifying when you consider the implications.

    Abed cares so little that he decides to go home.

  • jakobaggerjakobagger KøbenhavnRegistered User regular
    The important thing in this episode was Annie holding hands with Abed at the end, and Britta choosing to sit on the arm rest of Troy's chair. Overanalyzing? No u.

    Overall I enjoyed the episode, but a little less than usual I think. I'm not really into musicals in general or Glee specifically, so I guess there were some jokes I didn't get. "Booby doopy doop sex" was hilarious though. Italics!

  • Joe DizzyJoe Dizzy Registered User regular
    Having been this person before, it seems to me that every episode that features some darker joke or theme will have somebody go "no, that's too far... they really messed things up this time". That's kind of fascinating.

    ...in accordance to the ancient prophecies.

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  • SchrodingerSchrodinger Registered User regular
    You seem really devoted to this episode being bad. Since so many other people enjoyed it, it must have been doing something right. Did you expect an incredible send-off that would get hundreds of millions of viewers so the show would stay on?

    Some people really loved it. Others really didn't.

    One of my friends who was a huge fan of the series posted on my wall, "I shall openly say that I no longer have faith in 'Community.'"

    They don't need a huge send up. But what they needed was an episode that reflected the best of what this series has to offer, and if the episode turns off a lot of loyal fans for failing to do the things that Community typically does right, then that's not a good spot to be in. Especially since first time viewers who watch this episode may not have an accurate expectation of the rest of the series.

  • Premier kakosPremier kakos Registered User, ClubPA regular
    The guy murdered an entire team of students because he wasn't happy with their performance. And the team allowed themselves to be brainwashed by him. Yes, that's pretty terrifying when you consider the implications.

    Abed cares so little that he decides to go home.

    Wow. When you consider the implications? Do you hate Wile E. Coyote cartoons because you have to stop and consider the implications of a sentient coyote trying to constantly kill a bird that can run faster than the speed of sound who seemingly can order any Rube Goldbergian contraption out of a catalog for a company whose sole purpose for existence is helping this sentient coyote kill this freakishly fast bird?

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  • Inter_dInter_d Registered User regular
    I loved the episode, I love the body snatchers theme and how easily everyone is manipulated through song.

    I still wish we could have heard the songs they used to turn Annie and Britta.

  • SchrodingerSchrodinger Registered User regular
    Joe Dizzy wrote:
    Having been this person before, it seems to me that every episode that features some darker joke or theme will have somebody go "no, that's too far... they really messed things up this time". That's kind of fascinating.

    The problem isn't being dark, though. It's the characters not behaving realistically.

    30 Rock could get away this this type of joke really easily, because all the characters on that show are caricatures. But then, 30 Rock is a show where they've been toying with the premise that Kenneth is secretly immortal.

    Remember in Chaos Theory, when the buzzer rings and Annie freaks out, because she had to apply a tourniquet on someone who was stabbed? Remember how we discover she bought a gun just to defend herself? That's Annie response to that particular situation. It makes her more human. But in this episode, she's told that the guy who convinced her to whore herself out to Jeff is a mass murderer who would have killed her if she didn't perform well enough, and...

  • AntimatterAntimatter Registered User regular
    Joe Dizzy wrote:
    Having been this person before, it seems to me that every episode that features some darker joke or theme will have somebody go "no, that's too far... they really messed things up this time". That's kind of fascinating.

    The problem isn't being dark, though. It's the characters not behaving realistically.

    this is a show where a character dressed up like Batman to take back a DVD from his landlord. your argument is invalid.

  • ReynoldsReynolds Actually a Magical Princess France, ApparentlyRegistered User regular
    I tried to watch the Star Wars Holiday Special once. Bad idea.

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  • SpoitSpoit *twitch twitch* Registered User regular
    Cambiata wrote:
    The only acknowledgement we get from Jeff is, "Wow, did he say he killed the old team?" (Change subject).

    Well, this would be one of the more vicious (and precision accurate) swipes at Glee. Maybe they shouldn't have 'gone there' for the sake of a joke, but they've gone to some pretty dark places for jokes before.
    Speaking of, is anyone else annoyed by how much they constantly try to hang a lantern on this (and to a greater extent, the whole "britta is the worst" thing)? Seriously, they're almost at Kingdom Hearts levels of meaningless mentions of darkness.

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  • Joe DizzyJoe Dizzy Registered User regular
    Joe Dizzy wrote:
    Having been this person before, it seems to me that every episode that features some darker joke or theme will have somebody go "no, that's too far... they really messed things up this time". That's kind of fascinating.

    The problem isn't being dark, though. It's the characters not behaving realistically.

    I think the point is "breaking the tone". Either because an otherwise non-cynical show suddenly goes very dark or because an otherwise plausible show dips its toe into absurdity that does not have the repercussions that one expected.

    Community seems to be a show that occasionally moves beyond its regular rules and tropes for a surprise gag, without any of those things (and their repercussions) being fully explored. That's how the show rolls. It's not so far out there as 30 Rock (from what I've seen of it), but every once in a while you get something that should be a big deal, but that turns out not to be. It's most obvious with the dark moments and undercurrents that occasionally show up, when dealing with the character's neurosis or mental hang-ups.

    ...in accordance to the ancient prophecies.

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  • DemiurgeDemiurge Registered User regular
    The Glee Club special was fucking amazing, you people who don't like it are weird.

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  • ToldoToldo But actually, WeegianRegistered User regular
    Modern Warfare--the scene where Jeff wakes up in his car and the camera zooms out to reveal a paint-splattered wasteland.

    I laughed so. Hard.

  • JohnOrangePeelJohnOrangePeel Registered User
    Yet another brilliant episode, making its suspension all the more aggravating. Glad they gave this bullshit glee culture the kicking it so thoroughly deserves.

  • useless4useless4 Registered User regular
    Podly wrote:
    mixology certification is my least favorite

    ughhh it was community at its preachy worst

    Everything after they leave the bar though is pitch perfect.
    It's an amazingly accurate portrayal of friends who continue to nonchalantly hook up. It really captures being the third wheel. It captures not knowing what your friend's life is like when they aren't with you -especially if they haven't let you in all the way.

    It was a 90s coming of age movie ending that out does every single attempt to do it in the 90s coming of age genre .

  • Robos A Go GoRobos A Go Go Registered User regular
  • NappuccinoNappuccino Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    What message did Mixology preach?

    Angry/confused/sad people who drink alcohol have bad experiences with alcohol?

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  • RhalloTonnyRhalloTonny Of the BrownlandsRegistered User regular
    Nappuccino wrote:
    What message did Mixology preach?

    Angry/confused/sad people who drink alcohol have bad experiences with alcohol?

    Expectations can set you up to be disappointed and alcohol just amplifies people's personality traits?

    !
  • CambiataCambiata Social Justice Vanguard of Your Destruction Registered User regular
    Rewatching the episode. Annie's bit is great, but I think my favorite song is Shirley's. The "secularism is out to get us" song is flippin' awesome, but on top of that Shirley's reactions to it are gold. "That's what they do, that's what they do!" makes me laugh every time. And then when she can stand it no longer and finally busts out singing, she has a really stellar voice. Maybe the best voice in the cast.

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  • RhalloTonnyRhalloTonny Of the BrownlandsRegistered User regular
    Cambiata wrote:
    Rewatching the episode. Annie's bit is great, but I think my favorite song is Shirley's. The "secularism is out to get us" song is flippin' awesome, but on top of that Shirley's reactions to it are gold. "That's what they do, that's what they do!" makes me laugh every time. And then when she can stand it no longer and finally busts out singing, she has a really stellar voice. Maybe the best voice in the cast.

    The setup for her to be infected/her reactions were perfect.

    !
  • CambiataCambiata Social Justice Vanguard of Your Destruction Registered User regular
    Is Abed eating noodles with knitting needles?

    Also, I've only noticed over the past 3 episodes or so, but Abed is showing a much broader range of emotion than he had been in the past. He never used to smile before, for example, and during this episode he smiled several times. Maybe the emotionally unavailable unicorn is no longer so emotionally unavailable?

    -Tal wrote:
    If you don't develop Stockholm Syndrome, it's not a real RPG.
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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Cambiata wrote:
    Rewatching the episode. Annie's bit is great, but I think my favorite song is Shirley's. The "secularism is out to get us" song is flippin' awesome, but on top of that Shirley's reactions to it are gold. "That's what they do, that's what they do!" makes me laugh every time. And then when she can stand it no longer and finally busts out singing, she has a really stellar voice. Maybe the best voice in the cast.

    As someone who wasn't a huge fan of the episode, Shirley's bit was the best.

    Lose: to suffer defeat, to misplace (Ex: "I hope I don't lose the match." "Did you lose your phone again?")
    Loose: about to slip, to release (Ex: "That knot is loose." "Loose arrows.")
  • ThatOneYoYoGuyThatOneYoYoGuy Registered User regular
    What message did Mixology preach?
    Alcohol is the Lifetime Channel of beverages.

  • JimothyJimothy Not in front of the fox he's with the owlRegistered User regular
    What message did Mixology preach?
    Alcohol is the Lifetime Channel of beverages.

    And your parents are just as dumb as you are.

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  • bloodatonementbloodatonement Registered User regular
    I just rewatched, it seems like Britta has a pretty good voice in the apartment. At the pageant I was hoping she would do some preachy Bandaid "Do They Know it's Christmas" style song.

    Only thing I didn't like about this episode was the Glee teacher. I just don't like that actor. At all.

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  • SchrodingerSchrodinger Registered User regular
    Antimatter wrote:
    Joe Dizzy wrote:
    Having been this person before, it seems to me that every episode that features some darker joke or theme will have somebody go "no, that's too far... they really messed things up this time". That's kind of fascinating.

    The problem isn't being dark, though. It's the characters not behaving realistically.

    this is a show where a character dressed up like Batman to take back a DVD from his landlord. your argument is invalid.

    Except that's a perfectly reasonable reaction from someone like Abed, who once had a mental breakdown and saw everyone in Claymation after his mom decided not to see him on Christmas. It would have only been unrealistic if Abed started displaying superhuman abilities to go with it.

  • VariableVariable Ted Hitler Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited December 2011
    it's realistic within an episode where people are being brainwashed to join a glee club. (edit - I'm sorry, but you can't tell me that some of the motivations in the chicken finger episode are 'realistic', except within the world of that episode. various episodes of this show create their own mini realities/storylines (which is something said in a commentary as well, I believe the My Dinner With Andre episode) so to continually reference how other eps have operated to show us how bad this one was is silly.)


    they didn't say 'fine let him go who cares'... they cut out the ENTIRELY UNNECCESSARY TO EVERYONE BUT YOU part of them starting up a manhunt and interviewing the main characters. what a fucking stupid waste of time that would have been.

    sort of like the time you're wasting trying to prove that this episode was bad and has doomed the show even as it receives praise from a majority of the posters here.

    Variable on
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  • SchrodingerSchrodinger Registered User regular
    Variable wrote:
    it's realistic within an episode where people are being brainwashed to join a glee club.

    Bad writing is realistic in the context of bad writing.
    because they didn't say 'fine let him go who cares'... they cut out the ENTIRELY UNNECCESSARY TO EVERYONE BUT YOU part of them starting up a manhunt and interviewing the main characters. what a fucking stupid waste of time that would have been.

    They didn't simply cut the manhunt scene out, they showed the characters completely not caring.
    sort of like the time you're wasting trying to prove that this episode was bad and has doomed the show even as it receives praise from a majority of the posters here.

    Confirmation biases are awesome and totally representative of what everyone else thinks! I'm not the only person complaining about this episode on this board. Several other very loyal fans have also spoken up and said that they didn't care for this episode. So yeah, while a lot of people thought this episode was awesome, you also had a lot of people who really didn't like it. This episode has a lot more negative feedback compared to other episodes, which usually have no negative feedback at all. And keep in mind that people who love the show and want it to continue are much more likely to post something positive than rock the boat with something negative.

    If you have some people shouting "OMG, best episode ever!" and some people saying, "Wow, that was very sloppy and not well made," then what that says is that the episode is going for something that is very, very different from what Community fans are accustomed to. Some fans may really enjoy that thing that's different, and other fans might really hate it. But both sides agree it's different.

    The problem is that the thing that is different doesn't reflect what the show typically delivers. Which means that a lot of new viewers might watch the episode and think, "Hey, that's awesome," but then they won't like standard episodes of Community. And other new viewers might watch and think, "Wow, that's not very good" and stay away.

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