[MISC] PAX Forum . . . fez?

Khadour

So, I was watching the twitter interplay between some webcomic folks today, and they linked to <removed at their request>

My initial response was "Awesome! I've been wanting to get a fez, just on general principles - but none of the designs on their site really appeal to me . . ." But then I noticed the <removed at their request> linky. Hmmm . . . if I could put anything in the world on a fez, what would it be?

About the only thing that really appealed to me was the PAX forum logo from the forum badges. Or maybe the arcade cabinet graphic from the back of this year's challenge coin. Then I noticed the requirement for at least 13 of them. Then I noticed that, as a fine piece of custom fezzery, they were spendy. Then I thought, well, I might as well toss it out there and see if anyone else is interested in something like this . . .

Well? Anyone interested? Or is it yet another case of "No, Khadour - just you"?

zerzhul

Fezzes are cool. Sounds kinda expensive... even though it might be fun to put the pax forums logo on one.

gigabrain

I'd be interested...depending on cost of course

Trandescent

Oh god yes. Let me know how much it would be.

MrArcys

According to the website, it would be at least $65.

I should be able to spare that money after the holidays are over.

Khadour

Yeah, it looks like at least $65/each (as I said, spendy), and a few months lead time on production. I'm glad to see that there's at least some interest in this (No, not just you, Khadour) - if we can pull together 13, I'd be all for it. Anyone have a preference on design?

The_Doctor1

I would definitely join in on this one...

Trandescent

Once a design is agreed on, i'll break out my wallet.

Khadour

I've pinged them for a cost estimate, based on the PAX forum community crest (as seen on the front of the forum badges). I'll let you nice folks know what they get back to me with . . .

Khadour

Just got this back from them:

Sorry, but the design is a tad pedestrian for us and it really didn't excite Jason. That, and the fact that I doubt the 'community' holds the copyrights on the inner panel images. Now, if you can get letters of authorization from each of the respective corporations, then it might be a project.

But thanks for writing, and have a fun weekend.

So, looks like that design is a non-starter with them. Sigh. Perhaps my fez dreams are doomed to languish in eternal limbo . . .

zerzhul

Heh. Elitist silly geese. Doesnt think anyone could have come up with that. They dont deserve our $

Khadour

Yeah, the tone struck me as a bit condescending as well. Not a fan.

peetsnack

wtf? how is it 'pedestrian' and what do they mean by the 'inner panel images'? also, i very much agree that whomever answered your email was very dismissive. seriously. wtf?

Khadour

If I had to guess, I'd say they're talking about the Pokeball and such that show up on the quarter panels of the forum badge. I'll take a look around when I get a few minutes and see if I can find another fez maker - one who is willing to work with us regarding the image, rather than just dismissing us out of hand . . .

kropotkin

Khadour wrote:

Just got this back from them:

Sorry, but the design is a tad pedestrian for us and it really didn't excite Jason. That, and the fact that I doubt the 'community' holds the copyrights on the inner panel images. Now, if you can get letters of authorization from each of the respective corporations, then it might be a project.

But thanks for writing, and have a fun weekend.

So, looks like that design is a non-starter with them. Sigh. Perhaps my fez dreams are doomed to languish in eternal limbo . . .

Wow, just WOW. Where did they get their customer facing training done? No doubt it was given by Paul Christoforo of Ocean Marketing fame! Why would you spit on a customer like that? Especially when you were making an enquiry that would lead them to make some significant sales! Is there some kind of malady out there that forces people who sell things to act like elitist jerks?

zerzhul

Khadour wrote:

If I had to guess, I'd say they're talking about the Pokeball and such that show up on the quarter panels of the forum badge. I'll take a look around when I get a few minutes and see if I can find another fez maker - one who is willing to work with us regarding the image, rather than just dismissing us out of hand . . .

Yeah, the pokeball would be the only thing that might be iffy, but that's not "all the panel images" either.

Khadour

Good - I'm glad it wasn't just me that had the "Wow - what a silly goose!" reaction to that.

karmacappa

If I recall, Scott Kurtz used Village Hat Shop to produce his PVP fezzes.

SmallLady

I was going to purchase a cthulhu fez from them, but after such a snotty response, I think not.

Exodus1

Actually, no we are not, "just in this for the money." This is more of a creative expression for us, the money is simply involved to allow us to continue expressing ourselves. If we find the concept too pedestrian or personally disagreeable we will likely reject it. We respect others' creativity and enjoy collaborating on designs, but if the concept doesn't inspire us - we most likely won't enjoy the process... we have better ways of making money. (Joe's note: see DisasterSupplyCatalog.com be prepared!)

Wow, straight from their FAQ page, they have better ways of making money, than selling fezs on their fez website, lol. The funniest part? Their best sellers are "Police Call Box" and "Cthulu", gosh, they are so on the edge of originality, lol.

I hope you can find another supplier.

kropotkin

Exodus1 wrote:

We respect others' creativity and enjoy collaborating on designs, but if the concept doesn't inspire us - we most likely won't enjoy the process... we have better ways of making money. (Joe's note: see DisasterSupplyCatalog.com be prepared!)

Wow, straight from their FAQ page, they have better ways of making money, than selling fezs on their fez website, lol. The funniest part? Their best sellers are "Police Call Box" and "Cthulu", gosh, they are so on the edge of originality, lol.

I hope you can find another supplier.

As do I. This kind of elitist guff makes my blood boil.

LexiconGrrl

I have a real Shriner's Fez that I'll be bringing to East. It makes me look like I should be riding a tiny tricycle behind a dancing bear. Don't mock me! It's still a Fez!

klokateer9047

Exodus1 wrote:

Actually, no we are not, "just in this for the money." This is more of a creative expression for us, the money is simply involved to allow us to continue expressing ourselves. If we find the concept too pedestrian or personally disagreeable we will likely reject it. We respect others' creativity and enjoy collaborating on designs, but if the concept doesn't inspire us - we most likely won't enjoy the process... we have better ways of making money. (Joe's note: see DisasterSupplyCatalog.com be prepared!)

Wow, straight from their FAQ page, they have better ways of making money, than selling fezs on their fez website, lol. The funniest part? Their best sellers are "Police Call Box" and "Cthulu", gosh, they are so on the edge of originality, lol.

I hope you can find another supplier.

Can somebody say " Pompous ass"?

General Pengwin

klokateer9047 wrote:

Exodus1 wrote:

Actually, no we are not, "just in this for the money." This is more of a creative expression for us, the money is simply involved to allow us to continue expressing ourselves. If we find the concept too pedestrian or personally disagreeable we will likely reject it. We respect others' creativity and enjoy collaborating on designs, but if the concept doesn't inspire us - we most likely won't enjoy the process... we have better ways of making money. (Joe's note: see DisasterSupplyCatalog.com be prepared!)

Wow, straight from their FAQ page, they have better ways of making money, than selling fezs on their fez website, lol. The funniest part? Their best sellers are "Police Call Box" and "Cthulu", gosh, they are so on the edge of originality, lol.

I hope you can find another supplier.

Can somebody say " Pompous ass"?

Pompous ass. There.

I can't believe that somebody would be so condescending about something you have to pay to receive. A simple: due to time and fear of possible copyright restraints we cannot fulfill this order, would have sufficed. I suppose one has to be a part of the community to understand how grand it is, but even so. Being disrespectful in any professional setting, albeit for monetary gain or not, is simply not okay.

Mint

now its not a custom fez... but what about someone organizing buying a bulk of maroon fezzes with the nice black or gold yellow tassel

then finding a company to make the patches of the forum badge and combine the two for something awesome??

General Pengwin

Mint wrote:

now its not a custom fez... but what about someone organizing buying a bulk of maroon fezzes with the nice black or gold yellow tassel

then finding a company to make the patches of the forum badge and combine the two for something awesome??

I was looking into getting patches made already, so I wouldn't even be mad.

But buying fezzes from them at all at this point?

Mint

amazon has some nice ones

Khadour

There are plenty of places to get a basic fez that are not populated with silly geese. The only problem then becomes . . . who do we talk into performing mass merges of the badges and fezzes to make awesome?

Mint

If they give/sell patches at the merch booth then maybe we should just plan a meet up....

bring your fez and patch and a couple of people bring some glue guns and we can go to town....
( you can always get it professionally sown on later)

LexiconGrrl

I have to say that I'm totally proud of Gabe for taking on this kind of vendor douchebaggery, and although I know that the PA guys can't e expected to publicly pick up every gauntlet that gets thrown down, I do hope that Scott and Kris are reading this.

(ref: http://penny-arcade.com/2011/12/26/just-wow1)

SmallLady

LexiconGrrl wrote:

I have to say that I'm totally proud of Gabe for taking on this kind of vendor douchebaggery, and although I know that the PA guys can't e expected to publicly pick up every gauntlet that gets thrown down, I do hope that Scott and Kris are reading this.

(ref: http://penny-arcade.com/2011/12/26/just-wow1)

Gabe & Tycho do not read the forums. It's likely that neither do Scott & Kris. Sorry.

zerzhul

I also wouldn't place this in the same category as the Ocean Marketing thing.

LexiconGrrl

SmallLady wrote:

LexiconGrrl wrote:

I have to say that I'm totally proud of Gabe for taking on this kind of vendor douchebaggery, and although I know that the PA guys can't e expected to publicly pick up every gauntlet that gets thrown down, I do hope that Scott and Kris are reading this.

(ref: http://penny-arcade.com/2011/12/26/just-wow1)

Gabe & Tycho do not read the forums. It's likely that neither do Scott & Kris. Sorry.

To clarify, I didn't mean literally, of course. The whole situation is just eerily similar to the Avenger Controller one, what with pompous vendors who're too sexy for their lowly consumer base. I think that Gabe gave people hope with his reaction, and seeing this situation occur so soon after that one just underscores the similarity, is all I'm saying.

klokateer9047

Okay guys. Bare with me here. How about we make capes? We can patch the PAX community crest on it and look bitchin' as all hell! I was planning on doing the same myself anyway and would be ecstatic if more peeps wanted to join!

Fez-o-Joe

Khadour wrote:

Just got this back from them:

Sorry, but the design is a tad pedestrian for us...

... As do I. This kind of elitist guff makes my blood boil.

... The whole situation is just eerily similar to the Avenger Controller one, what with pompous vendors who're too sexy for their lowly consumer base. I think that Gabe gave people hope with his reaction, and seeing this situation occur so soon after that one just underscores the similarity, is all I'm saying.

OK - enough of the flames, I think I need to toss in my 25 cents.

This is the image that he sent: http://www.btinternet.com/~c.oregan/PAX_East/PAXEast_2012_Front_v1.jpg and personally I'm appalled that someone would even suggest using copyrighted material that they didn't get permission on. Any of you old enough to know, or get a 'cease and desist' letter - want one?!? Making a patch for a hat for yourself is fan based and most corporations won't come after you for it - selling them on-line is whole different matter.

We get on average per week about 10 requests for custom fezzes - blank fezzes, band logos, sport team logos, etc. - so yes, a "due to time and fear of possible copyright restraints we cannot fulfill this order" would have been a tad more tactful (thanks, I'll use it from now on... oh wait - did you copyright it?!?) but then did any of you besides Khadour happen to read from the website,
"All custom orders would require a minimum order as well as actual ownership of the artwork. We can not, and will not reproduce copyrighted artwork without written permission of the Copyright owner. We value the creative endeavors of others and would not, and do not want to exploit their work. " ??? That's been on the site since its inception many, many moons ago... but I gather you just pulled what you wanted to flame us on.

As far as being 'elitist geese' - these fezzes are literally hand-made by two people who yes, have day jobs and have been doing this for the fun. Because we have fun with what we do, we don't put out a product that sucks, and that makes us elitist?!? If we were that pompous, we'd have sent these over to China and made an extremely cheap product, however; we are constantly looking to improve it - (http://fez-o-rama.com/blog/?p=1418) And besides, we have elitist llama's, not geese.

Aso aso wik, have you met an artist that isn't a pompous ass at one time or another?!? I work with one almost every weekend, and he admits he's an ass sometimes. (and then we move on...) The other side of all this is if you (empirically) of all people can't read sarcasm in text - then its lost on the lot of you.

For the record, our biggest seller is/was the 'Drunk Monkey' - and we retired that design years ago... Second place, that would be the Sons of the Desert - so, I don't know where you got your stats from kropotkin, as I've got the server, and multiple years reports at my fingertips. (besides being the one who ships the fezzes...) Now the Cthuhlu is making a good showing and it was quite popular when were an exhibtor at the HP Lovecraft film festival. (wow - topical placement) And one last *poke* - each of the designs on the site are truly original - even the Mignola fez was Jason's design approved by Mike.

So, to wrap all this up - there's a fez maker out in Florida, D.Turin I believe, and they'll be happy to make felt fezzes for almost anyone, at about $200 and up. Yes, the Village Hat Shoppe also sells them about $7 - made out of felt - and they'll fall apart before the next Con.

But consider a task for this board when you're done ripping me to shreds - come up with an original design that embodies your idea, in a 4" x 4" area, 100 dpi, 6 colors max, and zap it over to us... we'll take a serious look. (Khadour knows the email address)

Have fun.

- Joe

zerzhul

Fez-o-Joe wrote:

Any of you old enough to know

Yes, insulting age is a good way to get business I hear

Fez-o-Joe wrote:

All custom orders would require a minimum order as well as actual ownership of the artwork.

welp, looks like he didn't send the main logo by itself, but the centerpiece of that image is... GASP an ORIGINAL DESIGN that is FOR USE by this forum.



I think that everyone here thought Khadour sent you the Forum Crest by itself, which is the community logo. An original design for open use by this community. Sounds like there was miscommunication on both ends. He sent you a poor representation of what he needed (like a silly goose), and you did exactly zero questioning of what he wanted (like a silly goose).

Fez-o-Joe wrote:

Aso aso wik, have you met an artist that isn't a pompous ass at one time or another?!? I work with one almost every weekend, and he admits he's an ass sometimes. (and then we move on...) The other side of all this is if you (empirically) of all people can't read sarcasm in text - then its lost on the lot of you.

The fact that you called it pedestrian, regardless of the rest and whether you really think it is or not, is insulting to a customer and probably isn't a good way to win business for your little operation.
If you want to insult people to keep people out since it's a two person business, it sounds like you're succeeding.

Fez-o-Joe wrote:

And one last *poke* - each of the designs on the site are truly original

Boy you sure do like to assume things without asking questions. I've heard that's good business practice.

Fez-o-Joe wrote:

But consider a task for this board when you're done ripping me to shreds - come up with an original design that embodies your idea, in a 4" x 4" area, 100 dpi, 6 colors max, and zap it over to us... we'll take a serious look. (Khadour knows the email address)

Yes, because after insulting the group here (which if you had come here and posted all nice things and that everything was a miscommunication you could have avoided) I'm certain that the group will go back to you with our ALREADY original design and ask you to look at it again... because we totally want to give you our money NOW....

Djiem

I wonder why they'd send you another original design after you shot down the first original design. Also, why would they want to give you money? You clearly don't deserve anyone's business.

SmallLady

Fez-o-Joe wrote:

Aso aso wik, have you met an artist that isn't a pompous ass at one time or another?!? I work with one almost every weekend, and he admits he's an ass sometimes. (and then we move on...) The other side of all this is if you (empirically) of all people can't read sarcasm in text - then its lost on the lot of you.


- Joe

Thank you for coming and giving us your side of the story so to speak.

However, being an "artist" doesn't give anybody the right act like a self entitled jerk. It doesn't seem like a good business plan to alienate potential customers via sarcasm, which is exceeding hard to detect without actual tone of voice.

Anyways, good luck on your business. I won't be patronizing your store, but I'm sure others will.

Cheers!

Tube

This is going nowhere