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Hot damn is Super Castlevania IV overrated

TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
edited December 2011 in Games and Technology
Let me preface this by saying that I didn't really grow up with the series, being a sega kid and all. I had Castlevania I for DOS, and liked it, but it was nowhere near my favorite game. Years later, after the series had already been changed into a metroid-vania, I picked up Bloodlines and played it, and thought it was pretty fun. Thats when I began noticing the hype surrounding two particular titles in the series: Rondo of Blood, and Castlevania IV. The more hardcore crowd seemed to claim Rondo of Blood was better, while virtually everyone else (read: those who didn't even know what a PC Engine was) claimed Super Castlevania IV was the best in the series.

About 10 years ago, I picked up Rondo of blood, after hearing for ages about how great it was. And goddamn did it blow me away. It took everything I liked about Castlevania I and Bloodlines and just amped it up to 11. One of the greatest games I've ever played.

But what of Castlevania IV? For one reason or another, I just never got around to picking it up. Over the years, as Rondo of Blood became less obscure, I'd see people who had played Castlevania IV before Rondo of Blood hold on to their claim that it was the best in the series, and that piqued my interest. This christmas, I finally got the game, and I can't express what a complete let down it is.

I'll stop short of saying it's outright a bad game - it's not. It's perfectly playable, and there is nothing technically wrong with it. At least it's not broken. But it is lifeless as hell. This looks, sounds, and feels absolutely nothing like castlevania. It feels more like a completely unrelated game which uses the castlevania theme. The graphics are ugly - I don't mean "oh man later SNES games are so much better" ugly, I mean "castlevania III had a much more appealing art style" ugly. In fact, in just about every aspect, the NES-only Castlevania III is a much better game. I repeatedly hear people praise the game for it's "8-direction" whip, but the game is such a cake walk anyways that it's useless. Speaking of difficulty, this game is the easiest castlevania I've ever played. I popped this game into my SNES, having never played it before in my life, and an hour and a half later, I had finished it, without ever getting a game over. On my first damn try. Admittedly the second half of the game, the part which appears to be a castlevania I remake, is a bit more difficult, but it never approaches the difficulty of Bloodlines, let alone Rondo or Castlevania III.

The most disappointing aspect has to be the music. Castlevania games have killer synth-driven soundtracks... this game sounds like bad midi impersonations of public domain "scary" music. It's all the most boring organ music I've ever heard - the main theme from Columns blows all this crap away. The signature theme remixes at the end are pretty alright, but perhaps I was spoiled by the wailing synth rock renditions that Rondo put out, because I'm of the opinion that those are light years better.

The level design is really, really poor. Again, ignoring how much better Rondo was with it's multiple paths through each level, this is the blandest level design in any castlevania game I've played. Enemies seem like they're just there, with no rhyme or reason. Platforms never present a challenge, and a large porition of the game feels like I'm just trudging slowly in 1 direction. Bloodlines had wicked stage layouts, Castlevania IV does not.

I can't believe people get down on their knees and blow this game, yet bitch up and down about Sonic 4's changes. For all the complaints people levy about that particular game, they apply just as much to this game - it makes no attempt to be like any of the other games in the series - aestheticly, audibly, or gameplay-wise. I can only conclude that the hype for this game is a combination of nintendo fanboyism, nostalgia, and group think. What a disappointment.

TheSonicRetard on
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Posts

  • ArteenArteen I'm gonna clean up this world yet! Stop polluting!Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    I declare this the new Castlevania thread.

    Order of Ecclesia is fantastic. You should check it out.

    Arteen on
    sig_ap_001_zps3e5ddaa1.png
  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    Arteen wrote:
    I declare this the new Castlevania thread.

    Order of Ecclesia is fantastic.

    I just can't compare the metroidvania castlevanias and the old-school ones. They're too different.

    To be sure, I goddamn LOVE symphony of the night, and several of the GBA and DS games had me hook line and sinker. But, depending on my mood, I'll declare one or the other style to be better than the other. And it changes day to day.

    I'll say that, of the classic series, Rondo is by far my favorite, with Castlevania III coming in at a close 2nd place. Of the metroidvania titles, SotN is easily my favorite, with Aria coming in 2nd.

    Right now? I'd say I like classic better than metroidvania, and that's usually my opinion on the matter, but ask me again immediately following a good SotN playthrough, and my answer will likely be different.

  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
  • DaveTheWaveDaveTheWave Registered User regular
    Castlevania IV has one of the best soundtracks of any game. I don't know why this thread exists.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    Castlevania IV has one of the best soundtracks of any game. I don't know why this thread exists.



    vs



    lmfao

  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    I mean, hell, even the NES version is better than that organ crap:

  • chocoboliciouschocobolicious Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    Castlevania IV was nice for what it tried with things like rotating backgrounds and such.

    As for best game?

    Order of Ecclesia, obviously. Stage design more akin to old school castlevania while still including a lot of the stuff that makes the newer ones more enjoyable. Hands down the best one around.

    Also, uh, you realize both the rondo and IV one use an organ, I mean.. yeah.

    So calling it 'organ crap' is kind of silly. Different kind of organs, but still.

    Also for a better direct comparison:

    chocobolicious on
  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    Castlevania IV was nice for what it tried with things like rotating backgrounds and such.

    I feel like that makes the game nothing more than just a tech demo. Sure, for a launch SNES title, it's all very impressive to watch, but it's not very impressive to actually play. The rotating stage, for example - I had heard it hyped for years and when I got to it, it was like "that's it?" Because, for all the graphical pizazz, you're just sitting there, not pressing a button, for a good 5 seconds until the effect is done. The tunnel background is probably the best effect in the game, and the roating chandeliers has to be the worst.

    However, I'd trade every single effect in this game for less slowdown. Rotating an entire stage is a neat trick... dipping into single-digit frame rates when water "beads" off simon... not so much...

  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    On the subject of old school castlevania - Castlevania Rebirth is probably the closest game to Bloodlines I've played. The entire game reminds me of Bloodlines, from the look, to the sound, to the feel. I definitely dig it.

  • -SPI--SPI- Registered User regular
    Castlevania IV has one of the best soundtracks of any game. I don't know why this thread exists.

    vs

    lmfao
    Counter argument



    8t2qhu8l050f.jpg
  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    -SPI- wrote:
    Castlevania IV has one of the best soundtracks of any game. I don't know why this thread exists.

    vs

    lmfao
    Counter argument



    Your counter argument is null and void when even the goddamn Sega Genesis shames it:


  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    And Richter's theme (Divine Bloodlines) is a billion times better than Simon's theme (in any game).

  • -SPI--SPI- Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    -SPI- wrote:
    Castlevania IV has one of the best soundtracks of any game. I don't know why this thread exists.

    vs

    lmfao
    Counter argument
    -greatness-

    Your counter argument is null and void when even the goddamn Sega Genesis shames it:

    -poop from a butt-

    You are insane if you think that version is better. It sounds like a cheap half assed midi version you'd download from a geocities webpage in the late 90s.

    -SPI- on
    8t2qhu8l050f.jpg
  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    -SPI- wrote:
    -SPI- wrote:
    Castlevania IV has one of the best soundtracks of any game. I don't know why this thread exists.

    vs

    lmfao
    Counter argument
    -greatness-

    Your counter argument is null and void when even the goddamn Sega Genesis shames it:

    -poop from a butt-

    You are insane if you think that version is better. It sounds like a cheap half assed midi version you'd download from a geocities webpage in the late 90s.

    The irony being that the SNES version is literally midi.

    Sorry you can't handle real bass.

  • -SPI--SPI- Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    More like real ass.

    Bloodlines had a lot of good points, mostly absurd gore and violence, but that version of that song is not one of them, neither was the whip guy being a pile of shit compared to spear dude.

    -SPI- on
    8t2qhu8l050f.jpg
  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    -SPI- wrote:
    More like real ass.

    So you can't handle a real ass?

    Alright then...

    TheSonicRetard on
  • chocoboliciouschocobolicious Registered User regular
    edited December 2011


    I'm sorry I cant hear you over the sound of how awesome this is.

    chocobolicious on
  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular

    Thanks for helping me prove my point

    How can Super Castlevania IV have one of the best soundtracks of any game, when it doesn't even have the best soundtrack of any castlevania?

  • chocoboliciouschocobolicious Registered User regular
    Well, Symphony of the Night surely had some of the best music. They went pretty all out on it in an attempt to reinvigorate the franchise, though.

  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    Perhaps the worst part of Castlevania IV, which I didn't even touch on, is how mind bogglingly stupid the enemy AI is. It's obviously a step down from Rondo, which could be expected (best exmplified by the knights, who will purposely stand 1 step behind the range of your whip in Rondo, while in C4 they'll just march back and forth without a care in the world), but what's really surprising is how it's even a step down from Castlevania III.

    I just tested this out - hold your whip out in front of you in castlevania 4 and stand in front of a skeleton and don't move an inch or press any other button- it'll walk into you over and over again until it dies. No enemy in Castlevania III is that stupid.

  • plufimplufim Dr Registered User regular
    TSR, have you not played Eccelessia? It really is fucking great.

    3DS 0302-0029-3193 NNID plufim steam plufim PSN plufim
    steam_sig.png
  • chocoboliciouschocobolicious Registered User regular
    My only response is: Whip? Shanoa never had a whip. So who cares what happens with whips.

  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    plufim wrote:
    TSR, have you not played Eccelessia? It really is fucking great.

    Nope, I have not. But from all the acclaim in this topic, I'll have to check it out.

    Er... well, maybe not, considering the acclaim C4 gets...

  • AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    Mode 7 bitches!

    PSN; AlbertBOMB
  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    Algertman wrote:
    Mode 7 bitches!

    Putting graphics over gameplay

    Mode 7 aint shit today, son

  • chocoboliciouschocobolicious Registered User regular
    plufim wrote:
    TSR, have you not played Eccelessia? It really is fucking great.

    Nope, I have not. But from all the acclaim in this topic, I'll have to check it out.

    Er... well, maybe not, considering the acclaim C4 gets...

    I don't particularly like C4, but I played them all when they were new, so to me it was a huge step forward. (Sorry, 3 was good, but compared to 4 its lacking in a lot of ways. Though them removing the whole swapping characters thing was incredibly sadface making.)

    Ecclesia is just boss though. Not the hardest game, but there is definitely some good challenge in there. Course, I also liked Portrait of Ruin so my opinion may be suspect.

  • plufimplufim Dr Registered User regular
    Well, I've only ever played the metroidvania ones, and Ecclessia was my fave.

    Also:

    Fucking great.

    3DS 0302-0029-3193 NNID plufim steam plufim PSN plufim
    steam_sig.png
  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    plufim wrote:
    TSR, have you not played Eccelessia? It really is fucking great.

    Nope, I have not. But from all the acclaim in this topic, I'll have to check it out.

    Er... well, maybe not, considering the acclaim C4 gets...

    I don't particularly like C4, but I played them all when they were new, so to me it was a huge step forward. (Sorry, 3 was good, but compared to 4 its lacking in a lot of ways. Though them removing the whole swapping characters thing was incredibly sadface making.)

    Ecclesia is just boss though. Not the hardest game, but there is definitely some good challenge in there. Course, I also liked Portrait of Ruin so my opinion may be suspect.

    Changing characters always felt like a gimmick to me, in both Rondo and C3. No no, the big feature that Rondo and C3 got right, that C4 completely lacked, was the branching paths.

  • chocoboliciouschocobolicious Registered User regular
    plufim wrote:
    TSR, have you not played Eccelessia? It really is fucking great.

    Nope, I have not. But from all the acclaim in this topic, I'll have to check it out.

    Er... well, maybe not, considering the acclaim C4 gets...

    I don't particularly like C4, but I played them all when they were new, so to me it was a huge step forward. (Sorry, 3 was good, but compared to 4 its lacking in a lot of ways. Though them removing the whole swapping characters thing was incredibly sadface making.)

    Ecclesia is just boss though. Not the hardest game, but there is definitely some good challenge in there. Course, I also liked Portrait of Ruin so my opinion may be suspect.

    Changing characters always felt like a gimmick to me, in both Rondo and C3. No no, the big feature that Rondo and C3 got right, that C4 completely lacked, was the branching paths.

    Except Maria was awesome and there will be fisticuffs with anyone who says otherwise.

    Dove all in your face, bitches.

  • AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    Algertman wrote:
    Mode 7 bitches!

    Putting graphics over gameplay

    Mode 7 aint shit today, son


    You just mad genesis couldn't do that shit. Sega was all like "BUY THIS CD ADD-ON! WHILE YOU'RE ADD IT BUY NIGHT TRAP!" Sonic CD had some Mode 7 knock off stuff but it sucked. Mode 7 was blowing kids minds while you was playing Marky Mark and the Funky Bunch: Make My Video.

    PSN; AlbertBOMB
  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    plufim wrote:
    TSR, have you not played Eccelessia? It really is fucking great.

    Nope, I have not. But from all the acclaim in this topic, I'll have to check it out.

    Er... well, maybe not, considering the acclaim C4 gets...

    I don't particularly like C4, but I played them all when they were new, so to me it was a huge step forward. (Sorry, 3 was good, but compared to 4 its lacking in a lot of ways. Though them removing the whole swapping characters thing was incredibly sadface making.)

    Ecclesia is just boss though. Not the hardest game, but there is definitely some good challenge in there. Course, I also liked Portrait of Ruin so my opinion may be suspect.

    Changing characters always felt like a gimmick to me, in both Rondo and C3. No no, the big feature that Rondo and C3 got right, that C4 completely lacked, was the branching paths.

    Except Maria was awesome and there will be fisticuffs with anyone who says otherwise.

    Dove all in your face, bitches.

    The only thing awesome about maria is her hidden move.

  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    Algertman wrote:
    Algertman wrote:
    Mode 7 bitches!

    Putting graphics over gameplay

    Mode 7 aint shit today, son


    You just mad genesis couldn't do that shit. Sega was all like "BUY THIS CD ADD-ON! WHILE YOU'RE ADD IT BUY NIGHT TRAP!" Sonic CD had some Mode 7 knock off stuff but it sucked. Mode 7 was blowing kids minds while you was playing Marky Mark and the Funky Bunch: Make My Video.

    You realize I'm not fighting for sega in this topic, right?? Sega's entry into Castlevania is inferior too, the PC Engine reigns supreme.

    And the Sega CD can do the exact same mode 7 stuff.

  • chocoboliciouschocobolicious Registered User regular
    Algertman wrote:
    Algertman wrote:
    Mode 7 bitches!

    Putting graphics over gameplay

    Mode 7 aint shit today, son


    You just mad genesis couldn't do that shit. Sega was all like "BUY THIS CD ADD-ON! WHILE YOU'RE ADD IT BUY NIGHT TRAP!" Sonic CD had some Mode 7 knock off stuff but it sucked. Mode 7 was blowing kids minds while you was playing Marky Mark and the Funky Bunch: Make My Video.

    What was that, son? I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome Lunar, Popful Mail, Shining Force and fucking SNATCHER are.

  • chocoboliciouschocobolicious Registered User regular
    See, me and TSR? We gonna box. Hatin on the Maria. He just doesn't know how to handle the power. Dragons and birds and tigers all up ins his Castlevania and he just can't hang.

  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    edited December 2011
    Algertman wrote:
    Algertman wrote:
    Mode 7 bitches!

    Putting graphics over gameplay

    Mode 7 aint shit today, son


    You just mad genesis couldn't do that shit. Sega was all like "BUY THIS CD ADD-ON! WHILE YOU'RE ADD IT BUY NIGHT TRAP!" Sonic CD had some Mode 7 knock off stuff but it sucked. Mode 7 was blowing kids minds while you was playing Marky Mark and the Funky Bunch: Make My Video.

    What was that, son? I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome Lunar, Popful Mail, Shining Force and fucking SNATCHER are.

    This isn't a topic about how GENESIS DOES

    it's a topic about how overrated Castlevania IV is, and how people hype it up for all the wrong reasons.

    Let him be, because he's being the perfect example. While he "Oooohs" and "aaaahs" at glorfied screen savers, PC Engine owners get to play the biggest, and best classicvania of them all.

    TheSonicRetard on
  • chocoboliciouschocobolicious Registered User regular
    Algertman wrote:
    Algertman wrote:
    Mode 7 bitches!

    Putting graphics over gameplay

    Mode 7 aint shit today, son


    You just mad genesis couldn't do that shit. Sega was all like "BUY THIS CD ADD-ON! WHILE YOU'RE ADD IT BUY NIGHT TRAP!" Sonic CD had some Mode 7 knock off stuff but it sucked. Mode 7 was blowing kids minds while you was playing Marky Mark and the Funky Bunch: Make My Video.

    What was that, son? I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome Lunar, Popful Mail, Shining Force and fucking SNATCHER are.

    This isn't a topic about how GENESIS DOES

    it's a topic about how overrated Castlevania IV is, and how people hype it up for all the wrong reasons.

    Let him be, because he's being the perfect example. While he "Oooohs" and "aaaahs" at glorfied screen savers, PC Engine owners get to play the biggest, and best classicvania of them all.

    I actually want to say that, no, PCE owners do not get to play the best Castlevania of them all.

  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    Algertman wrote:
    Algertman wrote:
    Mode 7 bitches!

    Putting graphics over gameplay

    Mode 7 aint shit today, son


    You just mad genesis couldn't do that shit. Sega was all like "BUY THIS CD ADD-ON! WHILE YOU'RE ADD IT BUY NIGHT TRAP!" Sonic CD had some Mode 7 knock off stuff but it sucked. Mode 7 was blowing kids minds while you was playing Marky Mark and the Funky Bunch: Make My Video.

    What was that, son? I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome Lunar, Popful Mail, Shining Force and fucking SNATCHER are.

    This isn't a topic about how GENESIS DOES

    it's a topic about how overrated Castlevania IV is, and how people hype it up for all the wrong reasons.

    Let him be, because he's being the perfect example. While he "Oooohs" and "aaaahs" at glorfied screen savers, PC Engine owners get to play the biggest, and best CLASSICVANIA of them all.

    I actually want to say that, no, PCE owners do not get to play the best Castlevania of them all.

  • chocoboliciouschocobolicious Registered User regular
    Yes, well, I reiterate. I prefer Dracula X Chronicles on the PSP. I much prefer the music in general, the upgrades to the visuals are also all very very well done. My only complaint about that game is the noises he makes while jumping and such but, whatever, nothing is perfect.

  • AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    Algertman wrote:
    Algertman wrote:
    Mode 7 bitches!

    Putting graphics over gameplay

    Mode 7 aint shit today, son


    You just mad genesis couldn't do that shit. Sega was all like "BUY THIS CD ADD-ON! WHILE YOU'RE ADD IT BUY NIGHT TRAP!" Sonic CD had some Mode 7 knock off stuff but it sucked. Mode 7 was blowing kids minds while you was playing Marky Mark and the Funky Bunch: Make My Video.

    What was that, son? I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome Lunar, Popful Mail, Shining Force and fucking SNATCHER are.

    Don't give me that. You owned Revengers of Vengeance and you loved it.

    PSN; AlbertBOMB
  • chocoboliciouschocobolicious Registered User regular
    Algertman wrote:
    Algertman wrote:
    Algertman wrote:
    Mode 7 bitches!

    Putting graphics over gameplay

    Mode 7 aint shit today, son


    You just mad genesis couldn't do that shit. Sega was all like "BUY THIS CD ADD-ON! WHILE YOU'RE ADD IT BUY NIGHT TRAP!" Sonic CD had some Mode 7 knock off stuff but it sucked. Mode 7 was blowing kids minds while you was playing Marky Mark and the Funky Bunch: Make My Video.

    What was that, son? I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome Lunar, Popful Mail, Shining Force and fucking SNATCHER are.

    Don't give me that. You owned Revengers of Vengeance and you loved it.

    No, but I did own Sewer Shark and I have harbored some small hatred for Sega ever since. :(

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