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Video Game Industry Thread: February part II is done, go to the next thread

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  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    Couscous wrote: »
    http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FocusGroupEnding
    The only one is the Fallout 3 ending in the video game section. Is it because nobody wants to redo entire sections of the game nowadays? Most videogames don't have anything that could be considered postproduction they could use to change shit so it would explain the lack of them. Or it could be due to a lack of information on the development process itself due to a lack of developer commentaries with games.

    Of course not. That costs shitloads of money to do, and lots of time as well. The way most games are developed, they don't have a lot of time set aside for stuff to drastically change.

  • Skull2185Skull2185 is an A-hole. but not 100% a dick.Registered User regular
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    ...Honestly, the FFVII expansion stuff did more harm than good.

    The best things to come out of it were Cloud and Tifa's outfit updates.

    Hey, I enjoy Advent Children!

    ...Not for any expanding upon the story(lolwut) that it tries to do, but dem flashy fight scenes!

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  • skeldareskeldare Time for adventure! Gresham, ORRegistered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    ...Honestly, the FFVII expansion stuff did more harm than good.

    The best things to come out of it were Cloud and Tifa's outfit updates.

    Hey, I enjoy Advent Children!

    ...Not for any expanding upon the story(lolwut) that it tries to do, but dem flashy fight scenes!

    Crisis Core wasn't bad either. Although it really retconned a lot.

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  • DragkoniasDragkonias Registered User regular
    Yeah. All I did was watch the fight scenes. Wasn't going to try to make sense of that gibberish they called a plot.

  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    edited March 2012
    skeldare wrote: »
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    ...Honestly, the FFVII expansion stuff did more harm than good.

    The best things to come out of it were Cloud and Tifa's outfit updates.

    Hey, I enjoy Advent Children!

    ...Not for any expanding upon the story(lolwut) that it tries to do, but dem flashy fight scenes!

    Crisis Core wasn't bad either. Although it really retconned a lot.

    Crisis Core was the only part of the compilation of FF7 that I really liked. It retconned stuff, but it felt more like they were clarifying or expanding on stuff rather than drastically changing it. And it actually made me appreciate FF7 a lot more.
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    Yeah. All I did was watch the fight scenes. Wasn't going to try to make sense of that gibberish they called a plot.

    The fight scenes were created first, independent of the rest of the movie. After the fight scenes were done, they went back and wrote a plot to connect them all together. I really despite AC.

    Post edited by TheSonicRetard on
  • skeldareskeldare Time for adventure! Gresham, ORRegistered User regular
    skeldare wrote: »
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    ...Honestly, the FFVII expansion stuff did more harm than good.

    The best things to come out of it were Cloud and Tifa's outfit updates.

    Hey, I enjoy Advent Children!

    ...Not for any expanding upon the story(lolwut) that it tries to do, but dem flashy fight scenes!

    Crisis Core wasn't bad either. Although it really retconned a lot.

    Crisis Core was the only part of the compilation of FF7 that I really liked. It retconned stuff, but it felt more like they were clarifying or expanding on stuff rather than drastically changing it. And it actually made me appreciate FF7 a lot more.
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    Yeah. All I did was watch the fight scenes. Wasn't going to try to make sense of that gibberish they called a plot.

    The fight scenes were created first, independent of the rest of the movie. After the fight scenes were done, they went back and wrote a plot to connect them all together. I really despite AC.

    Have you seen the Complete version? It actually adds quite a bit and makes a whole lot more sense.

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  • AutomaticzenAutomaticzen Registered User regular
    reVerse wrote: »
    Allforce wrote: »
    Someone posted a nice light-on-spoilers synopsis a few pages back when I asked. I think it boiled down to "all your choices through 3 games really mean nothing, Pick A, B, or C to continue on for your ending".

    That, and the ending sequence that follows is really short and the latter of half of it doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

    The producer defended the ending with that they wanted a Lost like ending that people would debate and that would be memorable. I've never seen the ending of Lost, but I presume it doesn't end with half the characters eating ice cream in Canada ROLL CREDITS

    Once you get to those stakes it was vaguely understandable. ME1's ending mostly came down to some choices you made towards the end, but not as bad. ME2 spoiled people because the survivors of the final mission is directly related to choices you made during the game and just prior to the mission.

    Doesn't excuse this. I've lived through some disappointing endings in books, movies, and TV shows. Doesn't ruin the entire experience for me.

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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    Edit: I think the Jurassic Bark/Bender's Big Score thing was artistic license and/or tweaking the fans (in a future episode, they do an entire joke around "oh no, I found another of Fry's dogs!) rather than bowing to fan pressure. The ending to Jurassic Bark was awesome. It reduced me into a horrible gelatinous blob of sorrow.

    I dunno, the ending changed in BBS which made it a lot less depressing. And worse, IMO. The original ending is one of my favorite moments in television. I too get reduced to a sobbing mess every time I see that episode, and it's precisely why I think it's so great. I kinda disregard BBS for that very reason.

    That's the closest I can get to an ending changing, though, and like you said, it might not have even been to fan pressure. I guess you could count the changes they made to Final Fantasy VII through the sequels and prequels, though. Although the big change that a lot of fans want, that would ruin the story IMO, is Aeris being brought back, which hasn't happened yet.

    Life sucks enough already without super-sad stories. That's not to say Jurrassic Bark wasn't spectacularly well-done for what it was trying to do, but that episode was uniformly banned in my family until Bender's Big Score. Sad dog stories are just no.

    But that, at least, was definitely a quality piece.

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  • greeblegreeble Registered User regular
    Crisis Core is an excellent game, its a shame so few people played in the west, because "lol psp". (Also a shame no digital release so Vita owners can't play it either) Only 2nd Final Fantasy game I finished.... awesome ending.

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  • Skull2185Skull2185 is an A-hole. but not 100% a dick.Registered User regular
    Bender's Big Score was one of the films right? I think I saw all of them, I don't rmember anything too sad. What are you guy's talking about?

    It's like the N-word and the C-word had a baby, and it was raised by all the bad words for Jews.
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  • Santa ClaustrophobiaSanta Claustrophobia Ho Ho Ho Disconnecting from Xbox LIVERegistered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Bender's Big Score was one of the films right? I think I saw all of them, I don't rmember anything too sad. What are you guy's talking about?

    In Jurrasic Bark, the dog dies sad and lonely outside the pizza shop waiting for Fry to return.

    In BBS, they go back in time and prevent that. Or something. I forget the specifics.

  • ShadowfireShadowfire Registered User regular
    Allforce wrote: »
    Someone posted a nice light-on-spoilers synopsis a few pages back when I asked. I think it boiled down to "all your choices through 3 games really mean nothing, Pick A, B, or C to continue on for your ending".

    It's not a big deal when deus ex (any of the three two games) do it, but Mass Effect people go all crazy batshit.

    To be fair, there is a significant investment in the Mass Effect universe. I created my Shepard, the choices made were mine, and I've been that Shepard for five years now. To say that people are all crazy batshit over a game is to ignore the emotional attachment to the fiction that Bioware itself wanted to create.

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  • CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    edited March 2012
    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-03-20-dragons-dogma-can-sell-10-million-worldwide-reckons-capcom
    Capcom is hoping to sell 10 million copies of forthcoming fantasy RPG Dragon's Dogma, according to producer Hideaki Itsuno.

    Speaking to Videogamer, Itsuno insisted that figure was ambitious but attainable, and is emblematic of Capcom's desire to chase success on a global stage and not just in Japan.

    "I don't know if other Japanese developers are trying to become more global, but I know we definitely are," he said.

    "It's difficult, because we really want this game to sell 10 million units worldwide. We want to sell a lot, and that's just something that we think we can do. We're not positive [it will be a success]. Of course it's a risk, but that's what we want - a challenge."

    Itsuno added that Capcom believes the game will almost certainly break the million barrier in its homeland.

    "But in Japan, we can absolutely sell a million units. We know that's attainable, it's absolutely do-able. We have a kind of assurance that that will happen, but for worldwide that's not so much the case, and I think that's why a lot of Japanese developers are hesitant about going global. It's because they don't have that assurance that it'll be successful."

    The game, which Capcom claims is one of its largest productions ever, is due out on 25th May for PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360.
    Yeah...
    A million units would be fucking amazing in Japan.

    Post edited by Couscous on
  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    10 million?

    They have to be smoking something.

    I don't think even Skyrim sold 10 million.

    Capcom doesnt seem to understand what reasonable expectations for their games should be. It explains some of their dumber decisions though if they're expecting a game that might sell a million copies to sell 10 times what is reasonable.

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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Bender's Big Score was one of the films right? I think I saw all of them, I don't rmember anything too sad. What are you guy's talking about?

    In Jurrasic Bark, the dog dies sad and lonely outside the pizza shop waiting for Fry to return.

    In BBS, they go back in time and prevent that. Or something. I forget the specifics.

    The dog still dies in BBS, but instead of it spending years waiting outside for Fry to come back and then just dying quietly, Fry sees it all the time because he goes back in time.

    Less unmitigated horror that way.

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  • DragkoniasDragkonias Registered User regular
    ...So...I don't even think Skyrim topped 10 million.

    Yet Capcom is expecting this game(which while I'm still buying it doesn't look so hot).

    Man, you know I made fun of Capcom's old management...but their new management is insane.

  • skeldareskeldare Time for adventure! Gresham, ORRegistered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Bender's Big Score was one of the films right? I think I saw all of them, I don't rmember anything too sad. What are you guy's talking about?

    It wasn't sad. It basically made the ending of Jurassic Bark less sad because
    Spoiler:

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  • Santa ClaustrophobiaSanta Claustrophobia Ho Ho Ho Disconnecting from Xbox LIVERegistered User regular
    edited March 2012
    Shadowfire wrote: »
    Allforce wrote: »
    Someone posted a nice light-on-spoilers synopsis a few pages back when I asked. I think it boiled down to "all your choices through 3 games really mean nothing, Pick A, B, or C to continue on for your ending".

    It's not a big deal when deus ex (any of the three two games) do it, but Mass Effect people go all crazy batshit.

    To be fair, there is a significant investment in the Mass Effect universe. I created my Shepard, the choices made were mine, and I've been that Shepard for five years now. To say that people are all crazy batshit over a game is to ignore the emotional attachment to the fiction that Bioware itself wanted to create.

    And some things aren't really worth getting upset over.

    Post edited by Santa Claustrophobia on
  • cloudeaglecloudeagle Zhu-Li, do the thing! Registered User regular
    reVerse wrote: »
    Allforce wrote: »
    Someone posted a nice light-on-spoilers synopsis a few pages back when I asked. I think it boiled down to "all your choices through 3 games really mean nothing, Pick A, B, or C to continue on for your ending".

    That, and the ending sequence that follows is really short and the latter of half of it doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

    The producer defended the ending with that they wanted a Lost like ending that people would debate and that would be memorable. I've never seen the ending of Lost, but I presume it doesn't end with half the characters eating ice cream in Canada ROLL CREDITS

    Once you get to those stakes it was vaguely understandable. ME1's ending mostly came down to some choices you made towards the end, but not as bad. ME2 spoiled people because the survivors of the final mission is directly related to choices you made during the game and just prior to the mission.

    Still, people forget that, beyond who lived and died in ME2, the ending choice largely boiled down to "do you want to tell the Illusive Man to fuck himself?" Which didn't carry as much narrative weight as, say, do you choose to sacrifice a bunch of human soldiers to save aliens, and do you take advantage of a weakened Citadel to remake the council to favor humanity? Which was in the first game. But yeah, people may not have noticed the lack of true ending choice in ME2 because of the nail-biting choices you had to make in the final assault to avoid getting some or all of the characters you spent 20+ hours bonding with killed.

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  • R0land1188R0land1188 Registered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Bender's Big Score was one of the films right? I think I saw all of them, I don't rmember anything too sad. What are you guy's talking about?

    In Jurrasic Bark, the dog dies sad and lonely outside the pizza shop waiting for Fry to return.

    In BBS, they go back in time and prevent that. Or something. I forget the specifics.

    In Bender's Big Score, Fry returns and hangs out with Seymour until Bender tries to blow him to pieces. So he didn't sit and wait for Fry until he died.

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  • Skull2185Skull2185 is an A-hole. but not 100% a dick.Registered User regular
    I hope Dragon's Dogma does well. It certainly sounds like an awesome game.

    It's like the N-word and the C-word had a baby, and it was raised by all the bad words for Jews.
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  • FoomyFoomy Registered User regular
    edited March 2012
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Bender's Big Score was one of the films right? I think I saw all of them, I don't rmember anything too sad. What are you guy's talking about?

    In Jurrasic Bark, the dog dies sad and lonely outside the pizza shop waiting for Fry to return.

    In BBS, they go back in time and prevent that. Or something. I forget the specifics.

    BBS is all about time travel, and a duplicate of fry is accidentally created, he's trapped back in the past and lives out a normal life with seymour his dog at the pizza place. so instead of the ending of jurrasic bark being super sad because seymour spent his entire life waiting for Fry to return and never does, he lives a happy dog life. roughly from what I remember

    Post edited by Foomy on
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  • cloudeaglecloudeagle Zhu-Li, do the thing! Registered User regular
    Wasn't Dragon's Dogma going to be the game Capcom spent the most money they've ever spent on a game, at least until they announced Resident Evil 6 would be even more ginormous?

    That company sure is betting high nowadays.

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  • MukkMukk Registered User regular
    If they want to sell that much they should have a PC release. If that game doesn't have an autolock for ranged attacks I'm not buying it (on a console). I'm absolutely horrible at aiming with sticks, it feels so clumsy.

  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    Mukk wrote: »
    If they want to sell that much they should have a PC release. If that game doesn't have an autolock for ranged attacks I'm not buying it (on a console). I'm absolutely horrible at aiming with sticks, it feels so clumsy.

    Wait, what?

    There's not going to be a PC version?

    What. the. fuck?

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  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Bender's Big Score was one of the films right? I think I saw all of them, I don't rmember anything too sad. What are you guy's talking about?

    In Jurrasic Bark, the dog dies sad and lonely outside the pizza shop waiting for Fry to return.

    In BBS, they go back in time and prevent that. Or something. I forget the specifics.

    In Jurassic Bark, you're lead to believe that Fry's dog obeyed him and waited in that same spot for 13 years without moving, eventually dying waiting for fry to return, after fry opts not to bring him back to life because he thinks the dog would be sad since he'd live in a world without all the other people he'd have met in that time (not realizing that the dog didn't live with anyone else during that time period because all he wanted was to see fry again).

    In BBS, Fry is cloned, and you find out that he lived a simultaneous dual life in the past as Lars, where his life basically continued as normal. He lived a full life with Seymour, his dog, who had a happy life together.

    The BBS ending is more cheery and pretty much what everyone wanted, but the original ending was so sad and much better done, and the happy ending isn't nearly as great as the sad ending.

  • DragkoniasDragkonias Registered User regular
    Wait...wait...WAIT!

    People actually complained about the ending to Jurassic Bark.

    I don't even...I just don't get people.

  • AutomaticzenAutomaticzen Registered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    I hope Dragon's Dogma does well. It certainly sounds like an awesome game.

    It might be an awesome game.

    But not 10 million worth an awesome game. Street Fighter and Marvel Vs were bigger brands and they got nowhere near 10 million.

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  • Skull2185Skull2185 is an A-hole. but not 100% a dick.Registered User regular
    Foomy wrote: »
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Bender's Big Score was one of the films right? I think I saw all of them, I don't rmember anything too sad. What are you guy's talking about?

    In Jurrasic Bark, the dog dies sad and lonely outside the pizza shop waiting for Fry to return.

    In BBS, they go back in time and prevent that. Or something. I forget the specifics.

    BBS is all about time travel, and a duplicate of fry is accidentally created, he's trapped back in the past and lives out a normal life with seymour his dog at the pizza place. so instead of the ending of jurrasic bark being super sad because seymour spent his entire life waiting for Fry to return and never does, he lives a happy dog life. roughly from what I remember

    Ahh, I guess I didn't see that one then. On one hand, I like the sound of that, because Seymour doesn't die alone in the cold. On the other hand, it cheapens the whole jurassic bark episode.

    It's like the N-word and the C-word had a baby, and it was raised by all the bad words for Jews.
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  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    greeble wrote: »
    Crisis Core is an excellent game, its a shame so few people played in the west, because "lol psp". (Also a shame no digital release so Vita owners can't play it either) Only 2nd Final Fantasy game I finished.... awesome ending.

    I ripped my UMD copy of Crisis Core with my PSP-1000, then transfered it over to my modded PSP Go and played through the game on my TV using a Dual Shock 3. I had already played the game once before on my PSP-1000, but it's way, way better with a comfortable controller and bigger screen. It'd be great on the Vita, but playing it on the TV with a DS3 is a good alternative.

  • Death of RatsDeath of Rats Registered User regular
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    Wait...wait...WAIT!

    People actually complained about the ending to Jurassic Bark.

    I don't even...I just don't get people.

    I put all my dogs to sleep after watching Jurassic Bark when it first aired. All 3 of them. Paul, Simon, and Bobo. Just couldn't deal with the emotions at the time. A few months later I wrote to Fox and demanded they changed the ending.
    Spoiler:

  • maximumzeromaximumzero I...wait, what? New Orleans, LARegistered User regular
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Foomy wrote: »
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Bender's Big Score was one of the films right? I think I saw all of them, I don't rmember anything too sad. What are you guy's talking about?

    In Jurrasic Bark, the dog dies sad and lonely outside the pizza shop waiting for Fry to return.

    In BBS, they go back in time and prevent that. Or something. I forget the specifics.

    BBS is all about time travel, and a duplicate of fry is accidentally created, he's trapped back in the past and lives out a normal life with seymour his dog at the pizza place. so instead of the ending of jurrasic bark being super sad because seymour spent his entire life waiting for Fry to return and never does, he lives a happy dog life. roughly from what I remember

    Ahh, I guess I didn't see that one then. On one hand, I like the sound of that, because Seymour doesn't die alone in the cold. On the other hand, it cheapens the whole jurassic bark episode.

    Then you realize the whole parallel universe thing exists and you don't get your panties in a bunch.

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  • reVersereVerse Never odd or even Registered User regular
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    Wait...wait...WAIT!

    People actually complained about the ending to Jurassic Bark.

    I don't even...I just don't get people.

    A lot of people hate sad endings. "Real life is a downer, I demand happy endings in my fiction".

  • Santa ClaustrophobiaSanta Claustrophobia Ho Ho Ho Disconnecting from Xbox LIVERegistered User regular
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    Wait...wait...WAIT!

    People actually complained about the ending to Jurassic Bark.

    I don't even...I just don't get people.

    A Time to Kill movie and book spoilers (you know, just in case...):
    Spoiler:

    People behave funny when dogs are involved. Even in works of fiction. Nobody will bat an eye at brutally killing thousands but cause one dog to so much as whimper and the audience gets pissed.

  • ElderlycrawfishElderlycrawfish Registered User regular
    Sounds like they're shooting for Monster Hunter (portable 3 sold a shit ton in Japan) numbers for Dragon's Dogma, but on a worldwide scale. It sounds damn high and almost certainly going to not hit it, but I could easily see some number-crunching exec comparing the numbers to get that kin of projection.

    I'd like a bottle of whatever happy juice they're drinking though, that stuff is potent.

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  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    10 million?

    They have to be smoking something.

    I don't think even Skyrim sold 10 million.

    Capcom doesnt seem to understand what reasonable expectations for their games should be. It explains some of their dumber decisions though if they're expecting a game that might sell a million copies to sell 10 times what is reasonable.

    I agree. Their development model is flawed. I have to wonder what money sinks like Dark Void have been doing to Capcom. Large companies can only afford large budget games when they have money to develop them with. I wouldn't be surprised to see Capcom reduce their development budget to reflect lowered expectations. In other words, make games which are able to turn profits off of 500,000 sales.

  • TheSonicRetardTheSonicRetard Registered User regular
    reVerse wrote: »
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    Wait...wait...WAIT!

    People actually complained about the ending to Jurassic Bark.

    I don't even...I just don't get people.

    A lot of people hate sad endings. "Real life is a downer, I demand happy endings in my fiction".

    I can understand the sentiment, but I personally love a depressing story. I like watching jurassic bark and hugging my dog afterwards. Or reading stories about Hachiko.

  • DragkoniasDragkonias Registered User regular
    edited March 2012
    Meh. I say real life is 50/50, so movies should be too myself.

    Either way. I really don't know how they think DD is going to get 10 million.

    I'm expecting 2-3 at most.

    Post edited by Dragkonias on
  • Death of RatsDeath of Rats Registered User regular
    Downer endings make me appreciate my life much more. And bittersweet endings make me have hope. Happy endings usually make me feel mad because that's not how it usually happens.

    My girlfriend is the exact opposite. She doesn't like "Up" because the whole movie is bittersweet. She doesn't like Wall E for the same reason (the fact that it made her sad towards the end).

    Some people just don't know how to deal with things that aren't wrapped up nicely in a bow with flowers and smiling faces.

This discussion has been closed.