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[TESO] Probably better than a Cliff Racer hunting sim.

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Posts

  • Great ScottGreat Scott Registered User regular
    Hewn wrote: »
    Their efforts would have been better served making a Borderlands-like version of Skyrim. I understand an MMO with a Skyrim world is pretty daunting at this stage, but there's no reason they couldn't have a party based open world adventure.

    That's an excellent point. Hell, I'd pay good money for a multiplayer patch to Skyrim. Similar to the old Bauldur's Gate peer-to-peer system. No, it wouldn't be balanced, and Skyrim already supports a wide variety of difficulties so that doesn't matter.

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  • ironzergironzerg Registered User regular
    It's a model that hasn't been explored...multiplayer adventure games that can support a few hundred players in each "world", but the world is run on independent servers...you could have a private world just a few of your friends played in, a guild world for a couple hundred, or host a public server. Seems to me, trying to put together something like that for a ES type game would be great. Instead of a subscription, you sell adventures and add-on packs.

    To me, it seems like the tech to do this should be there.

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  • ElldrenElldren 3067-6294-6208Registered User regular
    ironzerg wrote: »
    It's a model that hasn't been explored...multiplayer adventure games that can support a few hundred players in each "world", but the world is run on independent servers...you could have a private world just a few of your friends played in, a guild world for a couple hundred, or host a public server. Seems to me, trying to put together something like that for a ES type game would be great. Instead of a subscription, you sell adventures and add-on packs.

    To me, it seems like the tech to do this should be there.

    NWN explored it pretty successfully in my opinion. I would not mind seeing more games that run with that kind of model.

  • eobeteobet Registered User regular
    ironzerg wrote: »
    It's a model that hasn't been explored...multiplayer adventure games that can support a few hundred players in each "world", but the world is run on independent servers...you could have a private world just a few of your friends played in, a guild world for a couple hundred, or host a public server. Seems to me, trying to put together something like that for a ES type game would be great. Instead of a subscription, you sell adventures and add-on packs.

    To me, it seems like the tech to do this should be there.

    You are describing the model that Dungeon Defenders use pretty accurately there. Unfortunately, the rampant hacking of their open network has now crept into their ranked network as well...

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  • HewnHewn Registered User regular
    Elldren wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    It's a model that hasn't been explored...multiplayer adventure games that can support a few hundred players in each "world", but the world is run on independent servers...you could have a private world just a few of your friends played in, a guild world for a couple hundred, or host a public server. Seems to me, trying to put together something like that for a ES type game would be great. Instead of a subscription, you sell adventures and add-on packs.

    To me, it seems like the tech to do this should be there.

    NWN explored it pretty successfully in my opinion. I would not mind seeing more games that run with that kind of model.

    Yeah, NWN came to mind, too. Add in NWN-esque multiplayer to Skyrim and you've created one of the most addictive and enduring games of the decade.

    And truly our complaints will do nothing, but at least it's comforting to know as a collective gaming culture we're kind of on the same page. Eventually the folks with the money will listen.

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  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    Hewn wrote: »
    Elldren wrote: »
    ironzerg wrote: »
    It's a model that hasn't been explored...multiplayer adventure games that can support a few hundred players in each "world", but the world is run on independent servers...you could have a private world just a few of your friends played in, a guild world for a couple hundred, or host a public server. Seems to me, trying to put together something like that for a ES type game would be great. Instead of a subscription, you sell adventures and add-on packs.

    To me, it seems like the tech to do this should be there.

    NWN explored it pretty successfully in my opinion. I would not mind seeing more games that run with that kind of model.

    Yeah, NWN came to mind, too. Add in NWN-esque multiplayer to Skyrim and you've created one of the most addictive and enduring games of the decade.

    And truly our complaints will do nothing, but at least it's comforting to know as a collective gaming culture we're kind of on the same page. Eventually the folks with the money will listen.

    True enough.

    Usually we here in G&T are at the least quietly excited for a new MMO. Especially one based on a IP we love.

    And I like Bethsoft. I have enjoyed all their games, have bought all their expansions, and including the DLC (even friggin Horse Armor).

    This time though, the opinion here seems to be fairly negative by and large. Usually I am a wait and see kind of guy, but we've heard this song over and over and we all know how it ends.



  • Toxic PickleToxic Pickle Registered User regular
    Most of us tried to be at least 'cautiously optimistic' before the GI article came out, but that sorta blew the doors open and ruined any hope most of us had clung to regarding this game.

    I'll still keep a watch out for it, but it'll be in the same way I watch new Funcom games. Which is to say, how I watch a car wreck happening in front of me.

  • AddaAdda Registered User regular
    Still really important to note that this is in no way a Bethesda game.

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  • ElldrenElldren 3067-6294-6208Registered User regular
    Adda wrote: »
    Still really important to note that this is in no way a Bethesda game.

    Other than that whole bit where they're publishing it and it's their IP

  • ironzergironzerg Registered User regular
    But they're not actually making the game.

    The problem is not the IP...it's that they're stripping out every mechanic that made Elder Scrolls Elder Scrolls.

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  • ElldrenElldren 3067-6294-6208Registered User regular
    ironzerg wrote: »
    But they're not actually making the game.

    The problem is not the IP...it's that they're stripping out every mechanic that made Elder Scrolls Elder Scrolls.

    Right, but they're still publishing it and they can still say "stop doing that please" and well, they aren't

  • AddaAdda Registered User regular
    Come on don't be quite that facetious, I think you know what I mean.

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  • ElldrenElldren 3067-6294-6208Registered User regular
    Adda wrote: »
    Come on don't be quite that facetious, I think you know what I mean.

    I do know what you mean but you are overstating it considerably

  • AddaAdda Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Elldren wrote: »
    Adda wrote: »
    Come on don't be quite that facetious, I think you know what I mean.

    I do know what you mean but you are overstating it considerably

    Bethesda's parent company is using their IP to develop an MMO. I'm keen to know how they can stop their owners from doing that.

    EDIT: Admittedly to us it shows some lack of love or respect for the IP but I guess they figure it was worth doing.

    Adda on
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  • Toxic PickleToxic Pickle Registered User regular
    It's mentioned in the article that Todd Howard stops by the Zenemax Online offices from time to time. I wonder if he has any authority or just goes there to mourn his baby as they ritually stab it to death.

  • ironzergironzerg Registered User regular
    For people who are just arguing blindly. Go read the article, gets some facts on the game, and then come back to the thread.

    This isn't just people going, "OMG, it's going to be the suck." Well, is it...but there's very valid reasons why.

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  • SquiddyBiscuitSquiddyBiscuit Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    I really hope this game's inevitable failure won't stop betheseda from making SP sequels to skyrim :/
    I know there are two different studios involved, but surely Betheseda has something to lose if they're publishing it?

    Ohgod, found this pic at neogaf:

    TESOmockup_1336173443.jpg

    SquiddyBiscuit on
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  • CorehealerCorehealer The Apothecary When has it ever been any different?Registered User regular
  • ElldrenElldren 3067-6294-6208Registered User regular
    oh god the hands

    the giant meaty mitts on that guy

    I can't unsee it

  • SegSeg Registered User regular
    The "[51] Yes, My Thane! -Carry 22 burdens" is fantastic though.

  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Seg wrote: »
    The "[51] Yes, My Thane! -Carry 22 burdens" is fantastic though.

    I was going to say that, but you beat me to it. :)

    edit-

    Also this pretty much sums up all my feelings on this venture.

    http://kotaku.com/5907598/first-elder-scrolls-online--details-make-it-sound-like-just-another-fantasy-mmo?tag=theelderscrolls

    Axen on
  • MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    Still not sure why people are so shocked.

    Skyrim is awesome, but Elder Scrolls games always seem like they barely pull off their glory in single player. I don't have enough faith in the developer to come even close to that when taking multiplayer into account.

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  • CorehealerCorehealer The Apothecary When has it ever been any different?Registered User regular
    I wonder if all this negative press is worrying Zenimax and company. Maybe they'll cancel and save the trouble of a few months of floundering and disappointment.

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  • AddaAdda Registered User regular
    With 5 years development already done I find it very unlikely they would consider cancelling.

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  • CorehealerCorehealer The Apothecary When has it ever been any different?Registered User regular
    Adda wrote: »
    With 5 years development already done I find it very unlikely they would consider cancelling.

    In that case, anyone wanna take bets how many months it will take for it to go F2P post launch? My money's on two, tops.

    2fbfH5V.png
  • AddaAdda Registered User regular
    The thing is, I'm not completely adverse to another hot bar mmo. Just have to wait and see more also I don't remember reading about their payment plans etc in the article so they may already be considering a break from the standard model. Considering how much the game appears to conform to other norms though, I wouldn't bet on it.

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  • CorehealerCorehealer The Apothecary When has it ever been any different?Registered User regular
    It's not so much the hotkeys as it is the gameplay itself. GW2 is a hotkey MMO and it's far and away more capable of being not WoW. Tera is the same to an extent. From what we've seen so far, TESO doesn't look like it's going to do anything different. Besides maybe 3 faction PvP.

    We don't have any financial model for it yet so that's just my assumption that it'll try a sub model. Maybe it'll do a F2P thing from the start.

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  • AddaAdda Registered User regular
    We haven't seen any combat or ui right? For all we know it could be more effective than gw2 with that stuff. I doubt it but it might.

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  • CorehealerCorehealer The Apothecary When has it ever been any different?Registered User regular
    Adda wrote: »
    We haven't seen any combat or ui right? For all we know it could be more effective than gw2 with that stuff. I doubt it but it might.

    As others have said, cautious wait and see. I'm ragging on the thing because of what it represents. Even with the article it might still be too early to write it off entirely.

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  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    If this game had come out three or even just two years ago then I'd probably be on board.

    It's just bad, bad timing on their part. TERA was just released, to much fanfare from what I gather, and GW2 is inbound sometime in the near future. GW2 being a game that even has my non gaming friends hyped beyond reason.



  • steejeesteejee Registered User regular
    Axen wrote: »
    If this game had come out three or even just two years ago then I'd probably be on board.

    It's just bad, bad timing on their part. TERA was just released, to much fanfare from what I gather, and GW2 is inbound sometime in the near future. GW2 being a game that even has my non gaming friends hyped beyond reason.

    I'd add that any WoW-like hotbar game is going to get instantly compared to RIFT, which is a high bar. RIFT is a wow clone, but given the size of the studio that put it out (and how much it was made for), it's been a successful one. TOR gets (justifiably) ripped on a lot for failing even to stand up to RIFT in anything other than the storylines/VA. Given the rate RIFT has been updated, it seems really unlikely TES Online could match up if it's just a WoW clone.

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  • HewnHewn Registered User regular
    steejee wrote: »
    TOR gets (justifiably) ripped on a lot for failing even to stand up to RIFT in anything other than the storylines/VA. Given the rate RIFT has been updated, it seems really unlikely TES Online could match up if it's just a WoW clone.

    Speaking of which, this is a good place for me to comment how voice acting in games, particularly ongoing content games like MMOs, doesn't always get me terribly excited. It very significantly stunts the rate of content production.

    I think it was the recent Shadowrun Kickstarter where the fans spoke out in pretty significant volumes saying not to bother with voice acting as it would only hold back more content. Are we getting to a point where maybe our new shiny toy, having lines read to us, is going to start being purposefully omitted?

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  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Hewn wrote: »
    steejee wrote: »
    TOR gets (justifiably) ripped on a lot for failing even to stand up to RIFT in anything other than the storylines/VA. Given the rate RIFT has been updated, it seems really unlikely TES Online could match up if it's just a WoW clone.

    Speaking of which, this is a good place for me to comment how voice acting in games, particularly ongoing content games like MMOs, doesn't always get me terribly excited. It very significantly stunts the rate of content production.

    I think it was the recent Shadowrun Kickstarter where the fans spoke out in pretty significant volumes saying not to bother with voice acting as it would only hold back more content. Are we getting to a point where maybe our new shiny toy, having lines read to us, is going to start being purposefully omitted?

    I totally get and agree with what you mean in regards to Shadowrun.

    However, when it comes to an MMO I don't think having it fully voiced would hold back content. I have to imagine that the dialogue would probably be finished long before the artists, programmers, designers, and the like finished their jobs.

    Though it might just depend on the company. I am pretty sure Bioware has at least a half-dozen or so VAs in cryo-stasis.

    Hell, Nolan North probably just knocked out two more games in the time it took me to write this post. :P

    edit- It would certainly cost more, but as long as the company was cool with it, I doubt it'd stunt the rate of content production at all.

    Axen on
  • HewnHewn Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    I don't know. I'm skeptical SWTOR isn't slowed by the voice acting. It is, apparently, the largest voice over project ever. And if not "slowed" less overall content.

    On the flip side, I admittedly know very little about it. Maybe somebody who knows more about this sort of thing can correct me.

    Edit: Some numbers...
    Director of production Dallas Dickinson and vice president of production Richard Vogel said SWTOR has over 321 actors voicing more than 4094 characters. The game features more voice over work than every single other BioWare game combined.

    Hewn on
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  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    Hewn wrote: »
    I don't know. I'm skeptical SWTOR isn't slowed by the voice acting. It is, apparently, the largest voice over project ever. And if not "slowed" less overall content.

    On the flip side, I admittedly know very little about it. Maybe somebody who knows more about this sort of thing can correct me.

    Edit: Some numbers...
    Director of production Dallas Dickinson and vice president of production Richard Vogel said SWTOR has over 321 actors voicing more than 4094 characters. The game features more voice over work than every single other BioWare game combined.

    Truth be told Bioware may be the exception to your theory.

    However any additional content they (Bioware) release would be a far, far smaller scale project compared to the original game. Which, if the new content was Black Talon quality, would probably have about as much dialogue as a 30min show, maybe a bit more. And, I am only assuming here, but I'd figure they would have the script written out long before the devs finished producing the content. I don't know much about that end of things, but I don't think it would be a stretch to say it'd at least take a month to make it, if not more? That is plenty of time to get the lines recorded.

    Plus Bioware is not afraid to reuse generic lines for the player character's response. (Could almost make a drinking game out of the number of times my dude said, "Now it's time for you to see what a Sith can do.")

    As long as money is no object, and for a company like Bioware that is certainly the impression I get, then spoken lines would most certainly not slow down content production.


    However, take Funcom for example, it looks like The Secret World will have fully voiced quest givers. Sadly, Funcom does not strike me as a company that could keep VAs on retainer like Bioware seems to. :P

    In that case I see one of two things happening. 1) They do slow down on content updates do to budget restraints. 2) Any future content updates might involve the player getting a letter or something similar.

  • steejeesteejee Registered User regular
    Hewn wrote: »

    In that case I see one of two things happening. 1) They do slow down on content updates do to budget restraints. 2) Any future content updates might involve the player getting a letter or something similar.

    Or 3 - everything is voice by people in the office or random cheap actors who they can contract quickly =)

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  • ArthilArthil Henchman 21 Registered User regular
    I'm not sure why you guys assume they don't have the VAs they've currently used contractually obliged to come back for more voice work.

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  • MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    Arthil wrote: »
    I'm not sure why you guys assume they don't have the VAs they've currently used contractually obliged to come back for more voice work.

    All three of them.

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  • Toxic PickleToxic Pickle Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Axen wrote: »
    If this game had come out three or even just two years ago then I'd probably be on board.

    It's just bad, bad timing on their part. TERA was just released, to much fanfare from what I gather, and GW2 is inbound sometime in the near future. GW2 being a game that even has my non gaming friends hyped beyond reason.

    This, to me, is the crux of the issue really. A few years ago, people might have bought that action combat wasn't possible in an MMO because of latency, as an example, but that article came out right as TERA was releasing, proving their claim of "It's too haaaard" to be not quite true. It's too hard for them, perhaps, which is all the more reason for me not to give them my money.

    Toxic Pickle on
  • ironzergironzerg Registered User regular
    Meh, off topic, but whatever.

    What's the big deal about VA? So now I have a talking head that reads the quest text to me, instead of me reading it myself. So what? Like in SWToR, there was a few "well acted" scenes that I enjoyed watching, but after about 10 minutes, I put the sub-titles on and ended up spacebar-ing through most of the trivial, generic quest dialog.

    So I feel like this whole, "OMG VA SO AWESOME!" trend is really a false-postive. I didn't find myself any more compelled to collect 10 space bear asses because the quest text was hidden by VA, as opposed to reading it.

    To come full circle, based on the shit that was shoveled out in that magazine article, ESO could ressurect William Shakespeare, have it write and direct the "story", and the game would still be crap.

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This discussion has been closed.