Our new Indie Games subforum is now open for business in G&T. Go and check it out, you might land a code for a free game. If you're developing an indie game and want to post about it, follow these directions. If you don't, he'll break your legs! Hahaha! Seriously though.
Our rules have been updated and given their own forum. Go and look at them! They are nice, and there may be new ones that you didn't know about! Hooray for rules! Hooray for The System! Hooray for Conforming!

[A Song of Ice and Fire, Books and Books+Show] Touch this thread and all shall be spoilt

11516182021101

Posts

  • SmoogySmoogy Registered User regular
    Am I the only one who really hopes (if they make seasons out of the 4th and 5th books) that they drastically change the plot? There's no way TV viewers could watch those filmed as they were written...

    3DS Friend Code: 1821-8991-4141
    Currently playing: Diablo 3, Pokemon X, 999
    Smoogy#1689
  • DarianDarian Registered User regular
    I would expect them to mix books 4 and 5, at the very least, to work through everything chronologically rather than the way they were written.

  • DracomicronDracomicron Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Yeah, they're not going to do one season of mainland Westeros and another season of Essos/the North/whatnot. They'll mix all of the significant events in chronologically, and if they do that, they should be set for a decent enough plotline.

    Though I'm intrigued as to how the hell they're going to do
    Spoiler:

    Dracomicron on
    Gary Gygax wrote:
    ''The secret we should never let the gamemasters know is that they don't need any rules.''
  • valiancevaliance Registered User regular
    valiance wrote: »
    Every single departure from the books this episode was flatly worse than the original text.

    Disappointing.

    How so?

    Spoilers up through DWD
    Spoiler:

    I agree we've lost a lot here, losing those guys also makes Arya's decision to "waste" her wishes harder to understand. In the books shes being beaten and abused regularly by these assholes and has seen people tortured and killed by them, and heard them boast and brag about the horrific shit they did to people even on the way to Harrenhal.

    But in the show she's right next to Tywin day in and day out. Harder to understand her decision not to have him killed.

    Is roose going to show up like he did in the books? and weasel soup?

    We also lose (SOS SPOILER):
    Spoiler:

    I like new Margary a LOT though. I don't think she was ever the counterpoint to Sansa in the way you suggest. I think the Tyrells were always active players, Margary included. In fact in general I think the show shows us explicitly a lot of things that were going in the book, but we couldnt see directly since we had no POV characters there. It fills in the blanks on a lot of implicit stuff, which I like.

  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    Spoiler:

    Well, right now if Tywin dies Arya's probably just going back into the pigsty and the torturer's understudy gets to practice on her. Anyway, it'll prolly go like in the books - the first death she doesn't really believe he can kill ANYONE yet, so she picks an easy target. Second one she gets angry at a horrible guard and orders his death, realizes she fucked up but can't take it back in time. And then #3 will probably still result in Harrenhal falling to the Boltons.

    Since Arya's not going by Weasel, apparently they named the jailer Weasel. So there's definitely still going to still be Weasel soup, just with a slightly different reason for the name.

    History is an account, mostly false, of events, mostly unimportant, which are brought about by rulers, mostly knaves, and soldiers, mostly fools.
  • YarYar Registered User regular
    poshniallo wrote: »
    Your idea of sense or humanity has never matched mine.

    ...ok. The guy just finished brashly exiling his cousin for saying he was tired and needed a rest, and made it redundantly clear that if he weren't a Lannister, he'd be dead for saying that. Next up, his servant threatens to kill him, and... what exactly? Explain your superior sense of humanity here.

  • DracomicronDracomicron Registered User regular
    Yar wrote: »
    poshniallo wrote: »
    Your idea of sense or humanity has never matched mine.

    ...ok. The guy just finished brashly exiling his cousin for saying he was tired and needed a rest, and made it redundantly clear that if he weren't a Lannister, he'd be dead for saying that. Next up, his servant threatens to kill him, and... what exactly? Explain your superior sense of humanity here.

    Honestly, it wasn't a threat. Arya just spoke a universal truth. "Anyone can be killed" is simply true. Yes, it can be viewed as a threat... if you're an insecure pussy. Tywin ain't that.

    Tywin abhors weakness, and that's even more apparent in TV Tywin. He respects Robb because he is not weak. He sacked that Lannister cousin because he was complaining about being tired when there was work to do. He likes Arya because she proved smart, capable, and realistic. He hates Tyrion because he is viewed as a weak demon monkey dwarf, even as he understands Tyrion's utility to him.

    He's not going to kill Arya for reminding him that anyone can die. He'd rather his lieutennants learned something from her northern mindset.

    Gary Gygax wrote:
    ''The secret we should never let the gamemasters know is that they don't need any rules.''
  • ArbitraryDescriptorArbitraryDescriptor Registered User regular
    I honestly thought Tywin took her statement as inspiration, and that's what the pause and his expression are meant to infer. Also why he might have told her to get out so abruptly, because there was planning to do. They were talking about how to be Robb, and failing to do so over and over. In that moment Tywin could have realized that he needn't beat the armies devoted to the Young Wolf's growing legend, he merely needed to kill him and watch them fall apart.

    I enjoy this interpretation, because it.means
    Spoiler:

    Automata-Sg.png
  • InvisibleInvisible Registered User regular
    I read the scene a couple of different ways.
    1. As a mirror to Sansa's scene in the previous episode when the Lannister's were talking about Robb. I forget the exact line, but the implication was that the true king was Robb and he could win.
    2. I've seen my father die, I've watched commoners chosen at random to die, I've killed and all men must die.
    3. As just a fact, a precursor to the ending scene when she sees her first wish granted.

    steam_sig.png
  • ShadowenShadowen Snores in the morning Registered User regular
    Yeah, they're not going to do one season of mainland Westeros and another season of Essos/the North/whatnot. They'll mix all of the significant events in chronologically, and if they do that, they should be set for a decent enough plotline.

    Though I'm intrigued as to how the hell they're going to do
    Spoiler:

    She's not
    Spoiler:

  • Smaug6Smaug6 Registered User regular
    Invisible wrote: »
    I read the scene a couple of different ways.
    1. As a mirror to Sansa's scene in the previous episode when the Lannister's were talking about Robb. I forget the exact line, but the implication was that the true king was Robb and he could win.
    2. I've seen my father die, I've watched commoners chosen at random to die, I've killed and all men must die.
    3. As just a fact, a precursor to the ending scene when she sees her first wish granted.

    All men must die

    valar morghulis

    steam_sig.png
  • DracomicronDracomicron Registered User regular
    Shadowen wrote: »
    Yeah, they're not going to do one season of mainland Westeros and another season of Essos/the North/whatnot. They'll mix all of the significant events in chronologically, and if they do that, they should be set for a decent enough plotline.

    Though I'm intrigued as to how the hell they're going to do
    Spoiler:

    She's not
    Spoiler:

    Yeah, I knew about all that.
    Spoiler:

    Gary Gygax wrote:
    ''The secret we should never let the gamemasters know is that they don't need any rules.''
  • override367override367 Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Kana wrote: »
    Spoiler:

    Well, right now if Tywin dies Arya's probably just going back into the pigsty and the torturer's understudy gets to practice on her. Anyway, it'll prolly go like in the books - the first death she doesn't really believe he can kill ANYONE yet, so she picks an easy target. Second one she gets angry at a horrible guard and orders his death, realizes she fucked up but can't take it back in time. And then #3 will probably still result in Harrenhal falling to the Boltons.

    Since Arya's not going by Weasel, apparently they named the jailer Weasel. So there's definitely still going to still be Weasel soup, just with a slightly different reason for the name.

    It frankly makes no sense for Arya to want Tywin dead, from her point of view he's actually one of the better people without Stark after their name that she has met.

    override367 on
    XBLIVE: Biggestoverride
    League of Legends: override367
  • poshnialloposhniallo Registered User regular
    Yar wrote: »
    poshniallo wrote: »
    Your idea of sense or humanity has never matched mine.

    ...ok. The guy just finished brashly exiling his cousin for saying he was tired and needed a rest, and made it redundantly clear that if he weren't a Lannister, he'd be dead for saying that. Next up, his servant threatens to kill him, and... what exactly? Explain your superior sense of humanity here.

    Humans often act suboptimally.

    I figure I could take a bear.
  • ArbitraryDescriptorArbitraryDescriptor Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Shadowen wrote: »
    Yeah, they're not going to do one season of mainland Westeros and another season of Essos/the North/whatnot. They'll mix all of the significant events in chronologically, and if they do that, they should be set for a decent enough plotline.

    Though I'm intrigued as to how the hell they're going to do
    Spoiler:

    She's not
    Spoiler:

    Yeah, I knew about all that.
    Spoiler:
    Spoiler:

    ArbitraryDescriptor on
    Automata-Sg.png
  • DracomicronDracomicron Registered User regular
    Shadowen wrote: »
    Yeah, they're not going to do one season of mainland Westeros and another season of Essos/the North/whatnot. They'll mix all of the significant events in chronologically, and if they do that, they should be set for a decent enough plotline.

    Though I'm intrigued as to how the hell they're going to do
    Spoiler:

    She's not
    Spoiler:

    Yeah, I knew about all that.
    Spoiler:
    Spoiler:

    True.

    That said, I should go watch 300 again. :winky:

    Gary Gygax wrote:
    ''The secret we should never let the gamemasters know is that they don't need any rules.''
  • MyiagrosMyiagros Registered User regular
    From what I understand, I think it might have been mentioned in an interview during season 1, but she has a non-nude clause since she became a mother.

    iRevert wrote: »
    Because if you're going to attempt to squeeze that big black monster into your slot you will need to be able to take at least 12 inches or else you're going to have a bad time...
    Steam: MyiagrosX27
  • valiancevaliance Registered User regular
    Myiagros wrote: »
    From what I understand, I think it might have been mentioned in an interview during season 1, but she has a non-nude clause since she became a mother.

    so I guess we dont get that myrish swamp scene huh

  • SmoogySmoogy Registered User regular
    I can just see them altering things a lot come book 4/5, for the better. Things George R. R. Martin should have left out anyway. For example:
    Spoiler:

    Streamline the story into what it SHOULD have been, if Martin had maintained his brilliant writing from 1-3 in 4 and 5.

    3DS Friend Code: 1821-8991-4141
    Currently playing: Diablo 3, Pokemon X, 999
    Smoogy#1689
  • saggiosaggio Registered User regular
    Smoogy wrote: »
    I can just see them altering things a lot come book 4/5, for the better. Things George R. R. Martin should have left out anyway. For example:
    Spoiler:

    Streamline the story into what it SHOULD have been, if Martin had maintained his brilliant writing from 1-3 in 4 and 5.

    All of that is stupid. You basically want the show to eliminate the entirety of Dany's storyline and some very significant, big things that matter for the overall arc. Some stuff will have to be cut from AFFC and ADWD in whichever season they inhabit, but pretty much everything you've listed is pretty important to the story.

    Moreover, most of the concerns people had with AFFC and ADWD was that it was so loooooong without much plot movement. All of that is alleviated in the television show, by necessity. They only have 10 episodes per season and only 60 minutes of screen time each week. Each character is only getting maybe a scene or two once every second episode at this point; do you think that the show will indulge hours of Brienne riding around the wilderness with Podrick and Nimble Dick? Or Tyrion wondering aloud where do whores go?

    I don't think so.

    Moreover, Jon Connington is awesome (as is everyone from Dorne), and totally necessary for the plot. Aegon, whether he is legitimate or not, is a pretty big deal.

    3DS: 0232-9436-6893
  • saggiosaggio Registered User regular
    I don't know why that stuff is struck through. Automatic spoiler proofing, or something?

    3DS: 0232-9436-6893
  • MyiagrosMyiagros Registered User regular
    Smoogy wrote: »
    I can just see them altering things a lot come book 4/5, for the better. Things George R. R. Martin should have left out anyway. For example:
    Spoiler:

    Streamline the story into what it SHOULD have been, if Martin had maintained his brilliant writing from 1-3 in 4 and 5.
    Spoiler:
    Some stuff definitely should be cut, but they can do that by cutting down a lot of the travelling that is seen in the books(ie. Brienne in AFFC). Cutting out potentially major characters is not the way to do it.

    iRevert wrote: »
    Because if you're going to attempt to squeeze that big black monster into your slot you will need to be able to take at least 12 inches or else you're going to have a bad time...
    Steam: MyiagrosX27
  • ArbitraryDescriptorArbitraryDescriptor Registered User regular
    Smoogy wrote: »
    I can just see them altering things a lot come book 4/5, for the better. Things George R. R. Martin should have left out anyway. For example:
    Spoiler:

    Streamline the story into what it SHOULD have been, if Martin had maintained his brilliant writing from 1-3 in 4 and 5.
    What? No.
    Spoiler:

    Automata-Sg.png
  • CanadianWolverineCanadianWolverine Registered User regular
    I gotta wonder why some people even admit they read the books with how much they want to cut. Most things from the books are just establishing the setting anyways from a single point of view, the tv show is not stuck in first person. All kinds of things will take a 1000 words and turn it into a single picture.

    For me, the big thing from the books that I wonder if it will be cut or not is the songs. The whole appeal of these books for me is how much world is not like it is in bard's songs but then suddenly it is - that is the return of magic IMHO. Your fingers or your tongue, bard, which do you want cut?

    steam_sig.png
  • valiancevaliance Registered User regular
    Smoogy wrote: »
    I can just see them altering things a lot come book 4/5, for the better. Things George R. R. Martin should have left out anyway. For example:
    Spoiler:

    Streamline the story into what it SHOULD have been, if Martin had maintained his brilliant writing from 1-3 in 4 and 5.

    Yeah a lot of these books have turned into filler. Book 3 was the high point of the series, matched only by perhaps the theon work in book 5, which is some of GRRM's best stuff. I still love them, but I wish they maintained the level they had at SOS.
    Spoiler:

  • TarantioTarantio Registered User regular
    I don't talk about other book series on the internet much. Is it common for people to wish the author had cut out entire characters and plot arcs? Or to skip them when reading?

    It's just so alien to me, and the way I approach books.

    "Arguing with anonymous strangers on the Internet is a sucker's game because they almost always turn out to be -- or to be indistinguishable from -- self-righteous sixteen-year-olds possessing infinite amounts of free time."
    Neal Stephenson
  • InvisibleInvisible Registered User regular
    I find it strange too. It's not filler if it's actually establishing plot.

    steam_sig.png
  • reVersereVerse Never odd or even Registered User regular
    It's mostly people who don't have the mental power to comprehend stories with more than one important character who moves in a straight line from point A to point B.

  • DomhnallDomhnall Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Tarantio wrote: »
    I don't talk about other book series on the internet much. Is it common for people to wish the author had cut out entire characters and plot arcs? Or to skip them when reading?

    It's just so alien to me, and the way I approach books.
    Spoiler:

    I know this is really vague but I find it hard to figure out what exactly would be suitably cut because I'm really sad whenever they change anything. What I'm trying to say is cutting out entire massive chunks of the story is crazy and they'd never do that. They'll just cut bits and pieces down.

    Domhnall on
    Xbox Live - Minty D Vision
    Steam - Minty D. Vision!
    Origin/BF3 - MintyDVision
  • NotYouNotYou Registered User regular
    reVerse wrote: »
    It's mostly people who don't have the mental power to comprehend stories with more than one important character who moves in a straight line from point A to point B.

    My theory is that lots of people don't like reading

  • TaminTamin Registered User regular
    saggio wrote: »
    I don't know why that stuff is struck through. Automatic spoiler proofing, or something?

    You tried to write season(s), but put brackets instead of parentheses. Which turned it into the html code for strike. ... odd that it didn't require a close tag, but Vanilla is weird, to say the least.

  • LoserForHireXLoserForHireX Registered User regular
    reVerse wrote: »
    It's mostly people who don't have the mental power to comprehend stories with more than one important character who moves in a straight line from point A to point B.

    Do you really need to be a dick about it?

    "The only way to get rid of a temptation is to give into it." - Oscar Wilde
    "We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
  • CelestialBadgerCelestialBadger Registered User regular
    Spoiler:
    Spoiler:

  • quantumcat42quantumcat42 Registered User regular
    Apparently this guy is auditioning for a "mystery role" in season 3. Hm, what could it possibly be?

  • ArbitraryDescriptorArbitraryDescriptor Registered User regular
    Could be a number of people. The Mance, Magnar, Tormund Giantsbane - Husband to Bears.

    Automata-Sg.png
  • saggiosaggio Registered User regular
    Could be a number of people. The Mance, Magnar, Tormund Giantsbane - Husband to Bears.

    Totally Tormund. That's great! He's my favourite wildling.
    Tamin wrote: »
    saggio wrote: »
    I don't know why that stuff is struck through. Automatic spoiler proofing, or something?

    You tried to write season(s), but put brackets instead of parentheses. Which turned it into the html code for strike. ... odd that it didn't require a close tag, but Vanilla is weird, to say the least.

    Ah, yeah, I see that now. Thanks for the heads up.

    3DS: 0232-9436-6893
  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    Apparently this guy is auditioning for a "mystery role" in season 3. Hm, what could it possibly be?

    BRIAN BLESSED

    History is an account, mostly false, of events, mostly unimportant, which are brought about by rulers, mostly knaves, and soldiers, mostly fools.
  • LaOsLaOs Registered User regular
    This is one example of why I love the TV ONLY thread:
    Those are all fair. And yeah it does point more to her loyalty being more for sale than her specifically being after Tyrion. It was more something that crossed my mind when I was worried about Tyrion. I'll say my guess was

    1. Happenstance with Bronn and her crossing paths and there was something going on with her and the other guy she was with - not sure if she was gonna kill him or something. But I'm guessing Tywin might know what she is.

    2. Yeah I kinda doubt Cersei is involved. I'm guessing it's more Tywin that had her for some purpose and would be worried about her loyalty.

    ...huh. Tywin and a whore? He seems so disdainful of them and his son's use of them. Maybe she's working for him as a spy.

    Someone started speculating about possible hidden motives/characterization for Shae and this was the latest post. :)

  • TaminTamin Registered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    Apparently this guy is auditioning for a "mystery role" in season 3. Hm, what could it possibly be?

    BRIAN BLESSED

    I concur it should be Tormund!

  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    reVerse wrote: »
    It's mostly people who don't have the mental power to comprehend stories with more than one important character who moves in a straight line from point A to point B.

    Do you really need to be a dick about it?

    Sorry, but when the suggestions are "Let's cut every plot thread for the second half of the series", mockery and disdain is required.

Sign In or Register to comment.