Video Game Industry Thread: 300+ people lose their jobs. Curt Schilling still rich.

Rorus Raz

Details on the Pokemon thing here.

Nintendo was not pleased, to put it mildly.

skeldare

Turkey wrote: »

Rorus Raz wrote: »

It's funny to think that the N-Gage was ahead of its time.

Also worth noting is that the Pokemon Company has been flirting with iOS via an app. I don't think this means "Pokemon on iPhone!" any time soon, but even one of Nintendo's biggest allies is seeing the allure of Apple.

Could you link to that? I really need to read this now.

http://kotaku.com/5818044/her-it-is-an-official-pokmon-app

It's over a year old and still not out apparently.

UncleSporky

Where was I that people were talking about the potential brilliance of Nintendo releasing free short demos of games on iOS to encourage purchases on their actual devices?

Because that is an idea worth flirting with, at least.

cloudeagle

Here ya go, from last year:

Kotaku Japan is reporting that an official Pokemon game is on its way to the App Store and Android marketplace in Japan this summer. Provided the translations we’ve seen are accurate, it’s called Pokemon Say Tap? Apparently, it’s a rhythm game that has you tapping on Pokemon-themed cards in time with the game’s music.

When it hits it’ll be available for $0, which should strike you as an uncharacteristic move for a publisher who rails against the App Store when promoting the its comparatively high-priced 3DS and its high-priced games. But this probably isn’t a Nintendo-published joint; rather, it appears to be a The Pokemon Company title. The Pokemon Company is an affiliate of Nintendo and has licensing and marketing power over the well-loved, well-travelled IP. So, not-official, but official. You see what I'm getting at?

This does seem to have some amount Nintendo backing, though, if a listing on the game’s official JP page and a credit on the title screen itself is any indication of this kind of weighty stuff. I have a feeling the accreditation and promotion is more about "Hey, we're Nintendo; we do Pokemon!" than it says about Nintendo's plans for the App Store, which I'm almost positive there are none. Sorry, folks.

Either way, an official Pokemon app is on its way. I wonder if Nintendo or The Pokemon Company will start cracking down on the immense amount of unofficial Pokemon stuff on Android and the App Store?

http://toucharcade.com/2011/07/05/pokemon-coming-to-the-app-store-this-summer/

Seems to only be up in Japan, though.

Also there's an Xbox Live app for iOS.

Turkey

I was expecting some sort of 2d Pokedex, but this is quite surprising.

I wonder what the thought pattern was behind it?

The Wolfman

Wasn't there that stupid thing a few months back, where some dipshit scammer was putting up fake Pokemon games on the app store, and the takeaway analysts had was not "maybe the app store should get some better regulation" but instead "well gee, Nintendo is stupid not to put Pokemon games on it, clearly there's a demand".

The whole thing is silly regardless. I can see and appriciate the allure of Nintendo just going 3rd party ala Sega. But you have to be a real dip not to understand why they will not, especially in the near future.

RainbowDespair

I posted this in the kickstarter thread, but I think it's worth discussing here as well. It's an article about how the gaming populace is largely naive about how games are actually made and how kickstarter could end up being a harsh splash of reality.

http://odiousrepeater.wordpress.com/2012/04/20/dragged-kickstarting-and-screaming/

Some quotes:

here’s plenty of lofty conceptual goals, but precious few details on milestone dates, development methodologies, staffing or scheduling.

Most publishers wouldn’t want to be caught dead financing something so iffy. Again, it’s only because the average gamer is so pie-in-the-sky that this even has the slightest chance of working. And people are quick to capitalize on it; new projects are cropping up every day, and even though I find it very hard not to be excited at the prospect of a new Shadowrun or similar, I have no choice but to gawk at how sloppy some of these pitches and “project plans” are.

Finally, the budgets – the crazy-ass budgets! A role-playing game for 400 000 USD, a “realistic, squad-based tactical shooter” for half that, my goodness, how can they print this stuff with a straight face? Many developers would struggle to even make a convincing prototype for that kind of money, depending on where the quality bar is set. From the pledges that these games are getting, however, it seems like the bait-and-switch is working, and that’s ultimately what matters.

The results will include public outrage, scandals, legal conflicts and probably a newfound respect for the kind of stuff the average publisher has to put up with when dealing with arrogant, primadonna game developers. The corollary is that people will also be forced to stop deifying some of their developer idols, as their understanding of the nuances of the developer-financier relationship improves. Most importantly, however, is that the average person’s knowledge of how games development works, and their desire to look behind the scenes in the future, will likely increase many times over once they’ve lost a good chunk of their own hard-earned money to some glorified hack with a cool-sounding idea and a bit of stolen concept art. I can hardly wait for the first instance of someone who’d pledged 10 000 USD to one of these projects to painfully realize that he should learn the meaning of words like “milestone”, “risk matrix”, “contingency” and “feature creep”. Because ultimately, the only way to make people grow up that is better than to be allowed to own your failures, is to also be forced to own somebody else’s.

skeldare

The Wolfman wrote: »

Wasn't there that stupid thing a few months back, where some dipshit scammer was putting up fake Pokemon games on the app store, and the takeaway analysts had was not "maybe the app store should get some better regulation" but instead "well gee, Nintendo is stupid not to put Pokemon games on it, clearly there's a demand".

The whole thing is silly regardless. I can see and appriciate the allure of Nintendo just going 3rd party ala Sega. But you have to be a real dip not to understand why they will not, especially in the near future.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2012/02/fake-pokemon-yellow-rises-to-no-3-position-on-itunes-app-charts.ars

And therein, perhaps, lies the lesson in all this for Nintendo. If even a broken, unlicensed version of a decades-old Pokemon game can make it to the third position on the iOS App Store over the course of a weekend, imagine what a sensation a real, new Pokemon game would be on Apple's devices. Sure, it might cost Nintendo a few 3DS hardware sales, but why continue to struggle building an audience for your own mobile platform when Apple already has an established device with an audience that's obviously desperate for your software. In other words, why continue to try and beat the IP thieves when you can, instead, join them?

Rorus Raz

That's why I'm pretty much only going to even consider Kickstarters for experienced, accomplished developers. I assume Double Fine actually knows a thing or two about budgeting and maintaining realistic goals.

Then again, most developers like that aren't going to be investing heavily in Kickstarter. Which is the problem.

korodullin

Wasn't the "realistic squad-based tactical shooter" with the $200k budget only to get a playable alpha build out to show the other private investors they already had lined up an actual working product?

RainbowDespair

korodullin wrote: »

Wasn't the "realistic squad-based tactical shooter" with the $200k budget only to get a playable alpha build out to show the other private investors they already had lined up an actual working product?

Yes. Which is a powder keg just waiting to explode in a huge mess of broken promises.

What really bothers me about a lot of kickstarters is that they have feature creep build into them. "If we reach 200%, we'll add this feature! 300% and we'll add this feature!" The problem is you can't just throw money on a lot of features and expect them to work. I expect a lot of people who end up getting overfunded will discover that even with the extra money, the scope of their project has ballooned so much that they can't manage it.

The Wolfman

So the lesson that may be learned is that, while we may shake our fists at the perceived stupidity of how the big evil corporations like EA and Activision run their businesses, on at least a pretty decent level they do kind of know what they're doing.

Dritz

Didn't Nintendo release their earnings or something? Although I see the place for mobile (as in phone) games I'd really hate to see a future where they are the only game in town.

As for Nintendo's core franchises? Pokemon... maybe but movement would be annoying. Metroid? Yah right. Despite awesome platformers existing for the platform they have to be tailor made and are far from what I'd want from Mario. Zelda? No thanks.

The rise of mobile gaming and peoples insistence that Nintendo move toward them is not exactly something new. The reasoning behind it is the same reason why console wars are a thing. You are heavily invested in a platform and don't want to spend the time/money/effort to get something else to play a game you really, really want. Thus you must take it upon yourself to personally wage war on the 'others' so your platform is the only choice for developers.

I think everyone feels this way to some extent. Just today I expressed some annoyance in the Tales thread that those games never seem to make it to the Nintendo consoles. Since there are so many former gamers with smartphones I think it's only natural to hear some outcry for stuff they used to like.

Ninja Snarl P

Rorus Raz wrote: »

That's why I'm pretty much only going to even consider Kickstarters for experienced, accomplished developers. I assume Double Fine actually knows a thing or two about budgeting and maintaining realistic goals.

Then again, most developers like that aren't going to be investing heavily in Kickstarter. Which is the problem.

Aside from the "no duh" element that people should obviously not be investing in people with no experience and nothing more to show for a game than some ideas and concept art, that guy is being far too harsh on the Kickstarter thing.

For one, the way he rips on the Kickstarter budgets like they're just inconcievably stupid. What about the massive budget bloat that publishers inflict on games? I've seen that complaint a lot from developers. It's well within reason that a veteran team can construct a great game for 2 million from an IP they've been working on as a hobby for years if they don't have a publisher breathing down their neck. That goes double for something like the Shadowrun Kickstarter where the game is being developed for iOS/Android/PC devices; choosing that level of hardware will automatically cut out a huge portion of the costs related to the sort of visuals that publishers demand. It's not going to be some mega-hit that pushes the envelope of modern technology, but that approach is generally a crutch anyway.

Or the fact that the Wasteland 2/Shadowrun folks would even dare to run their Kickstarter without having the game half-designed already. Guess what? A good reputation can translate into funding. Half the problem with publishers these days is that they seem to know jack shit about the people developing a given game or IP and only care if that IP tends to make a lot of money.

The whole article seems pretty useless to me. The meaningful bits of it could be summed up in "don't give money to people you don't know anything about or think that funding a hundred bucks into something will get you a game worth a hundred bucks." In other words, folks should use some common sense funding this stuff. Not a revolutionary idea.

Dehumanized

I only back projects to the extent that I would be willing to lose if they fail. I'm sure there are masses of people who aren't approaching it in the same manner, though, and when one of the large projects inevitably does fall short it'll be a total mess.

DFA is kind of unique among the ones running that they built insight into the development process into the pitch with the documentary. Wouldn't be surprised if Shadowrun Returns or Wasteland 2 goes dark once they get underway.

Rorus Raz

Doesn't Kickstarter have a policy that the money is refunded if they fail to reach their goal?

Dehumanized

Their funding goal. If they fail to deliver on their project, Kickstarter does nothing. If they want $400k and only receive $398k of pledges, nobody pays anything. If they receive $401k but spent it all on yachts and hookers (instead of making Gundude 3: The Lost Gundudes), your money is gone.

UncleSporky

Dehumanized wrote: »

I only back projects to the extent that I would be willing to lose if they fail. I'm sure there are masses of people who aren't approaching it in the same manner, though, and when one of the large projects inevitably does fall short it'll be a total mess.

DFA is kind of unique among the ones running that they built insight into the development process into the pitch with the documentary. Wouldn't be surprised if Shadowrun Returns or Wasteland 2 goes dark once they get underway.

I was just going to say that before you edited. They have a fallback. You are funding a game slash documentary, and the pitch even presented the prospect that the game might be a spectacular failure, but at least it will be caught on film!

And their rewards were carefully set up so as not to promise too many in-game rewards. You get art books and music, something that they can fairly easily deliver on even if the game as a whole falls through. None of this "we will name a city after you and put a statue of you in town and also rotoscope animate you into the game and let you do one of the main characters' voices."

Ninja Snarl P

Dehumanized wrote: »

I only back projects to the extent that I would be willing to lose if they fail. I'm sure there are masses of people who aren't approaching it in the same manner, though, and when one of the large projects inevitably does fall short it'll be a total mess.

DFA is kind of unique among the ones running that they built insight into the development process into the pitch with the documentary. Wouldn't be surprised if Shadowrun Returns or Wasteland 2 goes dark once they get underway.

I would be extremely surprised if they went completely dark. Even if they didn't delve into the specifics of the gameplay (which would be wise until it's already heavily solidified), it would still be in the best interests of the Wasteland 2/Shadowrun guys to at least update on things like art designs or music snippets or things like that.

The Kickstarter funding is only where things start; if these devs keep the backers supplied with info throughout the development process, that's that much more time for word of mouth to expand the number of people who notice the game and want to get it when it's released.

The Wolfman

We'll just have to wait and see how the first inevitable Kickstarter scandal is handled. And I really doubt it'll be the simple "dine-n-dash" type. That one's easy and obvious. It'll be the one where they spent, they tried... and they failed. Either due to inexperience, mismanagement, or some combo of the two.

Honestly... I don't have much faith in the maturity of the internet to be calm and understanding. The loudest voices will very likely be those screaming for their money back.

skeldare

http://twitter.com/#!/Konami/status/195287273116401664

Corrupted transmission incoming from operative’s implant. Recovery initializing on 4.30.12 @ http://bit.ly/MGR430 #MakeItRight

Looks like there's going to be some kind of annoucement for Metal Gear Solid Rising Revengeance on April 30th at Metalgearsolid.com

Undead Scottsman

Well, to be fair, if you're putting money in, the kickstarter says that if you paid XXX amount of money, you get Y reward, with the reward often being a copy of the finished game.

If the company takes the money and runs, I imagine you'd be able to involve the Better Business Bureau since, you know, they just stole your money. I'm not a lawyer of course.

Ninja Snarl P

The Wolfman wrote: »

We'll just have to wait and see how the first inevitable Kickstarter scandal is handled. And I really doubt it'll be the simple "dine-n-dash" type. That one's easy and obvious. It'll be the one where they spent, they tried... and they failed. Either due to inexperience, mismanagement, or some combo of the two.

Honestly... I don't have much faith in the maturity of the internet to be calm and understanding. The loudest voices will very likely be those screaming for their money back.

I thoroughly expect the first scandal to be grab-and-run. The folks with reputations worth anything would almost certainly end up using their own money or finding alternate funding before simply throwing up their hands in defeat; it's the nobodies who wouldn't have anything to lose by walking with the money.

Zephiran

Well, there are those guys who're putting up a Kickstarter to re-localise The Kore Gang...

UncleSporky

Zephiran wrote: »

Well, there are those guys who're putting up a Kickstarter to re-localise The Kore Gang...

Actually they're not, they're just asking for money on their own homepage.

tyrannus

Rorus Raz wrote: »

That's why I'm pretty much only going to even consider Kickstarters for experienced, accomplished developers. I assume Double Fine actually knows a thing or two about budgeting and maintaining realistic goals.

Then again, most developers like that aren't going to be investing heavily in Kickstarter. Which is the problem.

It's the weirdest fucking thing ever, too. After the kickstarter campaign is over, the money goes into a regular checking account after Amazon and Kickstarter take their fees. It's not even escrowed or anything. There are no draw requests - it's literally as naked of a process as you eating chocolate.

Zephiran

Oh right. Memories of GAF commenting on the "sketchy looking nature of their site" come flushing to my mind.

Gaslight

tyrannus wrote: »

it's literally as naked of a process as you eating chocolate.

So you're one of my webcam subscribers, I take it.

EVOL

I know this is a few pages back, but holy shit at the Fire Emblem numbers. It sold in it's first week the lifetime sales of the DS Fire Emblems, and overtook the Wii and GC entries. That's amazing.

Here's the numbers:

20/04/90 [NFC] Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon and the Blade of Light - ? / 329.000
14/03/92 [NFC] Fire Emblem Gaiden - ? / 325.000
21/01/94 [SFC] Fire Emblem: Mystery of the Emblem - ? / 776.000
14/05/96 [SFC] Fire Emblem: Holy War Story - 228.578 / 429.763 (498.000 from sinobi)
28/08/99 [SFC] Fire Emblem: Thracia 776 - 30.104 / 158.695
29/03/02 [GBA] Fire Emblem: The Sealed Sword - 126.267 / 345.574
25/04/03 [GBA] Fire Emblem: Blazing Sword - 109.429 / 265.286
07/10/04 [GBA] Fire Emblem: The Sacred Stones - 146.026 / 246.719
20/04/05 [GCN] Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance - 100.357 / 156.413
22/02/07 [WII] Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn - 73.337 / 171.924
07/08/08 [NDS] Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon - 147.704 / 252.309
15/07/10 [NDS] Fire Emblem: Mystery of the Emblem - Hero of Light and Shadow - 147.045 / 247.248
19/04/12 [3DS] Fire Emblem: Awakening - 242.600 / NEW

It's safe to say we'll be seeing the series a lot more in the future.

RainbowDespair

I'm going to attribute the dramatic sales increase for Fire Emblem 3DS entirely to the fact that you can marry and have kids with a moe underage dragon girl.

Zephiran

Also every other character ever in the history of Fire Emblem is possibly going to see release as DLC.

Hunh, DLC people might actually be looking forward to for once and even buying the game just to get a chance at.

Curious, that.

Xenogears of Bore

RainbowDespair wrote: »

I'm going to attribute the dramatic sales increase for Fire Emblem 3DS entirely to the fact that you can marry and have kids with a moe underage dragon girl.

None of that is new to FE.

This will probably end up as the second or third best selling FE game. Apparently these MC numbers do not count the bundles or some ridiculous amount of units Nintendo directly sold with some promotion.

I give all the credit to the box art.

Valleo

Man I love me some Fire Emblem, but portable systems are smelly and stupid.

I'm hoping they'll decide to do a DS/3DS player with the WiiU (like the Gamecube had), since it will basically function the same as a DS/3DS double screen with it's touchscreen controller.

If they do that, it will be the first time I've purchased a console at launch.

LockedOnTarget

Valleo wrote: »

Man I love me some Fire Emblem, but portable systems are smelly and stupid.

I'm hoping they'll decide to do a DS/3DS player with the WiiU (like the Gamecube had), since it will basically function the same as a DS/3DS double screen with it's touchscreen controller.

If they do that, it will be the first time I've purchased a console at launch.

That's...actually a pretty sweet idea.

Dragkonias

Hmm...I wonder what was the reason for it doing so well...

I guess they did do a decent amount of promotions. What with all the ads and the free release of Sacred Stones.

Xenogears of Bore

Well it's basically a best of, everyone in the pool release and more or less has the best graphics the series has ever seen. The last six games in the series have been underwhelming graphically for the system they were on.

They did a decent amount of promotion too including headlining the original Nintendo Direct and more traditional ads as the game came close to release. They are also pushing early sales by offering free DLC for a limited time, a fantastically brilliant move that I can't believe other companies with more dlc experience didn't think of first. One of the main points of project ten dollars and online play codes is to get people to buy the game at full price on launch day. Instead of using the stick Nintendo decides to use the carrot and go, hey, free marth designed by this dude as long as you buy the game before May something or other.

Linespider5

LockedOnTarget wrote: »

Valleo wrote: »

Man I love me some Fire Emblem, but portable systems are smelly and stupid.

I'm hoping they'll decide to do a DS/3DS player with the WiiU (like the Gamecube had), since it will basically function the same as a DS/3DS double screen with it's touchscreen controller.

If they do that, it will be the first time I've purchased a console at launch.

That's...actually a pretty sweet idea.

Oh wow. Nintendo is absolutely doing this. This idea matches up immaculately with their philosophies of long-term planning and repackaging games.

Of course, we probably won't get that functionality until 2014, but it will happen.

Algertman

Dragkonias wrote: »

Hmm...I wonder what was the reason for it doing so well...

I guess they did do a decent amount of promotions. What with all the ads and the free release of Sacred Stones.

3DS is very hot over there right now.

Spoit

Turkey wrote: »

Rorus Raz wrote: »

It's funny to think that the N-Gage was ahead of its time.

Also worth noting is that the Pokemon Company has been flirting with iOS via an app. I don't think this means "Pokemon on iPhone!" any time soon, but even one of Nintendo's biggest allies is seeing the allure of Apple.

Could you link to that? I really need to read this now.

I thought Pokemon was wholly owned by Nintendo?

skeldare

Spoit wrote: »

Turkey wrote: »

Rorus Raz wrote: »

It's funny to think that the N-Gage was ahead of its time.

Also worth noting is that the Pokemon Company has been flirting with iOS via an app. I don't think this means "Pokemon on iPhone!" any time soon, but even one of Nintendo's biggest allies is seeing the allure of Apple.

Could you link to that? I really need to read this now.

I thought Pokemon was wholly owned by Nintendo?

The Pokemon Company is, Game Freak is not. Though it's Nintendo that brought out the iOS app.