When you kill X bandits, the bandits surrender or run away. When you blow up enough centaur supplies, the army (that has been futily attacking them the whole time) manages to push forward and burn their settlements down, even opening a new town if you push them all the way back (until they eventually push back in)
1. That sounds a lot like WoW's phasing.
2. If it's only seen by you, then it's still a LIE.
Somewhere along the line, MMOs stopped being "persistent multiplayer worlds" and became "single player experiences where other players happen to be running around as well". SWTOR is an excellent example of this.
I have no actual idea as to why people want to play MMOs as single player games, but they do. My only guess is that they want to "ride that shit through Ironforge", as it were, but don't want to actually talk to another player in game.
From what I've heard about GW2, this is not phased. It is open world zones and persistent for everyone.
The RPG Bestiary - Dangerous foes and legendary monsters for D&D 4th Edition
Check the top of the OP, I'm guessing Beezel/Montague isn't done paring down our alts yet. I think people can still invite you manually if you message them in-game?
Yeah I think I forgot to send Beezel a note, given that my characters have all been dropped from guild (Luminos, Katalytic). Unless I was a shitheel to somebody without knowing about it, but that seems less likely.
"It's just a game" is a bad argument from either side of this discussion because the whole point of an MMO is interacting with other people. Real people, with feelings. I mean, in real life, doesn't somebody you don't know being a jackass to you (even, or maybe especially, if you decide to leave the place because they're being a jackass) piss you off during the jackassery or after it's happened? Maybe put you in a bad mood for a while? The fact that it's text really doesn't mean anything. People are bothered in real life when people say stupid stuff, even if they know the person who's saying it is an idiot, so I don't really see how an MMO is any different aside from the Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory making it more likely you'll find idiots.
There is a huge difference here though, in real life you might be stuck dealing with jackasses.
On the internet, the only thing that stopping you from just walking away is yourself.
Also he was comparing DPS meter text to stuff like real life death sentences, cheating spouses, doctor diagnosis, etc.
There is a huge difference here though, in real life you might be stuck dealing with jackasses.
On the internet, the only thing that stopping you from just walking away is yourself.
Also he was comparing DPS meter text to stuff like real life death sentences, cheating spouses, doctor diagnosis, etc.
While that comparison is a bit extreme, calling it "just text" is incredibly dismissive. Just because you don't care doesn't mean others don't or shouldn't.
As for my opinion, I would prefer if they make it impossible to tell what others' DPS is, but a personal DPS meter would be awesome. That way, people can improve on their own if they so choose while diminishing the douchebaggery somewhat in pugs. Yes, people will still be assholes, but there's no point in giving them more outlets.
While that comparison is a bit extreme, calling it "just text" is incredibly dismissive. Just because you don't care doesn't mean others don't or shouldn't.
As for my opinion, I would prefer if they make it impossible to tell what others' DPS is, but a personal DPS meter would be awesome. That way, people can improve on their own if they so choose while diminishing the douchebaggery somewhat in pugs. Yes, people will still be assholes, but there's no point in giving them more outlets.
I personally don't care if Tera adds DPS meters or not. I read the tooltips and can tell when I'm killing faster or slower.
However the utility of DPS meters is good and I see no real reason they shouldn't be added. There are so many similar features in games that no one cries about, but since DPS meters might make them look like a bad player they get upset over it.
For example, no one complains in the same way about:
Scoreboard in an FPS
Win or Lose in fighting games
Finishing places in a racing game
Guitar Hero scores
Highest score in a co-op game (mass effect 3 for example)
....etc.
Games have ways of measuring performance all over the damn place. So if people feel good about themselves when they have higher DPS, then let them. If they spam that shit all the time and start being assholes, then leave... those type of players were gonna find a way to be an asshole anyway.
I've played many MMOs that have absolutely no form of DPS meters... still just as many assholes finding plenty of ways to act as such.
When you kill X bandits, the bandits surrender or run away. When you blow up enough centaur supplies, the army (that has been futily attacking them the whole time) manages to push forward and burn their settlements down, even opening a new town if you push them all the way back (until they eventually push back in)
1. That sounds a lot like WoW's phasing.
2. If it's only seen by you, then it's still a LIE.
Somewhere along the line, MMOs stopped being "persistent multiplayer worlds" and became "single player experiences where other players happen to be running around as well". SWTOR is an excellent example of this.
I have no actual idea as to why people want to play MMOs as single player games, but they do. My only guess is that they want to "ride that shit through Ironforge", as it were, but don't want to actually talk to another player in game.
From what I've heard about GW2, this is not phased. It is open world zones and persistent for everyone.
Ah, that's not so bad then.
On the subject of damage meters, there's one rather sizable issue that I see with them for Tera: there are many times during Tera's dynamic boss fights where NOT doing DPS does more for the party than doing DPS.
You don't need to watch all 20 minutes of that fight, but notice that the warrior (the only DPS) has the common sense to move AWAY from the boss when she's injured so that I can focus on healing the tank because she knows A) being forced to pound out heals is a great way to draw healing aggro and it's much harder (and slower) for a healer to stabilize two players than one and the tank takes priority.
DPS meters work in the prescripted bullcrap that is WoW because there are never any surprises during the fights. Bosses have a strict rotation and follow a script on their behavior.
Tera is a completely different beast in this regard. A player trying to rack up the most DPS will very likely do so at the cost of getting hit too often, causing the healer to need to do too much healing, drawing aggro and wiping, all because some asshat wanted to see the big numbers. Having the highest DPS is meaningless if it doesn't take into account good dodging. How much damage you AVOIDED is a more important stat in parties than how much damage you DID.
So suffice to say, I don't think DPS meters would do Tera any favors. I don't outright object to them, but I won't cry if we don't get them.
I archered several runs of SM last night. I'm sad that arc are considered sub par when i was critting the final boss for 12,000
Archer is a lot of fun and I hope the game does not devolve into 'must be one of 3 classes' to get a group. I'm having a blast shooting things!
FFXIV Petra Ironheart Infinity Mog 21 and over Free Company Sargatanas Server. Recruitment currently closed.
So suffice to say, I don't think DPS meters would do Tera any favors. I don't outright object to them, but I won't cry if we don't get them.
I think most anyone can draw the same conclusion that people aren't going to spam an endless DPS rotation in Tera. But when you are attacking, it would be nice to come in with prior knowledge as to what skills and combos are pulling off the most damage.
For example, I can tell from that video that the warrior could be doing more DPS if they read some tooltips and thought things out more. She keeps using death from above in her DPS rotation when the boss isn't moving. Then she is having to do rolls and run around to avoid damage. If she just would time her death from above during his attacks, then she wouldn't have to leave melee range as often. Death from above makes you invulnerable when the animation is going. The people in the video are around lvl 35? So as a warrior she should be able to do combative > traverse > blade draw... roll to dodge or reposition when the boss moves, then pounce > combative, followed by a mangle combo or another roll. DPS meters would allow her to try out combos on training dummies or mobs and learn what does the best damage, then apply that to the boss fight in between the doding and avoiding of damage.
Due to the lack of meters and proper tooltip reading, shes doing a ton of extra dodging for no reason... again, due to the wasted death from above skill. Also when she does get longer moments to do melee, I see skills being used that have no reason to be... like vortex blade, an AOE on a single enemy.
On the subject of damage meters, there's one rather sizable issue that I see with them for Tera: there are many times during Tera's dynamic boss fights where NOT doing DPS does more for the party than doing DPS.
You don't need to watch all 20 minutes of that fight, but notice that the warrior (the only DPS) has the common sense to move AWAY from the boss when she's injured so that I can focus on healing the tank because she knows A) being forced to pound out heals is a great way to draw healing aggro and it's much harder (and slower) for a healer to stabilize two players than one and the tank takes priority.
Er...what? Less than two minutes into the video the warrior is plinking away at the BAM at half health and then eats shit and dies. I mean I get what you're saying, just not sure it was the best example.
DPS meters work in the prescripted bullcrap that is WoW because there are never any surprises during the fights. Bosses have a strict rotation and follow a script on their behavior.
Are fights really not pre-scripted in TERA? I've only done BoL and SM so far, but I've definitely seen boss behavior that suggests there's at least some scripting involved.
So, fellow Eurotrash, what servers are you playing on?
I don't have any RL friends interested in Tera, so PA people would be a nice substitute.
Tried making a character on Essenia since it is mentioned in the OP, but there turned out to be a 30min queue and I got a disconnect after playing for 45mins. So I created a character on Allemantheia, only to read earlier that someone was playing on Velik.
I'm still only lvl 16, so it wont be too much of a hassle to move server again, but I would like to know beforehand what the server load is like.
So, fellow Eurotrash, what servers are you playing on?
I don't have any RL friends interested in Tera, so PA people would be a nice substitute.
Tried making a character on Essenia since it is mentioned in the OP, but there turned out to be a 30min queue and I got a disconnect after playing for 45mins. So I created a character on Allemantheia, only to read earlier that someone was playing on Velik.
I'm still only lvl 16, so it wont be too much of a hassle to move server again, but I would like to know beforehand what the server load is like.
I am downloading and installing. I will follow whoever, wherever.
However the utility of DPS meters is good and I see no real reason they shouldn't be added. There are so many similar features in games that no one cries about, but since DPS meters might make them look like a bad player they get upset over it.
For example, no one complains in the same way about:
Scoreboard in an FPS
Win or Lose in fighting games
Finishing places in a racing game
Guitar Hero scores
Highest score in a co-op game (mass effect 3 for example)
....etc.
Except for the final one all of those are victory conditions. You don't win at a dungeon by having the highest DPS. It's PVE, not PVP, and looking at it from the latter point of view is why people are objecting to seeing others' DPS in the first place, it creates contention where there is none. Did you finish the dungeon? Yes? Congrats, you won. Did it take longer than usual? A DPS meter wouldn't have changed anything.
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BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
I'd like to know as well where you fine gentlemen are congregating so I can provide accurate information in the OP for passing eyes
Wow. I just ventured to the EU forums to see about what this "Downloading Manifest" was and whether I should be worried. I know official forums are a hive of scum and villainy, but it seems like Frogster have the worst customer support. Maybe I should have just bought NA after all...
Er...what? Less than two minutes into the video the warrior is plinking away at the BAM at half health and then eats shit and dies. I mean I get what you're saying, just not sure it was the best example.
That was my fuck up: I healed her once, not realizing the boss had a followup attack on the way.
None of us had ever fought this BAM type before, and we were below level, but there are a number of times when the boss fired off one of those near-instant AoEs and she backed off until I could heal her up separate from the tank.
My point is that DPS meters are going to encourage the mindset of "The healer will deal with it." like they do in WoW.
Are fights really not pre-scripted in TERA? I've only done BoL and SM so far, but I've definitely seen boss behavior that suggests there's at least some scripting involved.
At certain health percentages, the BAM enrages and may summon adds or something, but their choice of attacks is still random enough and their tendency to leap around the room is still frequent enough that you can't fight a Tera boss like you do a WoW boss.
Wow. I just ventured to the EU forums to see about what this "Downloading Manifest" was and whether I should be worried. I know official forums are a hive of scum and villainy, but it seems like Frogster have the worst customer support. Maybe I should have just bought NA after all...
They're not great. After 3 tries managed to get through to LiveChat support on Saturday, was told the issue was escalated and had a ticket created for a problem. Still unresolved, despite being something that I was told they'd be doing at release anyway (merging all the mini sub-accounts into one).
My point is that DPS meters are going to encourage the mindset of "The healer will deal with it." like they do in WoW.
There are no meters right now, and I see people standing there mindlessly DPSing all the time.
I don't give a shit if they add meters or not. However if they do for some reason, I'll know for sure what when I am attacking I am doing the most damage I can.
That video you posted shows how someone is using their skills wrong. The warrior could have easily avoided damage/death if they used death from above correctly. Instead she was just mindlessly throwing it into her spamming of attacks. DPS meters might at least show a player like that, that certain moves shouldnt be used just randomly.... of course they could read the tooltip saying "death from above: makes you invulnerable when being used".
There are no meters right now, and I see people standing there mindlessly DPSing all the time.
I really don't think we're talking about this to the same extent.
I typically see players using evasion instead of just taking it on the jaw if it means doing a bit more DPS. It's not possible in Tera to "let the healer handle it" in the same way WoW does.
Again, I wouldn't mind DPS meters, but my concern is more that they'll encourage players to try to play Tera even more like WoW, and that just isn't good for anyone.
I don't see the point of a dps meter. I don't acre what my DPS is (As in I don't care what my damage per second is) I don't have the luxury of sitting there and running through an optimal rotation to maximize my deeps. I have to constantly reposition and get my hits in when I can. What hits I can get in and what I am able to do is dictated entirely by my current positioning and the bosses motions and actions.
If the boss just engaged in a long animation attack I may have time to do a whirlwind slash + overhand Strike if I'm positioned behind or to the side of him. If the boss is doing a quick animation I may be able to sneak in a Knockdown Strike + overhand Strike followed up by a stunning backstep and another overhand strike if it procced (otherwise I may go into distant blade to close the distance again)
Also I can already SEE what damage I'm doing, I can see what my abitilies are doing damage wise and which ones do more damage. A DPS meter is only useful to normalize your damage output and let you know over the course of X time I did Y damage.
That is useless information in Tera because you are constantly jockeying for position and making snap judgements on what abilities you can use based on their cast time/animation and how they will move you. That information is much more important than what sort of DPS you are doing.
I don't care about dps meters one way or the other, I used them in WoW but I didn't live by them either. I really don't see a place for them in Tera considering how the combat works.
Maybe if you are an archer or Sorc and have a regular rotation or something (Honestly though with how much the bosses bounce around you shouldn't even really have that) but most of the melee classes don't have that luxury.
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So, I -think- all the arguments against dps meters boil down to: Rude/stupid people used damage meters to do rude/stupid things, and now I don't want anyone to have damage meters.
It's as if you can't conceive of someone valuing improving their personal performance and using one of the most critical tools for doing so. It's not the only tool, but it is definitly a significant one. You also seem to have very little understanding of what and how meters are and can be used.
Tracking debuff/buff uptimes, seeing which abilities hit, and for how much and how often, all contribute to improving strategy in encounters. Playing better. Defeating an encounter in 3 minutes is better than defeating the encounter in 5, all things being equal. It is not better at any cost, but wanting to play better and having the tools to do so is completely reasonable. It's personally a primary reason I enjoy games. Moving towards mastery.
Dead players do 0 dps.
Your cartoonish histrionics about the subject absolutely undermine your reasonable concerns about people's behavior. The thing is, there are plenty of options and systems in place for dealing with bad behavior already. On the internet, the vast majority of suffering is self inflicted. If I don't like how someone plays, I don't play with them. If someone is annoying in chat, I ignore them. If the general chat channel is a festering cespool, I turn it off, as I imagine many other Nice Guys do.
There is room for debate about what dps meters may do to the player base at large, and whether or not they should be available in the game, but painting everyone that wants to use them as some sort of abusive stupid dick makes you sound like a fucking lunatic.
As an archer I'm mainly focused on keeping my DOT up, bursting when i can. Because I like to stay about 6-8m away to maximize my burst, I rarely get in a rotation. I'm constantly flanking, evading, and positioning for an optimal shot.
FFXIV Petra Ironheart Infinity Mog 21 and over Free Company Sargatanas Server. Recruitment currently closed.
I really don't think we're talking about this to the same extent.
I typically see players using evasion instead of just taking it on the jaw if it means doing a bit more DPS. It's not possible in Tera to "let the healer handle it" in the same way WoW does.
Again, I wouldn't mind DPS meters, but my concern is more that they'll encourage players to try to play Tera even more like WoW, and that just isn't good for anyone.
The type of player who is going to try and play Tera like WoW, is already doing that. I too see many people learning that they have to move a lot in combat. If people are currently dodging to avoid damage, meters isn't going to magically force them to stop dodging... if there are a few people who suddenly stop dodging because they are to focused on DPSing, then you don't think they just suck anyway?
DPS have two roles in this game, damage and not taking damage. So now a good DPS will need to perform both at the same time. I feel like people are way to focused on the "not taking damage" part, and ignoring the idea that a really good player will avoid damage while still doing damage.
Simply not taking damage as a DPS isn't really impressive at all in this game if they aren't also dishing some out.
I don't see the point of a dps meter. I don't acre what my DPS is (As in I don't care what my damage per second is) I don't have the luxury of sitting there and running through an optimal rotation to maximize my deeps. I have to constantly reposition and get my hits in when I can. What hits I can get in and what I am able to do is dictated entirely by my current positioning and the bosses motions and actions.
The other thing to consider is this: want to hone your rotation? Why not, oh I dunno, TEST TO SEE WHAT KILLS MOBS THE QUICKEST?! :P
If you kill one mob in half the time it took for you to kill another of the same kind of mob, either you crit or you've found a better rotation and should probably keep using it.
When you kill X bandits, the bandits surrender or run away. When you blow up enough centaur supplies, the army (that has been futily attacking them the whole time) manages to push forward and burn their settlements down, even opening a new town if you push them all the way back (until they eventually push back in)
1. That sounds a lot like WoW's phasing.
2. If it's only seen by you, then it's still a LIE.
Somewhere along the line, MMOs stopped being "persistent multiplayer worlds" and became "single player experiences where other players happen to be running around as well". SWTOR is an excellent example of this.
I have no actual idea as to why people want to play MMOs as single player games, but they do. My only guess is that they want to "ride that shit through Ironforge", as it were, but don't want to actually talk to another player in game.
From what I've heard about GW2, this is not phased. It is open world zones and persistent for everyone.
Ah, that's not so bad then.
It's basically exactly what you described, when I played a second character in the first area it was completely different than the first time. Instead of a farmer needing help with worms the farm had been taken by bandits and they needed to be repelled. There's a good video showing it off with a bad accent here
It's actually really goddamn amazing, even having played through it I didn't realize they were this detailed because I never followed anyone around, I just moved on, but the world genuinely changes based on players doing stuff (and it will eventually loop around and start back at phase 1)
There is room for debate about what dps meters may do to the player base at large, and whether or not they should be available in the game, but painting everyone that wants to use them as some sort of abusive stupid dick makes you sound like a fucking lunatic.
The other thing to consider is this: want to hone your rotation? Why not, oh I dunno, TEST TO SEE WHAT KILLS MOBS THE QUICKEST?! :P
If you kill one mob in half the time it took for you to kill another of the same kind of mob, either you crit or you've found a better rotation and should probably keep using it.
You don't have to manage mana on a single mob. Its pretty obvious what skills do the most damage. In a group fight with bosses or BAMs, can you simply spam that same move that killed a single mob quicker? Can your mana sustain the constant spamming of it? If it has a cooldown, what other skill should be used in between? If you have dots, do they add enough damage to be worth using when you can?
When SWTOR first came out we did exactly what you said. (well i didnt, I tank) The DPS got together in the PA empire guild and timed how long it took each of us to kill the same elite mob or whatever, solo. Just to see if anyone's class/gear was making it drastically harder for us to kill bosses. Turned out that no one was really lagging behind, of course the people with more gear killed the mob quicker, but it was all in reasonable means to not have someone need to really worry that they were under-geared. With DPS meters, we could have gotten the same answer a bit quicker and as the game changes with patches people would always have a way to gauge what they are doing. None of this had to do with who has the bigger internet weiner and how hard that weiner hits, it had to do with a group a people who wanted to progress together through the games content.
"I want thing X because it's useful to me!"
"Yeah, but thing X causes the community in general to behave like assholes."
"ARE YOU CALLING ME AN ASSHOLE!!"
And round and round we go.
Loving my Berserker. I am an easy target in PvP, mostly because if people start to lose against me they can just walk away from me and I can never catch up, but I am just wrecking everything in PvE, including BAM's. They're just not very scary when you can block literally all of their attacks
I do wish I had some more ways of PvPing more effectively though. I hear they're going to buff Berserker speeds soon which sounds like exactly the kind of stuff I need to keep people from evading me forever
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From what I've heard about GW2, this is not phased. It is open world zones and persistent for everyone.
Yeah I think I forgot to send Beezel a note, given that my characters have all been dropped from guild (Luminos, Katalytic). Unless I was a shitheel to somebody without knowing about it, but that seems less likely.
"...only mights and maybes."
There is a huge difference here though, in real life you might be stuck dealing with jackasses.
On the internet, the only thing that stopping you from just walking away is yourself.
Also he was comparing DPS meter text to stuff like real life death sentences, cheating spouses, doctor diagnosis, etc.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
That has turned it down to 90kb/s. Should I wait for it to pick up?
"...only mights and maybes."
*Update = the speed seems to be increasing by .02 of a kb/s constantly. Maybe I'll just leave it like this and see what it maxes at...
While that comparison is a bit extreme, calling it "just text" is incredibly dismissive. Just because you don't care doesn't mean others don't or shouldn't.
As for my opinion, I would prefer if they make it impossible to tell what others' DPS is, but a personal DPS meter would be awesome. That way, people can improve on their own if they so choose while diminishing the douchebaggery somewhat in pugs. Yes, people will still be assholes, but there's no point in giving them more outlets.
XBL: Torn Hoodie
@hoodiethirteen
"...only mights and maybes."
I personally don't care if Tera adds DPS meters or not. I read the tooltips and can tell when I'm killing faster or slower.
However the utility of DPS meters is good and I see no real reason they shouldn't be added. There are so many similar features in games that no one cries about, but since DPS meters might make them look like a bad player they get upset over it.
For example, no one complains in the same way about:
Scoreboard in an FPS
Win or Lose in fighting games
Finishing places in a racing game
Guitar Hero scores
Highest score in a co-op game (mass effect 3 for example)
....etc.
Games have ways of measuring performance all over the damn place. So if people feel good about themselves when they have higher DPS, then let them. If they spam that shit all the time and start being assholes, then leave... those type of players were gonna find a way to be an asshole anyway.
I've played many MMOs that have absolutely no form of DPS meters... still just as many assholes finding plenty of ways to act as such.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Ah, that's not so bad then.
On the subject of damage meters, there's one rather sizable issue that I see with them for Tera: there are many times during Tera's dynamic boss fights where NOT doing DPS does more for the party than doing DPS.
As an example...
You don't need to watch all 20 minutes of that fight, but notice that the warrior (the only DPS) has the common sense to move AWAY from the boss when she's injured so that I can focus on healing the tank because she knows A) being forced to pound out heals is a great way to draw healing aggro and
DPS meters work in the prescripted bullcrap that is WoW because there are never any surprises during the fights. Bosses have a strict rotation and follow a script on their behavior.
Tera is a completely different beast in this regard. A player trying to rack up the most DPS will very likely do so at the cost of getting hit too often, causing the healer to need to do too much healing, drawing aggro and wiping, all because some asshat wanted to see the big numbers. Having the highest DPS is meaningless if it doesn't take into account good dodging. How much damage you AVOIDED is a more important stat in parties than how much damage you DID.
So suffice to say, I don't think DPS meters would do Tera any favors. I don't outright object to them, but I won't cry if we don't get them.
Archer is a lot of fun and I hope the game does not devolve into 'must be one of 3 classes' to get a group. I'm having a blast shooting things!
Infinity Mog 21 and over Free Company Sargatanas Server. Recruitment currently closed.
I think most anyone can draw the same conclusion that people aren't going to spam an endless DPS rotation in Tera. But when you are attacking, it would be nice to come in with prior knowledge as to what skills and combos are pulling off the most damage.
For example, I can tell from that video that the warrior could be doing more DPS if they read some tooltips and thought things out more. She keeps using death from above in her DPS rotation when the boss isn't moving. Then she is having to do rolls and run around to avoid damage. If she just would time her death from above during his attacks, then she wouldn't have to leave melee range as often. Death from above makes you invulnerable when the animation is going. The people in the video are around lvl 35? So as a warrior she should be able to do combative > traverse > blade draw... roll to dodge or reposition when the boss moves, then pounce > combative, followed by a mangle combo or another roll. DPS meters would allow her to try out combos on training dummies or mobs and learn what does the best damage, then apply that to the boss fight in between the doding and avoiding of damage.
Due to the lack of meters and proper tooltip reading, shes doing a ton of extra dodging for no reason... again, due to the wasted death from above skill. Also when she does get longer moments to do melee, I see skills being used that have no reason to be... like vortex blade, an AOE on a single enemy.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Er...what? Less than two minutes into the video the warrior is plinking away at the BAM at half health and then eats shit and dies. I mean I get what you're saying, just not sure it was the best example.
Are fights really not pre-scripted in TERA? I've only done BoL and SM so far, but I've definitely seen boss behavior that suggests there's at least some scripting involved.
I don't have any RL friends interested in Tera, so PA people would be a nice substitute.
Tried making a character on Essenia since it is mentioned in the OP, but there turned out to be a 30min queue and I got a disconnect after playing for 45mins. So I created a character on Allemantheia, only to read earlier that someone was playing on Velik.
I'm still only lvl 16, so it wont be too much of a hassle to move server again, but I would like to know beforehand what the server load is like.
.
Island. Being on fire.
I am downloading and installing. I will follow whoever, wherever.
"...only mights and maybes."
That was my fuck up: I healed her once, not realizing the boss had a followup attack on the way.
None of us had ever fought this BAM type before, and we were below level, but there are a number of times when the boss fired off one of those near-instant AoEs and she backed off until I could heal her up separate from the tank.
My point is that DPS meters are going to encourage the mindset of "The healer will deal with it." like they do in WoW.
At certain health percentages, the BAM enrages and may summon adds or something, but their choice of attacks is still random enough and their tendency to leap around the room is still frequent enough that you can't fight a Tera boss like you do a WoW boss.
There are no meters right now, and I see people standing there mindlessly DPSing all the time.
I don't give a shit if they add meters or not. However if they do for some reason, I'll know for sure what when I am attacking I am doing the most damage I can.
That video you posted shows how someone is using their skills wrong. The warrior could have easily avoided damage/death if they used death from above correctly. Instead she was just mindlessly throwing it into her spamming of attacks. DPS meters might at least show a player like that, that certain moves shouldnt be used just randomly.... of course they could read the tooltip saying "death from above: makes you invulnerable when being used".
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I really don't think we're talking about this to the same extent.
I typically see players using evasion instead of just taking it on the jaw if it means doing a bit more DPS. It's not possible in Tera to "let the healer handle it" in the same way WoW does.
Again, I wouldn't mind DPS meters, but my concern is more that they'll encourage players to try to play Tera even more like WoW, and that just isn't good for anyone.
If the boss just engaged in a long animation attack I may have time to do a whirlwind slash + overhand Strike if I'm positioned behind or to the side of him. If the boss is doing a quick animation I may be able to sneak in a Knockdown Strike + overhand Strike followed up by a stunning backstep and another overhand strike if it procced (otherwise I may go into distant blade to close the distance again)
Also I can already SEE what damage I'm doing, I can see what my abitilies are doing damage wise and which ones do more damage. A DPS meter is only useful to normalize your damage output and let you know over the course of X time I did Y damage.
That is useless information in Tera because you are constantly jockeying for position and making snap judgements on what abilities you can use based on their cast time/animation and how they will move you. That information is much more important than what sort of DPS you are doing.
I don't care about dps meters one way or the other, I used them in WoW but I didn't live by them either. I really don't see a place for them in Tera considering how the combat works.
Maybe if you are an archer or Sorc and have a regular rotation or something (Honestly though with how much the bosses bounce around you shouldn't even really have that) but most of the melee classes don't have that luxury.
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It's as if you can't conceive of someone valuing improving their personal performance and using one of the most critical tools for doing so. It's not the only tool, but it is definitly a significant one. You also seem to have very little understanding of what and how meters are and can be used.
Tracking debuff/buff uptimes, seeing which abilities hit, and for how much and how often, all contribute to improving strategy in encounters. Playing better. Defeating an encounter in 3 minutes is better than defeating the encounter in 5, all things being equal. It is not better at any cost, but wanting to play better and having the tools to do so is completely reasonable. It's personally a primary reason I enjoy games. Moving towards mastery.
Dead players do 0 dps.
Your cartoonish histrionics about the subject absolutely undermine your reasonable concerns about people's behavior. The thing is, there are plenty of options and systems in place for dealing with bad behavior already. On the internet, the vast majority of suffering is self inflicted. If I don't like how someone plays, I don't play with them. If someone is annoying in chat, I ignore them. If the general chat channel is a festering cespool, I turn it off, as I imagine many other Nice Guys do.
There is room for debate about what dps meters may do to the player base at large, and whether or not they should be available in the game, but painting everyone that wants to use them as some sort of abusive stupid dick makes you sound like a fucking lunatic.
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The type of player who is going to try and play Tera like WoW, is already doing that. I too see many people learning that they have to move a lot in combat. If people are currently dodging to avoid damage, meters isn't going to magically force them to stop dodging... if there are a few people who suddenly stop dodging because they are to focused on DPSing, then you don't think they just suck anyway?
DPS have two roles in this game, damage and not taking damage. So now a good DPS will need to perform both at the same time. I feel like people are way to focused on the "not taking damage" part, and ignoring the idea that a really good player will avoid damage while still doing damage.
Simply not taking damage as a DPS isn't really impressive at all in this game if they aren't also dishing some out.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
The other thing to consider is this: want to hone your rotation? Why not, oh I dunno, TEST TO SEE WHAT KILLS MOBS THE QUICKEST?! :P
If you kill one mob in half the time it took for you to kill another of the same kind of mob, either you crit or you've found a better rotation and should probably keep using it.
It's basically exactly what you described, when I played a second character in the first area it was completely different than the first time. Instead of a farmer needing help with worms the farm had been taken by bandits and they needed to be repelled. There's a good video showing it off with a bad accent here
It's actually really goddamn amazing, even having played through it I didn't realize they were this detailed because I never followed anyone around, I just moved on, but the world genuinely changes based on players doing stuff (and it will eventually loop around and start back at phase 1)
You don't have to manage mana on a single mob. Its pretty obvious what skills do the most damage. In a group fight with bosses or BAMs, can you simply spam that same move that killed a single mob quicker? Can your mana sustain the constant spamming of it? If it has a cooldown, what other skill should be used in between? If you have dots, do they add enough damage to be worth using when you can?
When SWTOR first came out we did exactly what you said. (well i didnt, I tank) The DPS got together in the PA empire guild and timed how long it took each of us to kill the same elite mob or whatever, solo. Just to see if anyone's class/gear was making it drastically harder for us to kill bosses. Turned out that no one was really lagging behind, of course the people with more gear killed the mob quicker, but it was all in reasonable means to not have someone need to really worry that they were under-geared. With DPS meters, we could have gotten the same answer a bit quicker and as the game changes with patches people would always have a way to gauge what they are doing. None of this had to do with who has the bigger internet weiner and how hard that weiner hits, it had to do with a group a people who wanted to progress together through the games content.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
"Yeah, but thing X causes the community in general to behave like assholes."
"ARE YOU CALLING ME AN ASSHOLE!!"
And round and round we go.
I do wish I had some more ways of PvPing more effectively though. I hear they're going to buff Berserker speeds soon which sounds like exactly the kind of stuff I need to keep people from evading me forever