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[TRENCHES] Thursday, June 28, 2012 - Impasse

GethGeth LegionPerseus VeilRegistered User, Super Moderator, Penny Arcade Staff, Vanilla Staff vanilla
edited June 2012 in The Penny Arcade Hub
Impasse


Impasse
http://trenchescomic.com/comic/post/impasse

More Shorts!

Anonymous

- They routinely made people work every day of the week without a day off, which is illegal in our state. They would then lie to HR and production about it. When they were finally busted on it, they started giving people “split” days off, i.e. 12 hours off one day, and 12 hours off another day, which is just as illegal.

- Management would frequently give “rousing” speeches during crunch every day at 4:55 about how necessary our overtime was, and how we should proud to be giving it our all because it’ll be just so worth it when the game ships. Why 4:55? Because management left at 5:00.

- One day we were locked out of the building. It was the weekend and the complex was closed. I called the boss to tell him we needed let in, and he bitched me out. He eventually drove by and threw his building key out the window then sped off.


Posts

  • Dark Raven XDark Raven X When you speak I hear muffinsRegistered User regular
    Wait what.

    Did we skip a comic?

    rv0c1titu3ci.pngc0ppr8iiann6.png
  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Death Groupie Registered User regular
    Marley got fired, remember? Came back as Rarley or whatever.

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  • jbizzlejbizzle Registered User
    Credenza is talking about Q. He was the lead tester so it falls back to him. This is why Q 's demeanor changes.

  • AegeriAegeri Registered User regular
    That was also my interpretation.

  • Ori KleinOri Klein Registered User regular
    As is mine. Which is entirely hilarious.
    However, the matter of the mole is still afoot...unless Q was to be blamed for it as well? O.o

  • GaslightGaslight Registered User regular
    jbizzle wrote: »
    Credenza is talking about Q. He was the lead tester so it falls back to him. This is why Q 's demeanor changes.

    Bingo.
    Ori Klein wrote: »
    As is mine. Which is entirely hilarious.
    However, the matter of the mole is still afoot...unless Q was to be blamed for it as well? O.o

    As I've mentioned before, Q somehow getting blamed for the leak so he can be busted back down to QA and be in the comic regularly again was my initial prediction. I'm not sure how "necessary" it really is though, since he's still around often enough.

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  • Ori KleinOri Klein Registered User regular
    Speaking of Trench stories, here's one with a happy ending note I ran across on ycombinator.
    http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/vomtn/update_my_friends_call_me_a_scumbag_because_i/

  • DiannaoChongDiannaoChong Registered User regular
    edited June 2012
    I just now noticed Q wears a utilikilt. It's a little offputting in the comic, just looks awkward.

    edit: that reddit story (the original) is exactly the same as mine, only about 5 minutes into the job I let them know I could have this spreadsheet fed into this vb form using a vbscript I could write in about an hour, with more accuracy and faster then I could ever do it by hand. They were super impressed and had me do it, but really confused because thats all they had for me to do for weeks as busy work while they got my training ready for my real position. They recognized my talents and shifted my job pretty soon to working on automation/MSSQL stuff for the company. That guy took a super lazy wrong approach to all of that and is lucky he isn't sued/in jail for preventing access to code that the company owns.

    DiannaoChong on
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  • DaedalusDaedalus Registered User regular
    Geth wrote:
    Management would frequently give “rousing” speeches during crunch every day at 4:55 about how necessary our overtime was, and how we should proud to be giving it our all because it’ll be just so worth it when the game ships. Why 4:55? Because management left at 5:00.

    This would probably result in me leaving around 5:05.

    vvvvvv-dithw.png
  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    Ori Klein wrote: »
    Speaking of Trench stories, here's one with a happy ending note I ran across on ycombinator.
    http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/vomtn/update_my_friends_call_me_a_scumbag_because_i/

    That dude is all up in the absolutely not in the right. Any code you write on the company dime belongs to the company, and he's violating all kinds of shit with what he's pulling.

    "Well, look at this. Appears we got here just in the nick of time. What's that make us?"
    "Big Damn Heroes, Sir."
    "Ain't we just."
  • cckerberoscckerberos Registered User regular
    Darkewolfe wrote: »
    Ori Klein wrote: »
    Speaking of Trench stories, here's one with a happy ending note I ran across on ycombinator.
    http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/vomtn/update_my_friends_call_me_a_scumbag_because_i/

    That dude is all up in the absolutely not in the right. Any code you write on the company dime belongs to the company, and he's violating all kinds of shit with what he's pulling.
    Things might be different in the Netherlands, though.

    steam_sig.png
  • pwn493pwn493 Registered User regular
    Darkewolfe wrote: »
    Ori Klein wrote: »
    Speaking of Trench stories, here's one with a happy ending note I ran across on ycombinator.
    http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/vomtn/update_my_friends_call_me_a_scumbag_because_i/

    That dude is all up in the absolutely not in the right. Any code you write on the company dime belongs to the company, and he's violating all kinds of shit with what he's pulling.

    I found this story a little unclear. They fired the guy and then demanded his password? At this point they have his code, they just can't access it, and he doesn't owe them anything, because he doesn't work for them. Then he has a bunch of meetings with the company management. Was he never fired, or did he get rehired?

    I think his intentionally preventing others from accessing the code specifically is the biggest issue. Most corporations set up their work machines so that they're inaccessible without the correct passwords (on the hard disk and OS), to limit the damage caused if a machine is stolen. Many developers I know have tons of code on their machine that they've written on the company dime to help them do their job that isn't widely available, because it's in a state where it's really hard to use and/or specific to their job. Writing a tool that's only on your machine is natural, but writing one that only you can use is pretty difficult to justify.

    On the other hand, the moment he mentioned the tool, he got fired, which makes me think his actions, while wrong, were appropriate.

  • jackaljackal Registered User regular
    I would be interested to know type of data entry he is doing that can be automated. I've heard there are a lot of companies out there that will literally hire people to move things between excel spreadsheet and webapps or email, stuff like that. But most data entry jobs involved scanned images so he would have had to set up an OCR system which would be take a lot of work and expertise.

  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    pwn493 wrote: »
    Darkewolfe wrote: »
    Ori Klein wrote: »
    Speaking of Trench stories, here's one with a happy ending note I ran across on ycombinator.
    http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/vomtn/update_my_friends_call_me_a_scumbag_because_i/

    That dude is all up in the absolutely not in the right. Any code you write on the company dime belongs to the company, and he's violating all kinds of shit with what he's pulling.

    I found this story a little unclear. They fired the guy and then demanded his password? At this point they have his code, they just can't access it, and he doesn't owe them anything, because he doesn't work for them. Then he has a bunch of meetings with the company management. Was he never fired, or did he get rehired?

    I think his intentionally preventing others from accessing the code specifically is the biggest issue. Most corporations set up their work machines so that they're inaccessible without the correct passwords (on the hard disk and OS), to limit the damage caused if a machine is stolen. Many developers I know have tons of code on their machine that they've written on the company dime to help them do their job that isn't widely available, because it's in a state where it's really hard to use and/or specific to their job. Writing a tool that's only on your machine is natural, but writing one that only you can use is pretty difficult to justify.

    On the other hand, the moment he mentioned the tool, he got fired, which makes me think his actions, while wrong, were appropriate.

    I dunno about the Netherlands, but in the U.S. they could sue his ass into the ground for not providing that password.

    "Well, look at this. Appears we got here just in the nick of time. What's that make us?"
    "Big Damn Heroes, Sir."
    "Ain't we just."
  • DiannaoChongDiannaoChong Registered User regular
    jackal wrote: »
    I would be interested to know type of data entry he is doing that can be automated. I've heard there are a lot of companies out there that will literally hire people to move things between excel spreadsheet and webapps or email, stuff like that. But most data entry jobs involved scanned images so he would have had to set up an OCR system which would be take a lot of work and expertise.

    You would be surprized how many companies do things manually and by hand just becuase its how it's always been done. I still run into this issue where I work.

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  • El SkidEl Skid The frozen white northRegistered User regular
    Working as a consultant, I see all sorts of crazy things like this.

    It all depends on the mindset of management, at the end of the day.

    If your department/project/whatever is focused on providing value for the money spent and trying to get more efficient at what they are doing so that they can use savings to help drive improved services and add more value, then it should be really obvious after you work there for a while (assuming this vision is communicated down to you). If you've been at your job for two years, and your efficiency is the same as it was last year, people should be talking with you and asking you why that is. In this kind of environment, you very rarely see these types of pointless processes- people are encouraged (maybe even rewarded) to make things more efficient, and then given other things to do that could help save more money down the road.

    If your department/project/whatever is focused solely on maintaining the status quo, then you'll also know this pretty shortly. If you do things quicker than others you'll be told to slow down, if you think of a better way of doing things you'll be told to never talk about it again. This is the type of workplace where you find these processes. Sure we could do it better, but that would change the status quo. What would people do with the extra time? Would they just be let go? Will that be my fault?

    It'd be nice to think that globally we're moving away from the latter culture and towards more of the former. Current evidence doesn't really point that way in any statistically significant way.

    mrpaku wrote: »
    my name is precisionk and i'm ten tanks

    wrath God fear traitor evil
  • Ori KleinOri Klein Registered User regular
    Darkewolfe wrote: »
    Ori Klein wrote: »
    Speaking of Trench stories, here's one with a happy ending note I ran across on ycombinator.
    http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/vomtn/update_my_friends_call_me_a_scumbag_because_i/

    That dude is all up in the absolutely not in the right. Any code you write on the company dime belongs to the company, and he's violating all kinds of shit with what he's pulling.

    Is that the law where you live? Sounds awfully messed up.
    Most places, doing it on company's time doesn't make it company's owned. It's HIS intellectual property, as far as software rights go.
    However, doing it on the company's time is what got him fired, which is perfectly legal as engaging in any other activity save work, as per company regulations, (and some exceptions such as restroom-time) on company time is negligence of duty and grounds for dismissal.
    Naturally, the fact that he came up with a technological solution that saves the company money as well as turn their process more efficient and accurate is the reason he got rehired.
    His boss' failure to understand that and handle it properly, as well as previous failures (or so alleged), is what got his boss replaced.

    Bottom line of that story, I think, is: Make yourself indispensable by being able to tell when opportunity knocks.
    A by-the-book drone manager is no good, of little value and can easily be replaced by the next drone in line.
    If you want to advance in managerial positions you need to open your head for identifying initiatives that are good for the company, even if they're not the norm in the way the company works and bring them up to your superiors. Then you look good, they look good and no one gets fired. ;)

  • Jack ShandyJack Shandy Registered User
    The law most places http://copyright.surf.nl/copyright/files/International_Comparative_Chart_ZwolleIII_1104.pdf seems to involve a "work for hire" concept at least as it applies to software programs. This includes the Netherlands.

  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    Ori Klein wrote: »
    Darkewolfe wrote: »
    Ori Klein wrote: »
    Speaking of Trench stories, here's one with a happy ending note I ran across on ycombinator.
    http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/vomtn/update_my_friends_call_me_a_scumbag_because_i/

    That dude is all up in the absolutely not in the right. Any code you write on the company dime belongs to the company, and he's violating all kinds of shit with what he's pulling.

    Is that the law where you live? Sounds awfully messed up.
    Most places, doing it on company's time doesn't make it company's owned. It's HIS intellectual property, as far as software rights go.
    However, doing it on the company's time is what got him fired, which is perfectly legal as engaging in any other activity save work, as per company regulations, (and some exceptions such as restroom-time) on company time is negligence of duty and grounds for dismissal.
    Naturally, the fact that he came up with a technological solution that saves the company money as well as turn their process more efficient and accurate is the reason he got rehired.
    His boss' failure to understand that and handle it properly, as well as previous failures (or so alleged), is what got his boss replaced.

    Bottom line of that story, I think, is: Make yourself indispensable by being able to tell when opportunity knocks.
    A by-the-book drone manager is no good, of little value and can easily be replaced by the next drone in line.
    If you want to advance in managerial positions you need to open your head for identifying initiatives that are good for the company, even if they're not the norm in the way the company works and bring them up to your superiors. Then you look good, they look good and no one gets fired. ;)

    If you've designed something related to your job function using the resources of the company while on company dime, it makes perfect sense that it belongs to your employer. If it's unrelated to your job and you did it on your breaks, that's something else. The whole reason you employ the most talented people to work in your company is because you hope to see benefits you couldn't specifically predict and ask for, including advances in software development. That's the trade you're making, though, you're part of the brain pool that makes up the company when you're doing those things, and of course the things you do as part of the brain pool belong to the brain pool. That's what joining a company is.

    "Well, look at this. Appears we got here just in the nick of time. What's that make us?"
    "Big Damn Heroes, Sir."
    "Ain't we just."
  • Ori KleinOri Klein Registered User regular
    edited June 2012
    The law most places http://copyright.surf.nl/copyright/files/International_Comparative_Chart_ZwolleIII_1104.pdf seems to involve a "work for hire" concept at least as it applies to software programs. This includes the Netherlands.
    Those pertain to a situation whereas a person has been hired to produce such work or a direct by-product of producing the work. Moreover it is explicitly stated that initial ownership defaults to the author.
    And unless he signed a contract, which states that should he make software (for producing work) under company time it belongs to the company, then it's his.
    What he did was operating outside his specified regulations which is why he was fired.
    Darkewolfe wrote: »
    you're part of the brain pool that makes up the company when you're doing those things, and of course the things you do as part of the brain pool belong to the brain pool. That's what joining a company is.
    If you're a manager/consultant/troubleshooting&solutions-provider, not if you're a cog in the system.
    Drones are tasked with specific work and specific operational parameters.
    And, sad as it is, managers oft discourage "big head" thinking and prefer the drones to behave as a predictable robot.
    The last thing drones are expected of is to out-think their frame. Infact, they fear 'smart' drones.

    Ori Klein on
  • ScooterScooter Registered User regular
    It's sort of a contradictory situation since in almost every case I'd say the company owns it...except here, the guy was fired for working on "non-work related stuff" or whatever they called it. If they fired me for that sort of reason, I would logically take that to mean that they considered the software to be mine.

  • DisrupterDisrupter Registered User regular
    Further more, one has to wonder whether or not he was salary. I mean, if you are a salary employee technically ALL time is company time, and yet all of it is not company time. If he is salary and got his job done as good or better than expected, what does it matter what else he was up to? Hes not being paid for his time, hes being paid for a job to get done.

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