MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited February 2015
You clearly missed the guy who said "I saw no bugs game is fine."
I'm basically talking to people like that.
Are you like that?
Then I'm not talking to you.
It is very unhelpful for people to ignore problems based on anecdotal information. It's also extremely common - extremely common - whenever any new game comes out and someone has had a fun time in it that you'll get people who think their experience = everyone elses.
Whereas I am at least acknowledging that some people don't get the bugs I do.
I'm just cranky.
With the way threads work you do have to put a little reminder like that in every single post of that kind, because there will be Mr New Anecdotal Guy 981 who will come in without reading anything prior and jump on you for daring to claim his bug free game has any at all.
That is also really tiring. So I don't intend to stop doing that.
But I will be less snarky about it.
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Oh right I forgot, HW1 had a completely different formation and physics system than HW2 did. I played 1 more than 2 so I just kind of forgot that so much changed between 1 and 2. : (
I actually always hated that they ditched all the physics in HW2 as it was so cool how complex it was. Meh...not sure how I feel now. I just kind of assumed they'd go with HW1's physics because they were so much deeper than HW2.
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im not interested in anyones lovely lucky story of a good time
there's thousands of people with identical problems to me
You know, I'm reasonably sure that by now we've all managed to internalize the notion that you're really really outraged over how HW1 turned out, and people may even generally agree that it's screwed up, but these pushy, preemptive "don't you dare contradict me" bits that are starting to show up in every other post are a little tiring.
I think @Morninglord has said multiple times that he's not outraged over how things turned out - HW1RM is a different game, not necessarily worse or better. It's basically like Homeworld 2 but with Homeworld 1's missions. I think Morninglord is also tired of people telling him that the game is fine because it's not crashing or breaking for them, even though for thousands of other people it's fucked up. This happens in every thread when a new buggy game comes out. Some people complain that it's buggy, other people tell them to shut up because it's not buggy, the people experiencing bugs say "don't tell me I'm wrong, I know for sure these bugs exist," then people like you get even more touchy and then it's a huge clusterfuck just like formations are a clusterfuck.
I really don't want to be limited to just that. Even in HW2 the formations were very useful and the ships actually stayed on the targets you set. Without all that, it may as well just be a game of A-moving.
*Edit - Wait what? Apparently you can't send orders through the Sensors Manager? That can't be true.
That was true for HW1 Classic, HW2 and Remastered do not have that limitation, Sensor manager actually started accepting orders in Cataclysm, HW1 did not allow much to be done from Sensor Manager.
Umm, no I'm playing HW1 right now (from my original disc) and you can issue just about any order you want (just move orders and hyperspaceing, I have no idea why I thought I could do attack orders in SM lol nm) from within the Sensors Manager.
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited February 2015
Yeah there's a podcast with a cata dev (who also worked on hw1) who basically says that hw1 worked more or less by accident. It was an overengineered mess, poised over the abyss of complete unplayability at all times.
I mean, its very doubtful, looking at how hw2 works, that they actually intended corvette walls and balls backed up by repairers to be death fleets.
They likely moved to HW2 because its a fuck ton easier to code and balance. You just change some percentages and voila.
I think when they fix all the bugs and black screens and weird ui not functioning randomly, then fix formations and modify some strike craft rng numbers (and take a look at assault frig hit chance versus interceptors) and that kind of stuff hw1r will be a really interesting game. I know they're working on a critical issues patch right now and I'm going to wait for that before I finish my hw1r game. If I wasn't being stopped cold with script issues every second mission I'd still be slugging through it.
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Yeah I know, I acknowledge everything your saying. I think there was a reason HW2 didn't hold my attention as long as HW1 did. I just don't know that I will buy HWR given it's basically HW2 with HW1 stuff added in (gameplay wise) that will never work the way it did in HW1. I was really hoping for the "best of both worlds" with HWR, given how far hardware has advanced I figured they could find a way to pull it off. Expected too much I guess.
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
It's worth it for the graphical upgrade. Game is gorgeous. They even redrew the animatics.
And you get the classics that you can play without sacrificing an arm and a leg on modern systems.
They don't have lan play although apparently a modder put that back in.
I did see an interesting modder who was working on his own hw1 remastered before gearbox did this, and he apparently managed to create proper flight paths and physics simulation (visual illusion) so that it felt like hw1. So it'd be possible to create the illusion of it pretty convincingly if gearbox take note of that guy. I hope they do.
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited February 2015
Also this is really fucking weird but apparently the hw2 classic .big file has an old version of the star trek mod's files tucked away into it, which are bloating its size.
Someone packed up the wrong workspace.
I found that out yesterday and had to laugh. I kept forgetting to mention it.
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I dunno. I'm going to think about it abit. I've still got all my HW1, Cata, and HW2 discs so I can replay them anytime. The graphics are indeed gorgeous, but HW1 played so much better than HW2 and I'm mostly interested in this for the MP community, and I enjoyed HW1's MP more than HW2. Bleh, I'm just too much of a grognard, it's my own fault.
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
The, uh, well from what I've seen of people talking about it there's not a lot of happy hw1 vets playing the weird mixed multi so maybe its for the best that you hold off and see if they manage to sort that out.
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That pretty much seems to be the the current situation, yes. Sigh. Oh well - glad you are enjoying it!
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited February 2015
One of the reasons they did this is because they noticed there wasn't an easily available digital version of these games for people to play that would be around for years and they thought it would be a shame for them to fade away.
That's why they included the classics. For posterity.
They're also going to release all their tools to the wild so the game is going to be ridiculously moddable.
The main menu even has a mod section.
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people have, but you've got a bug. apparently one way to fix it is to restart the mission (from the menu, pick restart, do not load campaign and pick the auto save because the auto save also has the bug).
Out of interest, because I also got this, did you get a random black screen at any point? The entire viewing area that wasn't UI went black. I could still select ships with hotkeys (could hear them responding), even press the sensor bar, but I couldn't see anything. I'm thinking this might have been the cutscene trying to start. To fix it I had to make a save and reload it.
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HW1 on my old discs won't even launch on my PC, more or less actually play. So that HW1r isn't an exact copy of the mechanics that honestly were 95% broken at all times anyway and only sort of make a game by accident doesn't bother me.
I don't know how yours is going, but this was how I did it on mine:
I knew the level from the original, so I decided to keep to the 'expected' mission structure, but not make life harder for myself.
So I sent one ship that wasn't any threat against strike craft (a destroyer for me, but almost anything but an Assault or drone frigate should work fine).
Once I lost control of that, I massed all the strike craft I had, and sent them at the ghost ship.
(Maybe doing that first messes with the scripting?)
I learned the wonders of Defensive tactics, which had them attack all the ships they found en route, so I stuck them all on Passive.
Move in it's general direction, and attack once it's in sight. You'll lose ships. Near as I can tell, it's inevitable.
After I lost all my fist wave, I rebuilt with 25 Scouts, 25 Defenders, 35 Bombers, and all the Heavy Corvettes I had room for, and did the same thing again (moving directly under where the Ghost Ship is and then heading straight up let me avoid a fair amount of fire on the approach). Just keep attacking the Ghost Ship, and eventually it'll shut down, and all those ships are yours. Then, just send a Salvage Corvette, and you're done.
The only tactic available is to throw strike craft at it until it gives. It might help to use scouts to kite the defenses while the other ships attack, but since the AI in Remastered is smart enough to go after its strengths, I don't think it works as well as it did in Classic. My corvettes all died in pretty short order, anyway.
If you wanted, you could mass Bombers and take out the defending ships first, but that's throwing away a lot more RU's-worth of ships than you'll be losing to take them intact.
(Pretty sure the fleet gets padded to scale with your fleet. I had maximum everything plus a half-dozen multibeams going in, so I got so many Assault frigate, they went past the safe zone in the next mission, and five of them instantly started dying. I think I'm set for frigates now.)
...
(Which isn't going to stop me from stealing every Elite Ion Frigate I can, you understand.)
(Random question: What happens if you don't take the Bentussi's deals? Do you lose the technology for good? I've never dared find out)
I haven't had any game-ending bugs (yet), but I've noticed a few odd things.
I captured the Carrier on mission 5. Right after I captured it, it got re-painted in Kushan colours and emblem. Nice touch, moving on.
Start of the next mission, it went back to Taidaan colours, but kept the Kushan emblem.
Then on mission 9, it got its old Taidaan emblem back from somewhere.
And some (not all) of my Resource Collectors sometimes turn invisible. Using hotkeys shows where they are, and they still fly/harvest/dock as normal, the model just doesn't appear. So far, they've always shown up again once I went to the next mission.
Early experiments with cloaking technology would seem to be 100% successful.
Also, I don't know what formation my ships are in when they come out of hyperspace now, but it sure isn't Parade formation. I don't get it, they were all lined up when they left...
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited February 2015
He wasn't talking about beating the mission fyi. He was talking about this bug.
Mission refuses to progress the objectives.
It's a scripting bug. You'll never get the hyperspace option and the mission will never end.
It generally seems to be related to cutscenes as far as I know. The last time this happened to me was the asteroid mission. I also had the objective circles permanently fixed on the map there as well.
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Hrm well I'm just going to try to get over the hw1 vs hw2 engine issues. It's still hw2 which was quite fun, and there still is nothing like it so...better than nothing. It just knocked out alot of my excitement for some reason. I honestly didn't think it would be that big a deal to me, but I guess I had built up this idea of what it would be.
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
I figured out the solution to my "sucking at hw2 this morning" problem.
Pressing escape makes the screen go black. Thats the worst glitch Ive seen. (Yes its a bad one.)
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited February 2015
welp my memories of hw2 were of torpedo frigates eating strike craft alive cos their torps can split into macross missile swarms that choose a new target after their old target dies
turns out that only happens with a later research upgrade and i need to build a lot more flak frigates in mission 4
also upgrade them
whoops
(restart)
Morninglord on
(PSN: Morninglord) (Steam: Morninglord) (WiiU: Morninglord22) I like to record and toss up a lot of random gaming videos here.
welp my memories of hw2 were of torpedo frigates eating strike craft alive cos their torps can split into macross missile swarms that choose a new target after their old target dies
turns out that only happens with a later research upgrade and i need to build a lot more flak frigates in mission 4
also upgrade them
whoops
(restart)
Odd i think I only ever made like 3 Flaks total across the entire Campaign, My Interceptors + Some Corvette help just sort of walked over any Vaygr Fighters, but I have an obscene amount of practice with Fighter brawls since I sort of specialized in them for Multi-Player. What exactly in Mission 4 is kicking your butt?
Just beat Homeworld 1. Despite some tough learning experiences, really shitty mission designs and a number of forced resets, it was a good experience.
Had a weird bug in the last mission where my attack fleet couldn't pass an invisible barrier or attack across it. But neither could the enemie's three heavy cruisers. That's when:
The rebellion's reinforcements showed up and slowly moved their ion frigates all the way across the map and proceeded to murder the enemy mothership.
welp my memories of hw2 were of torpedo frigates eating strike craft alive cos their torps can split into macross missile swarms that choose a new target after their old target dies
turns out that only happens with a later research upgrade and i need to build a lot more flak frigates in mission 4
also upgrade them
whoops
(restart)
Torpedo frigates are good vs. corvettes. The improved torpedoes make them better against frigates.
Ship composition is much more manageable in HW2. For strike crafts, you really only need to build bombers. For corvettes, just build gunships. For frigates, just build torpedo frigates. Use torpedo frigates to kill enemy assault frigates and gunships. Use gunships to kill enemy fighters. Bombers can kill other frigates, destroyers, and battlecruisers.
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited February 2015
Amusingly, nearly every source I look up for hw2 has a completely different strategy and a completely different opinion on which unit is more powerful.
There are people who adore flak frigates and mass them the entire game to great effect, ignoring the other two.
There are people who despise torpedo frigates and only use ions.
There are people who only build torpedo frigates.
There are people who hate all frigates and don't build any of them.
there are people who build an equal balance, or an unequal split, of all forces.
There are people who say guniships are useless but pulsar gunships are ridiculous.
It goes on and on, at every level of the game.
All people who have beaten the game with their chosen strategy.
Each time they use a different supporting ship composition to shore up the weaknesses in their choices.
As a long time analyser of other peoples behavior that tells me the game's actually pretty damn balanced.
Honestly the reason mission 4 is kicking my ass is because I suck at strategy games and I'm being particularly sucky today. I take too long to think. And I think too much before I attack, cutting off potential options before even trying them.
Remembering back, it took many many restarts and save game reloads to beat hw2 and hw1 classic. In that respect, nothings changed.
I'll figure out the method that suits me eventually. (And I will try each suggestion if the ones I'm thinking of myself don't work. For example, only bombers and no interceptors has never, ever, occurred to me. It's the kind of crazy ass plan that just might work. But I've got a couple of other ideas I want to try first. Cos that could go wrong really quickly and I'm not really fast enough to baby sit them right now.)
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited March 2015
Also I was completely confused by all the vaygr corvettes looking and behaving like fighters, just slower. So i thought torpedo frigates could handle fighters easily. If they're only good versus corvettes that explains why they weren't working, since I was watching them fail to kill swarms of fighters zoomed out quite far and couldn't see the torpedoes.
I just assumed a later upgrade was why but I must have been doing something else wrong. I had plenty of interceptors at the time but maybe I needed to micro them better.
the main thing that is kicking my ass is
the laser corvettes that ambush my collectors. They fried them all in seconds the first time through. I saved and tried again since I've got 10k resources at start, and sent three flak frigates and my two elite gunships off with the collectors thinking they'd do the trick, because at first glance I thought it was bombers and fighters attacking the collectors.
It was only after my flak frigates were obliterated and my elite gunships were quickly dying without finishing off the enemy forces did I have a proper look close up and realise I was dealing with laser corvettes.
Next time I'll send my 4 pulsar gunship squads with the flak frigs. That should do the job. Keep the elites to protect my torpedo pack.
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As long as you have a mix that works for every Ship Class you should do fine. The main thing is to just figure out how you play with the Mix you have. Like my preferred Mix is heavy on Interceptors, Pulsars, and Ions. which means i am pretty mobile defensively and killing the smaller ship types or small frigate groups but my big punch is in the bigger slower ships. Versus someone who is heavy Bomber/Flak who can do anti shipping strikes really fast but is defensively very mobility limited.
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited March 2015
Basically. I've just completely forgotten how to play. I know I could do this before. I beat the whole game before the patch that toned down the dynamic difficulty and I was the kind of player that builds up a huge force, practically maxed out, whenever the game gives me time to.
So I was running into mammoth waves of enemy forces in the later missions, which I then somehow beat.
I just have less time nowadays to keep plugging away at it like I did back then. More down time to talk about it.
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(PSN: Morninglord) (Steam: Morninglord) (WiiU: Morninglord22) I like to record and toss up a lot of random gaming videos here.
Amusingly, nearly every source I look up for hw2 has a completely different strategy and a completely different opinion on which unit is more powerful.
There are people who adore flak frigates and mass them the entire game to great effect, ignoring the other two.
There are people who despise torpedo frigates and only use ions.
There are people who only build torpedo frigates.
There are people who hate all frigates and don't build any of them.
there are people who build an equal balance, or an unequal split, of all forces.
There are people who say guniships are useless but pulsar gunships are ridiculous.
It goes on and on, at every level of the game.
All people who have beaten the game with their chosen strategy.
Each time they use a different supporting ship composition to shore up the weaknesses in their choices.
As a long time analyser of other peoples behavior that tells me the game's actually pretty damn balanced.
Honestly the reason mission 4 is kicking my ass is because I suck at strategy games and I'm being particularly sucky today. I take too long to think. And I think too much before I attack, cutting off potential options before even trying them.
Remembering back, it took many many restarts and save game reloads to beat hw2 and hw1 classic. In that respect, nothings changed.
I'll figure out the method that suits me eventually. (And I will try each suggestion if the ones I'm thinking of myself don't work. For example, only bombers and no interceptors has never, ever, occurred to me. It's the kind of crazy ass plan that just might work. But I've got a couple of other ideas I want to try first. Cos that could go wrong really quickly and I'm not really fast enough to baby sit them right now.)
Every strategy is viable but some require less micromanagement. All sorts of fleet compositions can be effective but having only one kind of strike craft, one kind of corvette, and one kind of frigate makes managing your fleet much easier.
There are some ships that are really good vs. their supposed counters. For example, destroyers and battlecruisers are really good vs. ion frigates because they can destroy way the frigates really fast. Similarly, assault/flak frigates will tear up any corvettes and strike crafts, even ones that are supposed to be good against frigates. So it's a lot easier to stick to more specialized counters like using bombers against capital ships and non-assault/flak frigates, then have other ships focus on making sure your bombers don't get countered by assault/flak frigates, gunships, and interceptors.
Vaygr laser corvettes do not fuck around. I usually MP'd as the Vaygr just because their fighters and corvettes are pretty great.
They hurt my mans so bad. It's so painful.
I start the mission with 2 gunships, 2 elite gunships, 4 pulsars, 3 flak frigs and...thats it.
I lost everything else in the last mission. I miss my elite bombers.
I've got 10k moneys, the mothership, the carrier, 6 collectors and 1 resource controller.
And I want to be able to split up a small force to protect the collectors that don't need to be microed so I can focus on the mission goals without worrying about them too much.
I'm ridiculously bad at microing two battles at once.
Maybe I should just wait until the first ambush happens and then go start the mission goals.
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HW 1 Autoharvests for you when you hyperspace to the next mission.
It just doesn't tell you. Your RU will go up.
Also there's a good analysis of why the resourcers stop resourcing randomly. They don't seem to go after anything ??? or in the fog of war, so you have to use probes on resource patches to get them to go after everything automatically. Pressing H forces them to pick a patch in the fog of war.
edit: Seems I jumped the gun cos it, like everything else, appears to be a little buggy and nobody is quite sure why.
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(PSN: Morninglord) (Steam: Morninglord) (WiiU: Morninglord22) I like to record and toss up a lot of random gaming videos here.
HW 1 Autoharvests for you when you hyperspace to the next mission.
It just doesn't tell you. Your RU will go up.
Also there's a good analysis of why the resourcers stop resourcing randomly. They don't seem to go after anything ??? or in the fog of war, so you have to use probes on resource patches to get them to go after everything automatically. Pressing H forces them to pick a patch in the fog of war.
edit: Seems I jumped the gun cos it, like everything else, appears to be a little buggy and nobody is quite sure why.
i try and deploy probes to resource areas and it seems to work.
that said, i figured out the new way to beat the garden/cathedral (drone frigates, who would have thunk huh) but holy shit well of lost souls what? did the standard strike craft attack and lost all my interceptors bombers and corvettes before they even got to attack the ship. jeeeeeeesus.
HW 1 Autoharvests for you when you hyperspace to the next mission.
It just doesn't tell you. Your RU will go up.
Also there's a good analysis of why the resourcers stop resourcing randomly. They don't seem to go after anything ??? or in the fog of war, so you have to use probes on resource patches to get them to go after everything automatically. Pressing H forces them to pick a patch in the fog of war.
edit: Seems I jumped the gun cos it, like everything else, appears to be a little buggy and nobody is quite sure why.
i try and deploy probes to resource areas and it seems to work.
that said, i figured out the new way to beat the garden/cathedral (drone frigates, who would have thunk huh) but holy shit well of lost souls what? did the standard strike craft attack and lost all my interceptors bombers and corvettes before they even got to attack the ship. jeeeeeeesus.
before i got bugged out I actually built 70 bombers, snuck them in, the enemy force turned around from my distraction and started absolutely wiping them out so I ordered all of them to kamikaze and was left with a handful of bombers all red and smoking and all the enemy ships.
woulda been worth it up until, you know, the script bugged out on me.
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I'm basically talking to people like that.
Are you like that?
Then I'm not talking to you.
It is very unhelpful for people to ignore problems based on anecdotal information. It's also extremely common - extremely common - whenever any new game comes out and someone has had a fun time in it that you'll get people who think their experience = everyone elses.
Whereas I am at least acknowledging that some people don't get the bugs I do.
I'm just cranky.
With the way threads work you do have to put a little reminder like that in every single post of that kind, because there will be Mr New Anecdotal Guy 981 who will come in without reading anything prior and jump on you for daring to claim his bug free game has any at all.
That is also really tiring. So I don't intend to stop doing that.
But I will be less snarky about it.
I actually always hated that they ditched all the physics in HW2 as it was so cool how complex it was. Meh...not sure how I feel now. I just kind of assumed they'd go with HW1's physics because they were so much deeper than HW2.
Umm, no I'm playing HW1 right now (from my original disc) and you can issue just about any order you want (just move orders and hyperspaceing, I have no idea why I thought I could do attack orders in SM lol nm) from within the Sensors Manager.
I mean, its very doubtful, looking at how hw2 works, that they actually intended corvette walls and balls backed up by repairers to be death fleets.
They likely moved to HW2 because its a fuck ton easier to code and balance. You just change some percentages and voila.
I think when they fix all the bugs and black screens and weird ui not functioning randomly, then fix formations and modify some strike craft rng numbers (and take a look at assault frig hit chance versus interceptors) and that kind of stuff hw1r will be a really interesting game. I know they're working on a critical issues patch right now and I'm going to wait for that before I finish my hw1r game. If I wasn't being stopped cold with script issues every second mission I'd still be slugging through it.
And you get the classics that you can play without sacrificing an arm and a leg on modern systems.
They don't have lan play although apparently a modder put that back in.
I did see an interesting modder who was working on his own hw1 remastered before gearbox did this, and he apparently managed to create proper flight paths and physics simulation (visual illusion) so that it felt like hw1. So it'd be possible to create the illusion of it pretty convincingly if gearbox take note of that guy. I hope they do.
Someone packed up the wrong workspace.
I found that out yesterday and had to laugh. I kept forgetting to mention it.
That's why they included the classics. For posterity.
They're also going to release all their tools to the wild so the game is going to be ridiculously moddable.
The main menu even has a mod section.
im stuck on scout the anomaly
people have, but you've got a bug. apparently one way to fix it is to restart the mission (from the menu, pick restart, do not load campaign and pick the auto save because the auto save also has the bug).
Out of interest, because I also got this, did you get a random black screen at any point? The entire viewing area that wasn't UI went black. I could still select ships with hotkeys (could hear them responding), even press the sensor bar, but I couldn't see anything. I'm thinking this might have been the cutscene trying to start. To fix it I had to make a save and reload it.
Amusingly I suck at hw2.
Like real bad!
Mind you I woke up really early this morning so maybe that has something to do with it.
I'm like, oh shit things attacking my resourcers.
*stare blankly*
I don't know how yours is going, but this was how I did it on mine:
So I sent one ship that wasn't any threat against strike craft (a destroyer for me, but almost anything but an Assault or drone frigate should work fine).
Once I lost control of that, I massed all the strike craft I had, and sent them at the ghost ship.
(Maybe doing that first messes with the scripting?)
I learned the wonders of Defensive tactics, which had them attack all the ships they found en route, so I stuck them all on Passive.
Move in it's general direction, and attack once it's in sight. You'll lose ships. Near as I can tell, it's inevitable.
After I lost all my fist wave, I rebuilt with 25 Scouts, 25 Defenders, 35 Bombers, and all the Heavy Corvettes I had room for, and did the same thing again (moving directly under where the Ghost Ship is and then heading straight up let me avoid a fair amount of fire on the approach). Just keep attacking the Ghost Ship, and eventually it'll shut down, and all those ships are yours. Then, just send a Salvage Corvette, and you're done.
The only tactic available is to throw strike craft at it until it gives. It might help to use scouts to kite the defenses while the other ships attack, but since the AI in Remastered is smart enough to go after its strengths, I don't think it works as well as it did in Classic. My corvettes all died in pretty short order, anyway.
If you wanted, you could mass Bombers and take out the defending ships first, but that's throwing away a lot more RU's-worth of ships than you'll be losing to take them intact.
(Pretty sure the fleet gets padded to scale with your fleet. I had maximum everything plus a half-dozen multibeams going in, so I got so many Assault frigate, they went past the safe zone in the next mission, and five of them instantly started dying. I think I'm set for frigates now.)
...
(Which isn't going to stop me from stealing every Elite Ion Frigate I can, you understand.)
(Random question: What happens if you don't take the Bentussi's deals? Do you lose the technology for good? I've never dared find out)
I haven't had any game-ending bugs (yet), but I've noticed a few odd things.
I captured the Carrier on mission 5. Right after I captured it, it got re-painted in Kushan colours and emblem. Nice touch, moving on.
Start of the next mission, it went back to Taidaan colours, but kept the Kushan emblem.
Then on mission 9, it got its old Taidaan emblem back from somewhere.
And some (not all) of my Resource Collectors sometimes turn invisible. Using hotkeys shows where they are, and they still fly/harvest/dock as normal, the model just doesn't appear. So far, they've always shown up again once I went to the next mission.
Early experiments with cloaking technology would seem to be 100% successful.
Also, I don't know what formation my ships are in when they come out of hyperspace now, but it sure isn't Parade formation. I don't get it, they were all lined up when they left...
Mission refuses to progress the objectives.
It's a scripting bug. You'll never get the hyperspace option and the mission will never end.
It generally seems to be related to cutscenes as far as I know. The last time this happened to me was the asteroid mission. I also had the objective circles permanently fixed on the map there as well.
turns out that only happens with a later research upgrade and i need to build a lot more flak frigates in mission 4
also upgrade them
whoops
(restart)
Odd i think I only ever made like 3 Flaks total across the entire Campaign, My Interceptors + Some Corvette help just sort of walked over any Vaygr Fighters, but I have an obscene amount of practice with Fighter brawls since I sort of specialized in them for Multi-Player. What exactly in Mission 4 is kicking your butt?
Had a weird bug in the last mission where my attack fleet couldn't pass an invisible barrier or attack across it. But neither could the enemie's three heavy cruisers. That's when:
Torpedo frigates are good vs. corvettes. The improved torpedoes make them better against frigates.
Ship composition is much more manageable in HW2. For strike crafts, you really only need to build bombers. For corvettes, just build gunships. For frigates, just build torpedo frigates. Use torpedo frigates to kill enemy assault frigates and gunships. Use gunships to kill enemy fighters. Bombers can kill other frigates, destroyers, and battlecruisers.
There are people who adore flak frigates and mass them the entire game to great effect, ignoring the other two.
There are people who despise torpedo frigates and only use ions.
There are people who only build torpedo frigates.
There are people who hate all frigates and don't build any of them.
there are people who build an equal balance, or an unequal split, of all forces.
There are people who say guniships are useless but pulsar gunships are ridiculous.
It goes on and on, at every level of the game.
All people who have beaten the game with their chosen strategy.
Each time they use a different supporting ship composition to shore up the weaknesses in their choices.
As a long time analyser of other peoples behavior that tells me the game's actually pretty damn balanced.
Honestly the reason mission 4 is kicking my ass is because I suck at strategy games and I'm being particularly sucky today. I take too long to think. And I think too much before I attack, cutting off potential options before even trying them.
Remembering back, it took many many restarts and save game reloads to beat hw2 and hw1 classic. In that respect, nothings changed.
I'll figure out the method that suits me eventually. (And I will try each suggestion if the ones I'm thinking of myself don't work. For example, only bombers and no interceptors has never, ever, occurred to me. It's the kind of crazy ass plan that just might work. But I've got a couple of other ideas I want to try first. Cos that could go wrong really quickly and I'm not really fast enough to baby sit them right now.)
Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
I just assumed a later upgrade was why but I must have been doing something else wrong. I had plenty of interceptors at the time but maybe I needed to micro them better.
the main thing that is kicking my ass is
It was only after my flak frigates were obliterated and my elite gunships were quickly dying without finishing off the enemy forces did I have a proper look close up and realise I was dealing with laser corvettes.
Next time I'll send my 4 pulsar gunship squads with the flak frigs. That should do the job. Keep the elites to protect my torpedo pack.
So I was running into mammoth waves of enemy forces in the later missions, which I then somehow beat.
I just have less time nowadays to keep plugging away at it like I did back then. More down time to talk about it.
Every strategy is viable but some require less micromanagement. All sorts of fleet compositions can be effective but having only one kind of strike craft, one kind of corvette, and one kind of frigate makes managing your fleet much easier.
There are some ships that are really good vs. their supposed counters. For example, destroyers and battlecruisers are really good vs. ion frigates because they can destroy way the frigates really fast. Similarly, assault/flak frigates will tear up any corvettes and strike crafts, even ones that are supposed to be good against frigates. So it's a lot easier to stick to more specialized counters like using bombers against capital ships and non-assault/flak frigates, then have other ships focus on making sure your bombers don't get countered by assault/flak frigates, gunships, and interceptors.
Now I really want to see GDI vs NOD vs Allies vs Soviets in a C&C Remastered. From either C&C1/RA1 or C&C2/RA2.
Or maybe both.
They hurt my mans so bad. It's so painful.
I start the mission with 2 gunships, 2 elite gunships, 4 pulsars, 3 flak frigs and...thats it.
I lost everything else in the last mission. I miss my elite bombers.
I've got 10k moneys, the mothership, the carrier, 6 collectors and 1 resource controller.
And I want to be able to split up a small force to protect the collectors that don't need to be microed so I can focus on the mission goals without worrying about them too much.
I'm ridiculously bad at microing two battles at once.
Maybe I should just wait until the first ambush happens and then go start the mission goals.
HW 1 Autoharvests for you when you hyperspace to the next mission.
It just doesn't tell you. Your RU will go up.
Also there's a good analysis of why the resourcers stop resourcing randomly. They don't seem to go after anything ??? or in the fog of war, so you have to use probes on resource patches to get them to go after everything automatically. Pressing H forces them to pick a patch in the fog of war.
edit: Seems I jumped the gun cos it, like everything else, appears to be a little buggy and nobody is quite sure why.
i try and deploy probes to resource areas and it seems to work.
that said, i figured out the new way to beat the garden/cathedral (drone frigates, who would have thunk huh) but holy shit well of lost souls what? did the standard strike craft attack and lost all my interceptors bombers and corvettes before they even got to attack the ship. jeeeeeeesus.
GDI vs. Allies vs. Toxin GLA.
Cross spin-off mashups could be pretty interesting.
before i got bugged out I actually built 70 bombers, snuck them in, the enemy force turned around from my distraction and started absolutely wiping them out so I ordered all of them to kamikaze and was left with a handful of bombers all red and smoking and all the enemy ships.
woulda been worth it up until, you know, the script bugged out on me.