??? What con job? Double Fine released both Broken Age and Massive Chalice...
The "con" of collecting money for a second game before conveniently announcing you're having financial hiccups with the first game. Which is why I put it in quotes, because while it's not illegal or anything, many people were not happy about being deceived like that, and said they'd never have given Massive Chalice a dime if they knew what was going on. It's skivvy as shit, and nobody's going to fall for it again.
"The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
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IanatorGaze upon my works, ye mightyand facepalm.Registered Userregular
...Wait, what?
I really want to know why these places have delayed dates for MN9. Isn't production supposed to be done? Done enough for them to start pre-production on Red Ash, at least.
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MaddocI'm Bobbin Threadbare, are you my mother?Registered Userregular
At this point it's far more likely to be something on Deep Silver's end.
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
Considering people have played a fully playable build it has to be near done. The only thing that could delay it would be going back to change something.
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Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
??? What con job? Double Fine released both Broken Age and Massive Chalice...
The "con" of collecting money for a second game before conveniently announcing you're having financial hiccups with the first game. Which is why I put it in quotes, because while it's not illegal or anything, many people were not happy about being deceived like that, and said they'd never have given Massive Chalice a dime if they knew what was going on. It's skivvy as shit, and nobody's going to fall for it again.
But Double Fine has several teams. With their own budgets. It's not like one game stole funds from the other. This is how most game companies work.... In fact, Massive Chalice never asked for more money. I don't see why a development house not firing a bunch of staff because they don't have work for them is "skivvy."
Edit: And yeah, I don't see how MN9 could possibly be delayed at this point, baring some massive bug found in testing (which, worst case, maybe pushes it back a *little* but not much). I'm not going to worry about it until I hear more.
Hey guys! Just received word from Nick that it's a mistake. Looks like there was just some miscommunication, no need to worry. The release date is the same!
??? What con job? Double Fine released both Broken Age and Massive Chalice...
The "con" of collecting money for a second game before conveniently announcing you're having financial hiccups with the first game. Which is why I put it in quotes, because while it's not illegal or anything, many people were not happy about being deceived like that, and said they'd never have given Massive Chalice a dime if they knew what was going on. It's skivvy as shit, and nobody's going to fall for it again.
But Double Fine has several teams. With their own budgets. It's not like one game stole funds from the other. This is how most game companies work.... In fact, Massive Chalice never asked for more money. I don't see why a development house not firing a bunch of staff because they don't have work for them is "skivvy."
Edit: And yeah, I don't see how MN9 could possibly be delayed at this point, baring some massive bug found in testing (which, worst case, maybe pushes it back a *little* but not much). I'm not going to worry about it until I hear more.
Hey guys! Just received word from Nick that it's a mistake. Looks like there was just some miscommunication, no need to worry. The release date is the same!
Now it's my turn to ??? you. What are you talking about? Stole funds?
This was the sequence of events:
-Double Fine creates Broken Age Kickstarter. Gets assload of money. Starts working on game.
-After a while, creates Massive Chalice Kickstarter. Also get load of money.
-Literally a week later, they come out and say "Yeah, all that money you gave us for Broken Age? Turns out this shit is really hard and we blew through it all. We'll uh... think of something to get more money (said something ended up being cutting the game in half and selling the first half).
People felt rightfully duped. Ain't nobody accusing them of using MC funds for BA. No, they're accusing them of intentionally withholding their financial problem until after the MC Kickstarter cleared, because otherwise people wouldn't have paid into MC if they knew about this. And rightfully so, people were pissed. Why would you give them money for a second game when they were having issues getting their first out?
People learned their lesson, and you can see it reflected in a lot of the criticism levied towards this Kickstarter. "Why should I fund this game when you haven't yet delivered on your first game and shown that you're actually worth it?".
"The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
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Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
What financial problem? They over scoped Broken Age and ran out of money. Massive Chalice was a completely different team within Double Fine, with a different project lead, who did not over scope. The two are 100% unrelated except for the company is Double Fine in both cases. I SERIOUSLY doubt anyone backing MN9 and potentially Red Ash was thinking about Double Fine when deciding.
It makes my heart glad that someone else started a Double Fine are a bunch of con men off topic tangent as that was a role I used to play many years ago. How the world has changed.
Glad to hear the delay wasn't anything big. I got up in the middle of the night and got a strange update and checked it out. It was weird that it was more than one retailer doing it...but I'm glad it is apparently nothing.
Your average person doesn't know nor cares about things such as different build teams or budgets or things like that. The only thing they see is Double Fine's name on both of them. Double Fine asked for money for a game. Then they asked for money for another game. Then right after that said they fucked up with the money for the first game. And people said "Oy! If you had said that first, I'd have never given you money for the second game!". And DF just shrugged their shoulders and didn't really deny it.
"The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
Your average person doesn't know nor cares about things such as different build teams or budgets or things like that. The only thing they see is Double Fine's name on both of them. Double Fine asked for money for a game. Then they asked for money for another game. Then right after that said they fucked up with the money for the first game. And people said "Oy! If you had said that first, I'd have never given you money for the second game!". And DF just shrugged their shoulders and didn't really deny it.
And then the people who backed Massive Chalice got their game in the agreed upon time frame and realized that whole "controversy" was made up bullshit? I'm pretty sure that's how the story ends.
Yeah like, whatever. Double Fine put out the first half early and then used profits and THEIR OWN MONEY to fund a longer second half.
In the end backers got what they paid for and they got a game that was twice as long as it was originally going to be at no extra charge. I never understood why anyone felt they were being duped.
It also let kickstarters \ know that they should detail how they'll spend the money or assure backers that their funding is to ensure they get a publisher's greenlight
I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
Honestly they'll be lucky if they don't hit 800k. Then they don't have to make a game no one will be pleased with.
I HOPE they do make the game and eventually port it to stuff. I'm just not going to pre-fund it for a console I don't own.
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Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
edited July 2015
So they've actually been updating the anime one a lot. They increased the length of the initial goal (now 12 minutes instead of 5) and are now promising a blu-ray as well. Honestly, it's funny but that one is being run better than the actual game's kickstarter. It's a shame there isn't more interest - it's looking better with every update. I'm kind of hoping at least *that* is funded.
The Anime stuff reeks of Japanese people not understanding Westerners don't pay stupid high prices for DVDs in general let alone think 12 minutes of footage on a blu-ray is acceptable
I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
Wanted to yak about Kickstarter, Red Ash, and what it all means.
Obviously appearance isn't reality but its a significant part in the reality of investment and funding.
To use the Doublefine example, investing millions to go overbudget means you don't want to invest further with that group, even if that group has subgroups that need that investment and won't have the same financial manager.
This is basic human interaction stuff. Your currency is your rep.
Not that Inafune's name is mud but KS as a whole and Inafune, in this specific instance, might have overdrafted. KS are preorders from the customer side and even as a capital holder investing through KS is risky. Especially with its example, the Double Fine Adventure game, eventually Broken Age... well didn't do overall so well as a project and was uneven as a product.
Just as celebrity KS up the currency going in to KS as a whole the celebrity disappointments will reflect on the practice. Add in the timing, the doldrums, rapidly, and with no announced console and few if any products under their umbrella... to the consumers, this is not a thing to invest in yet. And the timing and proposal has made it 'now or never' That.. isn't helpful.
Adding in that its seven days from ending and I figured when I got my own paycheck I'd put in a little like with Yooka Laylee and now its 'why bother its going to fail. Worse this runs the risk of tanking the property's overall appeal in the future alal the open design shop's lack of support used to underline Legends 3 cancellation.
That said yeah, people are gunshy about this game but for damned good reasons, give us reasons not to be and be flexible about it too.
I tried to play Gunvolt recently...someone explain Gunvolt to me. There's like five bars on the screen, numbers everywhere, I can equip...things? Now there's J-pop playing and I'm Super Saiyan apparently? I just wanted to jump and shoot mans.
Adding in that its seven days from ending and I figured when I got my own paycheck I'd put in a little like with Yooka Laylee and now its 'why bother its going to fail.
because there's no financial downside to you if it does fail?
I tried to play Gunvolt recently...someone explain Gunvolt to me. There's like five bars on the screen, numbers everywhere, I can equip...things? Now there's J-pop playing and I'm Super Saiyan apparently? I just wanted to jump and shoot mans.
I'll assume you're aware of the most basic concepts in the game, so here's a few of the non-obvious things I had to go into the in-game manual to understand.
- Your gun doesn't shoot bullets. It shoots lightning rods. When you hit an enemy, they get a marker-- blue for one shot, yellow for two, red for three. Then you can do big damage to them with your Flashfield (the lightning storm you trigger with R). However, that drains your Electric Power (EP). If you run out, you have to wait until it completely recharges before you can attack again.
- You can double-tap down at any time to instantly reload your Electric Power.
- The counter at the top-left is called your Kudos. This is basically just a bonus scoring system. You get Kudos for causing damage with your Flashfield. If you touch a checkpoint or use an attack skill (the things you touch on the bottom screen), you cash in the Kudos for extra score. If you get hit (even if you block it with Prevasion), you lose all of your Kudos. Fortunately, if all you want is "just to jump and shoot mans", you don't need to care about that at all.
- Speaking of "Prevasion", they tell you about it in the tutorial but you might have forgotten. Basically, if you get hit while your Flashfield isn't up, you dodge out of the way and take no damage.
- Speaking of "Skills", those are controlled by your Skill Points, represented by three bars on the bottom. Each skill has an individual cooldown time, and a Skill Point cost (typically 1). So you can't use the same skill instantly, and you can't just continually use your Skills-- treat them like smart bombs for desperate situations.
- Combining Prevasion with your anytime reload for your Electric Power means you can be invulnerable forever so long as you don't care about your score and don't attack.
- That "Super Saiyan" thing is a randomized resurrection thing. Sometimes when you die your girlfriend's magic power brings you back. At that point you have infinite Electric Power and unlimited double-jumps and air dashes. It also completely tanks your ranking for the level.
- Equipment is a pretty bog-standard crafting system. You give the equipment shop some vaguely-defined sci-fi crafting components and money, and they give you equipment. Lenses tend to give you stat bonuses, Rings tend to unlock secondary mobility abilities like double-jumps and air-dashes, and Pendants increase either your offensive or defensive powers.
- You've also got an experience level, which only affects your maximum health and unlocks Skills over time.
I'm not sure what more needs explaining, so feel free to ask any follow-on questions that come to mind.
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
Yeah, it's pretty much hopeless at this point. Baring a miracle anyways. Curious to see what he'll do. Maybe he should retry after Mighty No. 9 is released.
Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
Well that's unexpected...
Hello everyone, we've got some huge (and I mean huge) news for you today. We gave you a sneak peek during one of our previous updates, but the mock-up that HYDE has been working on...
is now available for you to play!
This is sure to boost donations... Wondering if it's too late though.
It's weird that you start out as MN9 Beck, but you can play as Red Ash Beck. You have to find him. You can also play as MN9 Call for some reason, and Red Ash Call is hidden in there. It's pretty simple but Beck actually animates pretty good for a prototype. I wish there was some combat though.
Looks like they're just going ahead anyway, full funding revealed
Announcement:
Hello everyone!
We have some very important and happy news for you today!
It's official: “RED ASH: The KalKanon Incident” is a GO for full development, along with ports to PlayStation 4 AND Xbox One!
We know this is sudden news. Are you surprised? How have we decided to develop the game before the Kickstarter campaign finishes? Well, that’s thanks to the support of FUZE Entertainment, who we’ll introduce now.
FUZE Entertainment Co., Ltd. is a Chinese digital entertainment company engaged in production of console hardware as well as sales of console games.
FUZE is based around Chinese game industry pioneer Wang Feng, and was co-founded with partners Huawei, NVIDIA, and Microsoft Xbox.
FUZE has established partnerships with major console game publishers to bring AAA titles to the Chinese market, and have made it their mission to bring the highest quality game experiences to gamers around the world.
Website: www.fuzegame.tv
We said it before: we have been working very hard behind-the-scenes for RED ASH! Alongside our Kickstarter campaign, we’ve been in negotiations with hardware makers and development partners, keeping your feedback and comments in mind. We hoped by introducing the world setting, art documents, creators involved, our latest prototype, and more, we could convey the charm of RED ASH. And it seems like that work has paid off with FUZE Entertainment deciding to join your ranks as backers, in a major way!
What happens to RED ASH now?
(1)
First off, the contribution of FUZE is a done deal. We can officially confirm that "The KalKanon Incident” will be developed to completion, with the initial goals for game content (8 hours), along with ports to BOTH PlayStation 4 and Xbox One!
(2)
The rights to RED ASH will be retained by comcept. We're excited to find such a great partner in FUZE who believes in our vision in its pure form. In addition, comcept will retain rights to creative discretion and decisions in game development.
What happens to Kickstarter?
The Kickstarter campaign is going 100% towards more content! Consider your pledge a contribution to stretch goals from here on out.
Exactly what are those stretch goals? We're sorry to say that will have to wait a little while longer! Like we said, we're very busy with many behind-the-scenes things over here, and we apologize if you feel left in the dark. As you can see, the things we have brewing that are keeping us occupied are BIG, and all for the purpose of getting you RED ASH in its biggest, bestest form. That's the reason we're less communicative than we'd like to be!
We know we’re in the final days of our campaign, but we’d like to ask fans to continue their support of RED ASH! Your money is going towards 100% content now, so please look forward to the revised "stretch goals"!
That wraps up the announcement!
Finally, we’d like to say, today’s announcement was made possible by everyone’s voices supporting RED ASH on Twitter, blogs, and other places. We’d like to thank our backers from the bottom of our hearts. We see all the work you're doing, pounding the pavement to get the word out, and we're overwhelmed by the support. We know the tide is against us, and it's you all that have kept us afloat. We're also beyond the ability to express our gratitude to HYDE for creating such amazing 3D models and a prototype in such a short time. We’re looking forward to working together more!
That’s all for today’s update.
Though... can they do that? I thought you were required to give kickstarter money back if not funded?
Posts
The "con" of collecting money for a second game before conveniently announcing you're having financial hiccups with the first game. Which is why I put it in quotes, because while it's not illegal or anything, many people were not happy about being deceived like that, and said they'd never have given Massive Chalice a dime if they knew what was going on. It's skivvy as shit, and nobody's going to fall for it again.
I really want to know why these places have delayed dates for MN9. Isn't production supposed to be done? Done enough for them to start pre-production on Red Ash, at least.
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But Double Fine has several teams. With their own budgets. It's not like one game stole funds from the other. This is how most game companies work.... In fact, Massive Chalice never asked for more money. I don't see why a development house not firing a bunch of staff because they don't have work for them is "skivvy."
Edit: And yeah, I don't see how MN9 could possibly be delayed at this point, baring some massive bug found in testing (which, worst case, maybe pushes it back a *little* but not much). I'm not going to worry about it until I hear more.
Edit 2: Mighty No. 9 not delayed:
http://www.mightyno9.com/en/node/4143?page=0#comment-103320
Now it's my turn to ??? you. What are you talking about? Stole funds?
This was the sequence of events:
-Double Fine creates Broken Age Kickstarter. Gets assload of money. Starts working on game.
-After a while, creates Massive Chalice Kickstarter. Also get load of money.
-Literally a week later, they come out and say "Yeah, all that money you gave us for Broken Age? Turns out this shit is really hard and we blew through it all. We'll uh... think of something to get more money (said something ended up being cutting the game in half and selling the first half).
People felt rightfully duped. Ain't nobody accusing them of using MC funds for BA. No, they're accusing them of intentionally withholding their financial problem until after the MC Kickstarter cleared, because otherwise people wouldn't have paid into MC if they knew about this. And rightfully so, people were pissed. Why would you give them money for a second game when they were having issues getting their first out?
People learned their lesson, and you can see it reflected in a lot of the criticism levied towards this Kickstarter. "Why should I fund this game when you haven't yet delivered on your first game and shown that you're actually worth it?".
Glad to hear the delay wasn't anything big. I got up in the middle of the night and got a strange update and checked it out. It was weird that it was more than one retailer doing it...but I'm glad it is apparently nothing.
And then the people who backed Massive Chalice got their game in the agreed upon time frame and realized that whole "controversy" was made up bullshit? I'm pretty sure that's how the story ends.
In the end backers got what they paid for and they got a game that was twice as long as it was originally going to be at no extra charge. I never understood why anyone felt they were being duped.
That actually did happen. After PS4 was announced, funding actually went down.
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
This is why I didn't pledge, I presumed it would be on there. But... isn't this irrelevant unless they hit $1M? Which they won't.
I HOPE they do make the game and eventually port it to stuff. I'm just not going to pre-fund it for a console I don't own.
What do you folks think?
This will be here until I receive an apology or Weedlordvegeta get any consequences for being a bully
Obviously appearance isn't reality but its a significant part in the reality of investment and funding.
To use the Doublefine example, investing millions to go overbudget means you don't want to invest further with that group, even if that group has subgroups that need that investment and won't have the same financial manager.
This is basic human interaction stuff. Your currency is your rep.
Not that Inafune's name is mud but KS as a whole and Inafune, in this specific instance, might have overdrafted. KS are preorders from the customer side and even as a capital holder investing through KS is risky. Especially with its example, the Double Fine Adventure game, eventually Broken Age... well didn't do overall so well as a project and was uneven as a product.
Just as celebrity KS up the currency going in to KS as a whole the celebrity disappointments will reflect on the practice. Add in the timing, the doldrums, rapidly, and with no announced console and few if any products under their umbrella... to the consumers, this is not a thing to invest in yet. And the timing and proposal has made it 'now or never' That.. isn't helpful.
Adding in that its seven days from ending and I figured when I got my own paycheck I'd put in a little like with Yooka Laylee and now its 'why bother its going to fail. Worse this runs the risk of tanking the property's overall appeal in the future alal the open design shop's lack of support used to underline Legends 3 cancellation.
That said yeah, people are gunshy about this game but for damned good reasons, give us reasons not to be and be flexible about it too.
because there's no financial downside to you if it does fail?
Less than a week to go and it's just at 59 percent.
I'll assume you're aware of the most basic concepts in the game, so here's a few of the non-obvious things I had to go into the in-game manual to understand.
- Your gun doesn't shoot bullets. It shoots lightning rods. When you hit an enemy, they get a marker-- blue for one shot, yellow for two, red for three. Then you can do big damage to them with your Flashfield (the lightning storm you trigger with R). However, that drains your Electric Power (EP). If you run out, you have to wait until it completely recharges before you can attack again.
- You can double-tap down at any time to instantly reload your Electric Power.
- The counter at the top-left is called your Kudos. This is basically just a bonus scoring system. You get Kudos for causing damage with your Flashfield. If you touch a checkpoint or use an attack skill (the things you touch on the bottom screen), you cash in the Kudos for extra score. If you get hit (even if you block it with Prevasion), you lose all of your Kudos. Fortunately, if all you want is "just to jump and shoot mans", you don't need to care about that at all.
- Speaking of "Prevasion", they tell you about it in the tutorial but you might have forgotten. Basically, if you get hit while your Flashfield isn't up, you dodge out of the way and take no damage.
- Speaking of "Skills", those are controlled by your Skill Points, represented by three bars on the bottom. Each skill has an individual cooldown time, and a Skill Point cost (typically 1). So you can't use the same skill instantly, and you can't just continually use your Skills-- treat them like smart bombs for desperate situations.
- Combining Prevasion with your anytime reload for your Electric Power means you can be invulnerable forever so long as you don't care about your score and don't attack.
- That "Super Saiyan" thing is a randomized resurrection thing. Sometimes when you die your girlfriend's magic power brings you back. At that point you have infinite Electric Power and unlimited double-jumps and air dashes. It also completely tanks your ranking for the level.
- Equipment is a pretty bog-standard crafting system. You give the equipment shop some vaguely-defined sci-fi crafting components and money, and they give you equipment. Lenses tend to give you stat bonuses, Rings tend to unlock secondary mobility abilities like double-jumps and air-dashes, and Pendants increase either your offensive or defensive powers.
- You've also got an experience level, which only affects your maximum health and unlocks Skills over time.
I'm not sure what more needs explaining, so feel free to ask any follow-on questions that come to mind.
anniemayshun
This is sure to boost donations... Wondering if it's too late though.
This also marks I believe at least the third game where you can play as him before his actual game comes out. This is approaching Asagi levels.
Someone didn't look hard enough
It's weird that you start out as MN9 Beck, but you can play as Red Ash Beck. You have to find him. You can also play as MN9 Call for some reason, and Red Ash Call is hidden in there. It's pretty simple but Beck actually animates pretty good for a prototype. I wish there was some combat though.
Edit: Paradox!
Announcement:
Though... can they do that? I thought you were required to give kickstarter money back if not funded?
i guess they could complete it themselves
They should've just not even bothered with the Kickstarter.
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