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A Fucking Thread About the 2016 Elections, Seriously, What the Hell, I Don't Even

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Posts

  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades Class Traitor Smoke-filled roomRegistered User regular
    My antivirus software is up to date so I'm not worried about E-bola in the slightest.

  • Eat it You Nasty Pig.Eat it You Nasty Pig. tell homeland security 'we are the bomb'Registered User regular
    edited October 2014
    From last night's Paleyfest cast reunion of the The Wire:
    Former Mayor of Baltimore and now Governor of Maryland, Martin O'Malley was apparently not a fan of Aidan Gillen's Thomas Carcetti, a character loosely based on O'Malley, nor of the show. In fact, it was indicated tonight that when the Maryland state budget had to be cut, the film incentives went away, killing TV and movie production in Baltimore, because of O'Malley's dislike of the Carcetti character and the show.

    Via David Simon who is somewhat biased, but still.

    back when the show was airing simon caught a bunch of hell from o'malley and others, and wrote a response that was basically 'the show is fictional guys... but still, fuck y'all for being awful.'

    it was pretty great

    ed: found it, http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/crime/blog/2011/01/simon_responds_to_bealefelds_c.html

    Eat it You Nasty Pig. on
    NREqxl5.jpg
    it was the smallest on the list but
    Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
  • Eat it You Nasty Pig.Eat it You Nasty Pig. tell homeland security 'we are the bomb'Registered User regular
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    Rand Paul is going to have a hard time topping a ticket like this;
    Rand Paul had a message for students at Plymouth State University who had gathered for a pizza party with the Kentucky senator on Thursday: Ebola is coming for us all and the government is hiding the truth about the deadly disease.
    “This thing is incredibly contagious,” Paul said. “People are getting it, fully gowned, masked...

    “If someone has Ebola at a cocktail party they’re contagious and you can catch it from them. [The administration] should be honest about that…. You start to wonder about a basic level of competence.”

    That's a level of crazy conspiracy theory that has been relegated to VP of late.

    Isn't he a doctor of some kind? This is straight up irresponsible.

    it's just that they drink actual blood at most of the cocktail parties he goes to, you see

    I really hope they're dumb enough to nominate him. An entire campaign devoted to Rand Paul Saying Weird Things would be the best, especially since there's probably no way they keep his dad off the campaign trail.

    NREqxl5.jpg
    it was the smallest on the list but
    Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    He's an ophthalmologist. When there's an outbreak of eyebola then I might care what he has to say.

    Specifically a self-licensed one. Made his own board and everything.

    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
  • MarathonMarathon Registered User regular
    He's an ophthalmologist. When there's an outbreak of eyebola then I might care what he has to say.

    Specifically a self-licensed one. Made his own board and everything.

    The free market at work. Creating doctors out of thin air.

  • iTunesIsEviliTunesIsEvil Cornfield? Cornfield.Registered User regular
    edited October 2014
    He's an ophthalmologist. When there's an outbreak of eyebola then I might care what he has to say.

    Specifically a self-licensed one. Made his own board and everything.

    There's not a reaction button appropriate for this post. I need a "fuck this world/country" button on occasion.

    There should not be a way that he can fucking do that. INTERNET RAGE

    iTunesIsEvil on
  • silence1186silence1186 Character shields down! As a wingmanRegistered User regular
    He's an ophthalmologist. When there's an outbreak of eyebola then I might care what he has to say.

    Specifically a self-licensed one. Made his own board and everything.

    There's not a reaction button appropriate for this post. I need a "fuck this world/country" button on occasion.

    There should not be a way that he can fucking do that. INTERNET RAGE

    Oh man. The next reaction IcyLiquid makes should be "Table flip."

  • DiplominatorDiplominator Hardcore Porg Registered User regular
    He's an ophthalmologist. When there's an outbreak of eyebola then I might care what he has to say.

    Specifically a self-licensed one. Made his own board and everything.

    As far as I can tell this is true but not exactly the whole story. He went to a legit medical school and went through residency and everything and practiced for a while, and it looks like the certification thing was a way to protest the ophthalmology board requiring decennial recertification for new members but not older ones. This all seems kinda arrogant and petty to me, but I was mostly joking about the eyebola thing. He's a real-life medical professional and he should not be running his mouth to scare people and score political points.

  • silence1186silence1186 Character shields down! As a wingmanRegistered User regular
    Bernie Sanders was on Chris Hayes tonight talking about his possible presidential run. Even if he won't win, I sort of hope he does run, just to inject his ideas into the public discourse.

  • silence1186silence1186 Character shields down! As a wingmanRegistered User regular
    Geth knows what's up.

  • JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    http://www.queerty.com/students-embarrass-rick-perry-with-explicit-questions-about-gay-sex-during-college-visit-20141110

    This is super immature and I know I should be opposed to people doing shit like this, but goddamn it, it's hilarious.

  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades Class Traitor Smoke-filled roomRegistered User regular
    That'll change minds, asking questions phrased like they're from an immature 12-year-old.

    Don't get me wrong, Perry is a horrible person and I won't lose any sleep over him being embarrassed, but stuff like this actually sort of hurts the cause by making its supporters look unintelligent and puerile. Rise above the bigotry, don't sink below it.

  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    That'll change minds, asking questions phrased like they're from an immature 12-year-old.

    Don't get me wrong, Perry is a horrible person and I won't lose any sleep over him being embarrassed, but stuff like this actually sort of hurts the cause by making its supporters look unintelligent and puerile. Rise above the bigotry, don't sink below it.

    This isn't sinking below the bigotry, this is just some kids mocking a old wrinkly douchebag with some juvenile humour.

  • CptKemzikCptKemzik Registered User regular
    edited November 2014
    I honestly could care less about the questions being "immature."

    If you, as a public figure, have a habit of making asinine remarks, be prepared to reap asinine questions from an audience at a "serious" political event.

    CptKemzik on
  • MillMill Registered User regular
    Well Jim Webb has launched an exploratory committee for president. On one hand I don't really want Hilary, mostly because I don't like the dynasty thing and she strikes me as too hawkish and pro-Israel. Age is a minor factor, but I'll only really panic about that if she picks a nutjob person for her VP spot, which seems very unlikely (there are rumors that it might get offered to Tim Kaine if she does indeed get the nod). I'd like for the democratic primary to be competitive and in such a way that it nudges the winner to the left. This is where I'm not exactly thrilled with having Webb in the mix because I'm skeptical that he'll move the party left, let alone any of the areas where we really do need leftward movement. On the other hand, no dynasty and policy wise, doesn't strike me as any worse than Hillary and might be a much more difficult opponent for the GOP to take on (granted, I'm thinking their primary is going to be a real clown slow and I suspect Jeb Bush either won't run this time or won't be able to get out of it, the shit show a few weeks ago, that was our last midterms, just means the crazies will be emboldened).

    I'm also worried that he is going to have the same issue Warner has based on this:
    Is it possible that our next President could actually lay out a vision for the country, and create an environment where leaders from both parties and from all philosophies would feel compelled to work together for the good of the country, despite all of the money and political pressure that now demands they disagree?

    Maybe he gets it and realizes that the GOP is bat shit crazy and listen to dumb fuck, greedy, myopic oligarchs, but I'm afraid this is going to end up being Warner's dumb ass radical centrism. If one wants to shoot for centrist politics that means either taking up what the democrats already do or running to the left of them depend on whether one feels they are on the political center or just right of it. Running to the middle of the Democrats and Republicans isn't really running to the center of politics and anyone with any sense doesn't want that and I suspect most of what will be the 2016 electorate will want fuck all to do anything that would be found there.

    I won't completely write him off, quite yet. It depends on what issues he pushes and whether or not he stands with Obama and the party's position. What I would love to see pushed for:
    -Economic fairness: helping out those that need a hand. Making the 1% pay their fair share. Reigning in corporate excesses. Squelching the bullshit attempts from wealthy people to fuck those with less out of their pensions and entitlements (seriously fuck privatizing social security and medicare). Also raising the minimum wage and having it automatically adjust with inflation.
    -Point out where ACA was successful, point out where it could be improve and push for how it would be better if we just had universal health care.
    -Point out that government can be an agent for positive change and that it's just is to protect the people by reigning in the excess of those with lots of power. Also be nice if there was an effort to point out that this country has an unhealthy fetish with privatization and that most of the efforts in that are lately are pretty much bullshit scams designed to fuck over the tax payer (aka the people that want privatize things are interested in better results, they are just interested in pocketing as much taxpayer as they can for their own, while avoiding having to provide anything).
    -Really beat the environment drum and the need to combat climate change.
    -Really promote smart innovation and keeping the nation as a leader in innovative technology. So not just pushing for more research in technology to combat climate change, but pushing for more research into making new breakthroughs that could create new industries and improve everyone's quality of life.
    -Push for sane education policies.
    -Same deal with immigration, push for some sane policies.
    -Push for sane gun laws.
    -Push for sane regulations that prevent police departments from getting out of control.
    -Push for ending the stupidest aspects of the drug war.
    -Push for investing in infrastructure. We have stuff that needs repairs. Other things that need replacement or improvement to keep up with the demand they have take care of now. Get the ball rolling on getting certain pieces of infrastructure up to speed with today's reality (aka we really should be treating broadband as vital infrastructure because it's become the internet has become so integral to some many things, which mean not just laying down new lines but preventing money-grubbing, shithead imbeciles from treating it like their own little private playground that they can exploit have ever they please).
    -Bang the drum for making a run on ending the shitty CU decision by amendment, so that we don't have to wait for the court to pull its head out of its ass or worried about a future shitty court deciding that the Robert's Court was right all along, if a court before that one decides that the Robert's Court was fucking wrong.
    -Efforts on protecting the franchise and rolling back some new shit and old shit, that was blatantly designed to keep "undesirables" from voting because some asshole decided they tend not to vote for the "right" person.
    -Don't fucking run away from stuff that is popular with the base or other party members that are popular with the base. Unless someone does something illegal, it's really dumb to do so. Fuck the national media's narratives and stop letting the GOP control the narratives.

    I get that plenty of that requires having a willing Congress, but it'll be easier to get that willing Congress if we get a Presidential candidate that decides to own all or most of what I listed. If people like the candidate, they are likely to show up and vote and if they are voting for the presidential candidate, maybe they'll remember to vote down ticket. Ideally, the democrats working on the national strategy for the House and Senate races, will realize that it's okay to have a central message and that the stuff up there is worth owning. I want the 2016 Presidential race to set the tone, where in 2018, it's not the dumb fuck national media or the GOP controlling the narrative and the narrative is that the GOP can't seem to explain adequately why the oppose certain policies that are popular with a majority of the public.

    I'm skeptical that either Webb or Hillary will be on board with most of that, but then maybe they've learned and I'll be proven wrong.

  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Webb is way too conservative, has a bad tendency to discount the struggles of black people, and generally sucks on things which are not prison reform.

    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Webb is way too conservative, has a bad tendency to discount the struggles of black people, and generally sucks on things which are not prison reform.

    Yeah, I don't get the desire to throw up any other candidate as long as it's not Hillary.

  • Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    edited November 2014
    He's an ophthalmologist. When there's an outbreak of eyebola then I might care what he has to say.

    Specifically a self-licensed one. Made his own board and everything.

    As far as I can tell this is true but not exactly the whole story. He went to a legit medical school and went through residency and everything and practiced for a while, and it looks like the certification thing was a way to protest the ophthalmology board requiring decennial recertification for new members but not older ones. This all seems kinda arrogant and petty to me, but I was mostly joking about the eyebola thing. He's a real-life medical professional and he should not be running his mouth to scare people and score political points.

    Arrogant and petty..Rand Paul? Surely you jest. Anyway, in classic Rand Paul behavior, he's been implying hes' "board certified" (meaning the real board, not the one he personally made up, and also not the one that brings up a whole host of questions about the ethics of sitting on a board and certifying yourself.) up until someone did some research and asked, and then gets all huffy about it and acts like the questioner is being a total asshole. Because why should he have to answer for anything? The man thinks he's a king already, his presidential run is going to be laughable.

    Dark_Side on
  • MillMill Registered User regular
    Honestly, I'd rather not have Webb or Clinton. I don't know if we'll get better options or not, I'm kind of skeptical of that given how meager the bench looks. I do think though, that if we're going to get stuck with Clinton, that we do need for the primary to be competitive enough to fire up interest, hopefully make sure she has incentive to really trumpet the positions that the base is interested in and maybe to build up a bench of future candidates either for the next time around or for Governor and Senate seats.

    I don't think we'll be well served if Clinton gets the nod without having to make any effort. Even if the the GOP primary ends up being a burning clown car show.

  • JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    Webb is way too conservative, has a bad tendency to discount the struggles of black people, and generally sucks on things which are not prison reform.

    If there is one thing I would trust Webb to fix, it's the Veterens Affairs problems.

    Not my dream candidate by any means, but I'd definitely take him over any Republican candidate.

  • AstaerethAstaereth In the belly of the beastRegistered User regular
    Jragghen wrote: »
    Webb is way too conservative, has a bad tendency to discount the struggles of black people, and generally sucks on things which are not prison reform.

    If there is one thing I would trust Webb to fix, it's the Veterens Affairs problems.

    Not my dream candidate by any means, but I'd definitely take him over any Republican candidate.

    It's not my dream candidate, but I'd take a wheel of cheese over any Republican candidate.

    ACsTqqK.jpg
  • TraceTrace GNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam We Registered User regular
    http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/24/politics/mccain-encouraging-graham-to-run-for-president/index.html?hpt=hp_t2
    Washington (CNN) -- South Carolina Sen. Lindsey Graham is getting encouragement from a close colleague and friend, Sen. John McCain, to run for President.

    "I think he is looking at it, and I am strongly encouraging him to take a look at it," McCain, an Arizona Republican, told ABC News in a story published Monday. "I know of no one who is better versed and more important on national security policy and defense than Lindsey Graham, and I don't think these challenges to our security are going away."

    Graham floated the possibility of a run in an interview with the Weekly Standard last month, telling the magazine he'd be interested in running to guide the conversation on national security.

    "If I get through my general election, if nobody steps up in the presidential mix, if nobody's out there talking — me and McCain have been talking — I may just jump in to get to make these arguments," Graham said.

    As the libertarian wing of the GOP has gained prominence, led by expected 2016 presidential contender Sen. Rand Paul, members of the party's more hawkish old guard have floated presidential runs to offer a contrasting voice in key national security debates.

    This Sunday, however, speaking on CNN's "State of the Union," Graham sounded far from an affirmative decision.

    He said running for president is "the hardest thing one could ever do. You go through personal hell. You have got to raise a ton of money. I'm nowhere near there."

    RELATED: Sen. Lindsey Graham says GOP-led Benghazi report is 'full of crap'

    If he does jump in the race, he'll add to a Republican primary field that's already likely to include more than half a dozen contenders for the party's nomination. McCain told ABC News that he's all for a broad slate of candidates, and that the race is currently "wide open."

    "I think we should let a thousand flowers bloom. I think that the process is wide open right now, and I think not only will members of the Senate be considered, but I think some of our successful Republican governors will also be interested," he said.

  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    HAHAHAHAHAHA

    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
  • TraceTrace GNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam We Registered User regular
    I know right.

    I hope he does.

  • JohnnyCacheJohnnyCache Starting Defense Place at the tableRegistered User regular
    Trace wrote: »
    http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/24/politics/mccain-encouraging-graham-to-run-for-president/index.html?hpt=hp_t2
    Washington (CNN) -- South Carolina Sen. Lindsey Graham is getting encouragement from a close colleague and friend, Sen. John McCain, to run for President.

    "I think he is looking at it, and I am strongly encouraging him to take a look at it," McCain, an Arizona Republican, told ABC News in a story published Monday. "I know of no one who is better versed and more important on national security policy and defense than Lindsey Graham, and I don't think these challenges to our security are going away."

    Graham floated the possibility of a run in an interview with the Weekly Standard last month, telling the magazine he'd be interested in running to guide the conversation on national security.

    "If I get through my general election, if nobody steps up in the presidential mix, if nobody's out there talking — me and McCain have been talking — I may just jump in to get to make these arguments," Graham said.

    As the libertarian wing of the GOP has gained prominence, led by expected 2016 presidential contender Sen. Rand Paul, members of the party's more hawkish old guard have floated presidential runs to offer a contrasting voice in key national security debates.

    This Sunday, however, speaking on CNN's "State of the Union," Graham sounded far from an affirmative decision.

    He said running for president is "the hardest thing one could ever do. You go through personal hell. You have got to raise a ton of money. I'm nowhere near there."

    RELATED: Sen. Lindsey Graham says GOP-led Benghazi report is 'full of crap'

    If he does jump in the race, he'll add to a Republican primary field that's already likely to include more than half a dozen contenders for the party's nomination. McCain told ABC News that he's all for a broad slate of candidates, and that the race is currently "wide open."

    "I think we should let a thousand flowers bloom. I think that the process is wide open right now, and I think not only will members of the Senate be considered, but I think some of our successful Republican governors will also be interested," he said.

    oh please of please let this happen

  • Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    I cannot wait for the next Republican primary bloodbath.

  • TraceTrace GNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam We Registered User regular
    I think we should let a thousand flowers bloom


    McCain and his flowery poetry.

  • So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    old, wrinkly, white man flowers

  • JarsJars Registered User regular
    71752-bigthumbnail.jpg

  • kaidkaid Registered User regular
    Trace wrote: »
    http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/24/politics/mccain-encouraging-graham-to-run-for-president/index.html?hpt=hp_t2
    Washington (CNN) -- South Carolina Sen. Lindsey Graham is getting encouragement from a close colleague and friend, Sen. John McCain, to run for President.

    "I think he is looking at it, and I am strongly encouraging him to take a look at it," McCain, an Arizona Republican, told ABC News in a story published Monday. "I know of no one who is better versed and more important on national security policy and defense than Lindsey Graham, and I don't think these challenges to our security are going away."

    Graham floated the possibility of a run in an interview with the Weekly Standard last month, telling the magazine he'd be interested in running to guide the conversation on national security.

    "If I get through my general election, if nobody steps up in the presidential mix, if nobody's out there talking — me and McCain have been talking — I may just jump in to get to make these arguments," Graham said.

    As the libertarian wing of the GOP has gained prominence, led by expected 2016 presidential contender Sen. Rand Paul, members of the party's more hawkish old guard have floated presidential runs to offer a contrasting voice in key national security debates.

    This Sunday, however, speaking on CNN's "State of the Union," Graham sounded far from an affirmative decision.

    He said running for president is "the hardest thing one could ever do. You go through personal hell. You have got to raise a ton of money. I'm nowhere near there."

    RELATED: Sen. Lindsey Graham says GOP-led Benghazi report is 'full of crap'

    If he does jump in the race, he'll add to a Republican primary field that's already likely to include more than half a dozen contenders for the party's nomination. McCain told ABC News that he's all for a broad slate of candidates, and that the race is currently "wide open."

    "I think we should let a thousand flowers bloom. I think that the process is wide open right now, and I think not only will members of the Senate be considered, but I think some of our successful Republican governors will also be interested," he said.

    oh please of please let this happen

    Okay please let Lindsey Graham run hell I will vote for him if only to see how many fainting couches need to be installed in the white house to prevent him from injuring himself. I am white and middle age man of reasonable income I say bring on the Lindseypocalypse.

  • TaramoorTaramoor Storyteller Registered User regular
    Americans won't vote for a man named Lindsey for President.

  • TofystedethTofystedeth Registered User regular
    Taramoor wrote: »
    Americans won't vote for a man named Lindsey for President.
    What about
    g1rwc6dylofh.gif
    ?

    steam_sig.png
  • HefflingHeffling No Pic EverRegistered User regular
    Because the last time we had an actor as president it turned out so well...

  • TofystedethTofystedeth Registered User regular
    Not Christian Kane. Lindsay McDonald. Accomplished lawyer, musician, swordsman and practitioner of the dark arts.

    steam_sig.png
  • TicaldfjamTicaldfjam Snoqualmie, WARegistered User regular
    Dammit Now I want Santorum to run against Lindsey in the GOP Primary to see the fucking heads explode at the cognitive dissonance of their most feared nightmare.

    The popcorn. The Popcorn!!

  • JohnnyCacheJohnnyCache Starting Defense Place at the tableRegistered User regular
    kaid wrote: »
    Trace wrote: »
    http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/24/politics/mccain-encouraging-graham-to-run-for-president/index.html?hpt=hp_t2
    Washington (CNN) -- South Carolina Sen. Lindsey Graham is getting encouragement from a close colleague and friend, Sen. John McCain, to run for President.

    "I think he is looking at it, and I am strongly encouraging him to take a look at it," McCain, an Arizona Republican, told ABC News in a story published Monday. "I know of no one who is better versed and more important on national security policy and defense than Lindsey Graham, and I don't think these challenges to our security are going away."

    Graham floated the possibility of a run in an interview with the Weekly Standard last month, telling the magazine he'd be interested in running to guide the conversation on national security.

    "If I get through my general election, if nobody steps up in the presidential mix, if nobody's out there talking — me and McCain have been talking — I may just jump in to get to make these arguments," Graham said.

    As the libertarian wing of the GOP has gained prominence, led by expected 2016 presidential contender Sen. Rand Paul, members of the party's more hawkish old guard have floated presidential runs to offer a contrasting voice in key national security debates.

    This Sunday, however, speaking on CNN's "State of the Union," Graham sounded far from an affirmative decision.

    He said running for president is "the hardest thing one could ever do. You go through personal hell. You have got to raise a ton of money. I'm nowhere near there."

    RELATED: Sen. Lindsey Graham says GOP-led Benghazi report is 'full of crap'

    If he does jump in the race, he'll add to a Republican primary field that's already likely to include more than half a dozen contenders for the party's nomination. McCain told ABC News that he's all for a broad slate of candidates, and that the race is currently "wide open."

    "I think we should let a thousand flowers bloom. I think that the process is wide open right now, and I think not only will members of the Senate be considered, but I think some of our successful Republican governors will also be interested," he said.

    oh please of please let this happen

    Okay please let Lindsey Graham run hell I will vote for him if only to see how many fainting couches need to be installed in the white house to prevent him from injuring himself. I am white and middle age man of reasonable income I say bring on the Lindseypocalypse.

    to be clear, I am talking about him running, which would amuse me. Not him winning, which would mark our national descent into bat country.

  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    edited November 2014
    Ticaldfjam wrote: »
    Dammit Now I want Santorum to run against Lindsey in the GOP Primary to see the fucking heads explode at the cognitive dissonance of their most feared nightmare.

    The popcorn. The Popcorn!!

    I'd vote for Lindsey McDonald.

    Harry Dresden on
  • BlindPsychicBlindPsychic Registered User regular
    I hope this is the appropriate thread for this, as our dear Senator Cruz would like to run for President. I hope I'm not reposting this.

    Anyways, on November 20th, Ted Cruz gave a speech that was basically the Mad Libs version of Cicero's 'Against Catiline"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVYfPKzZY9Y

    Now, as expected, I don't think Cruz really understands the context of what Cicero is talking about here, beyond that it fits nicely into what he wants to say about Obama.
    There was - there was once such virtue in this republic, that brave men and women would repress mischievous citizens with severer chastisement than the most bitter enemy. For we have a resolution of the senate, a formidable and authoritative decree against you, O Catiline Mr. President; the wisdom of the republic is not at fault, nor the dignity of this senatorial body. We, we alone - I say it openly - we, the consuls Senate, are waiting in our duty to stop this lawless administration and its unconstitutional amnesty.

    Now, I don't think Cruz, purposely made a veiled death threat against the President there, but who knows.

    (For Context, Cicero here was making allusions to the fates of the Gracchi brothers, Saturninus and a few other attempted reformers who's names escape me at the moment)

  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    Not Christian Kane. Lindsay McDonald. Accomplished lawyer, musician, swordsman and practitioner of the dark arts.

    Ehhhh, still evil. Now Elliot Spencer, that's a man I trust.

  • AManFromEarthAManFromEarth Let's get to twerk! The King in the SwampRegistered User regular
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