Oh, I didn't mean to be taken seriously when I made offensive racist and monstrously sexist remarks about a group of women I don't even fucking know and have never met, I just wanted a few cheap laughs from my mouth-breather listeners. Please forgive me?
How about "No."
Radio broadcasters have been fired for far, far less. Only ultraconservative right-wing shills like Limbaugh and Dr. Laura can make these kinds of comments without losing their jobs, and that is only because they are accurately representing the opinions of their right-wing employers.
Don Imus is on CN-fucking-N, and if he expected to be employed after making that comment then he is so fucking terminally stupid he should have died from forgetting not to inhale while swallowing a long time ago.
I'm less interested in seeing him lose his job because his comments are so wildly offensive and more interested in seeing him go down because I find him utterly unentertaining, and of course; schadenfreude.
Wow, this thread is...depressing. Yet also strangely pleasing. Because I am not particularly cool or worldly, yet compared to some of you I'm James Goddamn Bond.
I mean, we've had Guy Who Doesn't Know Who Imus Is Yet Feels The Need To Hold Forth In This Thread, Guy Who Doesn't Know the Connotations of "Nappy" Yet Feels The Need To Hold Forth In This Thread, and that perennial escapee from the fucktard booby hatch, Guy Who Doesn't Get Why People Get Offended About Asshole Things Said To Them. Make yourselves comfortable, sheltered white internet nerds, for I am about to lay bare the deepest secrets of the universe:
You don't get to tell people, especially people who live every day putting up with other people's fear and suspicion of them, what they may and may not be offended by. You don't get to set boundaries as to what's reasonable, partly because you're not the one getting pulled over at 3am for having a clean, fairly new car that "doesn't look like it belongs to you", but mainly because there's this cool thing called basic human decency.
Miss Manners says that, if you give offense without meaning to, you apologize and make amends. You don't start fucking blathering about how silly and trivial it was and what the fuck is wrong with the person and they're probably just trying to blow it all out of proportion to make you look bad - that is, unless you actually want to look like a complete creep. Now, if someone doesn't accept your sincere apology, then you can write them off as a dick, but that doesn't actually relieve you of your obligation to behave like a grown-up.
Oh, and you don't do it again. Which is the problem here: Imus has a history of this shit, and people are sick of his fake-ass lying apologies, and have decided to correct the popular misimpression of him as a mouthy-but-loveable "straight shooter."
Nobody's saying he needs to be hauled off to jail or denying his right to behave like a jackass, yet people like Vargas Prime - apparently coming to us via transdimensional internet from Earth-2 - keep railing against exactly that. "It's a free speech issue." Well duh, which is why Sharpton and Jesse Jackson and pundits and people around the nation are getting out there and using their free speech rights to talk about Imus, put pressure on sponsors and raise the public consciousness. But apparently Vargas finds that sort of free speech objectionable.
And I'm free, in my turn, to find that desperately retarded at best, and actively despicable at worst.
My bad. Same point though, unless he was on Fox News his ass was getting fired for that comment, and I refuse to believe that his ego is so large he didn't see it coming.
Guy Who Doesn't Know the Connotations of "Nappy" Yet Feels The Need To Hold Forth In This Thread
The only point I have tried to make, Guy Who Tries To Be Handy With The Tongue-Sword, But Comes Off As Trying Just A Bit Too Hard, is that with all of the important, potentially life-changing and newsworthy events going on right now, why should I care about this old, decrepid jackass or who the father of Anna Nicole's child is? Why is this mindless, pointless, inane drivel on the front page of every major news source when countries like Iran are enriching uranium? Go ahead, nail this guy to the cross, fire him, fine him, whatever. It won't change a goddamn thing. If racism is really the issue here, how about we put our collective grunt into something that will actually make a difference? Oh wait, this is America. Mob mentality and all that.
PS. Sorry I didn't know what nappy meant, asshole.
Edit for a random semicolon. Fuck you, semicolon.
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ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
edited April 2007
Damn shame.
You know, I understand why people would be upset. And that's fine. But for someone to lose their job because someone else doesn't like what they said... it's rather bullshit. Jesus christ, people here laugh about "fatties," "fat-asses," "hogs," and the like, but I've never called a press conference over it because I was offended!
It really comes down to people being too fucking sensitive, and not using their brains. You don't like what someone says?
Use it. You don't want to support them? Fine, vote with your wallet.
It all comes back to the old saying, "Sir, I disagree with what you say, but I will fight for your right to say it."
Turn the station, find a better program, and move on with your life.
Edit for quick definition lookup, from dictionary.com:
JacobkoshGamble a stamp.I can show you how to be a real man!Moderatormod
edited April 2007
Why does it make the news? Maybe because it pissed off millions of people?
You persist in your massively paternalistic insistence that it's not worth talking about, when the entire black/minority/not-a-dickhole community begs to differ. What the fuck does Anna Nicole's baby have to do with this or anything? Do you see why people might possibly get het up at your blithe comparisons of a symptom of a serious social problem with a celebrity freakshow? It certainly doesn't make you look very well-informed or considerate.
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JacobkoshGamble a stamp.I can show you how to be a real man!Moderatormod
Just to be clear, that means MSNBC won't be playing his show as they broadcast it on the radio, it should still be on the radio all around the country unless CBS radio decides to drop it.
Nobody's saying he needs to be hauled off to jail or denying his right to behave like a jackass, yet people like Vargas Prime - apparently coming to us via transdimensional internet from Earth-2 - keep railing against exactly that. "It's a free speech issue." Well duh, which is why Sharpton and Jesse Jackson and pundits and people around the nation are getting out there and using their free speech rights to talk about Imus, put pressure on sponsors and raise the public consciousness. But apparently Vargas finds that sort of free speech objectionable.
And I'm free, in my turn, to find that desperately retarded at best, and actively despicable at worst.
Well, Mr. James Goddamn Bond, since you called me out specifically...
From my post here at Earth-2, I can comfortably agree that no one gets to pick and choose what they are offended by. By that same right, you can't go causing a media scene and call for someone's head because they say something that offends you personally, but doesn't violate any laws or personal rights.
Some people are offended by dick and fart jokes, so when a radio personality like Howard Stern or Opie and Anthony base most of their shows around crude humor and foul language, does that mean that any prude listening to the radio should get up in arms and take to the streets, calling for people's jobs? Sure, if they want to, but it shouldn't bear legal precedent or result in fines when no regulations have been broken.
Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, the Rutgers girls, and every person from here to California has a right to speak up and voice their opinion about what Imus said, and I never said they didn't even though it might be some of the biggest hypocritical bullshit in history. But when people let those opinions affect legal issues like his right to broadcast, it's turned into something that it shouldn't be. I hope to whatever god is listening that NBC doesn't let Imus go, and I don't even listen to his show. But advertisers are pulling their support like wildfire, and now the FCC is investigating Imus's show, and it's a sad fucking commentary on the state of free speech in our media.
Why does it make the news? Maybe because it pissed off millions of people?
Pissed off? "Let's find out where he lives and cut his fucking head off!!!" Or "Hey, that was a dickish thing to say, what a dildo. I'm not listening to this crap anymore. *click*"? I'm the latter.
You persist in your massively paternalistic insistence that it's not worth talking about, when the entire black/minority/not-a-dickhole community begs to differ.
Absolutes are triple-A AAAwesome.
What the fuck does Anna Nicole's baby have to do with this or anything? Do you see why people might possibly get het up at your blithe comparisons of a symptom of a serious social problem with a celebrity freakshow? It certainly doesn't make you look very well-informed or considerate.
They're both sensational stories, and The Mob is loving to take a bite of this huge shit-sandwich.
Again I ask, if this is truely about racism why do we crucify one man instead of attacking the institution as a whole? I promise Don Imus is not the be-all-end-all of racism in America. Promise.
Edited for grammar. Fuck you, grammar.
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ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
Did you read the other post on the last page about the significance of nappy hair? Read it again.
1 - True, true. Again, if people don't like what he has to say, they have the right to bitch. But the thought of his program being removed from the air is disturbing. If you don't think so, I find that disturbing as well.
2 - I read the post. I disagree. Many people believe, like the one poster (too lazy to look, I'm sorry) that it means exactly what the definition I posted says. Obviously, dictionary.com believes it too.
I've seen the pictures of the women on the team. Most of them have -very- straight hair, when it's done up for the camera. When they were playing, it was a tangled mess. They had tattoos all over. Is it wrong of a person to think someone is unattractive to say so? Jesus christ, you really don't know that he was being racist... unless you come from the future with your mind-reading hat.
I'd also like to point out that at least two of the players were white... ya know, for the record.
Again I ask, if this is truely about racism why do we crucify one man instead of attacking the institution as a whole? I promise Don Imus is not the be-all-end-all of racism in America. Promise.
Why can't we do both?
and @ Vargas -- nobody, that I'm aware of, is calling for legal sanctions against Mr. Imus. They're simply asking he be fired, and applying public pressure to achieve these means, which pretty much makes your whole post moot.
Again I ask, if this is truely about racism why do we crucify one man instead of attacking the institution as a whole? I promise Don Imus is not the be-all-end-all of racism in America. Promise.
Why can't we do both?
Go right the Hell ahead, but unfortunately only the first is happening.
Don't worry, we'll slay this paper dragon (read: racism in media) just like we have ten thousand times before and the next time he rears his ugly head we'll all be dumbfounded as to why.
Again I ask, if this is truely about racism why do we crucify one man instead of attacking the institution as a whole? I promise Don Imus is not the be-all-end-all of racism in America. Promise.
Why can't we do both?
and @ Vargas -- nobody, that I'm aware of, is calling for legal sanctions against Mr. Imus. They're simply asking he be fired, and applying public pressure to achieve these means, which pretty much makes your whole post moot.
That you're aware of. The fact that the FCC is now investigating him, so far after the broadcast, means that SOMEONE was putting pressure on them to do so. Whether it was pressure applied by activists behind the scenes, or whether the wishy-washy FCC decided that they just HAD to do something because so many people complained, who knows?
The FCC is probably going to reach some made-up conclusion about the broadcast, or drudge up some quote from years-gone-by that could possibly, when taken out of context and analyzed enough, be grounds for a fine to the station, and Imus's removal from his show.
I agree with Shadowfire above. The fact that he's getting backlash for his comments doesn't surprise me in the least, but the fact that it's coming into a legal aspect and the FCC is getting involved disturbs me greatly.
Again I ask, if this is truely about racism why do we crucify one man instead of attacking the institution as a whole? I promise Don Imus is not the be-all-end-all of racism in America. Promise.
Why can't we do both?
Go right the Hell ahead, but unfortunately only the first is happening.
Don't worry, we'll slay this paper dragon just like we have ten thousand times before and the next time he rears his ugly head we'll all be dumbfounded as to why.
Edited to add stuff. Fuck you adding stuff.
Obviously Imus losing his job won't end racism but I think the point is to send the message that society is no longer willing to tolerate that kind of behavior.
2 - I read the post. I disagree. Many people believe, like the one poster (too lazy to look, I'm sorry) that it means exactly what the definition I posted says. Obviously, dictionary.com believes it too.
dictionary.com is hardly the resource you want to be leaning on here. What you're doing is the equivalent of posting the definition of "big" and "nose" to make the claim a remark someone made wasn't anti-semitic.
Like jacobkosh said, it's not really your place to be deciding what is offensive and what isn't. As a matter of fact it's dangerously paternalistic to do so. No matter how determined some people seem to be in believing it, this isn't just some uppity rabble-rousers causing a stink. There are a significant number of level-headed people who are upset with his comments, and based on his track record, are having a hard time finding his subsequent apology sincere. They are not attempting to restrict his free speech, they're merely attempting to get him removed from his position as a national broadcaster.
I'm personally glad that it appears they've been effective.
2 - I read the post. I disagree. Many people believe, like the one poster (too lazy to look, I'm sorry) that it means exactly what the definition I posted says. Obviously, dictionary.com believes it too.
dictionary.com is hardly the resource you want to be leaning on here. What you're doing is the equivalent of posting the definition of "big" and "nose" to make the claim a remark someone made wasn't anti-semitic.
Like jacobkosh said, it's not really your place to be deciding what is offensive and what isn't. As a matter of fact it's dangerously paternalistic to do so. No matter how determined some people seem to be in believing it, this isn't just some uppity rabble-rousers causing a stink. There are a significant number of level-headed people who are upset with his comments, and based on his track record, are having a hard time finding his subsequent apology sincere. They are not attempting to restrict his free speech, they're merely attempting to get him removed from his position as a national broadcaster.
I'm personally glad that it appears they've been effective.
O_o
I really, really don't see the difference between those two things. He has a show, on the radio, where his main tactic is to say things some people find offensive, and others find funny. In reality, I'm not saying people shouldn't be offended... people will be offended at whatever they like. That's fine. But coming out and having press conferences, plastering it all over the news (when there are more worthwhile things to be shown), and trying to ruin a guy's career for doing his job is assinine. Seriously, change the station to something else.
Anyone else think we'll see Imus on XM soon enough?
Again I ask, if this is truely about racism why do we crucify one man instead of attacking the institution as a whole? I promise Don Imus is not the be-all-end-all of racism in America. Promise.
Why can't we do both?
Go right the Hell ahead, but unfortunately only the first is happening.
Don't worry, we'll slay this paper dragon just like we have ten thousand times before and the next time he rears his ugly head we'll all be dumbfounded as to why.
Edited to add stuff. Fuck you adding stuff.
Obviously Imus losing his job won't end racism but I think the point is to send the message that society is no longer willing to tolerate that kind of behavior.
Just last month here in Texas, neo-Nazis rallied at the border to decry illegal immigration. Even if the message is terrible, America will never eliminate free speech to end racism.
2 - I read the post. I disagree. Many people believe, like the one poster (too lazy to look, I'm sorry) that it means exactly what the definition I posted says. Obviously, dictionary.com believes it too.
dictionary.com is hardly the resource you want to be leaning on here. What you're doing is the equivalent of posting the definition of "big" and "nose" to make the claim a remark someone made wasn't anti-semitic.
Like jacobkosh said, it's not really your place to be deciding what is offensive and what isn't. As a matter of fact it's dangerously paternalistic to do so. No matter how determined some people seem to be in believing it, this isn't just some uppity rabble-rousers causing a stink. There are a significant number of level-headed people who are upset with his comments, and based on his track record, are having a hard time finding his subsequent apology sincere. They are not attempting to restrict his free speech, they're merely attempting to get him removed from his position as a national broadcaster.
I'm personally glad that it appears they've been effective.
O_o
I really, really don't see the difference between those two things. He has a show, on the radio, where his main tactic is to say things some people find offensive, and others find funny. In reality, I'm not saying people shouldn't be offended... people will be offended at whatever they like. That's fine. But coming out and having press conferences, plastering it all over the news (when there are more worthwhile things to be shown), and trying to ruin a guy's career for doing his job is assinine. Seriously, change the station to something else.
You have a right to free speech. You don't have a right to a radio show.
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JacobkoshGamble a stamp.I can show you how to be a real man!Moderatormod
But coming out and having press conferences, plastering it all over the news (when there are more worthwhile things to be shown), and trying to ruin a guy's career for doing his job is assinine.
Amazing concept time: not your place to decide. Instead perhaps now might be a good time to go brain on/mouth off and actually educate yourself as to why people who've experienced certain things might decide they've had enough of that type of behavior.
EDIT: also, wtf? How is being a caveman boor his job? Being decent human beings is all our real job, no matter what we get paid for.
I mean you could make a small list of more intelligent hip-hop artists, like maybe Tribe, but they still have songs that are sexist in some manner on some of their albums.
Listen to more rap music, unless you want to talk about what sells, which is something else entirely.
I think what sells is all that matters here.
Its the cultural impact of rap.......white/black/latinos using "ghetto" speak to be funny. It's the popularization of hip-hop/rap culture.
Anyway, if it pisses you off, stop paying for cable, or boycott the show. I could care less if he gets fired or not, it doesn't mean al sharpton isn't a hypocritical douche bag.
Imus will probably get a new job on sirius or something......which could be worse than hell.
Funny too, I bet most of you who are screaming the loudest for Imus' blood, own or have played Grand Theft Auto, but if anybody tried to drag out the creators you'd scream, "freedom of speech!". It much more sexist on every level. Simulating Beating up hookers? Living out some voyeurs fantasy of living in the "hood". The language is worse and it advocates more violence and sexism than any comment that moron has made.
But that probably hits a little too close to home for most of you to stomach.
Lesson: Before you get on any high horse realize you're just as much a part of the problem as anybody.
I do see the difference between prohibiting someone from speaking their mind, and making a business decision not to continue sponsoring, simulcasting, and broadcasting his program.
People are being overly sensitive, sure, but I'm not in charge over at WFAN or at CBS, or MSNBC. It's their decision.
Now, shit like the FCC's unconstitutional crusade to "clean up" the airwaves is a different issue altogether.
I really, really don't see the difference between those two things. He has a show, on the radio, where his main tactic is to say things some people find offensive, and others find funny. In reality, I'm not saying people shouldn't be offended... people will be offended at whatever they like. That's fine. But coming out and having press conferences, plastering it all over the news (when there are more worthwhile things to be shown), and trying to ruin a guy's career for doing his job is assinine. Seriously, change the station to something else.
Anyone else think we'll see Imus on XM soon enough?
Just to be clear, that means MSNBC won't be playing his show as they broadcast it on the radio, it should still be on the radio all around the country unless CBS radio decides to drop it.
To all who think the outrage is somehow misguided:
People are demanding he apologize. And he has tried, and ends up sounding more racist than before. What's your problem with this situation? Free speech doesn't mean people don't have a right to make a stink if you're needlessly insulting. I don't see what you're all getting your panties in a bunch about.
Imus fucked up, and now he's experiencing what he deserves.
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JacobkoshGamble a stamp.I can show you how to be a real man!Moderatormod
Obviously Imus losing his job won't end racism but I think the point is to send the message that society is no longer willing to tolerate that kind of behavior.
Just last month here in Texas, neo-Nazis rallied at the border to decry illegal immigration. Even if the message is terrible, America will never eliminate free speech to end racism.
I suppose that would make sense if some kind of legal action was being taken against him. Its more along the lines of if you choose to act that way expect people to respond negatively and if you happen to be a radio host it could mean losing your job. Last time I checked you don't need a radio show to exercise freedom of speech.
By that same right, you can't go causing a media scene and call for someone's head because they say something that offends you personally, but doesn't violate any laws or personal rights.
Yes you fucking can. Your failure to understand this is why people are making fun of you.
The fact that the FCC is now investigating him, so far after the broadcast, means that SOMEONE was putting pressure on them to do so. Whether it was pressure applied by activists behind the scenes, or whether the wishy-washy FCC decided that they just HAD to do something because so many people complained, who knows?
The FCC only responds when complaints are made.
Only.
ONLY.
That is how they work. It is their policy. If Imus' radio program were only broadcast in a few racist, all-white mouth-breather communities, then there would be no investigation, because no one would have complained.
The very fact that the FCC functions this way means that the more widely broadcast a program is, the more careful they need to be in what they say. When you are doing a national program you need to consider the community standards of every community in the country. Needless to say, this means making racist comments is abysmally stupid for such a widely broadcast show. And the stupid should be punished.
But the whole thing is getting out of proportion. Imus should be reprimanded for his racist comments against the Rutgers team and his previous comments during his career. I dont see why his past transgressions arent being brought up to light and attacked, instead of focusing on these players.
Don Imus has referred to Gwen Ifill as a "cleaning lady," called Amelie Mauresmo "a big old lesbo," called Howard Kurtz a "beanie-wearing little Jewboy," said that "the gorilla special effects in Instinct" reminded him of "the starting line-up of the Knicks," called the Williams sisters "two booma-chucka, big-butted women" while his partner called Venus an "animal" and said that they would more likely be featured in National Geographic than in Playboy (and his said his comments weren't racist, "just zoological."), called an Indian men's doubles team "Gunga Din and Sambo," Contessa Brewer, a female newsreader, left the show because she couldn't handle his abuse, and Stern has said that loved to go around the NBC studio and calling black people the n-word.
Plenty of people are talking about it. I keep hearing these stories repeated all over the news, but the recent one the most, because it's recent.
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JacobkoshGamble a stamp.I can show you how to be a real man!Moderatormod
edited April 2007
So here's what I think.
I was confused why the people lining up to howl "GEEZ GET OVER IT ALREADY GOSH" are clinging so tenaciously to this topsy turvy world of theirs where up is down, black is white, and the innocent are constantly being persecuted for clearly innocuous speech. I mean, once it's demonstrated that the speech wasn't innocuous, or that Imus was far from innocent, or that he's not even being persecuted, surely reason would assert itself? But it hasn't, and that confused me.
But now I think I know what it is. I think the conservative conventional wisdom has poisoned the waters to such an extent that, among a certain species of well-meaning but sheltered white middle-class person, there's this terror of being seen as racist, so that they go around looking at all black people like ticking time bombs waiting to go BOOM! and accuse them of all sorts of horrible things.
But allow me to lay the healing balm on thy troubled brow:
You don't need to worry about this. It's not real. 99% of black folks just want to be treated the way you treat anyone else - er, unless you're a dick to people, then you can leave that at home. That means, look them in the eye and speak with respect, while being cognizant that because of a different cultural background they might sometimes interpret things differently from you.
You might unintentionally give offense. It does happen sometimes, although much more rarely than fucking Rush Limbaugh would have you believe - and you know, when it does happen, nine times out of ten you won't hear about it, because the other person will just sigh and shake their head and try to get along with you anyway, or they'll write you off as a tard and avoid you. If they do get offended and tell you, quit sweating bullets! Apologize and endeavor not to repeat that mistake. If the person's cool, it won't be a big deal, and you'll have learned something.
This isn't special 21st century space wisdom. This is, like, eighteenth century elementary diplomacy. I think the real problem is that more and more the internerd keeps us from having to interact with people with vastly different backgrounds and worldviews, so we've forgotten the simple elegant rules for how to get along with people. But look: bottom line, if you're not sure how to handle a situation, ask yourself what would a decent gracious person do in this circumstance, and then copy them. The moral compass does not point towards racism or dickery.
You might unintentionally give offense. It does happen sometimes, although much more rarely than fucking Rush Limbaugh would have you believe - and you know, when it does happen, nine times out of ten you won't hear about it, because the other person will just sigh and shake their head and try to get along with you anyway, or they'll write you off as a tard and avoid you. If they do get offended and tell you, quit sweating bullets! Apologize and endeavor not to repeat that mistake. If the person's cool, it won't be a big deal, and you'll have learned something.
Counterpoint.
One day I was walking back to the barracks from work, and two of my fellow radiomen were a ways ahead of me. One black, one white. At a cross walk, an older black gentleman intersected them, and there was a brief hesitation, eye contact, and the white guy passed on through the crosswalk in front of this black gentleman "cutting him off" so to speak. This black gentleman went aggro, flagged down the nearest officer he could find (who was from a different command, and didn't want to be involved *at all* but felt obligated because he was in uniform) and demanded that he get the name and command of my white friend so he could lodge a formal complaint.
The complaint? This black gentleman felt slighted.
The verdict is that sometimes, however rarely, black people will be utter and total fucking assholes to random white people for no fucking reason whatsoever except that they don't like white people.
Like I said, just a counterpoint. The fears many white people have of the behavior of black people aren't totally founded in lunar logic. There's always another side to the story, however politically incorrect and taboo it may be to discuss.
None of this excuses Imus in any way, but I feel that no serious discussion on race in this country can ever be meaningful if it must begin from a standpoint of "white people are irrational and wrong".
That means, look them in the eye and speak with respect, while being cognizant that because of a different cultural background they might sometimes interpret things differently from you.
Certainly true - but what a lot of people want to know is, where is the line? Where is the understanding of nuance? When does context and intent come into play?
This should have been over the day it came out with an apology from IMUS to the basketball team, maybe a letter. Instead racial opportunists have hopped in here, tossed oil on the situation and are fanning those flames till they reach the sky. Absolutely the team has a right to not "get over it" - but IMUS also has the right to say "Look goddamnit, I wasn't thinking and the wrong word came out. Im not a racist, and if you insist I am - find me something more than 2-seconds where I lost my head. Sexist - sure; but racist - to hell with that." We see language like this used constantly, we're able to put STONE and PARKER's Southpark into context (hell where Jackson himself is demanding his o-ring to be fellated), but not here - not the unhip IMUS. He's going to be made an example of.
Posts
How about "No."
Radio broadcasters have been fired for far, far less. Only ultraconservative right-wing shills like Limbaugh and Dr. Laura can make these kinds of comments without losing their jobs, and that is only because they are accurately representing the opinions of their right-wing employers.
Don Imus is on CN-fucking-N, and if he expected to be employed after making that comment then he is so fucking terminally stupid he should have died from forgetting not to inhale while swallowing a long time ago.
I'm less interested in seeing him lose his job because his comments are so wildly offensive and more interested in seeing him go down because I find him utterly unentertaining, and of course; schadenfreude.
Ten awesome-points for you, sir!
My bad. Same point though, unless he was on Fox News his ass was getting fired for that comment, and I refuse to believe that his ego is so large he didn't see it coming.
"MSNBC is canceling its simulcast of Don Imus' radio show after he made racially charged remarks about Rutgers women's basketball team."
I'd link it but it's just some text under the "BREAKING NEWS" bar.
edit- Story on MSNBC.com
The only point I have tried to make, Guy Who Tries To Be Handy With The Tongue-Sword, But Comes Off As Trying Just A Bit Too Hard, is that with all of the important, potentially life-changing and newsworthy events going on right now, why should I care about this old, decrepid jackass or who the father of Anna Nicole's child is? Why is this mindless, pointless, inane drivel on the front page of every major news source when countries like Iran are enriching uranium? Go ahead, nail this guy to the cross, fire him, fine him, whatever. It won't change a goddamn thing. If racism is really the issue here, how about we put our collective grunt into something that will actually make a difference? Oh wait, this is America. Mob mentality and all that.
PS. Sorry I didn't know what nappy meant, asshole.
Edit for a random semicolon. Fuck you, semicolon.
You know, I understand why people would be upset. And that's fine. But for someone to lose their job because someone else doesn't like what they said... it's rather bullshit. Jesus christ, people here laugh about "fatties," "fat-asses," "hogs," and the like, but I've never called a press conference over it because I was offended!
It really comes down to people being too fucking sensitive, and not using their brains. You don't like what someone says?
Use it. You don't want to support them? Fine, vote with your wallet.
It all comes back to the old saying, "Sir, I disagree with what you say, but I will fight for your right to say it."
Turn the station, find a better program, and move on with your life.
Edit for quick definition lookup, from dictionary.com:
nap·py 1 (nāp'ē) Pronunciation Key
adj. nap·pi·er, nap·pi·est
1. Having a nap; fuzzy.
2. Kinky; frizzy.
You persist in your massively paternalistic insistence that it's not worth talking about, when the entire black/minority/not-a-dickhole community begs to differ. What the fuck does Anna Nicole's baby have to do with this or anything? Do you see why people might possibly get het up at your blithe comparisons of a symptom of a serious social problem with a celebrity freakshow? It certainly doesn't make you look very well-informed or considerate.
That's what they're encouraging people to do, if you'd actually, y'know, read the thread.
Did you read the other post on the last page about the significance of nappy hair? Read it again.
I would call both of them symptoms of serious social problems, but that's just me.
Well, Mr. James Goddamn Bond, since you called me out specifically...
From my post here at Earth-2, I can comfortably agree that no one gets to pick and choose what they are offended by. By that same right, you can't go causing a media scene and call for someone's head because they say something that offends you personally, but doesn't violate any laws or personal rights.
Some people are offended by dick and fart jokes, so when a radio personality like Howard Stern or Opie and Anthony base most of their shows around crude humor and foul language, does that mean that any prude listening to the radio should get up in arms and take to the streets, calling for people's jobs? Sure, if they want to, but it shouldn't bear legal precedent or result in fines when no regulations have been broken.
Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, the Rutgers girls, and every person from here to California has a right to speak up and voice their opinion about what Imus said, and I never said they didn't even though it might be some of the biggest hypocritical bullshit in history. But when people let those opinions affect legal issues like his right to broadcast, it's turned into something that it shouldn't be. I hope to whatever god is listening that NBC doesn't let Imus go, and I don't even listen to his show. But advertisers are pulling their support like wildfire, and now the FCC is investigating Imus's show, and it's a sad fucking commentary on the state of free speech in our media.
sketchyblargh / Steam! / Tumblr Prime
Pissed off? "Let's find out where he lives and cut his fucking head off!!!" Or "Hey, that was a dickish thing to say, what a dildo. I'm not listening to this crap anymore. *click*"? I'm the latter.
Absolutes are triple-A AAAwesome.
They're both sensational stories, and The Mob is loving to take a bite of this huge shit-sandwich.
Again I ask, if this is truely about racism why do we crucify one man instead of attacking the institution as a whole? I promise Don Imus is not the be-all-end-all of racism in America. Promise.
Edited for grammar. Fuck you, grammar.
1 - True, true. Again, if people don't like what he has to say, they have the right to bitch. But the thought of his program being removed from the air is disturbing. If you don't think so, I find that disturbing as well.
2 - I read the post. I disagree. Many people believe, like the one poster (too lazy to look, I'm sorry) that it means exactly what the definition I posted says. Obviously, dictionary.com believes it too.
I've seen the pictures of the women on the team. Most of them have -very- straight hair, when it's done up for the camera. When they were playing, it was a tangled mess. They had tattoos all over. Is it wrong of a person to think someone is unattractive to say so? Jesus christ, you really don't know that he was being racist... unless you come from the future with your mind-reading hat.
I'd also like to point out that at least two of the players were white... ya know, for the record.
and @ Vargas -- nobody, that I'm aware of, is calling for legal sanctions against Mr. Imus. They're simply asking he be fired, and applying public pressure to achieve these means, which pretty much makes your whole post moot.
Go right the Hell ahead, but unfortunately only the first is happening.
Don't worry, we'll slay this paper dragon (read: racism in media) just like we have ten thousand times before and the next time he rears his ugly head we'll all be dumbfounded as to why.
Edited to add stuff. Fuck you, stuff.
That you're aware of. The fact that the FCC is now investigating him, so far after the broadcast, means that SOMEONE was putting pressure on them to do so. Whether it was pressure applied by activists behind the scenes, or whether the wishy-washy FCC decided that they just HAD to do something because so many people complained, who knows?
The FCC is probably going to reach some made-up conclusion about the broadcast, or drudge up some quote from years-gone-by that could possibly, when taken out of context and analyzed enough, be grounds for a fine to the station, and Imus's removal from his show.
I agree with Shadowfire above. The fact that he's getting backlash for his comments doesn't surprise me in the least, but the fact that it's coming into a legal aspect and the FCC is getting involved disturbs me greatly.
sketchyblargh / Steam! / Tumblr Prime
Obviously Imus losing his job won't end racism but I think the point is to send the message that society is no longer willing to tolerate that kind of behavior.
Like jacobkosh said, it's not really your place to be deciding what is offensive and what isn't. As a matter of fact it's dangerously paternalistic to do so. No matter how determined some people seem to be in believing it, this isn't just some uppity rabble-rousers causing a stink. There are a significant number of level-headed people who are upset with his comments, and based on his track record, are having a hard time finding his subsequent apology sincere. They are not attempting to restrict his free speech, they're merely attempting to get him removed from his position as a national broadcaster.
I'm personally glad that it appears they've been effective.
O_o
I really, really don't see the difference between those two things. He has a show, on the radio, where his main tactic is to say things some people find offensive, and others find funny. In reality, I'm not saying people shouldn't be offended... people will be offended at whatever they like. That's fine. But coming out and having press conferences, plastering it all over the news (when there are more worthwhile things to be shown), and trying to ruin a guy's career for doing his job is assinine. Seriously, change the station to something else.
Anyone else think we'll see Imus on XM soon enough?
Just last month here in Texas, neo-Nazis rallied at the border to decry illegal immigration. Even if the message is terrible, America will never eliminate free speech to end racism.
Kermit Washington dished out a brutal punch but he didn't mean to hit anyone. It was an accident.
You have a right to free speech. You don't have a right to a radio show.
Amazing concept time: not your place to decide. Instead perhaps now might be a good time to go brain on/mouth off and actually educate yourself as to why people who've experienced certain things might decide they've had enough of that type of behavior.
EDIT: also, wtf? How is being a caveman boor his job? Being decent human beings is all our real job, no matter what we get paid for.
I think what sells is all that matters here.
Its the cultural impact of rap.......white/black/latinos using "ghetto" speak to be funny. It's the popularization of hip-hop/rap culture.
Anyway, if it pisses you off, stop paying for cable, or boycott the show. I could care less if he gets fired or not, it doesn't mean al sharpton isn't a hypocritical douche bag.
Imus will probably get a new job on sirius or something......which could be worse than hell.
Funny too, I bet most of you who are screaming the loudest for Imus' blood, own or have played Grand Theft Auto, but if anybody tried to drag out the creators you'd scream, "freedom of speech!". It much more sexist on every level. Simulating Beating up hookers? Living out some voyeurs fantasy of living in the "hood". The language is worse and it advocates more violence and sexism than any comment that moron has made.
But that probably hits a little too close to home for most of you to stomach.
Lesson: Before you get on any high horse realize you're just as much a part of the problem as anybody.
People are being overly sensitive, sure, but I'm not in charge over at WFAN or at CBS, or MSNBC. It's their decision.
Now, shit like the FCC's unconstitutional crusade to "clean up" the airwaves is a different issue altogether.
People are demanding he apologize. And he has tried, and ends up sounding more racist than before. What's your problem with this situation? Free speech doesn't mean people don't have a right to make a stink if you're needlessly insulting. I don't see what you're all getting your panties in a bunch about.
Imus fucked up, and now he's experiencing what he deserves.
Yes you fucking can. Your failure to understand this is why people are making fun of you.
The FCC only responds when complaints are made.
Only.
ONLY.
That is how they work. It is their policy. If Imus' radio program were only broadcast in a few racist, all-white mouth-breather communities, then there would be no investigation, because no one would have complained.
The very fact that the FCC functions this way means that the more widely broadcast a program is, the more careful they need to be in what they say. When you are doing a national program you need to consider the community standards of every community in the country. Needless to say, this means making racist comments is abysmally stupid for such a widely broadcast show. And the stupid should be punished.
Yo.
Plenty of people are talking about it. I keep hearing these stories repeated all over the news, but the recent one the most, because it's recent.
I was confused why the people lining up to howl "GEEZ GET OVER IT ALREADY GOSH" are clinging so tenaciously to this topsy turvy world of theirs where up is down, black is white, and the innocent are constantly being persecuted for clearly innocuous speech. I mean, once it's demonstrated that the speech wasn't innocuous, or that Imus was far from innocent, or that he's not even being persecuted, surely reason would assert itself? But it hasn't, and that confused me.
But now I think I know what it is. I think the conservative conventional wisdom has poisoned the waters to such an extent that, among a certain species of well-meaning but sheltered white middle-class person, there's this terror of being seen as racist, so that they go around looking at all black people like ticking time bombs waiting to go BOOM! and accuse them of all sorts of horrible things.
But allow me to lay the healing balm on thy troubled brow:
You don't need to worry about this. It's not real. 99% of black folks just want to be treated the way you treat anyone else - er, unless you're a dick to people, then you can leave that at home. That means, look them in the eye and speak with respect, while being cognizant that because of a different cultural background they might sometimes interpret things differently from you.
You might unintentionally give offense. It does happen sometimes, although much more rarely than fucking Rush Limbaugh would have you believe - and you know, when it does happen, nine times out of ten you won't hear about it, because the other person will just sigh and shake their head and try to get along with you anyway, or they'll write you off as a tard and avoid you. If they do get offended and tell you, quit sweating bullets! Apologize and endeavor not to repeat that mistake. If the person's cool, it won't be a big deal, and you'll have learned something.
This isn't special 21st century space wisdom. This is, like, eighteenth century elementary diplomacy. I think the real problem is that more and more the internerd keeps us from having to interact with people with vastly different backgrounds and worldviews, so we've forgotten the simple elegant rules for how to get along with people. But look: bottom line, if you're not sure how to handle a situation, ask yourself what would a decent gracious person do in this circumstance, and then copy them. The moral compass does not point towards racism or dickery.
tl;dr:
Counterpoint.
One day I was walking back to the barracks from work, and two of my fellow radiomen were a ways ahead of me. One black, one white. At a cross walk, an older black gentleman intersected them, and there was a brief hesitation, eye contact, and the white guy passed on through the crosswalk in front of this black gentleman "cutting him off" so to speak. This black gentleman went aggro, flagged down the nearest officer he could find (who was from a different command, and didn't want to be involved *at all* but felt obligated because he was in uniform) and demanded that he get the name and command of my white friend so he could lodge a formal complaint.
The complaint? This black gentleman felt slighted.
The verdict is that sometimes, however rarely, black people will be utter and total fucking assholes to random white people for no fucking reason whatsoever except that they don't like white people.
Like I said, just a counterpoint. The fears many white people have of the behavior of black people aren't totally founded in lunar logic. There's always another side to the story, however politically incorrect and taboo it may be to discuss.
None of this excuses Imus in any way, but I feel that no serious discussion on race in this country can ever be meaningful if it must begin from a standpoint of "white people are irrational and wrong".
Certainly true - but what a lot of people want to know is, where is the line? Where is the understanding of nuance? When does context and intent come into play?
This should have been over the day it came out with an apology from IMUS to the basketball team, maybe a letter. Instead racial opportunists have hopped in here, tossed oil on the situation and are fanning those flames till they reach the sky. Absolutely the team has a right to not "get over it" - but IMUS also has the right to say "Look goddamnit, I wasn't thinking and the wrong word came out. Im not a racist, and if you insist I am - find me something more than 2-seconds where I lost my head. Sexist - sure; but racist - to hell with that." We see language like this used constantly, we're able to put STONE and PARKER's Southpark into context (hell where Jackson himself is demanding his o-ring to be fellated), but not here - not the unhip IMUS. He's going to be made an example of.