Lord_AsmodeusgoeticSobriquet:Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered Userregular
edited December 2014
Well since I finished Wind Waker HD (and I hate replaying games without waiting a while first) and I'm still waiting for them to put Phantom Hourglass on the Wii U, I'm guessing I should probably get Majora's Mask on the Wii U.
Oh, and a timeline question. (possible spoilers ahead)
The way I've seen it phrased, it seems like rather than being a separate timeline, Wind Waker and its sequels takes place hundreds of years after Majora's Mask and those games. Like I know it takes place hundreds of years after Ocarina of Time, but Majora's Mask supposedly follows Link after he gets sent back, and Wind Waker takes places hundreds of years later after all that stuff happens. Am I missing something? Like they're described as the Child and Adult timelines. What's the difference? In one case he stays an adult and doesn't go back?
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Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. - Lincoln
Link is frozen in the temple of time for 7 years, beats Ganon, goes back in time. This timeline continues, but it's Link has been sent to the next one.
Link has been sent back by Zelda and Ganon is dealt with before he can power up. Link then goes to Termina.
Link is frozen in the temple of time for 7 years, beats Ganon, goes back in time. This timeline continues, but it's Link has been sent to the next one.
Link has been sent back by Zelda and Ganon is dealt with before he can power up. Link then goes to Termina.
You forgot
Link dies so they can justify Twilight princess's weird setting oh lets toss the original in there too.
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Link is frozen in the temple of time for 7 years, beats Ganon, goes back in time. This timeline continues, but it's Link has been sent to the next one.
Link has been sent back by Zelda and Ganon is dealt with before he can power up. Link then goes to Termina.
You forgot
Link dies so they can justify Twilight princess's weird setting oh lets toss the original in there too.
Twilight Princess takes place in the Majora's Mask part of the timeline, where Link returned to being a child.
No, Nintendo's official timeline has a branch where Link dies. It's dumb. I don't accept anyone's timelines, I don't need it to make sense. Every game is just a legend passed down, unless they explicitly call out each other like Wind Waker does.
No, Nintendo's official timeline has a branch where Link dies. It's dumb. I don't accept anyone's timelines, I don't need it to make sense. Every game is just a legend passed down, unless they explicitly call out each other like Wind Waker does.
I know, but Twilight Princess doesn't take place in that branch.
You can tell that there was never supposed to be a timeline with the series but when people started asking about it Nintendo probably put someone random person in charge of it saying "So we don't really give a shit and neither should you, but just make something up so everyone shuts up."
Link is frozen in the temple of time for 7 years, beats Ganon, goes back in time. This timeline continues, but it's Link has been sent to the next one.
Link has been sent back by Zelda and Ganon is dealt with before he can power up. Link then goes to Termina.
You forgot
Link dies so they can justify Twilight princess's weird setting oh lets toss the original in there too.
Twilight Princess takes place in the Majora's Mask part of the timeline, where Link returned to being a child.
Oh yeah skullwolf is oot link . Forgot about that.
I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
You can tell that there was never supposed to be a timeline with the series but when people started asking about it Nintendo probably put someone random person in charge of it saying "So we don't really give a shit and neither should you, but just make something up so everyone shuts up."
And then they explicitly made Skyward Sword be the "origin" of the entire series. If you don't care about the timeline, why deliberately place important milestones on it?
I guess they pretty much backed themselves into a corner with the whole timeline thing. Had they been thinking about it since the series' inception then I'm guessing we would have a coherent timeline right now.
You can tell that there was never supposed to be a timeline with the series but when people started asking about it Nintendo probably put someone random person in charge of it saying "So we don't really give a shit and neither should you, but just make something up so everyone shuts up."
And then they explicitly made Skyward Sword be the "origin" of the entire series. If you don't care about the timeline, why deliberately place important milestones on it?
It can't be, because Link already has his hat in Skyward Sword, and Minish Cap shows the origin of the hat's addition to the green outfit. Also has no appearance of Demise or a Ganondorf-like character, instead it's Vaati.
You can tell that there was never supposed to be a timeline with the series but when people started asking about it Nintendo probably put someone random person in charge of it saying "So we don't really give a shit and neither should you, but just make something up so everyone shuts up."
And then they explicitly made Skyward Sword be the "origin" of the entire series. If you don't care about the timeline, why deliberately place important milestones on it?
It can't be, because Link already has his hat in Skyward Sword, and Minish Cap shows the origin of the hat's addition to the green outfit. Also has no appearance of Demise or a Ganondorf-like character, instead it's Vaati.
Minish cap just explains the origin of that specific hat and Vatti is clearly the reincarnation of the rage in his games then ganon comes back and eats him or something
I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
Is there any word on where Hyrule Warriors fits? Something said early on had me hoping it was just its own entirely separate thing, but then we got story details of all the criss-crossing timey-wimey stuff...
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
The best fanwank theory I saw to make the "Game Over" timeline canon is to say that a time travel event happened that we did not see, not that anytime Link dies it creates an alternate timeline (or worse, that the original games are just in a "What if" timeline).
There are several fan theories about what that unseen time travel event could have been, but my favorite is:
Link died in the battle against Ganon because Navi couldn't get close enough to Ganon to assist Link due to Ganon's aura. Zelda and Navi escape and the Imprisoning War happens leading to ALttP and such. At some point during this timeline, Zelda tries to prevent it from occurring by using the Ocarina to send Navi back to the fight, not understanding that she was just going to split the timeline by doing that.
So this time Navi forces her way through Ganon's aura and helps Link win. Then during the ending she flies away either because the aura overwhelmed her and she is dying, or because after seeing all the death and destruction in the other timeline she just needs to get away for the time being.
You can tell that there was never supposed to be a timeline with the series but when people started asking about it Nintendo probably put someone random person in charge of it saying "So we don't really give a shit and neither should you, but just make something up so everyone shuts up."
And then they explicitly made Skyward Sword be the "origin" of the entire series. If you don't care about the timeline, why deliberately place important milestones on it?
Well, they decided that the Adventure to Link was the final game a long time ago and they keep adding onto the beginning of the timeline.
When LttP came out, it was the first game (hence the past part of the title.)
Then OoT came out and it was the first game.
Then Minish Cap came out and it was the first game.
Then I stopped caring about the official timeline.
When LttP came out, it was the first game (hence the past part of the title.)
I don't think the name implies anything. In Japan I believe it was called Triforce of the Gods! Ultimately it was LoZ retold and expanded with more gameplay elements and story added.
I think they just wanted a name in the US that could use a pun with Link's name. The actual link to the past is about how in the past the sages sealed away the golden land etc. etc.
Most people thought LttP was the LAST game for a long time, because remember...the Master Sword sleeps again...FOREVER!
When LttP came out, it was the first game (hence the past part of the title.)
I don't think the name implies anything. In Japan I believe it was called Triforce of the Gods! Ultimately it was LoZ retold and expanded with more gameplay elements and story added.
I think they just wanted a name in the US that could use a pun with Link's name. The actual link to the past is about how in the past the sages sealed away the golden land etc. etc.
Most people thought LttP was the LAST game for a long time, because remember...the Master Sword sleeps again...FOREVER!
Oh, on the name I'm just going by what my '90s issue of Nintendo Power says. Also, I'm fairly certain the official stance was prequel, despite the what the ending says.
I guess they pretty much backed themselves into a corner with the whole timeline thing. Had they been thinking about it since the series' inception then I'm guessing we would have a coherent timeline right now.
Eh, most of the problematic games are in the "Link dies" branch, which they probably won't add to anymore (other than A Link Between Worlds). The other two are mostly coherent.
I went out of my way to farm some materials specifically for badges for the first time. God that was a headache, but at least Cia now has all of her attack badges, which should make getting giant boss materials a cinch with how she destroys weak point gauges.
I guess I should go out of my way to fill out the pictures and get more battles on the rewards map before really trying to farm badge materials. So far I just have the first one.
Well technically there is no Master Sword in the original LoZ, instead you get the Magical Sword. So it could be before that.
If you care about such things. :P Like I said, I think it's all BS anyway and they're all just legends. Of Zelda.
Back then, they did push it as a prequel, and as you said, the Master Sword wasn't in the NES games...
...but then, A Link Between Worlds brings it out of mothballs, so that's all bunk anyway.
Then they did Link's Awakening, then back further with OoT, then back, forwards, sideways, and no one knows which way we're ever going until we're either already there or looking at it in the rearview.
Worse is that Metroid has all but done the same thing, short of multiple timelines... unless they really are making the Prime trilogy AU (I don't think they are), in which case ERGH...
Edit: Oh, on my Hyrule Warriors question: "Eiji Aonuma has stated that Hyrule Warriors exists as a "separate dimension" and is not part of the main series.[2] However, he goes on to suggest that while the game does not slot into any particular part of the timeline, it has links to different periods of the timeline,[3] and that characters have been "brought together".[4] He said that he had been thinking of it as being similar to The Avengers.[5]"
...so it IS a separate thing... except where it's not.
Bleh. I wish it was just separate altogether, and that all the characters who come together were AU versions, rather than pulled through time and space and crap. Avengers didn't do that. =P
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Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
You can tell that there was never supposed to be a timeline with the series but when people started asking about it Nintendo probably put someone random person in charge of it saying "So we don't really give a shit and neither should you, but just make something up so everyone shuts up."
And then they explicitly made Skyward Sword be the "origin" of the entire series. If you don't care about the timeline, why deliberately place important milestones on it?
It can't be, because Link already has his hat in Skyward Sword, and Minish Cap shows the origin of the hat's addition to the green outfit. Also has no appearance of Demise or a Ganondorf-like character, instead it's Vaati.
I would go with the first game actually being Links appearance in Soul Calibur 2 and it turning out that the real identity of Ghirahim is that of the Soul Edge, who Demise claimed from this tale of souls and swords going even further back. Link wins the tournament but loses the Soul Edge and then it takes on sentience and bides its time waiting for the moment to resurrect Demise who has already been sealed away.
Then during the time in between Soul Calibur 2 and Skyward Sword Link is beset upon by monsters and having lost his sword he has to improvise. From this we arrive at Link's Crossbow Trainer as the second game. Then the sacred realm is stormed by Siegfried who is under the misconception that the Soul Calibur is there and The Goddess gets all pissed off because she thinks he was after The Triforce. With this the cast of Soul Calibur 2 (sans Link, because he won) earns their damnation to remain on Earth while Link and a few other chosen ones become the first residents of Skyloft.
But before Skyward Sword happens Link must make one more detour, after being invited to another tournament. This one involving go karts.
Is there any word on where Hyrule Warriors fits? Something said early on had me hoping it was just its own entirely separate thing, but then we got story details of all the criss-crossing timey-wimey stuff...
Official word is that it doesn't fit. It's an alternate continuity. Kind of like the Avengers movie franchise is to the Marvel comics.
It couldn't fit anyway, since Hyrule is still around, but Impa and Zelda know about the Hero of Time (who was only remembered in the timeline where the next disaster ended with Hyrule being flooded)
So this occurred to me over some terrible fast food on Christmas Eve:
In Skyward Sword, we're introduced to the goddess Hylia, who did battle with the Big Nasty Shadow God for the fate of the world.
In Ocarina of Time, we learn the creation myth of Hyrule, in which three Goddesses, Din, Farore, and Nayru, each contribute a fundamental piece of the world to create it.
Is there any official word on how the two relate? Is Hylia distinct from the three creation Goddesses, or is there some kind of weird Christian Trinity thing going on, or have the Hylians just kind of fucked up their records or what?
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
So this occurred to me over some terrible fast food on Christmas Eve:
In Skyward Sword, we're introduced to the goddess Hylia, who did battle with the Big Nasty Shadow God for the fate of the world.
In Ocarina of Time, we learn the creation myth of Hyrule, in which three Goddesses, Din, Farore, and Nayru, each contribute a fundamental piece of the world to create it.
Is there any official word on how the two relate? Is Hylia distinct from the three creation Goddesses, or is there some kind of weird Christian Trinity thing going on, or have the Hylians just kind of fucked up their records or what?
Hylia basically became a god because Triforce iirc.
Now, it's entirely possible that the myth is wrong, and there's evidence for it in Link Between Worlds (ending spoilers):
The Triforce has the power to create another Triforce.
The only game with clear links to Skyward Sword though is Twilight Princess, since the Lanayru Province guardians in each have the same form, and in TP the light spirits do speak of the goddesses iirc... though that could also be a corruption, as the guardians in TP are not all matching those of SS, so they could be different entities. Also, the guardians in SS are all dragons of some form I believe (I can't recall what the Eldin one was). Actually, I think the two guardians you meet in WW could be related too...
I will say that what happens at the Sealed Grounds at the end of the game makes a ton of sense in terms of other games... (SS ending spoilers)
Since the Triforce comes to rest... on the exact spot of Demise's demise... this would then become the Sacred Realm, be sealed many times, and be the future site of things like the Pyramid of Power and such. Ganondorf being more or less Demise reborn and repeatedly setting up shop on the exact spot Demise was killed... and ultimately being forever sealed in the same spot with the Master Sword lodged in his brain (Considering evil can't touch the sword, Ganondorf can't possibly have any agency like that, and the Triforce was used to forever seal away Hyrule...).
In retrospect, building Hyrule Castle on the burial grounds of an ancient god of evil may have been a bad idea.
There's a lot in SS that hints at an older tale before it, and basically all Zelda games take place then between Skyward Sword and Wind Waker (barring Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks that explicitly happen later... there's just no way to reconcile Ganondorf being a factor in the world after Wind Waker.
Although, the timeline split of OoT raises interesting questions with SS.
Demise basically curses Link and Zelda's descendents for eternity... which works out great until his soul is sealed forever in Wind Waker I guess.
The question then becomes simple - any descendant of Link, in theory, could play the critical role of Hero. Nothing forces it to be a descendant of the prior Link, just of the original. If we consider that there's a very real chance that SS Link and Zelda get hitched, this would mean any male of the Royal Family is in the line of the hero... so why would it even matter that one particular Link is sent back and the timeline forked in OoT? The bloodline explicitly survived (as every Zelda is then automatically of Link's line... also, justifies a game with Zelda as protagonist, but I digress). Either timeline could end with the lack of the Hero. Hell, both could... though the thing to note is that by the time of OoT, it would be basically impossible for Link's line to be killed off ever, because of simple math. There are easily hundreds of years between any given Zelda games (barring of course those explicitly linked). It's also unclear whether places like Holodrum and Labrynna are just geographically different or dimensionally and such, but... basically, SS means the OoT future > WW doesn't make any particular sense. There is no particular reason for Link not to appear in either one... aside from the Law of Large Numbers.
Hylia basically became a god because Triforce iirc.
That's actually kind of the opposite of how it went down.
Hylia was a goddess who existed independent of the golden goddesses. In order to truly defeat Demise, she needed to use the Triforce they left behind. However, the Triforce can't be used by the divine, so she chose to give up her divinity, and incarnate as a mortal, named Zelda.
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Now its time to level up Ruto. Luckily my favorite lvl grind stage has King Dodongo and plenty of magic transporters.
Go go Gold materials.
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Oh, and a timeline question. (possible spoilers ahead)
Link dies so they can justify Twilight princess's weird setting oh lets toss the original in there too.
Twilight Princess takes place in the Majora's Mask part of the timeline, where Link returned to being a child.
I know, but Twilight Princess doesn't take place in that branch.
And then the theories continued anyway.
Oh yeah skullwolf is oot link . Forgot about that.
And then they explicitly made Skyward Sword be the "origin" of the entire series. If you don't care about the timeline, why deliberately place important milestones on it?
It can't be, because Link already has his hat in Skyward Sword, and Minish Cap shows the origin of the hat's addition to the green outfit. Also has no appearance of Demise or a Ganondorf-like character, instead it's Vaati.
Minish cap just explains the origin of that specific hat and Vatti is clearly the reincarnation of the rage in his games then ganon comes back and eats him or something
Theres no real way to make a coherent timeline imo. A number of games clearly reference others, but like half of them give no real clues at all.
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There are several fan theories about what that unseen time travel event could have been, but my favorite is:
So this time Navi forces her way through Ganon's aura and helps Link win. Then during the ending she flies away either because the aura overwhelmed her and she is dying, or because after seeing all the death and destruction in the other timeline she just needs to get away for the time being.
Well, they decided that the Adventure to Link was the final game a long time ago and they keep adding onto the beginning of the timeline.
When LttP came out, it was the first game (hence the past part of the title.)
Then OoT came out and it was the first game.
Then Minish Cap came out and it was the first game.
Then I stopped caring about the official timeline.
I don't think the name implies anything. In Japan I believe it was called Triforce of the Gods! Ultimately it was LoZ retold and expanded with more gameplay elements and story added.
I think they just wanted a name in the US that could use a pun with Link's name. The actual link to the past is about how in the past the sages sealed away the golden land etc. etc.
Most people thought LttP was the LAST game for a long time, because remember...the Master Sword sleeps again...FOREVER!
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Oh, on the name I'm just going by what my '90s issue of Nintendo Power says. Also, I'm fairly certain the official stance was prequel, despite the what the ending says.
If you care about such things. :P Like I said, I think it's all BS anyway and they're all just legends. Of Zelda.
Eh, most of the problematic games are in the "Link dies" branch, which they probably won't add to anymore (other than A Link Between Worlds). The other two are mostly coherent.
UK, not Europe. Most of Europe doesn't get cool pre-order bonuses like this.
I guess I should go out of my way to fill out the pictures and get more battles on the rewards map before really trying to farm badge materials. So far I just have the first one.
Back then, they did push it as a prequel, and as you said, the Master Sword wasn't in the NES games...
...but then, A Link Between Worlds brings it out of mothballs, so that's all bunk anyway.
Then they did Link's Awakening, then back further with OoT, then back, forwards, sideways, and no one knows which way we're ever going until we're either already there or looking at it in the rearview.
Worse is that Metroid has all but done the same thing, short of multiple timelines... unless they really are making the Prime trilogy AU (I don't think they are), in which case ERGH...
Edit: Oh, on my Hyrule Warriors question: "Eiji Aonuma has stated that Hyrule Warriors exists as a "separate dimension" and is not part of the main series.[2] However, he goes on to suggest that while the game does not slot into any particular part of the timeline, it has links to different periods of the timeline,[3] and that characters have been "brought together".[4] He said that he had been thinking of it as being similar to The Avengers.[5]"
...so it IS a separate thing... except where it's not.
Bleh. I wish it was just separate altogether, and that all the characters who come together were AU versions, rather than pulled through time and space and crap. Avengers didn't do that. =P
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
I would go with the first game actually being Links appearance in Soul Calibur 2 and it turning out that the real identity of Ghirahim is that of the Soul Edge, who Demise claimed from this tale of souls and swords going even further back. Link wins the tournament but loses the Soul Edge and then it takes on sentience and bides its time waiting for the moment to resurrect Demise who has already been sealed away.
Then during the time in between Soul Calibur 2 and Skyward Sword Link is beset upon by monsters and having lost his sword he has to improvise. From this we arrive at Link's Crossbow Trainer as the second game. Then the sacred realm is stormed by Siegfried who is under the misconception that the Soul Calibur is there and The Goddess gets all pissed off because she thinks he was after The Triforce. With this the cast of Soul Calibur 2 (sans Link, because he won) earns their damnation to remain on Earth while Link and a few other chosen ones become the first residents of Skyloft.
But before Skyward Sword happens Link must make one more detour, after being invited to another tournament. This one involving go karts.
Official word is that it doesn't fit. It's an alternate continuity. Kind of like the Avengers movie franchise is to the Marvel comics.
It couldn't fit anyway, since Hyrule is still around, but Impa and Zelda know about the Hero of Time (who was only remembered in the timeline where the next disaster ended with Hyrule being flooded)
Wife played while I was at work and racked up enough change so I could level Ruto to +500 attack.
Ruto lvl 3 weapon acquired!
All LVL 3 weapons are now mine! Time to unlock the Master Sword's true power.
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In Skyward Sword, we're introduced to the goddess Hylia, who did battle with the Big Nasty Shadow God for the fate of the world.
In Ocarina of Time, we learn the creation myth of Hyrule, in which three Goddesses, Din, Farore, and Nayru, each contribute a fundamental piece of the world to create it.
Is there any official word on how the two relate? Is Hylia distinct from the three creation Goddesses, or is there some kind of weird Christian Trinity thing going on, or have the Hylians just kind of fucked up their records or what?
Hylia basically became a god because Triforce iirc.
Now, it's entirely possible that the myth is wrong, and there's evidence for it in Link Between Worlds (ending spoilers):
The only game with clear links to Skyward Sword though is Twilight Princess, since the Lanayru Province guardians in each have the same form, and in TP the light spirits do speak of the goddesses iirc... though that could also be a corruption, as the guardians in TP are not all matching those of SS, so they could be different entities. Also, the guardians in SS are all dragons of some form I believe (I can't recall what the Eldin one was). Actually, I think the two guardians you meet in WW could be related too...
I will say that what happens at the Sealed Grounds at the end of the game makes a ton of sense in terms of other games... (SS ending spoilers)
In retrospect, building Hyrule Castle on the burial grounds of an ancient god of evil may have been a bad idea.
There's a lot in SS that hints at an older tale before it, and basically all Zelda games take place then between Skyward Sword and Wind Waker (barring Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks that explicitly happen later... there's just no way to reconcile Ganondorf being a factor in the world after Wind Waker.
Although, the timeline split of OoT raises interesting questions with SS.
The question then becomes simple - any descendant of Link, in theory, could play the critical role of Hero. Nothing forces it to be a descendant of the prior Link, just of the original. If we consider that there's a very real chance that SS Link and Zelda get hitched, this would mean any male of the Royal Family is in the line of the hero... so why would it even matter that one particular Link is sent back and the timeline forked in OoT? The bloodline explicitly survived (as every Zelda is then automatically of Link's line... also, justifies a game with Zelda as protagonist, but I digress). Either timeline could end with the lack of the Hero. Hell, both could... though the thing to note is that by the time of OoT, it would be basically impossible for Link's line to be killed off ever, because of simple math. There are easily hundreds of years between any given Zelda games (barring of course those explicitly linked). It's also unclear whether places like Holodrum and Labrynna are just geographically different or dimensionally and such, but... basically, SS means the OoT future > WW doesn't make any particular sense. There is no particular reason for Link not to appear in either one... aside from the Law of Large Numbers.
3DS: 0473-8507-2652
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So nice.
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They really do seem to get this DLC thing
a buck a costume isn't terrible
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Time to move to the UK, I guess.
That's actually kind of the opposite of how it went down.
So, she stopped being a goddess because Triforce.