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[The Expanse] Step 1: Find God.

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Posts

  • StraygatsbyStraygatsby Registered User regular
    Layne Pryce continues to just utterly kill it as Dawes. I really hope they manage to keep him for the run. I do not envy the casting director who has to find a
    Marcos
    .

  • HonkHonk Honk is this poster. Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    Drummer is my favorite.

    This episode Drummer game on point.

    PSN: Honkalot
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  • DracomicronDracomicron Registered User regular
    Honk wrote: »
    Drummer is my favorite.

    This episode Drummer game on point.

    Yeah.
    Her straight up executing those beltalowdas to Alex's dismay was pure gold

    Gary Gygax wrote:
    ''The secret we should never let the gamemasters know is that they don't need any rules.''
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  • HonkHonk Honk is this poster. Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    Honk wrote: »
    Drummer is my favorite.

    This episode Drummer game on point.

    Yeah.
    Her straight up executing those beltalowdas to Alex's dismay was pure gold
    Then just straightening out the staggering and walking off

    Godbless

    PSN: Honkalot
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  • Apothe0sisApothe0sis Doesn't look like anything to me Registered User regular
    Beltalowda means "all belters", it's a collective noun.

    Also Bobbie is my favourite. I love Bobbie, our romance would be like Romeo and Juliet meets The Lakehouse, except that in this scenario Juliet is a power armoured super soldier and instead of a lakehouse separated by 3 years or whatever it's a galaxy and like a bunch of centuries.

    Drummer is my other favourite, of course.

    Tide goes in. Tide goes out.
    Es-annon NEVA 4GET
  • see317see317 Taco Count 2017: 39 Registered User regular
    Apothe0sis wrote: »
    Beltalowda means "all belters", it's a collective noun.

    Also Bobbie is my favourite. I love Bobbie, our romance would be like Romeo and Juliet meets The Lakehouse, except that in this scenario Juliet is a power armoured super soldier and instead of a lakehouse separated by 3 years or whatever it's a galaxy and like a bunch of centuries.

    Drummer is my other favourite, of course.

    Well, not quite that bad. I mean, it's just a century or two, and only a different planet. Heck, it's one of the close planets too. That's like, the girl next door in astrological terms.

    Ringo wrote: »
    Well except what see317 said. That guy's always wrong.
    Apothe0sis
  • DracomicronDracomicron Registered User regular
    Apothe0sis wrote: »
    Beltalowda means "all belters", it's a collective noun.

    Sorry, try "coyos," then.

    Gary Gygax wrote:
    ''The secret we should never let the gamemasters know is that they don't need any rules.''
    Apothe0sis
  • Atlas in ChainsAtlas in Chains Registered User regular
    Honk wrote: »
    Drummer is my favorite.

    This episode Drummer game on point.

    Yeah.
    Her straight up executing those beltalowdas to Alex's dismay was pure gold

    Really? I hated that bit. It's that kind of hammy, cartoonish bravado that reminds me I'm watching a show on Syfy and not a more prestigious network. Character, not caricature.

  • RiusRius Registered User regular
    You think that was bravado? What show were you watching

    Apothe0sisXeddicusKashaar
  • DracomicronDracomicron Registered User regular
    Honk wrote: »
    Drummer is my favorite.

    This episode Drummer game on point.

    Yeah.
    Her straight up executing those beltalowdas to Alex's dismay was pure gold

    Really? I hated that bit. It's that kind of hammy, cartoonish bravado that reminds me I'm watching a show on Syfy and not a more prestigious network. Character, not caricature.

    Shit, that's how life is in the Belt. Life is cheap; you piss off the head of security on a station, you're lucky if you eat a bullet instead of the airlock.

    Gary Gygax wrote:
    ''The secret we should never let the gamemasters know is that they don't need any rules.''
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  • SyngyneSyngyne Registered User regular
    Honk wrote: »
    Drummer is my favorite.

    This episode Drummer game on point.

    Yeah.
    Her straight up executing those beltalowdas to Alex's dismay was pure gold

    Really? I hated that bit. It's that kind of hammy, cartoonish bravado that reminds me I'm watching a show on Syfy and not a more prestigious network. Character, not caricature.

    Belters are very no-nonsense when it comes to threats to the station/ship. Comes from generations of living in an environment where one person doing something stupid can kill everyone on board.

    5gsowHm.png
    DracomicronCommander Zoomoverride367Zilla360jakobaggerCanadianWolverineknitdanArbitraryDescriptorThe DeliveratorTransporter
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    edited March 19
    Syngyne wrote: »
    Honk wrote: »
    Drummer is my favorite.

    This episode Drummer game on point.

    Yeah.
    Her straight up executing those beltalowdas to Alex's dismay was pure gold

    Really? I hated that bit. It's that kind of hammy, cartoonish bravado that reminds me I'm watching a show on Syfy and not a more prestigious network. Character, not caricature.

    Belters are very no-nonsense when it comes to threats to the station/ship. Comes from generations of living in an environment where one person doing something stupid can kill everyone on board.

    This is the same episode where
    an airlock full of people are spaced without a second thought in some pretty cartoon-grade villainy because they weren't Belters, despite the fact that they all lived on Ganymede and got fucked over as well. And by a random freighter crew with their own ship, who wouldn't really have cared about Ganymede that much.

    That was some pretty hamfisted stuff right there.

    The event on the station at least made some sense other than "look at this, people are being really bad!"
    Drummer is a Belter who has dealt with some heavy-duty Belter players and clawed her way to basically second in command of a huge station, then some asshole morons who can't think beyond "let's kill a bunch of people for not being us!" stormed the place where she works, killed people she knew on the way, and then began casually executing people from her crew.

    It was both culturally and personally fitting that she killed both those guys at the very first opportunity, because she knew they were shit Belters and would get more people killed later for more stupid reasons.

    Ninja Snarl P on
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  • override367override367 ALL minions Registered User regular
    edited March 19
    I mean, they were
    mutineers, if it was a UNN or MCRN station they would have been executed too, there would have just been paperwork first

    override367 on
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  • Dark Raven XDark Raven X The woods are lovely dark and deepRegistered User regular
    one thing I didn't quite pick up on
    what led to the hostility between Fred and the Roci crew? There was some tension between them over Holden trying to kill and then Fred losing the Protomolecule guy, but all of a sudden the episode ends with the Roci going to investigate Ganymede and Fred saying "fuck you, don't come back" after they just saved him and narrowly averted a catastrophe for the third time this week.

    And miles to go before I sleep.
  • electricitylikesmeelectricitylikesme Registered User regular
    The other thing re: Drummer:

    The medical technology in this show I assume is actually pretty damn good, seeing as how massive radiation poisoning is now survivable. So I assume she was pretty well patched up before they moved her (i.e. you wouldn't even chance helping someone up with that type of wound normally).

    tl;dr Drummer is awesome.

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  • JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    one thing I didn't quite pick up on
    what led to the hostility between Fred and the Roci crew? There was some tension between them over Holden trying to kill and then Fred losing the Protomolecule guy, but all of a sudden the episode ends with the Roci going to investigate Ganymede and Fred saying "fuck you, don't come back" after they just saved him and narrowly averted a catastrophe for the third time this week.

    Show isn't GREAT about making this explicit.
    The Roci has been getting repaired and restocked at Tycho for free - shit's expensive - And Fred just lost his trump card with the researcher being kidnapped.

    He tells Holden to bring back the protomolecule from Ganymede. Holden says no, he's young to destroy it. Fred says to not bother coming back then.

    camo_sig2.png
    Dracomicron
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    edited March 19
    Jragghen wrote: »
    one thing I didn't quite pick up on
    what led to the hostility between Fred and the Roci crew? There was some tension between them over Holden trying to kill and then Fred losing the Protomolecule guy, but all of a sudden the episode ends with the Roci going to investigate Ganymede and Fred saying "fuck you, don't come back" after they just saved him and narrowly averted a catastrophe for the third time this week.

    Show isn't GREAT about making this explicit.
    The Roci has been getting repaired and restocked at Tycho for free - shit's expensive - And Fred just lost his trump card with the researcher being kidnapped.

    He tells Holden to bring back the protomolecule from Ganymede. Holden says no, he's young to destroy it. Fred says to not bother coming back then.

    Fred has always
    treated the Roci and her crew as if he basically owns them, because they don't have any options to go anywhere else and he has leverage on the situation. Heck, the first thing Fred tried to do was break into their ship to take it over, while trying to talk them into giving up control of the ship. And Fred has done things behind their back they later found out about, on top of blatantly prying through their records to try and get more leverage on them.

    Maybe if he'd treated them as actual allies instead of just an asset to keep under his thumb, they wouldn't be so keen on getting away from him. But Fred really does let himself be limited by his Earther military background, so he really doesn't trust anybody he doesn't own and now that attitude is gonna bite him in the ass. He didn't want the Roci going out because he thought of it as his ship and he's already back to narrow-mindedly thinking about Tycho Station and his own powerbase, despite the fact that the Roci crew getting involved in things has saved the Belters, Mars, and Earth at least a couple times now.

    So Holden flips Fred the bird, because Holden knows that not getting involved will basically guarantee things are going to get hellishly bad in a hurry.

    Ninja Snarl P on
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  • SealSeal Registered User regular
    one thing I didn't quite pick up on
    what led to the hostility between Fred and the Roci crew? There was some tension between them over Holden trying to kill and then Fred losing the Protomolecule guy, but all of a sudden the episode ends with the Roci going to investigate Ganymede and Fred saying "fuck you, don't come back" after they just saved him and narrowly averted a catastrophe for the third time this week.

    I thought it came down to their unwillingness to be his pawns and it being really expensive to repair and supply a ship for free. Plus the whole stolen Martian property thing so it's a bit of a hot potato.

  • HonkHonk Honk is this poster. Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    Hrrrm hmmm.

    Legitimate salvage.

    PSN: Honkalot
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  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    Yeah, Fred is in danger of losing control completely, so he's trying to force the Roci's crew to bend the knee. Holden in turn calls his bluff, because Fred is unlikely to stay in control long enough for his threats to matter.

    I would guess that this plotline is going to result in (book spoilers)
    Fred salvaging the Nauvoo and trying to turn it into a half-assed warship. Hence why he's so hellbent on getting a barely functional piece of technology out of dock, because it's a matter of personal power politics, instead of the belters just being dumb.

    A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
    Zilla360glimmung
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    Yeah, Fred is in danger of losing control completely, so he's trying to force the Roci's crew to bend the knee. Holden in turn calls his bluff, because Fred is unlikely to stay in control long enough for his threats to matter.

    I would guess that this plotline is going to result in (book spoilers)
    Fred salvaging the Nauvoo and trying to turn it into a half-assed warship. Hence why he's so hellbent on getting a barely functional piece of technology out of dock, because it's a matter of personal power politics, instead of the belters just being dumb.
    If he were to go that way, I dunno about "half-assed". 30 nuclear missiles on a large (possibly self-sustaining, given time) mobile station, even if they're just single-warhead nukes and not MIRV types, is plenty to ensure that you stay an independent power.

    PAJoe_zpsc20d21e8.jpg
  • see317see317 Taco Count 2017: 39 Registered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    Yeah, Fred is in danger of losing control completely, so he's trying to force the Roci's crew to bend the knee. Holden in turn calls his bluff, because Fred is unlikely to stay in control long enough for his threats to matter.

    I would guess that this plotline is going to result in (book spoilers)
    Fred salvaging the Nauvoo and trying to turn it into a half-assed warship. Hence why he's so hellbent on getting a barely functional piece of technology out of dock, because it's a matter of personal power politics, instead of the belters just being dumb.
    If he were to go that way, I dunno about "half-assed". 30 nuclear missiles on a large (possibly self-sustaining, given time) mobile station, even if they're just single-warhead nukes and not MIRV types, is plenty to ensure that you stay an independent power.

    Book spoilers.
    The Nauvoo is salvaged by Fred and turned into a war ship in the books. But it's half assed because the Nauvoo wasn't designed to take the damage or the maneuvers of a war ship, let alone the recoil of the heavy weapons they strap to it's frame. So, it's a big scary gun boat that can't move and risks tearing itself apart if/when it fires and would get ripped to shreds in any kind of fire fight if it doesn't kill the enemy on the first salvo.

    Ringo wrote: »
    Well except what see317 said. That guy's always wrong.
    Zilla360
  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    I kind of feel for Fred Johnston. From watching the series so far:
    Every single advantage he gets, everything he can put in his back pocket, all of them, slip out of his grasp.

    The Navoo? That's gone. Mastermind scientist he was going to capture? Shot in the head. The Missiles that fell into his lap? Welp, gotta give those back now. The one scientist that was still around? Fucking stolen out from under him by a rival. Now the Roci is finally realizing that technically they might have the upper hand in the power dynamic at play, and not the other way around.

    It's like, Fred tries really really hard to obtain tools that can help him in his quest, and every single time without fail, he's either forced due to circumstances to give them up (specifically because it's the only sensible/available option) or is backed into a corner where he kind of has to give it up to save face/preserve his thing he has going.

    That might be the entire point behind the character. He's the guy trying too hard. The other significant characters in the story that hold power/wield influence? They don't come off as trying near as hard as Fred. And in a way, I guess, he doesn't understand this about why his way isn't working compared to how everyone else he can be compared against is succeeding.

    Currently DMing: None right now! :(
    Characters
    [5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +4/1d8+2 | Spell +4/DC 12
  • XeddicusXeddicus Registered User regular
    Fred:
    He's not trying too hard, he's just getting fucked over by plot/bad luck/rampant idiocy. Almost every other belter (offhand only Drummer is exempt) is a fucking idiot. It's hard to get things done when the people you're trying to help just want to get themselves killed.

    "For no one - no one in this world can you trust. Not men. Not women. Not beasts...this you can trust."
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  • chrono_travellerchrono_traveller Registered User regular
    edited March 20
    Xeddicus wrote: »
    Fred:
    He's not trying too hard, he's just getting fucked over by plot/bad luck/rampant idiocy. Almost every other belter (offhand only Drummer is exempt) is a fucking idiot. It's hard to get things done when the people you're trying to help just want to get themselves killed.

    Show discussion/spoiler?
    Miller and or Naomi wasn't/isn't exempt?

    chrono_traveller on
    The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it. ~ Terry Pratchett

    George R. R. Martin is not your bitch. ~ Neil Gaiman
  • CanadianWolverineCanadianWolverine Registered User regular
    Xeddicus wrote: »
    Fred:
    He's not trying too hard, he's just getting fucked over by plot/bad luck/rampant idiocy. Almost every other belter (offhand only Drummer is exempt) is a fucking idiot. It's hard to get things done when the people you're trying to help just want to get themselves killed.

    Show discussion/spoiler?
    Miller and or Naomi wasn't/isn't exempt?

    Show:
    Naomi I would say is exempt, so far. But Miller? Maybe not an idiot but definitely trying to get himself killed and did.

    steam_sig.png
  • XeddicusXeddicus Registered User regular
    Our Heroes are automatically exempt until proven otherwise.

    "For no one - no one in this world can you trust. Not men. Not women. Not beasts...this you can trust."
  • DracomicronDracomicron Registered User regular
    Xeddicus wrote: »
    Fred:
    He's not trying too hard, he's just getting fucked over by plot/bad luck/rampant idiocy. Almost every other belter (offhand only Drummer is exempt) is a fucking idiot. It's hard to get things done when the people you're trying to help just want to get themselves killed.

    ONLY Drummer is exempt?

    Maybe Naomi, too? And all those other hard-working Belters just trying to survive in a hostile system? You mostly hear the loud ones, the Black Sky and the Los Grigas, but most of the Belt are people like Doris and Prax: folks who work and make due with a shitty hand.

    Gary Gygax wrote:
    ''The secret we should never let the gamemasters know is that they don't need any rules.''
  • XeddicusXeddicus Registered User regular
    edited March 20
    Perhaps I should have specified out of the people with names or in the story for more than 3 seconds.
    But random belter captain is one of the hard working ones, the kid is a random one etc etc. So I classify all belters as iffy going by the evidence until they prove otherwise just to be on the safe side. Fred should start too. Prax is a good guy, and possibly there are a lot more out there. But we've met a lot more of the other side so far.

    Xeddicus on
    "For no one - no one in this world can you trust. Not men. Not women. Not beasts...this you can trust."
  • SealSeal Registered User regular
    Honk wrote: »
    Hrrrm hmmm.

    Legitimate salvage.
    I really want them to use that line with some Martian officer and just get narrowed eyes in response.

    KashaarHonkoverride367
  • SelnerSelner Registered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    Yeah, Fred is in danger of losing control completely, so he's trying to force the Roci's crew to bend the knee. Holden in turn calls his bluff, because Fred is unlikely to stay in control long enough for his threats to matter.

    I would guess that this plotline is going to result in (book spoilers)
    Fred salvaging the Nauvoo and trying to turn it into a half-assed warship. Hence why he's so hellbent on getting a barely functional piece of technology out of dock, because it's a matter of personal power politics, instead of the belters just being dumb.

    Book 2 and 3 spoilers:
    I do sort of wonder when the Nauvoo is coming back. At this equivalent point in book 2 (Holden going to Ganymede) the Nauvoo was already back at Tycho, and was being modified to be the Behemoth. I'm guessing we'll see the Behemoth by the end of the season, but maybe not at Tycho?

    The lack of a time skip like in the book means there's not a lot of time for the Nauvoo to be modified to the Behemoth. So it almost needs to be in dock somewhere now. Fred might unveil in an episode or two, in order to consolidate his hold on the Belters

    The Behemoth is extremely important for the plot going forward, as it needs to be part of the group investigating the Ring Gate.

    Dracomicron
  • SyngyneSyngyne Registered User regular
    Seal wrote: »
    Honk wrote: »
    Hrrrm hmmm.

    Legitimate salvage.
    I really want them to use that line with some Martian officer and just get narrowed eyes in response.

    Well (book 2 spoiler, and possibly season 2 spoiler if they keep this)
    He does get narrowed eyes in response, in the form of a lawyer that tells him the Martian Congressional Republic is suing him to get the Tachinante back.

    5gsowHm.png
  • chrono_travellerchrono_traveller Registered User regular
    Selner wrote: »
    Kana wrote: »
    Yeah, Fred is in danger of losing control completely, so he's trying to force the Roci's crew to bend the knee. Holden in turn calls his bluff, because Fred is unlikely to stay in control long enough for his threats to matter.

    I would guess that this plotline is going to result in (book spoilers)
    Fred salvaging the Nauvoo and trying to turn it into a half-assed warship. Hence why he's so hellbent on getting a barely functional piece of technology out of dock, because it's a matter of personal power politics, instead of the belters just being dumb.

    Book 2 and 3 spoilers:
    I do sort of wonder when the Nauvoo is coming back. At this equivalent point in book 2 (Holden going to Ganymede) the Nauvoo was already back at Tycho, and was being modified to be the Behemoth. I'm guessing we'll see the Behemoth by the end of the season, but maybe not at Tycho?

    The lack of a time skip like in the book means there's not a lot of time for the Nauvoo to be modified to the Behemoth. So it almost needs to be in dock somewhere now. Fred might unveil in an episode or two, in order to consolidate his hold on the Belters

    The Behemoth is extremely important for the plot going forward, as it needs to be part of the group investigating the Ring Gate.

    Book 2/3 spoilers:
    I think we'll get the time jump between seasons, and that is "when" the Behemoth will be built.

    The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it. ~ Terry Pratchett

    George R. R. Martin is not your bitch. ~ Neil Gaiman
  • DracomicronDracomicron Registered User regular
    Selner wrote: »
    Kana wrote: »
    Yeah, Fred is in danger of losing control completely, so he's trying to force the Roci's crew to bend the knee. Holden in turn calls his bluff, because Fred is unlikely to stay in control long enough for his threats to matter.

    I would guess that this plotline is going to result in (book spoilers)
    Fred salvaging the Nauvoo and trying to turn it into a half-assed warship. Hence why he's so hellbent on getting a barely functional piece of technology out of dock, because it's a matter of personal power politics, instead of the belters just being dumb.

    Book 2 and 3 spoilers:
    I do sort of wonder when the Nauvoo is coming back. At this equivalent point in book 2 (Holden going to Ganymede) the Nauvoo was already back at Tycho, and was being modified to be the Behemoth. I'm guessing we'll see the Behemoth by the end of the season, but maybe not at Tycho?

    The lack of a time skip like in the book means there's not a lot of time for the Nauvoo to be modified to the Behemoth. So it almost needs to be in dock somewhere now. Fred might unveil in an episode or two, in order to consolidate his hold on the Belters

    The Behemoth is extremely important for the plot going forward, as it needs to be part of the group investigating the Ring Gate.

    Book 2/3 spoilers:
    I think we'll get the time jump between seasons, and that is "when" the Behemoth will be built.

    Nah.
    It'll be cliffhangers every season.

    Gary Gygax wrote:
    ''The secret we should never let the gamemasters know is that they don't need any rules.''
    Jragghen
  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    The timeskips in the book honestly usually felt pretty unnecessary. Especially with how the show is purposefully setting up plotlines for future books ahead of time, I would strongly predict that the show is never going to go for a timeskip, at least not more than a few months.
    For instance, that "find god" line was most definitely a setup for a certain lady minister to make her appearance next(?) season.

    The show's got a nice thing going right now where every time they solve one problem, a new one is created. A timeskip would just interfere with the good rhythm they've got going now in the story.

    A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
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  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    I am just catching up on this.

    EP 4
    I feel pretty bad for the Mormons. This is like a giant decades long project that's gonna get smashed to bits one way or another.

    I mean maybe this is saving them from being eaten by space aliens, I dunno, I haven't read the books.

    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
    JacobkoshCanadianWolverine
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    Oh no!

    What even happened to that ship?!

    Oh they must be so angry. The sheer number of stern letters...

    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    I am just catching up on this.

    EP 4
    I feel pretty bad for the Mormons. This is like a giant decades long project that's gonna get smashed to bits one way or another.

    I mean maybe this is saving them from being eaten by space aliens, I dunno, I haven't read the books.

    I don't feel bad for them at all.
    Trying to leave Earth so they can go have a super-creepy super-male-dominated monoculture off somewhere else, under the auspices of some grand religious plan? Yeah, no thanks, the universe is genuinely better off with that sort of thing staying in our solar system.

    Hell, they'd warp the details of human history so badly that nobody would be within in a hundred years of the truth and reality of human civilization, because there wouldn't be any truth, just a bunch of propaganda.

    It's a shame that something like the Navoo would never get used for the peaceful purpose it was built for, but it's also not a bad thing that there won't be a chunk of the human species out there completely isolated from anything but what their religious elders choose to tell them is the truth of the week.

    PAJoe_zpsc20d21e8.jpg
    KashaarZilla360
  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    sneak peek!

    A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
    CanadianWolverineGONG-00chrono_travellerZilla360VoodooVMazzyx
  • Zilla360Zilla360 21st Century. Surreal. Immersive. Earth.Registered User regular
    I am just catching up on this.

    EP 4
    I feel pretty bad for the Mormons. This is like a giant decades long project that's gonna get smashed to bits one way or another.

    I mean maybe this is saving them from being eaten by space aliens, I dunno, I haven't read the books.

    I don't feel bad for them at all.
    Trying to leave Earth so they can go have a super-creepy super-male-dominated monoculture off somewhere else, under the auspices of some grand religious plan? Yeah, no thanks, the universe is genuinely better off with that sort of thing staying in our solar system.

    Hell, they'd warp the details of human history so badly that nobody would be within in a hundred years of the truth and reality of human civilization, because there wouldn't be any truth, just a bunch of propaganda.


    It's a shame that something like the Navoo would never get used for the peaceful purpose it was built for, but it's also not a bad thing that there won't be a chunk of the human species out there completely isolated from anything but what their religious elders choose to tell them is the truth of the week.
    Yeah, speaking as a secular humanist, (organised?) religion is the kind of shit we might want to leave behind if we ever get out of this solar system.

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