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[DOTA 2] 7.01 - The Dark Era of Anti-Mage

SceptreSceptre Registered User regular
edited January 8 in Games and Technology
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SO, WHAT IS DOTA 2?
Honestly, all you need to know is that in terms of skill curves and levels of competition, Dota 2 is basically Smash Bros. Melee for the PC. If you like strategic thinking, games that are easy to pick up but hard to master, learning to speak new languages, playing dress-up with monsters, and being genuinely angry with your friends and teammates, this is a game you're going to spend a shitload of time playing.

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GENERAL INFORMATION

Main website: www.dota2.com
Game wiki: http://dota2.gamepedia.com/
Stats for nerds: http://www.dotabuff.com
Stats for uber-nerds: http://www.datdota.com

One of my many nerd toys:
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Guides for new players
Welcome to Dota. You suck.
How to play Dota 2 in four minutes
Coming to Dota 2 after LoL
Reddit: Learn Dota 2 some great content on this sub for new players. Lots of discussion.
The art of Support
Chaq's guide to advanced Solo Mid


Dota News and Streams
http://www.liquiddota.com/
http://www.reddit.com/r/dota2
http://www.reddit.com/r/truedota2


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Dota is a weird and complicated game! If you have questions don't be afraid to ask here, we've all been there. Except for maybe Yilias... I don't think he was ever bad at Dota...

Sceptre on
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Posts

  • MortiousMortious The Nightmare Begins Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    mts wrote: »
    I don't get refresher on pugna. What exactly has a long enough cool down that that helps unless maybe double Dagon

    Netherward basically.

    It's extremely gimmicky, and I've only done so once or twice.

    Not my video, but the reason I tried it.

    Move to New Zealand
    It’s not a very important country most of the time
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/mortious
    La Moyenne Mort
  • MortiousMortious The Nightmare Begins Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    My other favourite gimmick build is radiance Bristleback.

    Vanguard+Wand+Guardian Greaves+Radiance meant that I could fight their entire team solo and kill the last one that tries to bug out.

    Of course that only worked because I had a great early game.

    I've always wanted to try this on Axe, but there never seems to be a good time to build a radiance on him.

    Move to New Zealand
    It’s not a very important country most of the time
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/mortious
    La Moyenne Mort
  • MusicoolMusicool Registered User regular
    edited November 2015
    Another trick for Disruptor is this: Glimpse someone after 3 procs of thunder strike to glimpse them back to where they were when you cast the strike. Since Thunder Strike procs once on cast and then every two seconds afterwards, the third strike is exactly 4 seconds after cast.

    So I saw an interesting new tactic in mid today. My opponent prioritised denies over last hits. Like, almost exclusively. Which, considering I was Tiny, I wasn't too fazed about. I figured that Puck would just have a much slower boots, bottle and eventually Blink, so all g. Plus I used Tiny's naturally high base damage to secure some last hits and let Puck miss the last hits on offer. But then I got aggressive and he combo'd me down. And I realised he was 7 and I was 5. So that was interesting. Didn't matter much though, because in the end he had a reeeeeeally slow blink and even skipped bottle, while I was casually farming and stuff. He got super salty about losing in the end too. Wouldn't even accept my compliment when I said it was a neat trick. :D

    Musicool on
    Burtletoy wrote: »
    I disagree completely.
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  • JakorianJakorian Registered User regular
    It's really amazing how brittle players are about their builds. Every time I play against Ursa I tell my team the importance of force staffs (and demonstrating how good it is against him) but they just go blink dagger which results in Ursa jumping on them and disabling it. I was wondering what made certain pubstompers so good and it seems to be any character that requires thinking differently. Players will just chase their desired builds right off a cliff no matter how much warning they get.

  • SceptreSceptre Registered User regular
    I don't know when players start to significantly modify or alter their builds... but people will follow their selected guide into the grave. Which is crazy when you think about how important item selection is to winning most games.

  • JakorianJakorian Registered User regular
    See also; carries who continue building bfury after 25 minutes.

  • MusicoolMusicool Registered User regular
    Sceptre wrote: »
    I don't know when players start to significantly modify or alter their builds... but people will follow their selected guide into the grave. Which is crazy when you think about how important item selection is to winning most games.

    Whenever I feel that I've become competent a hero I turn off guides. It makes me think about my skill points more, and dive through the shop menu more often when I'm wondering what the game needs from my next item.

    That said, I think BSJ's bigass Slark guide is a great vid. Not only because the build is rock solid, but also because he drops so many knowledge bombs in the video about carry itemisation.

    Burtletoy wrote: »
    I disagree completely.
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  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    Musicool wrote: »
    Sceptre wrote: »
    I don't know when players start to significantly modify or alter their builds... but people will follow their selected guide into the grave. Which is crazy when you think about how important item selection is to winning most games.

    Whenever I feel that I've become competent a hero I turn off guides. It makes me think about my skill points more, and dive through the shop menu more often when I'm wondering what the game needs from my next item.

    Pretty much this. I think a lot of it for me has to do with playing Single Draft and Random Draft, where I can't actually get comfortable enough with a Hero to know what items help them yet, so I need to use the standard build guide a lot. Especially when it comes to starting items. Late-game items, I exercise a lot more decision-making.

    But some Heroes I've played enough times now that I just know what I want and why. Venge, Disruptor, and some carries like Blood, Troll, and Viper. Zeus doesn't allow for a whole lot of options, but I like to try different things with him anyways.

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  • FrozenzenFrozenzen Registered User regular
    Wow, this OG vs CDEC game 1 at the majors was surely something.

  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    Frozenzen wrote: »
    Wow, this OG vs CDEC game 1 at the majors was surely something.

    And now we get to see Meepo in game 2. I'm gonna have to go back and watch these later, methinks.

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  • SceptreSceptre Registered User regular
    Pretty sure CDEC's lineup walks all over meepo though :(

  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    Sceptre wrote: »
    Pretty sure CDEC's lineup walks all over meepo though :(

    I agree. But maybe that just means a sweet Game 3 is coming up.

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  • SceptreSceptre Registered User regular
    How do you beat CDEC? You make them play your version of DOTA.

  • FoomyFoomy Registered User regular
    Sceptre wrote: »
    How do you beat CDEC? You make them play your version of DOTA.

    That's what EG learned at TI5, CDEC play one style of dota very well, but they can only play that way.

    As time goes on teams are learning how they play and countering it, It's the same sort of problem that Aliiance had.

    Steam Profile: FoomyFooms
    3clipse
  • Rubix42Rubix42 Registered User regular
    Watching those guys play, I definitely am not playing the same game. It's awesome.

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  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    Rubix42 wrote: »
    Watching those guys play, I definitely am not playing the same game. It's awesome.

    One thing that might not take very long to figure out is that the way those guys play is not the way you'll be playing. For like, a really really long time. I started playing Dota about a year ago, and everything they say about the learning curve is true. I probably just lack lots of talent, as well. But I am so far below their skill level it risks breaking my neck. If I play with someone like Sceptre, you can almost hear the quiet sound of him sobbing while I ruin everything. And Sceptre isn't at the pro level, he's merely very good. There's just so many huge gaps in skill level in this game.

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  • SceptreSceptre Registered User regular
    edited November 2015
    If I play late enough at night it will put occasionally throw me into games with 5k players, and all of a sudden it feels like I've never played the game before because they are just SO much better. Then you realize they feel the exact same way when they play against the real pros.

    I'm convinced that players who manage to get past 5k within their first year of playing are genetic freaks. They should be curing cancer or bringing peace to the middle east.

    Sceptre on
    ThawmusYilias
  • Rubix42Rubix42 Registered User regular
    Haha. So true. It's starting to click a little for me. Went 11/9/19 as disruptor just now in a 3 on 4 that we almost won. Even though we lost it was awesome.

    signature goes here
    Musicool
  • MusicoolMusicool Registered User regular
    Sceptre wrote: »
    If I play late enough at night it will put occasionally throw me into games with 5k players, and all of a sudden it feels like I've never played the game before because they are just SO much better. Then you realize they feel the exact same way when they play against the real pros.

    I'm convinced that players who manage to get past 5k within their first year of playing are genetic freaks. They should be curing cancer or bringing peace to the middle east.

    I'm coming up on a year now and even 2k is a distant dream. Is it nice there? It sounds nice. I heard there's free beer and pizza.

    Burtletoy wrote: »
    I disagree completely.
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  • mtsmts Registered User regular
    holy shit, every game of secret vs. eg in the winners bracket final was spectacular

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  • KharnastusKharnastus Registered User regular
    rawr! So I have been on a super sweet solo ranked winning streak. Been playing dat radiance wraith king safe lane and stomping faces. Also, my rando team has stopped trying to play jungle LC so that's nice. stupid jungle LC... I generally get some pretty awful supports who couldn't stack to save their lives though.

  • Rubix42Rubix42 Registered User regular
    edited November 2015
    Got a night of games in as disruptor. Really taking a shine to this pita hero. His abilities help secure so many kills early and late. And at my level with everyone being super aggressive I can catch people throighout the game. My item use sucks and the fact that he is good without items makes my life easier. My stats have vastly improved since I picked him up.

    Sadly most people at my level also don't know he can glimpse. Missed some early game kills because my lane partner didn't know.

    Anyways. The tips from last thread helped a ton and I really appreciate it.

    Rubix42 on
    signature goes here
    Kristmas Kthulhu
  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    Rubix42 wrote: »
    Got a night of games in as disruptor. Really taking a shine to this pita hero. His abilities help secure so many kills early and late. And at my level with everyone being super aggressive I can catch people throighout the game. My item use sucks and the fact that he is good without items makes my life easier. My stats have vastly improved since I picked him up.

    Sadly most people at my level also don't know he can glimpse. Missed some early game kills because my lane partner didn't know.

    Anyways. The tips from last thread helped a ton and I really appreciate it.

    You, me, Music, and others should play some 5v5v5 Overthrow sometime. Just so you can teamfight with him for 15 minutes straight and get some more practice with him. Disruptor is a pretty good Overthrow Hero.

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  • Rubix42Rubix42 Registered User regular
    Sounds good. Count me in! Gonna try to remember and add my info to the group sheet when I get home tonight.

    Side note. I think I can plug my Xbox headset into my Mac (don't judge) and use it for both speakers and voice. Is this accurate?

    signature goes here
  • mtsmts Registered User regular
    Assuming it is usb or analog yes

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  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    Warning! I am about to say something nice about Reborn! Warning!

    I really like how the tournament bracket viewer and the schedule are constructed to prevent me from spoiling the results, so I can go back and watch the whole damn tournament if I kept my head down enough. That's very cool.

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  • Aktn BstrdAktn Bstrd Registered User regular
    Played my first game in a few months. Wow the new item that reduces cooldowns is awesome!

  • SceptreSceptre Registered User regular
    I've never played much Phantom Lancer, just rolled him as a random. God damn what a crazy hero. Won more fights than I should have because my enemies were confused by all the illusions.

    schuss
  • Rubix42Rubix42 Registered User regular
    edited November 2015
    Just went 9/3/16 as disruptor. Hard carry on my team pissed because I secured early kills. Wow.

    I mean. I know I shouldn't get kills. But at the same time, I didn't let them get away. I'm confused.

    Rubix42 on
    signature goes here
  • 411Randle411Randle Librarian Oook.Registered User regular
    Well, OG just blew through EG and made Secret look like a pub team in Game 1 of the finals. Where did this come from?

    I also love that the Chinese teams' excuse for doing poorly is that Frankfurt "doesn't feel like a real big tournament like TI5". I mean, yeah, it's no 18 million prize pool, but 3 million plus is nothing to sneeze at. I bet they won't say the same thing when the Winter Major is in Shanghai.

    1) Silence 2) Books must be returned by the last date shown 3) Do not interfere with the nature of causality
  • FrozenzenFrozenzen Registered User regular
    Wow, OG is stepping up bigtime.

    Nice to see n0tail and gang delivering.

  • 411Randle411Randle Librarian Oook.Registered User regular
    edited November 2015
    Seriously, Secret, I've got the answer for you.

    Ban Dazzle.

    Seriously, just do it. Wyvern too, if you can, but definitely ban Dazzle.

    So many ganks and fights ruined because the cores kept getting Grave'd.

    EDIT: Hey, look, Secret banned Wyvern and first-picked Dazzle, and they're winning. What a concept.

    411Randle on
    1) Silence 2) Books must be returned by the last date shown 3) Do not interfere with the nature of causality
  • mtsmts Registered User regular
    Og has looked pretty solid. They play a ton of different heroes so it's hard to stop a particular strategy.

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  • 411Randle411Randle Librarian Oook.Registered User regular
    That looked more like the Secret I expected.

    Both teams are really good, and OG is better than people gave them credit for going in. I think their weakness is if you take away their sustain/aggro supports. That Game 3 showed, if they can't push, they're vulnerable in a farm war, especially against Secret.

    1) Silence 2) Books must be returned by the last date shown 3) Do not interfere with the nature of causality
  • mtsmts Registered User regular
    See I think they can do that. Miracle can go nuts if you let him farm. His am is nutso

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  • 411Randle411Randle Librarian Oook.Registered User regular
    edited November 2015
    Miracle can, but over on Secret you've got w33 and Envy, who are both insane farmers in their own rights.

    EDIT: I think Game 4 is going to OG. It's early, but Secret hasn't slowed down the Doom or SF at all.

    411Randle on
    1) Silence 2) Books must be returned by the last date shown 3) Do not interfere with the nature of causality
  • Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    Man..at the end of this thing that is definitely not the team I was expecting to win it.

    411RandleSceptre
  • 411Randle411Randle Librarian Oook.Registered User regular
    OG was in a best of 1 in the Lower Bracket to start this. They beat Fnatic, Mineski, Virtus.Pro, CDEC, EHOME, and EG before taking out Secret in the Grand Finals. Apparently, as long as they don't face Vega, they're unbeatable.

    Miracle is just a beast.

    1) Silence 2) Books must be returned by the last date shown 3) Do not interfere with the nature of causality
  • VishNubVishNub Registered User regular
    That was a really good tournament, IMO. Between the main event and the qualifiers there were a ton of good games, and this meta is really fun to watch.

    I guess we expect a new patch to drop soon. Looking forward to seeing how that changes things, and to the next Major.

    Steam = VishnuOwnz
    Dota2 = Glitchmo
    Sceptre411Randlevaliance
  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    When comparing yourselves to pro's also remember that these guys an insane amount of time playing as a team. Some of the strats you see in pro games are just not possible without that level of coordination.

    PSN: Canadian_llama
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