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[WoW Theorycraft] Theorycrafting, Simming, and dummy testing, oh my!

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Posts

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    More likely their stat priority just shifts. Frost mages in early WoD wanted Multi and Vers. Priority shifted after ilvl 650.

  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    Vers usually translates from rating to percent fairly poorly compared to other stats, so if vers is your best secondary it means your other stats are suboptimal for mechanical reasons (abilities not benefiting from crit, the rotation not generating enough resources for the extra expenditure from haste, or a lukewarm mastery effect). Everyone has the same base conversion of vers to %damage, so if verse is your best stat you are on average benefitting from secondary stats less than someone who has stats better than verse.

  • Kai_SanKai_San Commonly known as Klineshrike! Registered User regular
    It USED to, but the conversion for Vers from rating is much higher than it was before.

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    Dhalphir
  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    It's still lower for me. I get about 12% more crit per point, and 20% more haste. Even ignoring my class mechanics that synergize with crit and haste, they're still numerically better than verse (until I have large amounts of them).

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited September 2016
    DPS rankings after day 1 of Heroic raiding (75th percentile logs)

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    Dhalphir on
  • EspantaPajaroEspantaPajaro Registered User regular
    It boggles the mind how there is someone worst then warlocks.

    bowen
  • Kai_SanKai_San Commonly known as Klineshrike! Registered User regular
    Because they aren't THAT bad?

    Large amount of build up, and in some cases challenging to play well (for little reward) but they are not a broken spec. I mean look at how frost is built. THAT is a broken spec.

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  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Labyrinths are awesome!Registered User regular
    Three very important things to bear in mind from that data:

    1) Progression logs are frequently unreliable, because people are learning the fights/learning optimal damage positioning and burn times/etc. We'll have a much better idea of actual rankings in a month or so when fights are on farm.

    2) There's a lot of spec bias among high end raiders, which means the people best at a class all tend to play one spec, which can inflate that spec's rankings. Again, we need more data to round it out.

    3) Artifact trait timing is not equivalent among specs. For example, Marksmanship Hunters have both of their very important single target DPS golden traits already; the third one is very AoE oriented. The optimal path for Beast Mastery, on the other hand, doesn't get its incredibly important single target golden trait (+35,000-40,000 DPS for that one point) for several more weeks, so the disparity between them will hugely tighten just based on that alone. I'm sure this is true for other classes/specs as well.

    So overall I'm basically ignoring logs until everyone has full golden traits and the instance has been on farm for awhile. Too many things are just out of whack otherwise.

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    drunkenpandaren
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Labyrinths are awesome!Registered User regular
    I will say however that if you can convince your raid leader to upload everything to Warcraft Logs, do it. We started doing that and it's super helpful, and it will break down everyone's DPS by spec and compare it to every other uploaded parse of that spec and ilvl. Good way of making sure you're not underperforming.

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  • bowenbowen ayyyyyyyy Registered User regular
    Javen wrote: »
    Which is a shame, considering both tank trinkets I got today have tons of crit on them

    I can't find much gear with versatility

    it's always fucking mastery and haste.

    Warning: I am a programmer/sysop. IANAL/IANAD, seek actual advice from certified people in their respective fields if you are actually in need of it.
  • NyhtNyht Registered User regular
    Does anyone know if I dump the 39K artifact points to reset my talents in my weapon if the next point will still be 39k? Or will it act like I spent a point and make it like 40something? Every website I've seen kept suggesting I pickup the eyebeam talent as my second golden as Havoc DH. But reading the golden talent for Inner Demon, the damage it does, and watching it proc for people twice or so in thirty seconds, I am unable to understand HOW that is not better all the time. Hell I don't see how that's not more damage than EITHER of the golden talents.

  • Kai_SanKai_San Commonly known as Klineshrike! Registered User regular
    It likely just costs the same for the next point. But it is almost always never worth it because you will get the stuff you want eventually.

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    Smrtnik
  • NyhtNyht Registered User regular
    Kai_San wrote: »
    It likely just costs the same for the next point. But it is almost always never worth it because you will get the stuff you want eventually.

    The problem is, that EVENTUALLY is quite a ways off this high up. At on paper it looks like it should increase my damage (even AOE damage) by a fair amount. Mythic+ and Raids are out and it's more that I might be able to do even more to help out.

  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    So with the recent tank nerfs and healer buffs, they seem to have a pretty solid rock > paper > scissors thing going on, where dps can get healers, but not tanks, and tanks can't out pace healers. Except in the last case it's just really annoying, because the healers definitely can't kill the tanks either, so they just end up slapping each other indefinitely.

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  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Nyht wrote: »
    Does anyone know if I dump the 39K artifact points to reset my talents in my weapon if the next point will still be 39k? Or will it act like I spent a point and make it like 40something? Every website I've seen kept suggesting I pickup the eyebeam talent as my second golden as Havoc DH. But reading the golden talent for Inner Demon, the damage it does, and watching it proc for people twice or so in thirty seconds, I am unable to understand HOW that is not better all the time. Hell I don't see how that's not more damage than EITHER of the golden talents.

    Never ever respec an artifact for that much cost. It's just not worth it.

    bowenLD50Smrtnik3clipseDrHookensteinEspantaPajaro
  • DrHookensteinDrHookenstein Registered User regular
    Nyht wrote: »
    Kai_San wrote: »
    It likely just costs the same for the next point. But it is almost always never worth it because you will get the stuff you want eventually.

    The problem is, that EVENTUALLY is quite a ways off this high up. At on paper it looks like it should increase my damage (even AOE damage) by a fair amount. Mythic+ and Raids are out and it's more that I might be able to do even more to help out.

    Please don't do this. It's really not a good idea to respec at that cost.

    "He piled upon the whale's white hump the sum of all the general rage and hate felt by his whole race from Adam down; and then, as if his chest had been a mortar, he burst his hot heart's shell upon it." -Moby Dick
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    does anyone know anything about the proc rate for the armor neck enchant?

  • Kevin CristKevin Crist But it's like we weren't made for this world Though I wouldn't really want to meet someone who wasRegistered User regular
    WoWhead comment says it proced for him eight times in ten minutes, with a few overlaps.

    Also is procs from attacking, not being attacked.

    acpRlGW.jpg291.gif
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  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited September 2016
    that's awful. it's not even giving AP like armor procs used to, so you have no guarantee it'll proc when you need it

    Dhalphir on
  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    That sounds low. It's been proccing for me quite a bit

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  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited November 2016
    @Javen

    The PTR changes mean big changes for the standard Vengeance talent build.

    - Metamorphosis now gives 100% armor for duration
    - Fracture pain cost HALVED
    - Nerf to Last Resort & Fel Devastation move means Soul barrier is go-to survival talent in final tier, Fel Devastation go-to DPS talent
    - Soul Rending is now largely pointless, with the nerf to Last Resort meaning you'll only get one full-duration Meta, and the buff to meta overall.
    - Either Fracture or FtD will be the go-to but most likely Fracture
    - Demonic Infusion is a 15% straight uptime buff to demon spikes
    - Razor Spikes is now mandatory for DPS for that tier
    - Fel Eruption CD change to 30 sec lines it up with Fiery Brand, and its dmg got massively buffed. Probably replaces Felblade.
    - Soul Barrier's absorb got massively buffed

    Dhalphir on
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Shear also has 100% chance to spawn fragment during Metamorphosis, plus a 20% buff to damage.
    And we got 10% more baseline HP.

  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    Whether I take fracture or ftb will entirely depend on whether I can get 100% demon spikes uptime with just the tier bonus. If you can, it makes ftb redundant, otherwise I might still take it to hit that benchmark.

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  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    edited November 2016
    Also while I think making shear have 100% chance to make a soul fragment is a super clever idea to increase the self healing during metamorphosis, why do that AND keep soul rending?

    I'd rather them keep fel devastation where it is, nerf last resort if they really need to since soul barrier isn't totally awful now, and put demonic infusion where soul rending is.

    And speaking of soul fragments, I like how they're trying everything they can to make spirit bomb viable, when all they have to do is make the used fragments trigger FtB/FbP

    Javen on
    bar-cc-1.jpg
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Probably because everyone takes Soul Rending, and this talent change keeps a reasonably decent talent but also buffs the other two it competes with. There's some real choice in that range - Soul Rending is still a reasonable choice.

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Javen wrote: »
    Whether I take fracture or ftb will entirely depend on whether I can get 100% demon spikes uptime with just the tier bonus. If you can, it makes ftb redundant, otherwise I might still take it to hit that benchmark.

    You're going to sacrifice a ton of ST DPS going FtB over Fracture.

  • NyhtNyht Registered User regular
    PTR Havoc DH feels pretty bad now? Damage is lower by quite a deal and I have the BIS ring. Demon's Blade feels pretty dead now. The best results I got were Blind Fury, Demonic Appetite, and Demonic, with Nemesis. It was kind of fun as I always loved the idea of Eye Beam/demonic form build but I feel a lot of the hits were too much. I feel fury starved and my "legendary" ring just feels like I have it for the stats. An extra 1-6 fury or 1-12 (down from 1-12 and 1-20) feels way too low to be a "Legendary" affect. Random item in the world, sure.

    Posted a long breakdown of my thoughts on the forum but now sure if posts are read better through reddit or somewhere else as I know the official forums are mostly vitriol.

  • Kai_SanKai_San Commonly known as Klineshrike! Registered User regular
    Ever going to take the plunge and just name this the DH thread?

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  • Bobkins FlymoBobkins Flymo Fantastic Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited November 2016
    It's more likely going to become the locked thread if going two months without posts and being about one class is all it has to offer.

    Bobkins Flymo on
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    Kai_SanTryCatcher
  • TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    edited November 2016
    The EJ model is outdated, there simply should be a list of class Discords on the WoW thread's opening post and be done with it.

    TryCatcher on
  • DrHookensteinDrHookenstein Registered User regular
    The utility of EJ threads lay not just in the active discussion but also the historical information for people to browse through, IMO.

    "He piled upon the whale's white hump the sum of all the general rage and hate felt by his whole race from Adam down; and then, as if his chest had been a mortar, he burst his hot heart's shell upon it." -Moby Dick
    Lanlaorn
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    It's more likely going to become the locked thread if going two months without posts and being about one class is all it has to offer.

    That's fair, it is probably a failed experiment at this point.

    DrHookenstein
  • ArthilArthil Registered User regular
    People forgetting to bring theorycraft discussion into here didn't help.

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