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[MTG]-Cataclysmic Gearhulk is Awful and I Hate It And You Should Too

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    The Escape GoatThe Escape Goat incorrigible ruminant they/themRegistered User regular
    edited February 2017
    I want a god that does things with artifacts

    The Escape Goat on
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    The BetgirlThe Betgirl I'm Molly! Registered User regular
    I want a god that does things with artifacts
    there is a 99.9% chance that there will be jack and shit for good artifacts/artifacts matter in Amonkhet

    Steam PSN: YerFriendMolly
    ineedmayo.com Eidolon Journal Updated
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    DaebunzDaebunz Registered User regular
    I'm pretty excited for amonkhet

    I liked kaladesh block re: the cards themselves/mechanics/power level but I was pretty lukewarm on the plane itself

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    The BetgirlThe Betgirl I'm Molly! Registered User regular
    i think vehicles are probably the least healthy standard card type in a long time

    Steam PSN: YerFriendMolly
    ineedmayo.com Eidolon Journal Updated
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    DaebunzDaebunz Registered User regular
    edited February 2017
    rest in peace, friend copter

    too beautiful for this world

    Daebunz on
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    The Escape GoatThe Escape Goat incorrigible ruminant they/themRegistered User regular
    I want a god that does things with artifacts
    there is a 99.9% chance that there will be jack and shit for good artifacts/artifacts matter in Amonkhet
    I know but I still want it like, just to have that thematic niche covered

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    I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    Whippy wrote: »
    Likely gods, too, and if not devotion then something like it to turn those on
    they mentioned when discussing Crew that they took it from an amonkhet mechanic, so i wouldn't be surprised if there was some "worship" mechanic that they had to turn gods on initially that got reworked to Crew

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    The BetgirlThe Betgirl I'm Molly! Registered User regular
    'i crew my demigod'

    Steam PSN: YerFriendMolly
    ineedmayo.com Eidolon Journal Updated
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    WearingglassesWearingglasses Of the friendly neighborhood variety Registered User regular
    "If enough creatures bow tap to me, I'd be amenable to get off my ass and do something"

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    Lord PalingtonLord Palington he.him.his History-loving pal!Registered User regular
    Yeah, leave bowing cards to Return to Kamigawa please.

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    Dr. FlamingoDr. Flamingo 49 Gilded Disc Perceives the Sun Registered User regular
    Whippy wrote: »
    Likely gods, too, and if not devotion then something like it to turn those on
    they mentioned when discussing Crew that they took it from an amonkhet mechanic, so i wouldn't be surprised if there was some "worship" mechanic that they had to turn gods on initially that got reworked to Crew

    If only there were some way to combine the two...
    madmaxv8.jpg

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    ShadowenShadowen Snores in the morning LoserdomRegistered User regular
    Whippy wrote: »
    Likely gods, too, and if not devotion then something like it to turn those on
    they mentioned when discussing Crew that they took it from an amonkhet mechanic, so i wouldn't be surprised if there was some "worship" mechanic that they had to turn gods on initially that got reworked to Crew

    If only there were some way to combine the two...
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    WITNESS ME 3--While this creature is attacking and before combat damage is assigned, untap another creature you control and remove it from combat. This creature gets +3/0 and your choice of trample or double strike until end of turn. At end of combat, sacrifice this creature.

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    KalTorakKalTorak One way or another, they all end up in the Undercity.Registered User regular
    i think vehicles are probably the least healthy standard card type in a long time

    They're pretty similar to equipment - they rely on creatures to work, but are more resistant to removal, and generally get around color restrictions. In their first run at Equipment, we got stuff like Cranium Plating, Bonesplitter, Lightning Greaves, Loxodon Warhammer, Skullclamp, and the first couple Swords. Vehicles are more restrictive flavor-wise than equipment, but I think with some more experience balancing them out they'll be able to bring them back at a more reasonable level.

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    I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    counterpoint: they have never brought equipment up to a reasonable level and they're stuck at limited fodder forever

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    PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    counterpoint: they have never brought equipment up to a reasonable level and they're stuck at limited fodder forever

    Never? I'm not sure I'd say never.

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    The Escape GoatThe Escape Goat incorrigible ruminant they/themRegistered User regular
    edited February 2017
    I look at every equipment ever printed (barring living weapon and equip 0) and I'm like "what deck both wants to play this and is okay just skipping a turn not developing a minion and then another turn not developing a minion to equip it"

    the virtue of weapons seem to be "if your minion gets removed, you still have the equipment to re-attach and continue getting value from" which is just way too slow for any sort of constructed because you need another minion to equip it to that you don't have because you spent your mana playing and equipping it to the first creature, and if the game has gone on long enough that your other critter is around to swing with it your likely more on the aggressive side deck has probably lost the advantage

    at least for equipment that makes critters bigger, which seems to be most of them. If there were utility equipments that were basically auras like ocular halo, but more resilient, maybe that'd be useful... but might be too off-theme at that point

    The Escape Goat on
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    PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    edited February 2017
    Am I taking crazy pills?! Do y'all not remember how insane equipment was for the first 2 years it existed?

    Pinfeldorf on
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    The Escape GoatThe Escape Goat incorrigible ruminant they/themRegistered User regular
    Pinfeldorf wrote: »
    Am I taking crazy pills?! Do y'all not remember how insane equipment was for the first 2 years it existed?

    I think the key is "we want it to be playable but not bonkers" and it sounds like the first wave of equipment were pretty bonkers

    and no, I don't remember when equipment first came out, I was 7 :P

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    VyolynceVyolynce Registered User regular
    edited February 2017
    KalTorak wrote: »
    i think vehicles are probably the least healthy standard card type in a long time

    They're pretty similar to equipment - they rely on creatures to work, but are more resistant to removal, and generally get around color restrictions. In their first run at Equipment, we got stuff like Cranium Plating, Bonesplitter, Lightning Greaves, Loxodon Warhammer, Skullclamp, and the first couple Swords. Vehicles are more restrictive flavor-wise than equipment, but I think with some more experience balancing them out they'll be able to bring them back at a more reasonable level.

    The main difference is that if you kill every creature an opponent has, their remaining equipment isn't going to smash you in the face the next time they find a creature. Vehicles effectively give every creature in your opponent's deck (with sufficient power) haste and a substantial power boost plus often evasion as well.

    They're closer to creature-lands than they are to equipment, IMO. But not every deck can run every creature-land, because with like two exceptions they require colored mana to activate.

    I look at every equipment ever printed (barring living weapon and equip 0) and I'm like "what deck both wants to play this and is okay just skipping a turn not developing a minion and then another turn not developing a minion to equip it"

    Just counting those created post-Jitte (so none of the broken Mirrodin nonsense), I have recollections of all of these seeing Standard play:

    Basilisk Collar
    Behemoth Sledge (when pre-Jitte Loxodon Warhammer wasn't available)
    Captain's Claws (maybe just my local meta?)
    Ghostfire Blade
    Livewire Lash
    Runechanter's Pike
    Sunforger
    the other three Swords (obv)

    And a few other hits from Kamigawa that weren't Jitte:
    Kusari-Gama
    Manriki-Gusari (granted this was mostly anti-Jitte tech)


    And that's not counting nonsense like all of the zero-cost equipment for Cheerios-style decks (mostly a Modern/Legacy thing but Puresteel Paladin was definitely a deck in Standard briefly) or others used more for combo potential than as actual equipment (Nim Deathmantle, Deathrender, Sword of the Meek; Sunforger kind of falls here too but it was still swung).


    Yeah, leave bowing cards to Return to Kamigawa please.

    As amusing as it would be to watch WotC get sued by another game company instead of the other way around, I'm pretty sure we will never see the word "bow" as an in-game mechanic in Magic.

    Vyolynce on
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    initiatefailureinitiatefailure Registered User regular
    Gideon and Liliana as faces for the Egypt set? That doesn't really make sense. But I guess as an enfranchised player I'm not the one they want to get excited about seeing the same damn planeswalkers every other block and only having 2ish plane/story specific spots.

    Gideon I can see since he was supposed to rotate here before the switch back

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    KalTorakKalTorak One way or another, they all end up in the Undercity.Registered User regular
    one of Liliana's demons is on Amonkhet, so she'll probably be prominent in the story at least.

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    VyolynceVyolynce Registered User regular
    KalTorak wrote: »
    one of Liliana's demons is on Amonkhet, so she'll probably be prominent in the story at least.

    Yeah I expected Gideon to be front and center because of his relationship with Gods but learning about Lil's 3rd Demon made her a lock too.

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    initiatefailureinitiatefailure Registered User regular
    That actually is an interesting enough hook for me to retract the previous statement

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    StragintStragint Do Not Gift Always DeclinesRegistered User regular
    edited February 2017
    Does Rings of Brighthearth or Strionic Resonator work with Kaalia's ability?

    Also with Hellkite Charger, if I bring it in with Kaalia can I still activate it's ability or does it need to be declared as an attacker for it to work?

    Stragint on
    PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
    What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak

    I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
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    The BetgirlThe Betgirl I'm Molly! Registered User regular
    Like vyolynce said the problem with vehicles is that they give all your dudes pseudo-haste for more damage, they're overstatted for their cost, and nearly impossible to interact with at sorcery speed. They're not like equipment because a turn usually has to go by before it can be used again after a sweeper- if you have a creature and a vehicle still on board, you're good to go.

    Steam PSN: YerFriendMolly
    ineedmayo.com Eidolon Journal Updated
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    VyolynceVyolynce Registered User regular
    edited February 2017
    Stragint wrote: »
    Does Rings of Brighthearth or Strionic Resonator work with Kaalia's ability?

    Also with Hellkite Charger, if I bring it in with Kaalia can I still activate it's ability or does it need to be declared as an attacker for it to work?

    No, yes, and no/yes, respectively.

    Kaalia's ability is triggered ("when," "whenever," or "at"), not activated ("<cost>: <effect>"). Rings copies activated abilities, Resonator triggered. EDIT: Amusingly, Resonator's own ability is activated and Rings's is triggered, so they can actually copy each other.

    Hellkite needs to be declared as an attacker, as you suspected. It is not an activated ability, it is a triggered ability. You do not pay the cost until the trigger resolves.

    Vyolynce on
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    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    alright, which of you fuckers is responsible for Squiki-Chiki, Acorn Breaker

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    TynnanTynnan seldom correct, never unsure Registered User regular
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    alright, which of you fuckers is responsible for Squiki-Chiki, Acorn Breaker

    Their latest is Corgi Firewalker

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    SnowbearSnowbear Registered User regular
    what online card retailers do you all prefer? Found out that several people at work play and was looking to build some budget modern decks so i can turn cards sideways for the first time in years

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    Dr. FlamingoDr. Flamingo 49 Gilded Disc Perceives the Sun Registered User regular
    TCGPlayer dot com

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    The Escape GoatThe Escape Goat incorrigible ruminant they/themRegistered User regular
    edited February 2017
    so there were a couple of peeps doing w/r humans here, right?

    I wonder if it's possible to go for a more midrangey alpha-strike build that uses odric with all the double strike in aether revolt (scrapper champion and lightning runner, mostly, but solemn recruit might even still be worthwhile even if it's non-human because it seems like just a really solid card for that sort of strat)

    edit: odric even works with needle spires!

    also could use invigorated rampage (or maybe even impetuous devils) to give trample as well

    The Escape Goat on
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    I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    it is not because the thing that makes the deck viable is going as fast as humanly possible

    G/B's turns 4+ are Very Good and you don't want to try to be outpacing them then

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    KalTorakKalTorak One way or another, they all end up in the Undercity.Registered User regular
    TCGPlayer dot com

    yup, going to get the best price from tcgplayer, though it might take a little longer.

    Sometimes I'll go SCG if I'm ordering a big list of cards and I want to be able to get the whole thing from one vendor, or if I'm pre-ordering cards before the price goes up (don't do this), but for a mishmash of cards that you don't need super-urgently, TCGplayer is best.

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    DaebunzDaebunz Registered User regular
    KalTorak wrote: »
    TCGPlayer dot com

    yup, going to get the best price from tcgplayer, though it might take a little longer.

    Sometimes I'll go SCG if I'm ordering a big list of cards and I want to be able to get the whole thing from one vendor, or if I'm pre-ordering cards before the price goes up (don't do this), but for a mishmash of cards that you don't need super-urgently, TCGplayer is best.

    yeah pretty much, also scg has been extremely consistent for me re: shipping times and whatnot so I can generally expect when I'm going to get what I ordered and there aren't any surprises

    so I also would say tcgplayer or starcity depending on what you need

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    The Escape GoatThe Escape Goat incorrigible ruminant they/themRegistered User regular
    so now that we're past the "ugh more eldrazi" phase

    looking back through the EMN cards it's actually a really cool theme, just timed poorly

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    SnowbearSnowbear Registered User regular
    Thanks guys. Appreciate the recommendations

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    The Escape GoatThe Escape Goat incorrigible ruminant they/themRegistered User regular
    wait a sec could renegade rallier return a land?

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    KalTorakKalTorak One way or another, they all end up in the Undercity.Registered User regular
    so now that we're past the "ugh more eldrazi" phase

    looking back through the EMN cards it's actually a really cool theme, just timed poorly

    yeah, like... not to say that some of the disappointment wasn't warranted, but I really like the different flavors of eldrazi corruptions. It fit really well with the double-faced cards that are an integral part of Innistrad, and I'd like to see Emerge return when we see the Eldrazi next (hopefully not for a while though).

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    I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    wait a sec could renegade rallier return a land?

    yes

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    I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
This discussion has been closed.