Werewolf2000adSuckers, I know exactly what went wrong.Registered Userregular
edited October 2016
Looking at those Wikileaks tweets again and seeing how many replies are from people refusing to believe their assurances that Assange hasn't been murdered, I'm reminded once again that one of the most noteable aspects of this election has been people who've built their careers on cultivating distrust, hatred and suspicion in their followers finding it backfiring when their audience starts refusing to believe them, too. I'm remembering an article I read on the internet twenty years ago about "the paranoid theory of history", which observed that the problem with paranoia as a mindset is that you can never prove anything to a paranoid; all you can do is confirm whatever they currently believe. And I'm thinking to myself 'Man, if only you'd known.'
Ive lost all patience for rationales about trump supporters that don't mention foundational, structural white supremacy. It's the dogwhistle made physical form, and if people don't grapple with it, trump-like situations will continue to arise.
and really even if it wasn't there is tons of historical precedent that poor whites will put social status above economic status. sharecroppers were dirt poor regardless of race. but it didn't matter that the white sharecroppers were poor, so long as they could say that they were white and therefore better than the black sharecroppers.
Articles like this act like bigotry in rural America is a symptom of deeper troubles, or a reaction to those dastardly "urban elites." Trust me when I tell you that for large swaths of rural America, the hate is a feature not a bug.
analysis like that often focuses on material or sociological context, believing that everything can be understood by finding its relevant socio-economic "reasons"
insularity and tribalism need not necessary be anchored in a rational understanding of material cause and effect, or a marxist-esque "false consciousness" which is created by a dominant class that distorts perception of such causality.
people want to feel strong, and important, and secure and in control, even if the reality is very different. hate of the Other and and emphasis on group identity provide these qualities
I'm still genuinely puzzled why many wants to vote for Trump.
I would vote in a literal bag of putrid dogshit over him.
I can think of 4 reasons
1. Stupid
2. Ignorant
3. Insane
4. Evil
That's about it.
This type of rhetoric is harmful.
Liberals and progressives must turn the other cheek. You must show love and patience if you want to win any hearts and minds.
Once someone is commited to voting for Trump, considering everything that has happened since the primary, i'm not sure there is anything that can be done.
Either they will pull out their head from their ass on their own, or not, no amount of coddling from the liberals or progressives is going to help.
Nyysjan on
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Indie Winterdie KräheRudi Hurzlmeier (German, b. 1952)Registered Userregular
I no longer really wonder why people vote for/support trump.
One of the last tweets there, "[this country] belongs to white people," really struck a cord with me.
Because I think this election is the end of that notion, at least in terms of the Presidency.
Trump is winning the white vote by an overwhelming majority, yet he is losing. More than that, he is losing badly- talk of a modern Mondale isn't fantasy. This might prove to be something of a watershed moment for Hispanic voters. If certain states (Georgia, Arizona, Texas) flip, then it'll signal a massive shift in the electoral map, one that would basically end realistic chances for a Republican candidate. And we're only a few decades from being a majority minority country.
In many ways, the world that woman was crying about really is coming to an end. Or, if it's not the end, you can see it from here.
You can already see the conservative response, too: the rise in right-wing terrorism, continued attempts to disenfranchise non-whites, and attacks on the legitimacy of our democracy. Like 1964 and 1980, I think 2016 is going to go down as a harbinger for what the next few decades are going to be like, at least as far as the culture wars are concerned.
Werewolf2000adSuckers, I know exactly what went wrong.Registered Userregular
Look, the People Who Are More Righteously Left-Wing Than You have made it quite clear: The poor and the working class can never do anything wrong, and any signs of racism among them is purely a product of economic anxiety. Why, I'll bet that during America's periods of greatest prosperity, there was hardly any racism at all!
Hold on, I'll go check.
Oh.
Oh dear.
can i change my answer
EVERYBODY WANTS TO SIT IN THE BIG CHAIR, MEG!
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KwoaruConfident SmirkFlawless Golden PecsRegistered Userregular
The only way Trump wins is if there's truly some "clown majority" that hasn't been polled and will vote for him all the way.
Cut to the November 8th coverage.
"Pollsters were surprised and frightened as millions of distressed clowns appeared out of forests and swamps around the country today and shuffled their way to voting areas, silent except for the squeak of rubber and occasional honking of horns.
When asked to comment on their sudden appearance after months of avoiding the pre-election opinion polls, one sand faced clown opened his mouth and emitted a buzzing sound like a swarm of bees from which only two words could be made out, 'Vote Trump'"
The line I hear a lot is that people are embarrassed to admit their support for trump in polls because they're worried they'll be shamed for it so the polls are all inaccurate and once those people have the privacy of a voting booth they'll totally vote trump
The line I hear a lot is that people are embarrassed to admit their support for trump in polls because they're worried they'll be shamed for it so the polls are all inaccurate and once those people have the privacy of a voting booth they'll totally vote trump
Which is asinine
That's one of my Dad's lines.
Ugh the road trip the first week of November is going to be a thing
I'm still genuinely puzzled why many wants to vote for Trump.
I would vote in a literal bag of putrid dogshit over him.
Die hard Republican
Single issue voters People who hate Hillary
This
Quite a few of my coworkers have this absolute, undying hatred for Hillary; it doesn't matter what she does or says, they'll always despise her and would rather see anyone else in office.
But none of them vote, so I guess their opinions are negligible :rotate:
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
In the last presidential election, Barack Obama lost the college-educated white voters by 14 points. But now Clinton is winning this same group by about 8.7 points, according to an average of the most recent NBC/Wall Street Journal, CNN/ORC and ABC/Washington Post polls.
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EVERYBODY WANTS TO SIT IN THE BIG CHAIR, MEG!
This type of rhetoric is harmful.
Liberals and progressives must turn the other cheek. You must show love and patience if you want to win any hearts and minds.
Exactly. Like that guy in my middle class Boston suburb with the confederate flag. Round here that flag has nothing to do with Southern Heritage.
analysis like that often focuses on material or sociological context, believing that everything can be understood by finding its relevant socio-economic "reasons"
insularity and tribalism need not necessary be anchored in a rational understanding of material cause and effect, or a marxist-esque "false consciousness" which is created by a dominant class that distorts perception of such causality.
people want to feel strong, and important, and secure and in control, even if the reality is very different. hate of the Other and and emphasis on group identity provide these qualities
I no longer really wonder why people vote for/support trump.
You're better than that, Munkus.
Either they will pull out their head from their ass on their own, or not, no amount of coddling from the liberals or progressives is going to help.
now this
this is right on the money imo
One of the last tweets there, "[this country] belongs to white people," really struck a cord with me.
Because I think this election is the end of that notion, at least in terms of the Presidency.
Trump is winning the white vote by an overwhelming majority, yet he is losing. More than that, he is losing badly- talk of a modern Mondale isn't fantasy. This might prove to be something of a watershed moment for Hispanic voters. If certain states (Georgia, Arizona, Texas) flip, then it'll signal a massive shift in the electoral map, one that would basically end realistic chances for a Republican candidate. And we're only a few decades from being a majority minority country.
In many ways, the world that woman was crying about really is coming to an end. Or, if it's not the end, you can see it from here.
You can already see the conservative response, too: the rise in right-wing terrorism, continued attempts to disenfranchise non-whites, and attacks on the legitimacy of our democracy. Like 1964 and 1980, I think 2016 is going to go down as a harbinger for what the next few decades are going to be like, at least as far as the culture wars are concerned.
I think it goes bit too deep into "both sides bad" territory in places, but it is thought provoking, and also probably mostly correct.
This is actually not true. According to the polls Trump is attracting less of the white vote than Romney did.
http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/trumps-doing-worse-than-romney-did-among-white-voters/
That's the most recent article I can find, and it's from back when Trump was doing a whole lot better in the polls than he is now.
Or if dems get complacent and don't bother voting.
That too.
https://www.paypal.me/hobnailtaylor
Hold on, I'll go check.
Oh.
Oh dear.
can i change my answer
EVERYBODY WANTS TO SIT IN THE BIG CHAIR, MEG!
Or people stay home because the odds say Clinton will win so clearly I don't actually need to go out and vote
In this election of all elections I would think people would want to go out and vote regardless of how well Clinton is going to do or not.
Because to me, at least, this election is more about just getting Clinton to win.
It's about sending a message that people like Trump won't be tolerated as president and that the republican party needs to get its shit together.
https://www.paypal.me/hobnailtaylor
"Pollsters were surprised and frightened as millions of distressed clowns appeared out of forests and swamps around the country today and shuffled their way to voting areas, silent except for the squeak of rubber and occasional honking of horns.
When asked to comment on their sudden appearance after months of avoiding the pre-election opinion polls, one sand faced clown opened his mouth and emitted a buzzing sound like a swarm of bees from which only two words could be made out, 'Vote Trump'"
Which is asinine
http://www.audioentropy.com/
Why would anybody expect Trump supporters to have shame?
This will be here until I receive an apology or Weedlordvegeta get any consequences for being a bully
http://www.fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=16534
That's one of my Dad's lines.
Ugh the road trip the first week of November is going to be a thing
because white, college educated women are decidedly against trump. he'll win the white male vote and nothing else.
This will be here until I receive an apology or Weedlordvegeta get any consequences for being a bully
This
Quite a few of my coworkers have this absolute, undying hatred for Hillary; it doesn't matter what she does or says, they'll always despise her and would rather see anyone else in office.
But none of them vote, so I guess their opinions are negligible :rotate:
The new shortest, most terrifying horror story even written.
16 more days so don't get complacent eh folks
This will be here until I receive an apology or Weedlordvegeta get any consequences for being a bully
college educated whites of both genders who voted for Romney are indicating that they are voting for Clinton instead
http://www.npr.org/2016/08/12/489499596/the-latest-clinton-converts-white-college-educated-voters