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Nintendo Switch: March 3rd 2017

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    RidleySariaRidleySaria AnaheimRegistered User regular
    I'm not being negative, I swear. Just posting the shit that popups on my feed.

    http://nintendowire.com/blog/2017/01/17/switch-wont-netflix-multimedia-functions-launch/
    "According to Nintendo’s Kit Ellis, this is because the Switch is intended to be a “dedicated gaming machine,” and thus won’t have Netflix and other stream services day one."

    How long did it take Wii U to get Netflix?

    Don't be ridiculous. Of course Switch will have Netflix and other streaming services on day one! You just need to use the smart phone app. In fact, Switch already has Netflix. You're so clever, Nintendo!

    -- Switch friend code: 2978-3296-1491 -- PSN: RidleySaria -- Genshin Impact UID: 607033509 --
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    SniperGuySniperGuy SniperGuyGaming Registered User regular
    Entaru wrote: »
    It seems a weird thing to be angry about especially by a group who just a few pages ago were making fun of MS for focusing on TV during the Xbox One reveal.

    I mean Netflix being a pretty standard app on everything is quite different than a TV pass through port that requires your xbox to be on to watch TV.

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    Linespider5Linespider5 ALL HAIL KING KILLMONGER Registered User regular
    By the time you read this, you can probably get Netflix on a toaster. I'm really not concerned about streaming content because

    1) It will come to the Switch eventually

    2) But it will remind people that it can't be used unless on WiFi or docked where an Internet connection is, and this will make people mad that the Switch can't use an LTE connection, etc.

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    RidleySariaRidleySaria AnaheimRegistered User regular
    By the time you read this, you can probably get Netflix on a toaster.

    So what you're saying is that Switch is less advanced than a toaster. ;)

    -- Switch friend code: 2978-3296-1491 -- PSN: RidleySaria -- Genshin Impact UID: 607033509 --
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    CokomonCokomon Our butts are worth fighting for! Registered User regular
    Not having Netflix there on day one just seems like another reminder that this thing is coming in hot.

    Which seems weird, because I thought the reason it is releasing in 2017 anyway was to have things ready to go.

    post.png
    Twitter: Cokomon | dA: Cokomon | Tumblr: Cokomon-art | XBL / NNID / Steam: Cokomon
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    TDawgTDawg Registered User regular
    Honestly, per hour I am pretty sure my WiiU is mostly used as a Netflix / Crunchyroll streaming device. This isn't meant as a slight towards it, just an observed fact: I often curl up in bed with my WiiU tablet streaming something while playing a 3DS game. So not having a streaming app is a bit of a disappointment, but I have little doubt that it'll be released reasonably soon so it is a small concern.

    Wasn't the Wii the first console to get the Netflix app? Crazy times we were living in.

    NNID: ohnoTom || 3DS: 1762-3198-2019 || Steam || Take My Good Pokemon
    Let's Plays of Japanese Games
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    Linespider5Linespider5 ALL HAIL KING KILLMONGER Registered User regular
    Mind you, I'm sure Nintendo is delighted they've made a successor system that they don't have to shell out licensing fees for also being a DVD/Blu Ray player.

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    UnbreakableVowUnbreakableVow Registered User regular
    Talith wrote: »
    Looks like Disgaea 5 is releasing at launch as well. This would be awesome for me if I could somehow obtain a Switch.

    Where are you seeing this about launching with Switch?

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    TalithTalith 変態という名の紳士 Miami, FLRegistered User regular
    Talith wrote: »
    Looks like Disgaea 5 is releasing at launch as well. This would be awesome for me if I could somehow obtain a Switch.

    Where are you seeing this about launching with Switch?

    http://www.rpgsite.net/news/5202-disgaea-5-releasing-with-nintendo-switch-in-japan-and-the-west

    The game is slated for March third in Japan and listed as a spring release elsewhere. NISA is already taking preorders on the collectors edition and I hope that spring release listing is just there because they aren't sure if they can make launch but are definitely trying to.

    7244qyoka3pp.gif
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    NightslyrNightslyr Registered User regular
    I hated LA Noire so much. It's the one game I bought full price at launch that I regret the most.

    The first main character is an unlikable cunt.
    The second main character can't possibly be more of a Marty Stu if he tried.
    There is literally only one correct path through every negeociation and deviation from that costs you.
    The wonderfully recreated city has jack shit to do in it.
    Every chase sequence has you run into countless invisible walls.
    The story has more plot holes in it than swiss cheese.

    And this came after Red Dead Redemption which was fantastic in every way.

    I wonder what the actual vision of the game was originally. Because having an open world with almost nothing to do, and the ending nutjob's backstory presented through missable cutscenes (I missed some newspapers) just strike me as design flaws so egregious that they couldn't have been what people actually wanted from the start. To say nothing of the other issues you mention.

    Am I the only one who felt that the body language aspect of the interrogations became exceedingly counterintuitive as the game went on? Someone would act squirrely, but they'd actually be telling the truth. Someone would act normal, but be lying through their teeth. Now, I expect that kind of realistic variance every now and then, but towards the end it just felt like the game was trolling me. Maybe I just sucked at it, though.

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    vagrant_windsvagrant_winds Overworked Mysterious Eldritch Horror Hunter XX Registered User regular
    Nightslyr wrote: »
    I hated LA Noire so much. It's the one game I bought full price at launch that I regret the most.

    The first main character is an unlikable cunt.
    The second main character can't possibly be more of a Marty Stu if he tried.
    There is literally only one correct path through every negeociation and deviation from that costs you.
    The wonderfully recreated city has jack shit to do in it.
    Every chase sequence has you run into countless invisible walls.
    The story has more plot holes in it than swiss cheese.

    And this came after Red Dead Redemption which was fantastic in every way.

    I wonder what the actual vision of the game was originally. Because having an open world with almost nothing to do, and the ending nutjob's backstory presented through missable cutscenes (I missed some newspapers) just strike me as design flaws so egregious that they couldn't have been what people actually wanted from the start. To say nothing of the other issues you mention.

    Am I the only one who felt that the body language aspect of the interrogations became exceedingly counterintuitive as the game went on? Someone would act squirrely, but they'd actually be telling the truth. Someone would act normal, but be lying through their teeth. Now, I expect that kind of realistic variance every now and then, but towards the end it just felt like the game was trolling me. Maybe I just sucked at it, though.

    The game also trolled you by having you convict, and giving you perfect scores for doing so, people you knew as a player were innocent. And the characters damn well knew it too.

    You were throwing the book at people who could be convicted by evidence you had, not the actual culprits, in the Homicide cases for example.

    // Steam: VWinds // PSN: vagrant_winds //
    // Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
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    jothkijothki Registered User regular
    BlueBlue wrote: »
    eelektrik wrote: »
    Talith wrote: »
    Looks like Disgaea 5 is releasing at launch as well. This would be awesome for me if I could somehow obtain a Switch.

    I have never played Disgaea but having a tactics RPG at launch sounds like a great accompaniment to Breath of the Wild. I will definitely grab it before it becomes impossible to find later too.

    D5 imo is a huge deal - N1 has been porting their games to other systems but not anything current, steam is up to disgaea 2
    as far as I'm concerned, if released at the same time, the switch version will automatically be superior to the playstation version since it can be made portable, which disgaea games lend themselves to very well since they're turn based

    re: can you hop in - sure, they're pretty much self-contained stories though there's typically a lot of cameos, particularly in dlc
    they tutorial you pretty good every time as well

    I've been waiting a long time for them to be willing to let me play their games. I had Disgaea 2 on the PS2, Disgaea 1 on the DS, and Phantom Brave on the Wii, but beyond that they had completely locked me out.

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    UncleSporkyUncleSporky Registered User regular
    Mind you, I'm sure Nintendo is delighted they've made a successor system that they don't have to shell out licensing fees for also being a DVD/Blu Ray player.

    I'm delighted by cartridges.

    Like I know this is old news by now, we got lots of storage on tiny cards. I don't care, there is still no surer sign of living in the future than having this:

    5nIQZ9f.jpg?1

    stored on this:

    ZkzmNaq.jpg?1

    Plus I already got visions of a nice comfy carrying case for the Switch with slots for a dozen or more games across from it.

    Actually the size of the system vs. the size of the cards means we should be pretty good on that front. My current 3DS case only has room for 8 games. The Switch being bigger means I get to carry more games too. :)

    Switch Friend Code: SW - 5443 - 2358 - 9118 || 3DS Friend Code: 0989 - 1731 - 9504 || NNID: unclesporky
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    Linespider5Linespider5 ALL HAIL KING KILLMONGER Registered User regular
    Nightslyr wrote: »
    I hated LA Noire so much. It's the one game I bought full price at launch that I regret the most.

    The first main character is an unlikable cunt.
    The second main character can't possibly be more of a Marty Stu if he tried.
    There is literally only one correct path through every negeociation and deviation from that costs you.
    The wonderfully recreated city has jack shit to do in it.
    Every chase sequence has you run into countless invisible walls.
    The story has more plot holes in it than swiss cheese.

    And this came after Red Dead Redemption which was fantastic in every way.

    I wonder what the actual vision of the game was originally. Because having an open world with almost nothing to do, and the ending nutjob's backstory presented through missable cutscenes (I missed some newspapers) just strike me as design flaws so egregious that they couldn't have been what people actually wanted from the start. To say nothing of the other issues you mention.

    Am I the only one who felt that the body language aspect of the interrogations became exceedingly counterintuitive as the game went on? Someone would act squirrely, but they'd actually be telling the truth. Someone would act normal, but be lying through their teeth. Now, I expect that kind of realistic variance every now and then, but towards the end it just felt like the game was trolling me. Maybe I just sucked at it, though.

    The game also trolled you by having you convict, and giving you perfect scores for doing so, people you knew as a player were innocent. And the characters damn well knew it too.

    You were throwing the book at people who could be convicted by evidence you had, not the actual culprits, in the Homicide cases for example.

    It just really, really, really bothered me that an open world sandbox game would would require an incredibly linear set of specific outcomes in the actual 'game.' There SHOULD have been tiers of cases, and there SHOULD have been multiple ways to solve a case, and so on. They took some remarkable risks making it, and I applaud the efforts, but in practice, too much of it was jarringly inelegant.

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    DritzDritz CanadaRegistered User regular
    Disgaea was great, I was always pretty bummed I never had access to any of the games but the first (on DS). I've been eyeing the second on Steam but my backlog is already so huge and Switch is on the way.

    There I was, 3DS: 2621-2671-9899 (Ekera), Wii U: LostCrescendo
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    Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    the 3ds market is theoretically being rolled into this device as well.

    pokemon is going to come out for it, so that's a big thing.

    aeNqQM9.jpg
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    PROXPROX Registered User regular
    I really liked this persons reaction to the switch:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXV0lJiryJc

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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    disgaea at launch? awesome, I am looking forward to zelda but was somewhat concerned about being out of games I was super excited for by the end of april. disgaea 1 is one of my favorite games ever and I haven't had opportunity to keep up with the series since.

    guaranteed day 1 for me.


    it probably sounds silly but I don't think I've fully internalized and appreciated the fact that any game I get excited for on this system will ALSO be a portable experience. I think true portable gaming is going to become a part of my life in a way it hasn't been since the very first fat DS.

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
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    PeewiPeewi Registered User regular
    Mind you, I'm sure Nintendo is delighted they've made a successor system that they don't have to shell out licensing fees for also being a DVD/Blu Ray player.

    Idunno they probably got done with that when none of their previous console didn't play movie discs either.

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    CokomonCokomon Our butts are worth fighting for! Registered User regular
    Wait, Disgaea is a launch game? Seems like that info should be screamed from the mountaintops. I know it's a port, but it is also the type of game that would keep people busy until other heavy hitters drop.

    post.png
    Twitter: Cokomon | dA: Cokomon | Tumblr: Cokomon-art | XBL / NNID / Steam: Cokomon
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    PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    Well, dang. Tossed in a pre-order on Amazon for a fistful of Switch games, and I completely forgot that I had a Amazon gift card from the holidays.

    ...guess I'm going to have to get more games!

    persona4celestia.jpg
    COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Well, dang. Tossed in a pre-order on Amazon for a fistful of Switch games, and I completely forgot that I had a Amazon gift card from the holidays.

    ...guess I'm going to have to get more games!

    You can also apply a gift card to an already-placed order at any time before it charges/ships.

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    jothkijothki Registered User regular
    I think I'll be picking up a Switch the moment I can walk into a store and buy one without having to worry about any lines.

    I did the same thing with the WiiU, which sadly involved me preordering it a few days before the launch.

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    Linespider5Linespider5 ALL HAIL KING KILLMONGER Registered User regular
    Peewi wrote: »
    Mind you, I'm sure Nintendo is delighted they've made a successor system that they don't have to shell out licensing fees for also being a DVD/Blu Ray player.

    Idunno they probably got done with that when none of their previous console didn't play movie discs either.

    Oh damn. I never owned a WiiU, and, like much about that poor thing, I got the wrong ideas about what it could and couldn't do.

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    Raybies666Raybies666 Registered User regular
    I'm still a little surprised at the internet kerfuffle about the console price. My Xbox One was €300 sure, but it took close to 3 years to hit that price from €500.

    On launch day, a new console being €320 is not some slap in the face, and the expectation that it should be cheaper than said 3 year old Xbox on release day just raises my eyebrow.

    I see the point on the peripherals, but controller prices have been scandalous for a few years now and I'm still not going to buy a second Xbox controller either at the current price (which has also dropped since launch). That's just the way it is now unfortunately.

    The back and forth about paying an online fee seems odd too. We don't know what it will be like or cost yet, and us early adopters will get a free taste and then we'll have a better idea. Expecting Games with Gold right out of the gate seems like a crazy thing to expect, there's few games yet and we should get one or more free forever a month? How would this ever happen? I doubt it'll be two bucks a month but good servers cost money, so they have to charge, and I say that as someone who has had zero issues playing Mario Kart or Splatoon online.

    Don't get me wrong, I won't be paying for a inferior service if it's a similar price to Xbox gold, but can the internet not just chill a little until more details are forthcoming?

    Spoiler: no, have you ever been on the internet before?

    Beat me on Wii U: Raybies
    Beat me on 360: Raybies666

    I remember when I had time to be good at games.
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    MorranMorran Registered User regular
    Anyone know how the Switch reveal was received in Japan? There seem to be general consensus in the west (both media and forums) that the hardware is really nice, but the accessories are too expensive. Also, the SW support is not great.

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    klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    Raybies666 wrote: »
    Expecting Games with Gold right out of the gate seems like a crazy thing to expect, there's few games yet and we should get one or more free forever a month? How would this ever happen?

    With a company with arguably the single greatest library of old games they could give out on the Virtual Console?
    Giving out classic version of games as they release the new version would be a smart move to hype the new releases, too.
    Release Mario Kart 8 while giving out Super Mario Kart, or Mario Kart 64, and so on.

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
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    SpoitSpoit *twitch twitch* Registered User regular
    Iirc, the Japanese launch lineup is significantly better. Disgea at launch instead of the window, two dragon quest games, and some other stuff we're not getting?

    steam_sig.png
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    eelektrikeelektrik Southern CaliforniaRegistered User regular
    edited January 2017
    Honestly I'm getting extremely excited for launch. Breath of the Wild will last a good while and if Disgaea 5 makes launch I will absolutely get it. That's a lot of game to play just between those two.

    The other thing I'm excited to see are PC indies coming to the Switch. I have heard good things about Stardew Valley, Redout, and The Binding of Isaac(Afterbirth+ is launch according to Gamestop) but don't know how much I'd play them on PC. However they sound perfectly suited for portable play.

    If I can pick up Isaac and Disgaea at launch to go with my Switch and Zelda I will be good to go for a long while. At least until games like MK8D, Arms, and Splatoon 2 come out.

    eelektrik on
    (She/Her)
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    shadowaneshadowane Registered User regular
    Any word if there is a good sleep function on this? Obviously pretty important for a portable. I also hope everyone puts a temp save in their game that gets destroyed when you reload it that you can use whenever.

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    klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    I haven't heard anything, but I'd assume a sleep function is covered. Nintendo have been doing those for a while (even putting software sleep mode in most of their GBA games, before they added it to the hardware for DS), they're not going to forget it now.

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
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    Raybies666Raybies666 Registered User regular
    edited January 2017
    klemming wrote: »
    Raybies666 wrote: »
    Expecting Games with Gold right out of the gate seems like a crazy thing to expect, there's few games yet and we should get one or more free forever a month? How would this ever happen?

    With a company with arguably the single greatest library of old games they could give out on the Virtual Console?
    Giving out classic version of games as they release the new version would be a smart move to hype the new releases, too.
    Release Mario Kart 8 while giving out Super Mario Kart, or Mario Kart 64, and so on.

    Games with Gold gives you full retail games though. Thats what would be crazy to expect.

    They will be giving out VC games with the online service (I've heard free for the month, free forever if you keep subscribing, and just free forever, no-one seems to know yet) with online multiplayer added.

    Nintendo has already given discounts on VC games when a new iteration of that franchise releases or just a full retail game when you registered Mario Kart 8. As well as that, the first VC games on Wii U were fifty cents on their month of release. They've been doing close to what you suggested already.

    Raybies666 on
    Beat me on Wii U: Raybies
    Beat me on 360: Raybies666

    I remember when I had time to be good at games.
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    BlueBlueBlueBlue Registered User regular
    Spoit wrote: »
    Iirc, the Japanese launch lineup is significantly better. Disgea at launch instead of the window, two dragon quest games, and some other stuff we're not getting?

    What kind of stuff? I know about waiwai spelunker but that's about it - being region free means it's time to keep an eye out

    CD World Tour status:
    Baidol Voprostein Avraham Thetheroo Taya Zerofill Effef Crimson King Lalabox Mortal Sky ASimPerson Sal Wiet Theidar Tynic Speed Racer Neotoma Goatmon ==>Larlar Munkus Beaver Day of the Bear miscellaneousinsanity Skull Man Delzhand Caulk Bite 6 Somestickguy
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    reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    Raybies666 wrote: »
    I'm still a little surprised at the internet kerfuffle about the console price. My Xbox One was €300 sure, but it took close to 3 years to hit that price from €500.

    On launch day, a new console being €320 is not some slap in the face, and the expectation that it should be cheaper than said 3 year old Xbox on release day just raises my eyebrow.

    The flaw with this logic is that there is no cosmic New Peripheral Standard that new hardware gets compared to, new hardware gets compared to what is out there right now. PS4 and Xbone can both be had for cheaper than the Switch, and there's a lot more games out for them to buy right now.

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    PeewiPeewi Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    Raybies666 wrote: »
    Expecting Games with Gold right out of the gate seems like a crazy thing to expect, there's few games yet and we should get one or more free forever a month? How would this ever happen?

    With a company with arguably the single greatest library of old games they could give out on the Virtual Console?
    Giving out classic version of games as they release the new version would be a smart move to hype the new releases, too.
    Release Mario Kart 8 while giving out Super Mario Kart, or Mario Kart 64, and so on.

    When Mario Kart 8 originally came out, you got a discount on the eShop if you owned Super Mario Kart, effectively letting you get SMK for free. I don't think they've done anything like this since, but it is clearly something they're aware that they could do.

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    mojojoeomojojoeo A block off the park, living the dream.Registered User regular
    Mind you, I'm sure Nintendo is delighted they've made a successor system that they don't have to shell out licensing fees for also being a DVD/Blu Ray player.

    I'm delighted by cartridges.

    Like I know this is old news by now, we got lots of storage on tiny cards. I don't care, there is still no surer sign of living in the future than having this:

    5nIQZ9f.jpg?1

    stored on this:

    ZkzmNaq.jpg?1

    Plus I already got visions of a nice comfy carrying case for the Switch with slots for a dozen or more games across from it.

    Actually the size of the system vs. the size of the cards means we should be pretty good on that front. My current 3DS case only has room for 8 games. The Switch being bigger means I get to carry more games too. :)

    another point- carts dont require installs to play. ever.

    re- case. Nintendo's accessories pricing is doodoo. However. Their bag has what you just asked for and comes with a screen protector for 20. i was shocked by thier valuation of that compared to the rest.

    Chief Wiggum: "Ladies, please. All our founding fathers, astronauts, and World Series heroes have been either drunk or on cocaine."
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    UncleSporkyUncleSporky Registered User regular
    edited January 2017
    klemming wrote: »
    Raybies666 wrote: »
    Expecting Games with Gold right out of the gate seems like a crazy thing to expect, there's few games yet and we should get one or more free forever a month? How would this ever happen?

    With a company with arguably the single greatest library of old games they could give out on the Virtual Console?
    Giving out classic version of games as they release the new version would be a smart move to hype the new releases, too.
    Release Mario Kart 8 while giving out Super Mario Kart, or Mario Kart 64, and so on.

    I'm not sure their library is as extensive or desirable as you might think.

    There are only about 50 SNES games on Wii U VC for example, and that's likely all they have access to. Quite a few third parties didn't come back for Wii U VC, and remaining unreleased first party games are mostly tied up in licensing issues. Similar situations apply to most of their VC platforms.

    If they only gave out one SNES game a month that you got to keep, they'd be completely out of SNES games in about 4 years. Every Switch subscriber would have every SNES game, both the good and the bad ones. And where do they go from there? Other VC platforms, sure, but then later subscribers would never get a SNES game, because it'd be a slap in the face to offer them again to people who already own them. And assuming they have their VC stuff figured out, maybe they'd own those games not just for the Switch, but for all future platforms as well - Nintendo would never sell another SNES VC game to those people. Heck they wouldn't sell any as monthly distribution was going on either, because people would think to themselves "hey, I'm going to get it for free later anyway."

    Suppose the dream comes true and they have VC figured out right now, and we don't have to pay a fee to transfer from Wii U to Switch. You just own all previous VC. What if you bought a dozen SNES VC games? There's a 12/50 chance that every month is a wasted month for you. You could go a year with no games to show for it.

    Among those 50 SNES games are also 3 different versions of Street Fighter 2. Picture the online discussion the month they hand out Hyper Fighting when base Street Fighter 2 was only given out a year prior...and people already bought Switch's new Ultra Street Fighter 2.

    Picture them giving out NES games and the discussion for the month they give out Mappy-Land. Or The Adventures of Bayou Billy.

    If they decided to give out an N64 VC game each month, everyone would own all of them in about a year and a half.


    None of the above is a defense of the VC "rental" as a great idea. I'm just identifying some of the issues if they decided to go a different route.

    What they really need is a huge raft of indie games that they can hand out for free to keep, plain and simple. It's going to be a while before they have that, considering Switch is a clean break from Wii U and its architecture, but that's what they need to be able to offer in addition to the monthly VC rental. Needs to be like PS+ in that regard.

    UncleSporky on
    Switch Friend Code: SW - 5443 - 2358 - 9118 || 3DS Friend Code: 0989 - 1731 - 9504 || NNID: unclesporky
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    klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    I'm fine with the carts solution (it makes sense when you're on a portable battery, anyway), but I wonder how this is going to work with digital downloads. I know you can expand with micro SD cards, but depending on the game size, this could be a costly way to do it. Games like Skyrim can't be that small, how many can you fit on a reasonably priced card?

    I'd love it if they could do an iTunes thing where you can download the games onto your PC, then transfer the ones you want onto the Switch.

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
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    LindLind Registered User regular
    So one question. The physical games come on "carts" fine. But do you do an install or is it just plug and play?

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    SniperGuySniperGuy SniperGuyGaming Registered User regular
    mojojoeo wrote: »
    Mind you, I'm sure Nintendo is delighted they've made a successor system that they don't have to shell out licensing fees for also being a DVD/Blu Ray player.

    I'm delighted by cartridges.

    Like I know this is old news by now, we got lots of storage on tiny cards. I don't care, there is still no surer sign of living in the future than having this:

    5nIQZ9f.jpg?1

    stored on this:

    ZkzmNaq.jpg?1

    Plus I already got visions of a nice comfy carrying case for the Switch with slots for a dozen or more games across from it.

    Actually the size of the system vs. the size of the cards means we should be pretty good on that front. My current 3DS case only has room for 8 games. The Switch being bigger means I get to carry more games too. :)

    another point- carts dont require installs to play. ever.

    re- case. Nintendo's accessories pricing is doodoo. However. Their bag has what you just asked for and comes with a screen protector for 20. i was shocked by thier valuation of that compared to the rest.

    Why would you think a cart wouldn't require an install?

This discussion has been closed.