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Xorn was a Skrull all along! (Retcon Thread)

245

Posts

  • BlankspaceBlankspace __BANNED USERS
    edited July 2007
    Yeah, that was retconned out.


    I'm like 95% sure.

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  • Bad KarmaBad Karma Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Completely forgotten.

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  • HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User
    edited July 2007
    I don't see why they can't just say that the Nightcrawler stuff didn't happen.

    Editor's Note: None of that happened. We now return you to your regularly scheduled origin.

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  • DarkWarriorDarkWarrior __BANNED USERS
    edited July 2007
    Isn't Batmans entire current history a retcon?

    ...it's in the shape of a giant c**k.
  • AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Isn't Batmans entire current history a retcon?

    Every DC character is

    There was thing called Crisis on Infinite Earths. It reset everything

    You may have heard of it

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  • DarkWarriorDarkWarrior __BANNED USERS
    edited July 2007
    That hapenned before Miller?

    ...it's in the shape of a giant c**k.
  • MunchMunch Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Blackjack wrote: »
    Skullo wrote: »
    retcon you're all for?

    I would be all for bringing Stephanie Brown back to life/making it so she was never actually dead.

    Speaking of shitty retcons, turning kindly old Leslie Thompkins into a murderous, petty cunt who'd let a teenager die after being tortured for hours, just to prove a point to Batman, was possibly one of the worst things ever committed to paper in the last decade of comics.

  • AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    That hapenned before Miller?

    :|

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  • BlankspaceBlankspace __BANNED USERS
    edited July 2007
    Algertman wrote: »
    That hapenned before Miller?

    :|
    To expand on Algertman's :|,


    Yes, it was before Miller. COIE basically rebooted the DC Universe, so the characters origins had to be re-told. John Byrne did a Superman: Man of Steel miniseries and Miller did Batman: Year One.

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  • Bad KarmaBad Karma Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Bad retcon gone good -

    John Byrne's Doom Patrol.

    He wiped out their entire history. Along came Infinite Crisis and boom...history restored.


    Take it..bitch. Go scribble something.

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  • BlankspaceBlankspace __BANNED USERS
    edited July 2007
    It's really sad how John Byrne has fallen.

    I mean, he did some fantastic stuff. Fantastic Four, Superman: Man of Steel, She-Hulk, X-Men.


    Now, he's really not good at all.

    The last good thing I can think of that he's done is Hellboy, and he was working with Mignola and it was only for the first story.

    SIG.gif
  • AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Byrne got old and bitter

    he saw all those youngs guys do their thing and make money hand over fist in the 90's and he was left in the dust.

    PSN; AlbertBOMB
  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Super Moderator, Moderator mod
    edited July 2007
    From Byrne's forum a day or two ago - I should emphasize that this is 100% not sarcastic:
    Grant Morrison seems to be one of these writers who put a high priority on "fun" and "telling good stories" instead of actually RESPECTING the characters and their creators' original vision. It's indicative of a real sickness at the heart of today's comic books that someone like that would be hired to write one of the Lee/Kirby creations.

    o_O

    The sad thing is, Byrne has actually done one or two good retcons. His Man of Steel introduced suave businessman Lex Luthor, which was such an improvement on the fat mad scientist that it's pretty much been enshrined in permanent canon, and the West Coast Avengers run where he messed around with the Vision/android Human Torch's origin was also pretty cool at the time. (On the other hand, around the same time he was retconning Vision and Wanda's marriage out of existence in spectacularly retarded fashion, so...)

  • SkulloSkullo Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    From Byrne's forum a day or two ago - I should emphasize that this is 100% not sarcastic:
    Grant Morrison seems to be one of these writers who put a high priority on "fun" and "telling good stories" instead of actually RESPECTING the characters and their creators' original vision. It's indicative of a real sickness at the heart of today's comic books that someone like that would be hired to write one of the Lee/Kirby creations.

    o_O

    The sad thing is, Byrne has actually done one or two good retcons. His Man of Steel introduced suave businessman Lex Luthor, which was such an improvement on the fat mad scientist that it's pretty much been enshrined in permanent canon, and the West Coast Avengers run where he messed around with the Vision/android Human Torch's origin was also pretty cool at the time. (On the other hand, around the same time he was retconning Vision and Wanda's marriage out of existence in spectacularly retarded fashion, so...)

    Dear lord, you mean I might actually LIKE a comic book for being GOOD? I hope that day never comes!

    I'm all for respecting the characters, but I don't think that it's disrepectful to have them appear in GOOD stories. Poor guy, gettin' old and mixed up.

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  • HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Now I have my suspicions that it was John Byrne who killed Morrison's cat.

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  • BriareosBriareos Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Batman: Year One is current continuity? I didn't realize that. I mean, it's the definitive Batman story and all, but I thought all the original Bob Kane stuff was still his true origin. Not as if it matters. Batman's origin is really just "parents murdered in front of him." None of the other details are really that important.

    How about Long Halloween and Dark Victory? Are those considered current continuity also? After all, Loeb was deliberately following up on the Year One Batman.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User
    edited July 2007
    It's worth pointing out that Bob Kane initially wrote a Batman who didn't have a problem killing criminals, so the original stuff is most definitely out of continuity.

    Meanwhile, the classic Batman we're most familiar with came about through editorial mandate demanding nicer characters.

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  • SkulloSkullo Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Didn't he carry a gun in his first appearances also?

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  • HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Skullo wrote: »
    Didn't he carry a gun in his first appearances also?

    Certainly more than a few times during that relatively brief era.

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  • SkulloSkullo Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Man, speaking of Batman, I thought HUSH was pretty cool. But I thought changing all that stuff in the final fight to ACTUALLY being Jason was obnoxiously lame. Grr.

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  • SASA Registered User
    edited July 2007
    The whole Magneto/Xorn being influenced by Kick making him crazy thing actually goes deeper than that.

    In 'Here Comes Tomorrow' it is revealed that Kick was a way of being infected by the sentient organism, Sublime.

    So really it was Sublime who possessed Magneto/Xorn into doing those awful things.


    I wonder if Sublime will ever be revisited because he was revealed to be the underlying villian in Morrison's run. (His human form John Sublime was the leader of the U-Men, there were connections to Weapon Plus, Kick influenced Quenton Quire, the Omega Gang, and Xorn.)

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  • graizurgraizur __BANNED USERS
    edited July 2007
    Days of Future Now was incredibly meh. I say incredible because the pencils, inks and coloring was so popping but the story went no where fast. I say fast because a bunch of characters showed up all changed and futuristic but none of it mattered. I say none of it mattered because just like X-men: The End, it didn't really pull together a bunch of stories or show much of the rest of the Marvel U.

    robosagogo wrote: »
    Finally, an Apocalyptian-American superhero. I've been waiting so long.
  • HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User
    edited July 2007
    John Sublime's a possible cause of M-Day. I mean, give Scarlet Witch some Kick...

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  • ServoServo Super Moderator, Moderator, ClubPA mod
    edited July 2007
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    From Byrne's forum a day or two ago - I should emphasize that this is 100% not sarcastic:
    Grant Morrison seems to be one of these writers who put a high priority on "fun" and "telling good stories" instead of actually RESPECTING the characters and their creators' original vision. It's indicative of a real sickness at the heart of today's comic books that someone like that would be hired to write one of the Lee/Kirby creations.

    o_O

    The sad thing is, Byrne has actually done one or two good retcons. His Man of Steel introduced suave businessman Lex Luthor, which was such an improvement on the fat mad scientist that it's pretty much been enshrined in permanent canon, and the West Coast Avengers run where he messed around with the Vision/android Human Torch's origin was also pretty cool at the time. (On the other hand, around the same time he was retconning Vision and Wanda's marriage out of existence in spectacularly retarded fashion, so...)

    haha

    i had to read that twice. did lewis carrol write it? it's like literary nonsense. 'FUN characters and GOOD stories are NOT WHAT COMCIS ARE ABOUT! the GREEN revenge UNCLED regularly!'

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  • FencingsaxFencingsax Bondage Discipline Spider-Man Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    John Sublime's a possible cause of M-Day. I mean, give Scarlet Witch some Kick...
    Someone gave Wanda extreme power, which is what drove her insane, which basically caused everything up to and including Civil War (and thus, the initiative and what is happening currently), indirectly.

    It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it
  • HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    John Sublime's a possible cause of M-Day. I mean, give Scarlet Witch some Kick...
    Someone gave Wanda extreme power, which is what drove her insane, which basically caused everything up to and including Civil War (and thus, the initiative and what is happening currently), indirectly.

    Well, yeah, and that person could have been Sublime.

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  • ServoServo Super Moderator, Moderator, ClubPA mod
    edited July 2007
    i think that's what he's saying

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  • HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Servo wrote: »
    i think that's what he's saying
    Honestly, I don't know what Muffin Man was trying to say. Was he reiterating my point in greater detail? If so, why omit Sublime's name and say "someone"?

    That was the only response that seemed appropriate.

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  • FencingsaxFencingsax Bondage Discipline Spider-Man Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Servo wrote: »
    i think that's what he's saying
    Honestly, I don't know what Muffin Man was trying to say. Was he reiterating my point in greater detail? If so, why omit Sublime's name and say "someone"?

    That was the only response that seemed appropriate.
    Well, I agree that it could have been Kick and Sublime, but since her father went through that whole thing, it would seem to be somewhat derivative if Wanda went through that as well. Although Pietro is going through something else (that family's luck really sucks) so maybe Wanda was administered Kick, although I don't think it would be voluntary.

    It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it
  • ServoServo Super Moderator, Moderator, ClubPA mod
    edited July 2007
    i feel like sublime just chose kick because it was a convenient way to get to a lot of random mutants over an extended period of time. i think if he had just one person in mind, he could infect them without them using kick.

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  • HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    Servo wrote: »
    i think that's what he's saying
    Honestly, I don't know what Muffin Man was trying to say. Was he reiterating my point in greater detail? If so, why omit Sublime's name and say "someone"?

    That was the only response that seemed appropriate.
    Well, I agree that it could have been Kick and Sublime, but since her father went through that whole thing, it would seem to be somewhat derivative if Wanda went through that as well. Although Pietro is going through something else (that family's luck really sucks) so maybe Wanda was administered Kick, although I don't think it would be voluntary.

    This is the retcon thread, so it'd be a retcon.

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  • ServoServo Super Moderator, Moderator, ClubPA mod
    edited July 2007
    it doesn't seem so much derivative as it seems like a good plan on sublime's part.

    'hm, a family with two of the most powerful mutants on the world. i should probably just take over one of them. but which one? think, sublime, think!'

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  • BalefuegoBalefuego Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Wanda wasn't talking to hallucinations of her kids, she was talking to Skrulls posing as them.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • DouglasDangerDouglasDanger Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Skullo wrote: »
    Man, speaking of Batman, I thought HUSH was pretty cool. But I thought changing all that stuff in the final fight to ACTUALLY being Jason was obnoxiously lame. Grr.


    I thought the return of Jason Todd could have been really awesome, but it has been really dumb. I really wanted it to be a big conspiracy thing by a bunch of Bat-rogues and maybe Lex Luthor... involving Ra's and Deathstroke and Deadshot and David Cain and so on finding Jason, training him and brainwashing him and stuff, instead of Super-boy punched reality, lol... He also went from a badass dirty vigilante to a guy who gets kicked in the junk a lot...

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  • The Muffin ManThe Muffin Man Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Servo wrote: »
    i think that's what he's saying
    Honestly, I don't know what Muffin Man was trying to say. Was he reiterating my point in greater detail? If so, why omit Sublime's name and say "someone"?

    That was the only response that seemed appropriate.

    Wait, what did I say?

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  • delphinusdelphinus Registered User
    edited July 2007
    terrible retcon: Thanos' marvel universe the end:

    God Thanos (higher than living tribunal in power):" no living being shall come back from the dead from this day forth...."

    so much for that idea, as thanos sacrifices himself and his highest form of godhood to keep people in marvel universe from coming back from the dead, only for he himself to come back from the dead in annihilation several months following

  • DeicistDeicist Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    delphinus wrote: »
    terrible retcon: Thanos' marvel universe the end:

    God Thanos (higher than living tribunal in power):" no living being shall come back from the dead from this day forth...."

    so much for that idea, as thanos sacrifices himself and his highest form of godhood to keep people in marvel universe from coming back from the dead, only for he himself to come back from the dead in annihilation several months following


    Yes, and if that series (marvel: the end) was in the same continuity as Annihilation you might have a point.

    Thanos is as nothing before the power of wiki

  • SalmonOfDoubtSalmonOfDoubt Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    My favourite retcon was when all that stuff about the Punisher dying and being resurrected as an instrument of heavenly wrath and retribution was explained away in about two pages by Ennis.

    "Tried it for a while. Didn't like it. Told them where to shove it."

    Also, Winter Soldier. When I first heard of it, I thought it was damn stupid. Then when I actually read the story I found myself really liking the character, especially the CW stuff he popped up in.

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  • delphinusdelphinus Registered User
    edited July 2007
    can someone explain to me how winter soldier was a retcon? i saw him in civil war issues working with fury, and i thought that was pretty freakin cool, him being a super ultra secret agent.

    in Ultimate alliance it makes him seem like he was a 4th-tier villain in cap's rogues gallery. that and he was angry at cap for some reason. did he have a change of heart?

  • BlankspaceBlankspace __BANNED USERS
    edited July 2007
    Well, Winter Soldier is Bucky, who was Cap's partner in WWII. Bucky died way back when, and he stayed dead for decades.

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