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Xorn was a Skrull all along! (Retcon Thread)

124

Posts

  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Super Moderator, Moderator mod
    edited July 2007
    Man, I never thought I'd be nostalgic for the reign of Bill Jemas, but there it is.

  • FellhandFellhand Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    I don't like what they did with the whole Galactus/Abaraxes thing. I liked in the late 80s or 90s when they had said that after enough time Galactus would become a celestial.

  • AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    Man, I never thought I'd be nostalgic for the reign of Bill Jemas, but there it is.

    Shooter FTW!

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  • RingoRingo Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Skullo wrote: »
    Man, speaking of Batman, I thought HUSH was pretty cool. But I thought changing all that stuff in the final fight to ACTUALLY being Jason was obnoxiously lame. Grr.


    I thought the return of Jason Todd could have been really awesome, but it has been really dumb. I really wanted it to be a big conspiracy thing by a bunch of Bat-rogues and maybe Lex Luthor... involving Ra's and Deathstroke and Deadshot and David Cain and so on finding Jason, training him and brainwashing him and stuff, instead of Super-boy punched reality, lol... He also went from a badass dirty vigilante to a guy who gets kicked in the junk a lot...


    I swear to god, anytime I decide to give a new character (or the new look for the character) a chance terrible things happen to them.

    If it's DC they seem to immediately backpedal on anything that made the character readable or interesting (Bat Kids, I'm looking at YOU) and if it's Marvel, they character's dead within a year. Bleargh.



    ...Oh shit, I'd better stop buying Nova and Iron Fist....

    ceres wrote: »
    I'm just going to go ahead and lock this thread before I feel any worse about humanity.
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  • KreutzKreutz Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Bloods End wrote: »
    Joon wrote: »
    Skullo wrote: »
    Didn't he carry a gun in his first appearances also?

    Certainly more than a few times during that relatively brief era.

    I saw one panel on these boards before with an early Batman shooting a sleeping vampire. Just say "fuck it" to all the garlic, stake, and cross bullshit and shoot the guy while he's sleeping.

    But seriously

    FUCK vampires

    Yeah, in the early days, Batman and Robin were a little closer to the Punisher than they are now. I read this one story that featured the Bat-Gyro(copter), and Batman lasso'd some thug around the neck and broke his neck from 200 feet. I think the body was dropped on the front steps of GCPD.

    Now that is how get shit done.

    Man, if Batman still did that shit, I'd start reading DC again. The whole golden-age morality attached to the character (and most DC characters in general) is one of the major things I don't care for as far as DC is concerned. That, and the huge Crisis retcons.

  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Super Moderator, Moderator mod
    edited July 2007
    Algertman wrote: »
    Shooter FTW!
    Limed so fucking hard.

    He may have been an abrasive, unpopular personality, but I recently read some old interviews with him and he sounds, by far, like the most grown-up person in the business. And one of the reasons he was unpopular was because he insisted on keeping characters accessible to new readers and aimed at a youth market - and if creators wanted to do more adult work, he offered them titles at Epic, often at a loss for Marvel, because he figured letting them blow off some steam in a graphic novel was better than having their sexual hangups or pet political causes or whatever show up in an issue of Spider-Man.

    Lo and behold, twenty years later we have Norman Osborn's O-face and most of Marvel's titles are selling below what would have been cancellation levels in the 80s. I mean, I know correlation isn't causation, but still. Hmmm.

  • Calamity JaneCalamity Jane That Wrong Love Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Liming is a bit cliche, man.

    I think the worst retcon lately is the senseless resurrection of Captain Marvel (Marvel). Why the fuck does he exist?

  • BlankspaceBlankspace __BANNED USERS
    edited July 2007
    Anjin-San wrote: »
    Liming is a bit cliche, man.

    I think the worst retcon lately is the senseless resurrection of Captain Marvel (Marvel). Why the fuck does he exist?
    Not a retcon. He still dies in bed of cancer.
    BR: Ahhh, there's the thing that I think makes Captain Marvel interesting in today's Marvel Universe -- this isn't a resurrection. He is most certainly not "back from the dead". What we're seeing is Captain Marvel propelled into the future and witnessing what the world will become after he is gone.

    Captain Marvel still dies of cancer, lying there in his bed on Titan, with all the other heroes gathered around him. And he stays good and dead after that.

    SIG.gif
  • BogartBogart MR. Lady Anime Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    New entry for worst ever retcon is Jeph Loeb's new Wolverine origin. He and Creed are descended from an ancient race of cat-people, and are forever fated to fight each other because they have different-coloured hair. Yes, really.

    The X-Axis review is hysterically funny and absolutely accurate in every respect - Here.

  • BlackjackBlackjack Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    I suppose the most interesting thing about that retcon is wondering whether future writers will just ignore it or actually reretcon it.

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  • BogartBogart MR. Lady Anime Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    God knows. I just don't get why so many writers think that Logan needs more origin stories. He has two pretty good ones in Origin and the original Weapon X. One covers his mutation and one covers the adamantium. What else do you need? And yet here we are with both Wolverine titles shovelling yet more garbage continuity into his past.

  • MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    I originally disliked the Green Lantern: Rebirth storyline. I liked having Hal back, but the fear bug shit felt like a cop-out to me.

    Of course, the Sinestro War stuff they've been doing, what with all the new spectrums, has retconned the retcon into something far more awesome.

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  • hoodie13hoodie13 Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Bogart wrote: »
    New entry for worst ever retcon is Jeph Loeb's new Wolverine origin. He and Creed are descended from an ancient race of cat-people, and are forever fated to fight each other because they have different-coloured hair. Yes, really.

    The X-Axis review is hysterically funny and absolutely accurate in every respect - Here.
    What.

    Edit: Jesus.

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  • ServoServo Super Moderator, Moderator, ClubPA mod
    edited August 2007
    Bogart wrote: »
    God knows. I just don't get why so many writers think that Logan needs more origin stories. He has two pretty good ones in Origin and the original Weapon X. One covers his mutation and one covers the adamantium. What else do you need? And yet here we are with both Wolverine titles shovelling yet more garbage continuity into his past.

    well, i wish it was a situation where just every once in a while in his solo title, you'd get a story set in 1934 or something. that would be way more interesting and fun than having all the answers laid out in this series over here

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  • FuruFuru Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Bogart wrote: »
    New entry for worst ever retcon is Jeph Loeb's new Wolverine origin. He and Creed are descended from an ancient race of cat-people, and are forever fated to fight each other because they have different-coloured hair. Yes, really.

    The X-Axis review is hysterically funny and absolutely accurate in every respect - Here.

    Holy Shit

    What the...oh my god...that's...

    saiyan2.jpg
  • The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    ...

    yeah, I can't even say anything more than that.

    what the hell?

  • AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I can

    Fuck Loeb

    PSN; AlbertBOMB
  • The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    See, I can't just say Fuck Loeb.

    Because you know, editors let him do the story.

    No one told him how bad of an idea it was.

    There is a lot of blame to be passed here.

  • FuruFuru Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    See, I can't just say Fuck Loeb.

    Because you know, editors let him do the story.

    No one told him how bad of an idea it was.

    There is a lot of blame to be passed here.

    You know how in Murder on the Orient Express it turns out all the suspects killed the victim?

    That's what this comic is.

    saiyan2.jpg
  • GigatonGigaton Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Furu wrote: »
    See, I can't just say Fuck Loeb.

    Because you know, editors let him do the story.

    No one told him how bad of an idea it was.

    There is a lot of blame to be passed here.

    You know how in Murder on the Orient Express it turns out all the suspects killed the victim?

    That's what this comic is.

    Didn't CSI rip off that idea for one of their episodes? Something about almost everyone on the plane doing something to contribute to kill the guy and they all end up getting away with it?

  • FuruFuru Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Gigaton wrote: »
    Furu wrote: »
    See, I can't just say Fuck Loeb.

    Because you know, editors let him do the story.

    No one told him how bad of an idea it was.

    There is a lot of blame to be passed here.

    You know how in Murder on the Orient Express it turns out all the suspects killed the victim?

    That's what this comic is.

    Didn't CSI rip off that idea for one of their episodes? Something about almost everyone on the plane doing something to contribute to kill the guy and they all end up getting away with it?

    It's all in turn ripped off an old Chinese folktale to begin with.

    saiyan2.jpg
  • BogartBogart MR. Lady Anime Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Servo wrote: »
    well, i wish it was a situation where just every once in a while in his solo title, you'd get a story set in 1934 or something. that would be way more interesting and fun than having all the answers laid out in this series over here

    I think I know what you mean, and there's absolutely nothing stopping writers from doing that. They have pretty much any period between Origins (late 1800's?) and today in which they can set a Wolvie story, and still asshole after asshole instead does another fucking addition/complication to his origin or another retcon of an existing story. There should be a ten-year ban on stories where he goes back to a Weapon X lab, or discovers that Siver Fox was/wasn't dead like he thought last time, or in which he suddenly remembers shit even though he's supposed to have gotten all his memories back in House of M. And the Origins ongoing should be taken out behind Marvel's woodshed and discreetly shot because damn that's a fucking terrible comic.

  • Mr_RoseMr_Rose Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    With a bit of luck this whole thing will turn out to be yet another head game and we can all get on with our lives after we find out who's screwing with Logan's mind for no very good reason again...

    It's like someone said "hey, that animé shit sells bucket loads of comics, what do they have that we don't?" and instead of the correct answer (which is "well, they appeal to a totally different market segment in terms of both art ans storytelling style, also they tend to be Japanese") the answer came back "cat-people!" Because the man named wolverine must clearly be descended from cat-people. :rolleyes:

    That and there's so much potential in the WWII-era for stories; Captain America became Cap during the war and ol' Chuck was around back then and walking, not to mention Magneto in his youthful prime...

    ...because dragons are AWESOME! That's why.
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  • AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I think Ennis could do an amazing Wolverine WWII story

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  • BogartBogart MR. Lady Anime Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    If only he didn't hate Wolverine with the power of a thousand suns.

  • Bloods EndBloods End Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Mr_Rose wrote: »
    With a bit of luck this whole thing will turn out to be yet another head game and we can all get on with our lives after we find out who's screwing with Logan's mind for no very good reason again...

    It's like someone said "hey, that animé shit sells bucket loads of comics, what do they have that we don't?" and instead of the correct answer (which is "well, they appeal to a totally different market segment in terms of both art ans storytelling style, also they tend to be Japanese") the answer came back "cat-people!" Because the man named wolverine must clearly be descended from cat-people. :rolleyes:

    That and there's so much potential in the WWII-era for stories; Captain America became Cap during the war and ol' Chuck was around back then and walking, not to mention Magneto in his youthful prime...

    I'm pretty sure Magneto was getting Holocausted...Holocast...Holocausterized during that time. And Xavier was a baby.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • SpeedySwafSpeedySwaf Registered User
    edited August 2007
    Gigaton wrote: »
    Furu wrote: »
    See, I can't just say Fuck Loeb.

    Because you know, editors let him do the story.

    No one told him how bad of an idea it was.

    There is a lot of blame to be passed here.

    You know how in Murder on the Orient Express it turns out all the suspects killed the victim?

    That's what this comic is.

    Didn't CSI rip off that idea for one of their episodes? Something about almost everyone on the plane doing something to contribute to kill the guy and they all end up getting away with it?

    I remember that episode. Essentially the guy didn't have any of his medication, and was suffering from some kind of mental breakdown, becoming violent and a little crazy. He attempted to open up the door leading outside (where "outside" is thousands of feet up in the air) causing everyone to panic and rush over to beat the crap out of him, which ended up killing him.

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  • Bloods EndBloods End Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    When stuff like Loeb's Wolverine, and Jone's Nightwing get published, you have to start wondering about what stories were thrown out, or if the editors are even still alive.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • SpeedySwafSpeedySwaf Registered User
    edited August 2007
    Bloods End wrote: »
    When stuff like Loeb's Wolverine, and Jone's Nightwing get published, you have to start wondering about what stories were thrown out, or if the editors are even still alive.

    Maybe they were replaced by Skrulls?

    Deguello wrote:
    Nintendo set up a DS buffet and all the third parties went to the PSP Diner. The Diner came down with a case of botulism and everybody wonders why Nintendo is fat when they return.
  • ScooterScooter Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    That review actually has a very scary point. That story was worse than a lot of Austen's work. It's worse than the Nightcrawler retcon, because that one at least mostly fit, other than the angels/demons thing, it just messed with the character. This one messes with a ton of characters and doesn't fit with anything at all.

  • IrohIroh Registered User
    edited August 2007
    I actually let myself be strung along and bought all six issues because I like to collect in whole arcs. Bianchi's pencils really soften the blow, but the story is forgettable and probably won't ever be referenced again.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
  • Caveman PawsCaveman Paws Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    If they were smart they would just say that every "offical story of Wolverine's past" up to this point have just been illusions created by Loki. Why? Because Loki is a total dick.

    In the end Wolverine is just a very long lived mutant with a healing factor, his claws and metal skeleton came from the Weapon X project. The process was long and stupidly painful and so Logan's mind was damaged and his past forgotten.

    Is his real name Logan? No he just thought it sounded cool and would help him get laid, he is after all only 5'3!

    End of fucking story.

  • IrohIroh Registered User
    edited August 2007
    Fuck, I just figured it out; Loeb was writing bad Highlander fan fiction.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Iroh wrote: »
    Fuck, I just figured it out; Loeb was writing bad Highlander fan fiction.

    that's so terrible a theory it fits perfectly

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  • DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Bogart wrote: »
    If only he didn't hate Wolverine with the power of a thousand suns.

    But maybe thats what would make it worth reading?

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  • AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Doodmann wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    If only he didn't hate Wolverine with the power of a thousand suns.

    But maybe thats what would make it worth reading?

    exactly, Ennis is a war buff. He would handle the WWII aspect of it perfectly, plus he wouldn't write Wolverine as some unbeatable god that he's be shown as.

    PSN; AlbertBOMB
  • Mr_RoseMr_Rose Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Doodmann wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    If only he didn't hate Wolverine with the power of a thousand suns.

    But maybe that's what would make it worth reading?

    But how could anyone hate Wolverine? He's such an adorable little scamp...:P

    Actually, Wolverine turning out to be an Immortal would be kinda so-stupid-it's-awesome though. I mean, it's not as if the Highlander timeline could get any more fucked up anyway, plus built in swords and an adamantium spine would make him pretty much the guaranteed champion... But would he accept the Prize?

    ...because dragons are AWESOME! That's why.
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  • BogartBogart MR. Lady Anime Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Algertman wrote: »
    exactly, Ennis is a war buff. He would handle the WWII aspect of it perfectly, plus he wouldn't write Wolverine as some unbeatable god that he's be shown as.

    Based on the one story of his featuring Wolverine I can remember (Punisher vs Wolverine vs midget mobsters) I would guess that his "Logan in WWII" tale would feature 22 pages of the ol' canucklehead getting repeatedly run over by a lovingly described and accurately rendered Sherman Tank.

    There might be worthwhile stories about Logan in WWII waiting to be told (the one Claremont wrote where he teamed up with Cap was lots of fun), but I don't think Ennis is the man to write them. He obviously loathes super-hero comics. Reading his War Stories collection it seems to me that having a super-hero anywhere near one of them (or any story like it written by Ennis) would be like a variant cover foil-embossed one-shot special featuring Howard the Duck parachuting into Dachau. Super-heroes wouldn't add to an Ennis WWII story, they would cripple it.

  • WildcatWildcat Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Isn't Origins about to run a Wolvy-in-WWII story soon anyway?

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