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Work:How much information is ok for a boss to ask? or me ask them to do?

HorusHorus Los AngelesRegistered User regular
edited August 2007 in Help / Advice Forum
Basically whenever I ask my day off or need to take day from work. My boss asks me why, sometimes I give him generic excuse but he insists he needs to know the exact details. He says that its his right ask me. There was a time when he did that I felt it was inappropriate so I told him, "If you need to know my personal days lets go to HR and see what they have to say on you knowing." He stopped but now its like he wants to know what I do, basically our department was very close but we grew distant, its like Survival where alliances form and break. I just want to know what extent can they literally ask me.

Another situation we went out for staff lunch and in front of everyone he said he needs to know how much I make, hesitating I told him in front of everyone else. When I asked what was the purpose of the question he just said you know you could have not told me, really didn't have to answer that question. Yeah so my whole department knows how much I make to the hour. The thing about him is hes really good at making things look serious and I fall for it because I believe its really work related information.

Not sure if this may help understand my work environment but I have three boss/management and they control two employees, can this situation be the fact theres too many queen bees and no worker bees?


Another question is, I am trying hard for my bosses to give me the information through e-mail. They know if they email me the info on certain projects, I will catch their mistake. If they tell by mouth, they can straight say, I told you this way you did not listen. I tried every approach, from emailing them basically run down what they want (they never respond to say yes, or no thats not it), wrote it down then repeat it (they tell me I am wasting time) and finally I repeat everything they say right away (biggest problem is they speak in their heads 1 2 3 but in their talk to me its really 2 3 1)

I know its basically the problem of my coworkers not knowing how design works, but this boss thinks he knows so much to basically talk to me as though he knows more than me. Both questions apply to this individual who oversees my work.

tl;dr: To what extent can management ask me question before its crossing the line?
How can I make management document their directions so they don't get mad with me at "failing to follow orders"?
I need a new job!

Horus on
“You have brains in your head. You have feet in your shoes. You can steer yourself any direction you choose. You're on your own. And you know what you know. And YOU are the one who'll decide where to go...”
― Dr. Seuss, Oh, the Places You'll Go!

Posts

  • Blake TBlake T Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    You are always allowed to ask for written confirmation, it should be standard practice.

    Alternatively type down what they ask you and email it them asking for confirmation, if they don't answer back in half an hour wander over and ask if they can just quickly reply to it for your records.

    They don't have a right to ask you for any personal information other than address and an address of an emergency contact. He should not be able to ask you how much you earn. Just apologise and say I don't feel confident talking about that. My parents don't know how much I earn and they ask once a month.

  • LewishamLewisham Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Horus wrote: »
    Another question is, I am trying hard for my bosses to give me the information through e-mail. They know if they email me the info on certain projects, I will catch their mistake. If they tell by mouth, they can straight say, I told you this way you did not listen. I tried every approach, from emailing them basically run down what they want (they never respond to say yes, or no thats not it), wrote it down then repeat it (they tell me I am wasting time) and finally I repeat everything they say right away (biggest problem is they speak in their heads 1 2 3 but in their talk to me its really 2 3 1)

    Can you try harder to describe the problem here, I can't see what you are getting at. Are you requesting that your objectives and designs are communicated to you in a way that you can save?

    As for the other questions; IANAL, but management will generally ask you why you need time off, and have the right to refuse. They have to give you the days of leave as specified in your contract, but when you are allowed them is at the discretion of the company. This is to stop an employee bailing for two weeks right when a product is about to ship or something.

    What exactly do you have to hide when it comes to communicating your plans? Are you worried your boss will just flat out refuse everything? I don't know the legality of it, but I lied about my whereabouts to my workplace when I took leave in order to interview for new jobs.

    When you say your "boss", who do you mean? Usually the people who are the "boss" would know your salary. But he was being a dick when asking it in front of everyone, but you just have to have some decorum and politely reply it isn't polite to discuss salaries with others.

  • HorusHorus Los AngelesRegistered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Well let me try to answer best I can, basically when I ask a day off I would give a general reason, medical, family, personal day (vacation) or school(I go part time). I am a full time (no benefits) free lancer. When I gave my two days I will take vacation, 15 days ahead of time, I mention it as vacation but he asked where I am going or why I am going. I don't know to what degree is telling your boss reason for not coming to work has gone to invading privacy, only reason I do not want to talk to much is my bosses (3 total) are gossipers and really tell others your personal info.

    Lewishan:
    Can you try harder to describe the problem here, I can't see what you are getting at. Are you requesting that your objectives and designs are communicated to you in a way that you can save?

    Basically heres what happened today, my boss basically tells me ok do this and this on the Ad. I then repeat what he saidt and he goes Yes!. Once I am do the project, he goes thats not what I said. I need to find some proof what he said was actually what I did, because he sometimes thinks one thing but says another. He did that today where he was watching do some changes to an ad, waited till the end to finally tell me I did not get what he said. Even shouted, "Do I need a translator!" This problem does not happen with my other two bosses, they actually document what they want by giving me a creative brief. He just tells me and he really does say things but thinks he said it another way. Does that make sense?


    What exactly do you have to hide when it comes to communicating your plans? Are you worried your boss will just flat out refuse everything? I don't know the legality of it, but I lied about my whereabouts to my workplace when I took leave in order to interview for new jobs.

    Well I do not want them to know my life that they can write about my auto biography, like I said they gossip a lot and really spread your personal information among management. Like my other coworker, talked to each of us to let us know her engagement was broken, when she told the first boss, that person told the whole management before the coworker can.

    When you say your "boss", who do you mean? Usually the people who are the "boss" would know your salary. But he was being a dick when asking it in front of everyone, but you just have to have some decorum and politely reply it isn't polite to discuss salaries with others.


    Yeah he knows but thats my problem I need to learn how to decorum. Where do you buy this ?? =P

    FYI, I have three bosses
    Main Boss: Barely interact with her, the days I do is when shit blew the roof where she procrastinated on something and we have to cover for her. I can manage that.

    Second Boss: I have no idea whats her roll really, she does work a lot but I do not know what. She is very clear what she wants, gives me creative brief or/and writes one for Main Boss. She is easy to understand and talks to you step by step everything she wants.

    Third Boss: The one my post is predominately my post is about, he had longest childish beef with second boss over favoritism. He would be so mean to her, I do not care what she did. He takes things and makes it childish. It took Second Boss to ask him for a lunch meeting so she can figure out why he had a grudge on her. Also everyone knows him as a liar, even main and second boss, hell everyone in the floor does'nt take him seriously. He is having a kid and theres people who do not believe him. Also he loves to as they call it "bust your ass" basically gives you a hard time all in the name of a joke. He likes to take advantage of people who are gullible and make them stress out or scared them they screwed up at work. Hes really good but I think what comes around goes around, he is not being taken serious now.

    “You have brains in your head. You have feet in your shoes. You can steer yourself any direction you choose. You're on your own. And you know what you know. And YOU are the one who'll decide where to go...”
    ― Dr. Seuss, Oh, the Places You'll Go!
  • Blake TBlake T Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Then talk to Boss number two.

    Tell them that not having a creative breif is hurting your work and can you please tell three to do something about it. (this is of course assuming you have already asked three for a creative brief)

  • Iceman.USAFIceman.USAF Captain East CoastRegistered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I would tell your OTHER two bosses all of this, and then say you're uncomfortable doing projects for him. If they ask why, reiterate the blatant disregard for your personal well-being as well as his apparent lack of clarity. When he asks what your meeting was about, tell him you don't feel comfortable talking to him face to face and will only correspond via e-mail. Childish? perhaps, but he'll certainly (I would hope) get the message.



  • HorusHorus Los AngelesRegistered User regular
    edited August 2007
    ohh man I talked to them, about this issue. They really did not do anything other make boss 2 an asshole to me for two months before co worker made us kiss and make up. He has a way to talk his way into things.

    What I will do is reiterate the importance of documenting the direction of the project we are doing. Hope that reinforces to him indirectly to write it down.

    Thanks for advice, still open to more options.

    “You have brains in your head. You have feet in your shoes. You can steer yourself any direction you choose. You're on your own. And you know what you know. And YOU are the one who'll decide where to go...”
    ― Dr. Seuss, Oh, the Places You'll Go!
  • Steel FireSteel Fire Gunboat Diplomat PAI MarketingRegistered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Okay, here's what I know from my time in management and what has been passed on to me from various things HR taught us about managing people.

    Time off: As was stated, they can ask you a basic reason why you want the time off. However, you are not obligated to tell them anything more than it is for personal,vacation, doctor's appointment, etc. They have no right to press you for details, that is your business and yours alone. If you feel like sharing, that's cool, but they can't make you give details.

    Communications: My advice,with this boss that is not communicating well, is that after he tells you something,write it down in an e-mail and ask him to reply with confirmation or correction; and that you are proceeding as stated. If he does not reply, then you can reasonably assume (from an HR standpoint) that he did not have any changes. If you proceed that way and then at the end he says you did it wrong, then politely remind him that you asked him to confirm the instructions.

    Now, last bit of advice, and only you can decide if you really want to go this route.... The fact that you are posting here, asking for this level of advice, and from what you have described with the incidents of him asking your pay in front of everyone and pushing you for details about your time off, and especially your comment about him "busting people's ass" as a joke, this causes me some serious concern. Especially since you have taken this to the other two bosses and they have not acted; you, in my opinion, have a valid harrassment complaint. Remember, harrassment does not have to be sexual or racial, all it is is someone creating a hostile, uncomtfortable work environment; and if he is stressing you out this much and acting this way, that is harrassment.

    I suggest going to HR and letting them do their thing. Even if you are worried about repercussions and just want to find a different job (which seems totally because of this person), keep in mind that he will just do the same thing to someone else. I say it is better to take the risk and either force him to correct his behavior, or let him be the one to find another job.

  • FallingmanFallingman Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    On the email thing, either a) say "email me so we dont have a miscommunication again" - hell make it seem like you dont want to make a mistake again... then they'll have no reason not to.

    Or - as they are telling you - take notes. When they're finished, just quickly read it back to them.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • ThanatosThanatos Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Stop taking oral directions. If he comes in and starts telling you to do something, tell him "look, I'm busy right now, and have a lot on my mind, go ahead and e-mail it to me."

  • SerphimeraSerphimera Registered User
    edited August 2007
    Your boss is a giant dick.

    Do not take any more directions orally. Email him stating that you would like for him to give you directions via email from now on. This way you have documentation in case you ever decide to file a harassment case against him. I think it is definitely time to talk to HR (or maybe a lawyer??) about his behavior.

    And then I voted.
  • HorusHorus Los AngelesRegistered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Thank you everyone, I will approach the e-mail me what you want. But yeah about HR, everyone knows how he is and he pretty knows how to get away from things. Hes a smart man, and kiss ass. Awell thanks for the help. I am going to print this post for constant reminder.


    Thank you everyone.

    “You have brains in your head. You have feet in your shoes. You can steer yourself any direction you choose. You're on your own. And you know what you know. And YOU are the one who'll decide where to go...”
    ― Dr. Seuss, Oh, the Places You'll Go!
  • Steel FireSteel Fire Gunboat Diplomat PAI MarketingRegistered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Everyone may know how this guy is, but if it comes down to you talking about filing a harrassment charge, that may change their tune. Failure to act appropriately on a harrassment charge is a federal violation and, big important part, leads to personal liability for the people who did not act. That means that the company doesn't face fines or charges, the individual does; kinda gives them incentive to correct problems.

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