1) What's a 360 like in SD and 2) Renting a console.

Lave II

I've been thinking G&T, and this hurts, so I now need you help.

I'm not buying a HDTV till Freeview* goes HD. Which won't be for probably 5 years. But the 360 Arcade pack at £199 is tempting me - especially as I can probably get a bit of it's cost subbed this Capitalistic Pagan Winterval.

1) Can SDTV users tell me how they feel the games hold up? Is the text too small?1 Are the graphics still a Jump up? - I have a ~30' 4:3 SDTV.'

As no one I know in real life has a 360 or even a HDTV, I haven't been able to try one. So I got thinking, could I rent a 360? (and games?) I have little enough time to play all the Wii games I have, so If I could rent a 360 over xmas hols, I could probably get through the games in about 2 weeks that I wanted to play, and then return it.

In fact doing that for a couple of weeks a year, would make more sense than buying one. Even if it ended up more expensive in the long run.

So, 2) Does anyone know if you can rent consoles in the UK?

Many thanks Gentlemen and Women of this fine forum. You are wisdom and grace.

TL ; DR : How does a 360 hold up in SDTV, and anyone know if you can rent console in the UK?


*UK , free digital TV channels. About 40 or so. And all I'll ever need.

agoaj

360 still looks good in SD, but there are a few games that will be harder to play because of it(ex. Dead Rising and it's teeny tiny text).

corcorigan

Halo 3 looks gorgeous on a good SD TV (Using a PAL widescreen Sony Triniton). If anything rather better than the PC World set up did with an HD TV (probably a fairly crappy one to be fair).

No idea if you can rent them anywhere. I'm assuming not...

Lave II

Just to add, I have a 28" ish SDTV thats 4:3.

Is everything set up for widescreen?

(Thanks!)

Airan

Don't think there's any console renting service in the UK.

You may run into resolution problems in SD. For example, whenever I play Gears co-op on the SD widescreen at home half the GUI is outside the viewing boundary. I can't see the objectives (a small bar on the top right), my ammo bar is slightly cut out, and it's rather jarring. Another one that further shows this problem is the demo of Eternal Sonata, where the Action Time bar on the far left is basically out of view. I'm not sure why this is happening, as older consoles have absolutely no problems with displaying on SD, and it seems programmers have suddenly forgotten to code in SD resolutions or something.

The graphical quality in games is still superb. I just wish they squeeze in the interfaces more.

Smug Duckling

I play in SD and it looks wonderful. I haven't run into any problems so far with things not fitting on the screen, though I'm sure they do exist.

LBD_Nytetrayn

I haven't noticed a tremendous jump in quality without it being in HD. Not to say it isn't good, but it doesn't strike me as leaps and bounds beyond Xbox, short of maybe something some sort of numbers game that would be getting harder to notice.

Of course, I think GameCube and Xbox and Wii look just fine, so my opinion may not be very much help.

Incidently, and I don't know whether this speaks to the quality of the games or just their display in SD, but when I was at a game store a little while back, saw a guy playing Tomb Raider, the first one from the new engine and stuff. There was a PS2 on top of the TV, and that's what I thought he was playing, between that and the look at the screen, until I noticed he was holding a 360 controller. He also put in DOA4 for me to see. Looked good, but again, it didn't look to me like something that couldn't be done on Xbox.

Now, seeing stuff on HDTV, I do admit it's quite impressive.

Lave II

Airan wrote: »

Don't think there's any console renting service in the UK.

You may run into resolution problems in SD. For example, whenever I play Gears co-op on the SD widescreen at home half the GUI is outside the viewing boundary. I can't see the objectives (a small bar on the top right), my ammo bar is slightly cut out, and it's rather jarring. Another one that further shows this problem is the demo of Eternal Sonata, where the Action Time bar on the far left is basically out of view. I'm not sure why this is happening, as older consoles have absolutely no problems with displaying on SD, and it seems programmers have suddenly forgotten to code in SD resolutions or something.

The graphical quality in games is still superb. I just wish they squeeze in the interfaces more.

Crap, I care very little for graphics, and I'm fine if the 360 comes accross as an original Xbox in SD resolutions (which means it makes more sense that the Wii is as powerful as it is) but menu's not fitting on the screen is out of order.

Wow.

Noray

Yeah it's often clear developers don't give a shit about SDTV resolutions any more. I played my 360 on an SDTV for a few days before I got my VGA cable, and it's really not a big leap up from current gen graphics on it. Things like small text and small icons on a map (like in Crackdown) are just kind of blurs, and I was actually missing a large chunk of screen from the left of the screen as well (about 10%, give or take), which is definitely inexcusable. I personally wouldn't bother if you're not playing an HDTV at all. However, if you've got a semi-decent computer monitor, get a VGA cable and hook it up to that, it'll still look nice.

Also something to consider, if you don't want to get an HDTV just yet but you want to game in HD resolutions, you can get a good widescreen monitor (21" or thereabouts) for like 200 quid that will still look absolutely great.

RainbowDespair

I've been using my 360 on an SDTV for over a year and aside tiny text on a few games I haven't noticed any problems. Admittedly, it doesn't look anywhere near as awesome as it does on a nice HDTV (as my brief use of my parents 48" HDTV showed me), but it's still highly playable. I haven't noticed any menus or the like getting cropped off; maybe Airan's TV is just bad.

If you do hook it up to an SDTV, try to use S-Video cables or Component cables as those will do much towards making small text readable even on an SDTV.

capable heart

Lave II wrote: »

Airan wrote: »

Don't think there's any console renting service in the UK.

You may run into resolution problems in SD. For example, whenever I play Gears co-op on the SD widescreen at home half the GUI is outside the viewing boundary. I can't see the objectives (a small bar on the top right), my ammo bar is slightly cut out, and it's rather jarring. Another one that further shows this problem is the demo of Eternal Sonata, where the Action Time bar on the far left is basically out of view. I'm not sure why this is happening, as older consoles have absolutely no problems with displaying on SD, and it seems programmers have suddenly forgotten to code in SD resolutions or something.

The graphical quality in games is still superb. I just wish they squeeze in the interfaces more.

Crap, I care very little for graphics, and I'm fine if the 360 comes accross as an original Xbox in SD resolutions (which means it makes more sense that the Wii is as powerful as it is) but menu's not fitting on the screen is out of order.

Wow.

Menus not fitting on the screen is actually the TV's own fault. Depending on the particular model of TV, this problem can be better or worse.

However:

Usually what happens is that developers put the menu a few centimetres away from all edges of the picture, so that SDTVs don't clip them off. Sometimes they don't anticipate just how huge this "overscan" gets on SDTVs.

durandal4532

Looks splendid, leaps and bounds above my PS2, but text can be problematic. It's only really come up in Dead Rising and to a lesser extent Puzzle Quest, but it's annoying.

desperaterobots

The 360 is awesome in SD. In HD it is awesome-er. But yeah, there are some quirks. Expect them (they aren't that common) and you'll be fine.

DiscoZombie

durandal4532 wrote: »

Looks splendid, leaps and bounds above my PS2, but text can be problematic. It's only really come up in Dead Rising and to a lesser extent Puzzle Quest, but it's annoying.

seconded on all counts. Dead Rising and Puzzle Quest both forced me to sit right in front of the screen to have a hope of reading it, and still, I gave up on Dead Rising. I'll rent it again if/when when I have an HDTV. Other games can be a LITTLE hard to read but for the most part it doesn't interfere with gaming.

RainbowDespair

Some of the text in Puzzle Quest is small, but it's still substantially easier to read than the text in Dead Rising. On my SDTV w/component hookup, I can read all the text in Puzzle Quest fine, but in Dead Rising, I have to guess on some of the words.

Tofystedeth

RainbowDespair wrote: »

I've been using my 360 on an SDTV for over a year and aside tiny text on a few games I haven't noticed any problems. Admittedly, it doesn't look anywhere near as awesome as it does on a nice HDTV (as my brief use of my parents 48" HDTV showed me), but it's still highly playable. I haven't noticed any menus or the like getting cropped off; maybe Airan's TV is just bad.

If you do hook it up to an SDTV, try to use S-Video cables or Component cables as those will do much towards making small text readable even on an SDTV.

Yeah. I haven't had any problems seeing stuff on a SDTV about as big as yours. Had a friend who played a bunch of Gears of War on an SDTV and didn't hear anything about clipping menus, so I don't know about that. Halo 3 looks nice.

Lave II

This isn't the uniform answer I was expecting to be honest. The people reporting negatives, have negatives so bad, I would never want a 360, but then other people have no problems O_o

And I'm in the UK so the best I can do for my tele is a Scart Cable pushing 60Hz.

I have a laptop, though I do have a 14" 1024*768 external TFT, which I guess won't be any use. Either way, I want to sit in the living room, not at a desk, so I would rather avoid that route.

This isn't looking good at all. I'm far more tempted to rent one now. If thats is possible that is....

acidlacedpenguin

I just upgraded from my SDTV, I had no problems playing on it, its just that 27" was starting to get too small for my feeble old eyes. Gears still looked beautiful on it, same with Halo 3. I had no problems with my TV clipping off some of the screen but that is entirely down to what model of TV you have so YMMV. Also, keep in mind that I'm talking all NTSC, not too sure how my experiences would differ in PAL.

Lave II

Surely PAL would be better what with it being better an all (Higher res or something isn't it?)

I think

Maybe

Unicron

I don't own a 360 so can't really help much for or against. However, I have played GoW and Dead Rising on a mates small SDTV, over the pack-in cables. And although the text was small in DR it was still legible, didn't notice anything in GoW.

I think some of the confusion and conflicting reports comes from the difference between PAL and NTSC SDTV. Wikipedia has a nice little chart here.

darleysam

Well i've been playing on a widescreen SDTV for the past year, and I'll agree that text is small, but in that whole time there's maybe been one or two words that I haven't been able to read. I've played Dead Rising a lot, my younger brother's completed it, so I'd say the small text isn't a hindrance there, and that seems to be cited as the worst example. Yes, small icons are blurry and would be clearer on a HDTV, but it doesn't affect my enjoyment of the game. What actual games were you looking at getting, anyway?
And do Argos still do their returns policy? Could you get one from there, see how it looks on your tv, then take it back and either get one on a better deal, or just leave the idea from there?

Mr_Grinch

Had no probs with a 360 on an sdtv (other than Dead Rising), I personally have a HDTV but friends have just bog standard SD and have been gaming on them fine. A lot of games are set up for widescreen nowadays, but most will run full screen without issue.

As far as I'm aware there is NO rental service in the UK for consoles, unless you can purchase from PC World and then take it back before 28 days (their refund policy is EXCELLENT).

Lave II

Hmm, that PC world Idea is rather underhand, rather brilliant, and very, very tempting.... still I would prefer a rental service. I remember when you could rent PS2's from blockbusters...

At least it would be a good way to trial it out.

Maybe the problems are an issue with people with 4:3 SDTV and not for people with Widescreen SDTV?

I'm tempted by Oblivion, Assasin's Creed and GoW or Halo 3.

darleysam

If Argos do that returns policy (last I heard you could return anything for any reason within 2 weeks of purchase), then you could do that.
I've not personally had any problems with GoW and Halo 3, everything seemed to show up just fine. Not played Oblivion though, so I can't speak for that.

Snowbeat

I have a 4:3 SD TV and while it doesn't look as good as a HD, it still blows me away every time I load up Halo 3 or GoW.

I don't know about widescreen SDs but just go ahead and get a 360. You won't regret it.

Mr_Grinch

Blockbuster stopped doing console rentals a while ago, I worked there so I know It got too expensive and risky.

Unless you can lend one from a friend you're best off buying and returning. Just make sure you keep everything in tip top condition. Also, I have pm'd you

Guek

it looks really good but the experience is kind of spoiled after you've played on an HD set. I guess you could say that there's a definite graphical jump but it doesn't look like the phenomenal leap that it should be.

Airan

Not trying to scare you off into getting one (in fact, try that PC World refund trick :P) but just a warning. It could well be my TV (Matsui Widescreen... some size. 26'' I think? I didn't buy it). I'm using RGB, have set Xbox to Widescreen mode, have enabled the TV to be in Widescreen and the problem still arises (Gears co-opand ES are the worst offenders, Bioshock demo doesn't have this problem far as I can tell). Others seem to not have this issue though (probably better TVs).
It just strikes me as strange since I can play PS2 and Wii games with no interface clipping problems whatsoever.

Lunker

I've been rocking a 25" SDTV and have had no qualms about my 360. My Core pack came with only composite cables, though, which was terrible; I upgraded to S-Video (because my TV doesn't even have component!) and I have no problems with reading text, although as others have said the Dead Rising text (and even some in PGR3) is quite tiny. I don't know all the resolution differences in Yurrop, though, so just make sure to not stick with the bargain-basement cables.

But the games are still quite beautiful, and more important the games are still the same games, and Lave, since I know you're sorely tempted by XBLA it'll still give you those delicious downloads you crave.

Lave II

God damn XBLA is exciting. Far more than the 'proper' games. But then I need a hard drive, but those can come later I suppose.

Unicron

I'd go straight for the premium personally. You already get raped for the hard drive, it's just worse if you don't buy it in a bundle.

Lave II

Unicron wrote: »

I'd go straight for the premium personally. You already get raped for the hard drive, it's just worse if you don't buy it in a bundle.

Yes, but tunfortuantly hats much more money than I actually have, no matter how much "better" value it is.

And thats whilst getting some of it's price offset by xmas contributions. To be honest, my magic figure is more like £150, which I'm kicking myself about, because I remember play selling some cores off on sale at that price before then.

Unicron

Lave II wrote: »

Unicron wrote: »

I'd go straight for the premium personally. You already get raped for the hard drive, it's just worse if you don't buy it in a bundle.

Yes, but tunfortuantly hats much more money than I actually have, no matter how much "better" value it is.

And thats whilst getting some of it's price offset by xmas contributions. To be honest, my magic figure is more like £150, which I'm kicking myself about, because I remember play selling some cores off on sale at that price before then.

Ah yeah I can totally understand it as I'm pretty much in the same boat. I console (!) myself with the thought that the longer I wait, the cheaper the console will be and the easier it will be to get Platinum/2nd hand games.

Lunker

I feel ya, as the only reason I ended up buying a 360 when I did was because I got a Core for $200US. I ended up buying a secondhand hard drive for $60 shipped, so I'd scour eBay and such because I'm sure there are more and more 20GB HDs being cast into the sea with each passing month.