I only played bioshock demo, but come on, how did Mario Galaxy not win best original soundtrack?
Super Mario Galaxy's original score is great and worth listening to in its own right, but it really excels as tense in-game cues and atmosphere. And it's a damn shame there isn't a soundtrack CD with all the period music on it. Some great songs in this game.
Fix'd for the real truth.
When showing off what game music can be like to a good friend the other day, I went straight for Halo and BioShock music. She was suitably impressed.
I can't quite imagine Mario would have the same impact.
It's not going to sound the same as BioShock and Halo (i.e. you won't take it as "serious" music because it's so lighthearted), but it's fucking fantastic lighthearted music.
I'm actually listening to the SMG soundtrack right now at work as background music ... and it's not even a decent recording of it either (it's analog off the inputs so it sounds like tinny crap, but it's still great music).
No love for Halo 3 music? I can understand all the other complaints but the music is really fucking amazing. Especially Marty's Finish the Fight piece. :P
I agree with him. If King's Quest came out with a new collection this year of all of them, would it be considered one game?
edit: Orange Box is a collection of games, not 1 game. It's 1 product.
edit2: It isn't particularly a big deal to me though. I just think a collection isn't a game.
Thingm to me, is that it is incredibly difficult to justify giving a three hour game consideration for GotY, no matter how good it is. Portal alone could easily win Puzzle Game of the Year, but to take the cake (as it were) it needs to be included in the Orange Box, as a whole.
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HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
edited December 2007
Mmm, okay, the 1 product bit makes sense. It's just a little goofy is all.
I agree with him. If King's Quest came out with a new collection this year of all of them, would it be considered one game?
edit: Orange Box is a collection of games, not 1 game. It's 1 product.
edit2: It isn't particularly a big deal to me though. I just think a collection isn't a game.
That's not the same thing though because you cannot buy each product seperately on the 360 or PS3 than it automatically should be considered as a package for GOTY, if you could buy them seperately than yes each part should than individual be considered but even for PC, it should be considered one package.
something like a kings quest collection shouldn't be considered for GOTY because it's a product and you are able to buy each individually.
I really like the Edge list. I agree, 100%, which is weird and rare. Maybe I should subscribe.
So, I kinda wanted to throw out this question: how much do you think that pricing and value should figure in?
I definitely agree that Halo is essentially comprised of two and a half games -- Online, Campaign, and Co-op. And none of them, on their own, would necessarily merit GOTY. But when all 2.5 are on a single 60$ SKU, that's very compelling. Same with the Orange Box (for console people, at least). And I definitely think that Mario Galaxy is a very good value at 50$ -- it's a game without a lot of filler, and the 'optional' stars don't really feel like padding. All three products are very generous when you compare them to the average product in '07.
Anyway, I give Orange Box credit for maybe triggering a "2 or 3 small games in a package" revolution. It redefines what I want from a next-gen, 60$ game. It makes me wonder if I'm gonna be that happy about paying separately for MGS and MGS: Online (wow, fuck that noise unless it's absolutely the 2nd coming of games).
RedShell on
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I put very little stock in lists like these, just due to the fact that it always seems (especially on the 'casual mag' side, but still a problem with 'professional' game reviewers) that graphics trumps everything.
I mean, Bioshock was a great game, but mostly due to the atmosphere, as the game itself isn't really anything to write home about.
CoD4 was a fantastic game (just finished it this weekend), but it's main draw is the incredible visuals. The rest of the game has been done before, ad nauseum. Damn, do I love it, though.
I guess I'm just waiting for people to realize that soon we'll reach a plateau regarding visuals, the jump between generations is already getting smaller and smaller. Hopefully, as the years pass, gameplay will become more important.
To be honest, I suck at making lists, so I couldn't tell you what was my favorite this year. I can say the most fun I'd had with a game this year, without a doubt, was Galaxy, but I can see how the technical aspects of the other contenders might push that into the background.
I don't know why I wrote all of that, I don't really have a problem with (most of) these lists, they're all great games. I guess I just don't like the word 'innovative' being thrown around, when all it really refers to is the visuals of the game. Visuals are going to get better with better hardware, that's pretty much a given.
e: To clarify, this is all coming from an offline single player point of view. I think I might agree that online multiplayer shouldn't be included in this sort of competition. I mean, Halo 3 could be considered game of the year, but if a person doesn't have XBOX Live, its value decreases significantly. Same with CoD4, if you take out the online multi, you're left with a really pretty 5 hour game.
Orange Box is contentious because 3 of its titles have all seen separate, individual releases in previous years.
Actually, only 2 of them have, and those 2 are only included because one of the pieces would make zero sense to the un initiated without those 2.
True, I should learn to count. I can understand the reasoning behind including them, and I'm happy for it to be left as 'Orange Box' rather than individual titles, but still, HL2 and E1 have still already had individual releases in previous years, which makes me see OB more as a compilation. An awesome compilation, but not an individual title.
Orange Box is contentious because 3 of its titles have all seen separate, individual releases in previous years.
Actually, only 2 of them have, and those 2 are only included because one of the pieces would make zero sense to the un initiated without those 2.
True, I should learn to count. I can understand the reasoning behind including them, and I'm happy for it to be left as 'Orange Box' rather than individual titles, but still, HL2 and E1 have still already had individual releases in previous years, which makes me see OB more as a compilation. An awesome compilation, but not an individual title.
Well, it is the first release of Ep. 1 on a console, so there is that too.
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cj iwakuraThe Rhythm RegentBears The Name FreedomRegistered Userregular
Nobody considers Final Fantasy IV and Crono Trigger to be one game. Nobody says Final Fantasy Anthology is their favorite FF despite including 5 and 6. People might accept the argument of it being one game if in the history of gaming had compilations ever been viewed as a single game. If you want to argue that these lists are some sort of Consumer Report best way to spend money on video game software then that's one argument(and a valid one), but to argue that they are one "game" is stupid. Especially when the description for the product on Steam is this:
The Orange Box features THREE highly-awaited new GAMES by Valve: Half-Life® 2: Episode Two, the second installment in the Half-Life 2 episodic trilogy; Team Fortress® 2, the sequel to the game that put class-based, multiplayer team warfare on the map; and Portal, the game that blends puzzles, first person action, and adventure gaming to produce an experience like no other.
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Orange Box is contentious because 3 of its titles have all seen separate, individual releases in previous years.
Actually, only 2 of them have, and those 2 are only included because one of the pieces would make zero sense to the un initiated without those 2.
True, I should learn to count. I can understand the reasoning behind including them, and I'm happy for it to be left as 'Orange Box' rather than individual titles, but still, HL2 and E1 have still already had individual releases in previous years, which makes me see OB more as a compilation. An awesome compilation, but not an individual title.
Well, it is the first release of Ep. 1 on a console, so there is that too.
I'm never going to win this one, am I. I blame Drez.
Orange Box is contentious because 3 of its titles have all seen separate, individual releases in previous years.
Actually, only 2 of them have, and those 2 are only included because one of the pieces would make zero sense to the un initiated without those 2.
True, I should learn to count. I can understand the reasoning behind including them, and I'm happy for it to be left as 'Orange Box' rather than individual titles, but still, HL2 and E1 have still already had individual releases in previous years, which makes me see OB more as a compilation. An awesome compilation, but not an individual title.
Well, it is the first release of Ep. 1 on a console, so there is that too.
By that logic, both Halo 2 and Halo 3 can be in the top ten list because Halo 2 was released for the first time on the PC this year.
Indeed. Oh well, I guess I don't see most of these publications having the attention span to play through the game. I'm at 70+ hours now, and just now at the "end". Well... At least I think I'm at the end.
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cj iwakuraThe Rhythm RegentBears The Name FreedomRegistered Userregular
edited December 2007
What blows my mind is that the only media outlet I've seen recognize Persona 3 as a GOTY contender is the Spike TV Video Game Awards.
Hell, Persona 3 should have at least gotten a mention for soundtrack. Christ that soundtrack is awesome.
Oh man. I feel bad for people who haven't heard it yet. And I agree... The OST is probably the best I've ever heard in... Forever. And I don't even like that type of music generally.
Hell, Persona 3 should have at least gotten a mention for soundtrack. Christ that soundtrack is awesome.
Oh man. I feel bad for people who haven't heard it yet. And I agree... The OST is probably the best I've ever heard in... Forever. And I don't even like that type of music generally.
It's got a little of everything, really. Shoot, there's even a d'n'b track. (If 'When The Moon Reaches For The Stars' counts.)
To be honest, I suck at making lists, so I couldn't tell you what was my favorite this year. I can say the most fun I'd had with a game this year, without a doubt, was Galaxy, but I can see how the technical aspects of the other contenders might push that into the background.
(snip)
If it's your list, you can define "best" any way you want. You could say it's SMG because you had the most fun with it and fuck off everybody because it's your list.
One of the problems with these lists is that they rarely divulge the criteria on which they judge the best game of the year, if they even have a set of criteria beyond "I like this." Most of these magazines would be better off if they put out a list of "the editors' favorite games of the year and why we like 'em" instead of "this is the best game this year." It would lead to less inbox flamewar and a much more interesting article wherein they get to talk about anything they like about a game, not just review bullet points.
No love for Halo 3 music? I can understand all the other complaints but the music is really fucking amazing. Especially Marty's Finish the Fight piece. :P
I have no dislike for Halo 3 music ... in so far as I haven't really heard any yet. I was just saying that SMG is also very good. I'm assuming Halo 3's music is good based on what I know from Halo 1's music.
To be honest, I suck at making lists, so I couldn't tell you what was my favorite this year. I can say the most fun I'd had with a game this year, without a doubt, was Galaxy, but I can see how the technical aspects of the other contenders might push that into the background.
(snip)
If it's your list, you can define "best" any way you want. You could say it's SMG because you had the most fun with it and fuck off everybody because it's your list.
One of the problems with these lists is that they rarely divulge the criteria on which they judge the best game of the year, if they even have a set of criteria beyond "I like this." Most of these magazines would be better off if they put out a list of "the editors' favorite games of the year and why we like 'em" instead of "this is the best game this year." It would lead to less inbox flamewar and a much more interesting article wherein they get to talk about anything they like about a game, not just review bullet points.
Oh yeah, I was basically just lamenting my inability to pick favorites. I'm way too wishy-washy, I really can't make a top 10 of top 5 list of anything, just because my tastes change so much from day to day.
I see what you're getting at though, it would be nice if we knew why/how they were judging certain games. I mean, if you only look at 'fun', I'd say Galaxy wins, easily. If you're looking at 'atmosphere', I'd say Bioshock, and for just pure visuals I'd give the nod to CoD4.
That's probably the reason I have such a problem making my own list, because each of those games excels at different things, at which point it comes down to deciding which criteria is most important to me, not which game I actually think is best.
No way, their list made me giggle. I'm pretty certain those were possibly the only games they played this year.
Regarding the Edge list - what's innovative about Halo 3? That's not a rhetorical question, I figured it was just more of the same top-flight FPS gamery, but apparently it has innovation as well so I'm intrigued.
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cj iwakuraThe Rhythm RegentBears The Name FreedomRegistered Userregular
Regarding the Edge list - what's innovative about Halo 3? That's not a rhetorical question, I figured it was just more of the same top-flight FPS gamery, but apparently it has innovation as well so I'm intrigued.
Well, for starters there's the saved films features. I'm pretty sure no other game has done this as well as it has been done here. Complete camera control, saving of clips or entire films, slow motion or fast forward. It's a great feature that should be in every game.
Next is Forge, which really is "modding lite", allowing for editing of maps in such an amazingly simple way while still allowing really creative people to make amazing creations. The only thing that could top this is a map creator.
The scoring for campaign isn't exactly revolutionary, but it certainly adds great legs to an already outstanding campaign, and the already stellar matchmaking from Halo 2 has somehow been improved in a myriad of ways.
So yeah. I'd rather have that stuff than a teleporter gun (Even if Portal was fantastic).
No way, their list made me giggle. I'm pretty certain those were possibly the only games they played this year.
Regarding the Edge list - what's innovative about Halo 3? That's not a rhetorical question, I figured it was just more of the same top-flight FPS gamery, but apparently it has innovation as well so I'm intrigued.
Forge and the replays/Theatre are pretty new for consoles.
Yeah, I'm disappointed at the lack of Persona 3 in these lists as well. Between presents and birthday money, I picked up Mario Galaxy, The Orange Box, and Persona 3 all at about the same time and though they're all great games (or collections in the case of The Orange Box), of those three, I must say that I've been enjoying Persona 3 the most. It's stylish, has awesome music, and the addition of sim elements to the well done traditional RPG elements really makes it something special.
Cool. Forge is basically like a multiplayer gary's mod map builder type thing isn't it?
Yeah, you can move spawn points for weapons/ people, spawn vehicles, weapons, and pieces of scenery (Barrels, boxes, and other things). 8 people can be in a Forge room at once, and you can start editing anything by the press of a button. It gets intense when you start dueling with giant radio antennas 2 miles above the ground while avoiding people throwing tanks.
It's crazy fun.
Yeah, I'm disappointed at the lack of Persona 3 in these lists as well. Between presents and birthday money, I picked up Mario Galaxy, The Orange Box, and Persona 3 all at about the same time and though they're all great games (or collections in the case of The Orange Box), of those three, I must say that I've been enjoying Persona 3 the most. It's stylish, has awesome music, and the addition of sim elements to the well done traditional RPG elements really makes it something special.
:^: Indeed. I've put more time into Persona 3 than I have TF2/Portal/HL2/SMG combined. And I'm still enjoying it. Not saying those other games are teh suck, but P3 is more my style of game nowadays.
That's the same one I have. The two-discer's the import.
For once, all the best songs really are on the one we got.
Well, except Tanaka's theme.
Ahh okay. I was nervous! I just looked up the lyrics for Mass Destruction, and man... That's so GOOD for a battle theme.
Also: Fuck Tanaka.
Isn't he the "head" of SEES? I'm so bad at names, really.
I can honestly say that I'm surprised not to see SMG on the top of more lists. I'm not shocked to see so many FPS games in the various top 10's. Videogame writers are usually pretty biased towards the genre, IMO. For the past few years, not being a fan of FPS has meant that I can skip 50%-75% of the gaming articles out there because I just don't care.
EDIT: Also, there seems to be a huge multi-player bias amongst videogame writers. I suspect it has something to do with them working in an environment filled with people they can play the games with. I'd imagine I'd enjoy multi player games more if I were playing them for free on my free 360 on a comp'd XBL Gold membership with all of my friends from work who are playing the same game at the same time.
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No love for Halo 3 music? I can understand all the other complaints but the music is really fucking amazing. Especially Marty's Finish the Fight piece. :P
Thingm to me, is that it is incredibly difficult to justify giving a three hour game consideration for GotY, no matter how good it is. Portal alone could easily win Puzzle Game of the Year, but to take the cake (as it were) it needs to be included in the Orange Box, as a whole.
That's not the same thing though because you cannot buy each product seperately on the 360 or PS3 than it automatically should be considered as a package for GOTY, if you could buy them seperately than yes each part should than individual be considered but even for PC, it should be considered one package.
something like a kings quest collection shouldn't be considered for GOTY because it's a product and you are able to buy each individually.
So, I kinda wanted to throw out this question: how much do you think that pricing and value should figure in?
I definitely agree that Halo is essentially comprised of two and a half games -- Online, Campaign, and Co-op. And none of them, on their own, would necessarily merit GOTY. But when all 2.5 are on a single 60$ SKU, that's very compelling. Same with the Orange Box (for console people, at least). And I definitely think that Mario Galaxy is a very good value at 50$ -- it's a game without a lot of filler, and the 'optional' stars don't really feel like padding. All three products are very generous when you compare them to the average product in '07.
Anyway, I give Orange Box credit for maybe triggering a "2 or 3 small games in a package" revolution. It redefines what I want from a next-gen, 60$ game. It makes me wonder if I'm gonna be that happy about paying separately for MGS and MGS: Online (wow, fuck that noise unless it's absolutely the 2nd coming of games).
Pokemans D/P: 1289 4685 0522
Quake multi and single were different games?
Orange Box is contentious because 3 of its titles have all seen separate, individual releases in previous years. Halo 3 is Halo 3.
Actually, only 2 of them have, and those 2 are only included because one of the pieces would make zero sense to the un initiated without those 2.
I mean, Bioshock was a great game, but mostly due to the atmosphere, as the game itself isn't really anything to write home about.
CoD4 was a fantastic game (just finished it this weekend), but it's main draw is the incredible visuals. The rest of the game has been done before, ad nauseum. Damn, do I love it, though.
I guess I'm just waiting for people to realize that soon we'll reach a plateau regarding visuals, the jump between generations is already getting smaller and smaller. Hopefully, as the years pass, gameplay will become more important.
To be honest, I suck at making lists, so I couldn't tell you what was my favorite this year. I can say the most fun I'd had with a game this year, without a doubt, was Galaxy, but I can see how the technical aspects of the other contenders might push that into the background.
I don't know why I wrote all of that, I don't really have a problem with (most of) these lists, they're all great games. I guess I just don't like the word 'innovative' being thrown around, when all it really refers to is the visuals of the game. Visuals are going to get better with better hardware, that's pretty much a given.
e: To clarify, this is all coming from an offline single player point of view. I think I might agree that online multiplayer shouldn't be included in this sort of competition. I mean, Halo 3 could be considered game of the year, but if a person doesn't have XBOX Live, its value decreases significantly. Same with CoD4, if you take out the online multi, you're left with a really pretty 5 hour game.
True, I should learn to count. I can understand the reasoning behind including them, and I'm happy for it to be left as 'Orange Box' rather than individual titles, but still, HL2 and E1 have still already had individual releases in previous years, which makes me see OB more as a compilation. An awesome compilation, but not an individual title.
Well, it is the first release of Ep. 1 on a console, so there is that too.
My best guess is that most of these reviewers don't know it exists.
Then again, Next-Gen's top 30 includes Contra 4, so who knows.
I'm never going to win this one, am I. I blame Drez.
By that logic, both Halo 2 and Halo 3 can be in the top ten list because Halo 2 was released for the first time on the PC this year.
AWESOME GAME!
Final Fantasy XI -> Carbuncle - Samash
Indeed.
Oh man. I feel bad for people who haven't heard it yet. And I agree... The OST is probably the best I've ever heard in... Forever. And I don't even like that type of music generally.
What the duce? Are.. You serious? The world IS going to end. First Duke Nukem Forever MIGHT get released, and now this? Fuck..
It's got a little of everything, really. Shoot, there's even a d'n'b track. (If 'When The Moon Reaches For The Stars' counts.)
Well, RPG of the year, but it was something. Beaten by Mass Effect, of course.
And a free soundtrack included inthegame files on PC.
Want To Be Close takes it for me, followed by When The Moon(etc.).
And the last battle uses the coolest remix ever.
If it's your list, you can define "best" any way you want. You could say it's SMG because you had the most fun with it and fuck off everybody because it's your list.
One of the problems with these lists is that they rarely divulge the criteria on which they judge the best game of the year, if they even have a set of criteria beyond "I like this." Most of these magazines would be better off if they put out a list of "the editors' favorite games of the year and why we like 'em" instead of "this is the best game this year." It would lead to less inbox flamewar and a much more interesting article wherein they get to talk about anything they like about a game, not just review bullet points.
I have no dislike for Halo 3 music ... in so far as I haven't really heard any yet. I was just saying that SMG is also very good. I'm assuming Halo 3's music is good based on what I know from Halo 1's music.
Oh yeah, I was basically just lamenting my inability to pick favorites. I'm way too wishy-washy, I really can't make a top 10 of top 5 list of anything, just because my tastes change so much from day to day.
I see what you're getting at though, it would be nice if we knew why/how they were judging certain games. I mean, if you only look at 'fun', I'd say Galaxy wins, easily. If you're looking at 'atmosphere', I'd say Bioshock, and for just pure visuals I'd give the nod to CoD4.
That's probably the reason I have such a problem making my own list, because each of those games excels at different things, at which point it comes down to deciding which criteria is most important to me, not which game I actually think is best.
No way, their list made me giggle. I'm pretty certain those were possibly the only games they played this year.
Regarding the Edge list - what's innovative about Halo 3? That's not a rhetorical question, I figured it was just more of the same top-flight FPS gamery, but apparently it has innovation as well so I'm intrigued.
That's the same one I have. The two-discer's the import.
For once, all the best songs really are on the one we got.
Well, except Tanaka's theme.
I've got both soundtracks. I like having all the tracks in the game on the import but the one released in NA really has all the best "singles".
Next is Forge, which really is "modding lite", allowing for editing of maps in such an amazingly simple way while still allowing really creative people to make amazing creations. The only thing that could top this is a map creator.
The scoring for campaign isn't exactly revolutionary, but it certainly adds great legs to an already outstanding campaign, and the already stellar matchmaking from Halo 2 has somehow been improved in a myriad of ways.
So yeah. I'd rather have that stuff than a teleporter gun (Even if Portal was fantastic).
Forge and the replays/Theatre are pretty new for consoles.
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Spike TV gave Nocturne RPG of the Year when it came out, I believe.
3DS: 1607-3034-6970
Yeah, you can move spawn points for weapons/ people, spawn vehicles, weapons, and pieces of scenery (Barrels, boxes, and other things). 8 people can be in a Forge room at once, and you can start editing anything by the press of a button. It gets intense when you start dueling with giant radio antennas 2 miles above the ground while avoiding people throwing tanks.
It's crazy fun.
:^: Indeed. I've put more time into Persona 3 than I have TF2/Portal/HL2/SMG combined. And I'm still enjoying it. Not saying those other games are teh suck, but P3 is more my style of game nowadays.
Ahh okay. I was nervous!
Also: Fuck Tanaka.
EDIT: Also, there seems to be a huge multi-player bias amongst videogame writers. I suspect it has something to do with them working in an environment filled with people they can play the games with. I'd imagine I'd enjoy multi player games more if I were playing them for free on my free 360 on a comp'd XBL Gold membership with all of my friends from work who are playing the same game at the same time.