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Jack Thompson topic

1235762

Posts

  • ZapfZapf Registered User
    edited October 2005
    Defender wrote:
    Zapf wrote:
    You know, I don't consider myself to be an expert on US copyright law, but I'm pretty sure Defender is talking shit.

    hes mixing copyright law and trademark law like many other douches on the internet

    I'm repeating what Thompson says. It's his job to know this shit, and I'm taking his word for it that he's right on the legal end, since, you know, it's his JOB, and he's been doing this for DECADES.

    im looking at the us copyright office website and I'm not seeing anything about losing it do to not protecting it. maybe you'd like to cite something other than the crap that spews from jack thompsons mouth?

    trexwootss8c67.giftrexwootss8c67.giftrexwootss8c67.gif
  • denihilistdenihilist tiny, tiny little man live music capitol of the worldAdministrator admin
    edited October 2005
    Starfuck wrote:
    rock star loves when people talk about their games
    good or bad publicity, really at this point they are milking it for all they can and who would blame them.

    But aren't they griefing the industry in a way?

  • ZapfZapf Registered User
    edited October 2005
    only when they start mining our own airstrips den

    trexwootss8c67.giftrexwootss8c67.giftrexwootss8c67.gif
  • KazhiimKazhiim __BANNED USERS
    edited October 2005
    denihilist wrote:
    Starfuck wrote:
    rock star loves when people talk about their games
    good or bad publicity, really at this point they are milking it for all they can and who would blame them.

    But aren't they griefing the industry in a way?

    don't b a carebare lol

    lost_sig2.png
  • denihilistdenihilist tiny, tiny little man live music capitol of the worldAdministrator admin
    edited October 2005
    Zapf wrote:

    im looking at the us copyright office website and I'm not seeing anything about losing it do to not protecting it. maybe you'd like to cite something other than the crap that spews from jack thompsons mouth?

    Isn't that kind of the abandonware argument? Isn't that one of the reasons Nintendo so aggressively fights roms and the like?

    I would look at court cases on copyright for precendent.

  • StarfuckStarfuck Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited October 2005
    he just fuckin told you man
    he said that is what jack said
    i know defender can be an ASSHOLE (heeheehaha)
    but taking shots at him for something he already fuckin told you weren't his words is like yelling at the grocery clerk because you're milk is spoiled, it wasn't his job to check the milk.

    wait
    what

    jackfaces
    "If you're going to play tiddly winks, play it with man hole covers."
    - John McCallum
  • denihilistdenihilist tiny, tiny little man live music capitol of the worldAdministrator admin
    edited October 2005
    Zapf wrote:
    only when they start mining our own airstrips den

    :lol:

    It's interesting though isn't it? What's exploitation and what isn't?

    A lot of it has to do with the fact that Jack Thompson's generation didn't grow up playing videogame like we did. Shit's changing and it makes them uncomfortable.

    back in my day

  • ZapfZapf Registered User
    edited October 2005
    i

    i think i acknowledged that jack said that starfuck

    trexwootss8c67.giftrexwootss8c67.giftrexwootss8c67.gif
  • StarfuckStarfuck Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited October 2005
    denihilist wrote:
    Starfuck wrote:
    rock star loves when people talk about their games
    good or bad publicity, really at this point they are milking it for all they can and who would blame them.

    But aren't they griefing the industry in a way?

    of course they are
    but i don't think they care

    it be nice and dandy if they would say, oh man hey guys, we had a good run with GTA and all, but maybe we should look into new games and maybe try to something different. no way. money is rolling in and i doubt they care how it effects the industry.

    but, i would rather have rock star around doing what they do rather than have uncle sam step in and start fucking around with this shit. let the industry sort itself out,

    jackfaces
    "If you're going to play tiddly winks, play it with man hole covers."
    - John McCallum
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    denihilist wrote:
    Defender wrote:
    He would not require an M rating for those dolls because they don't already have code in them that would encourage its users to put them in violent or sexual poses. The Sims has built-in sex as part of the game. Barbie and Ken don't have a page in their user manual that tells you how to make them fuck or anything like that.

    The point is valid for GTA as it is coded for violence but The Sims isn't coded for explicit sexual activity. It's sexual behavior is no different from what you would see on a sitcom.

    Might it be The Sims 2? He was talking about having "blur" regions over the genital areas of nude characters' bodies in-game. I don't own a copy of any Sims product, so I'm not totally clear on what he's talking about, but since he said it like it was fact and the guy running the show brought it up and didn't say it was factually incorrect, I just believed it.
    denihilist wrote:
    The real question is this: Is it EA's responsibility to ensure that no 12 year olds can access digital porn using their software. Microsoft isn't held responisble for kids viewing porn with Internet Explorer. The site is supposed to have safeguards or the parents are expected to use software like net nanny.

    If EA actually licensed the engine to a developer that creates a mod in which you can sex it up, then it is the developer's responsibility to police that product, not EA. If the developer does not, then the developer is at fault and the government should prosecute.

    I guess his argument (which, if anything, suggests that the law is fucked up) is that if you modify The Sims and then do something commercial with those mods, and EA finds out, then they either have to sue you to stop, or lose their copyright, or sanction you. Since they're not suing anyone to stop and since they do still claim to own the whole Sims line, that makes their action #3 by default. I dunno, that's how Thompson's argument sounded.

    I'm worried that if Thompson's right, then they'll have to start saying "you can't mod anything" or "any mod you make is owned by us and if we say stop distributing it, you have to!"

    Hell, the EULA probably already says you agree not to mod it.

    hello massa, I jar jar binks
    I've overheard someone say "Don't say something is retarded, its not cool to make fun of retards. Just say its gay."
  • Penguin IncarnatePenguin Incarnate King of Kafiristan Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    I really think Rock Star is a fucking cesspool of a game company.

  • denihilistdenihilist tiny, tiny little man live music capitol of the worldAdministrator admin
    edited October 2005
    Nudity doesn't equal sexual content. It's about time America realized that.

  • QorzmQorzm Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    i want jack thompson to register here and make an announcement to us
    it would be fucking glorious

  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    Tarranon wrote:
    man defender. I know you like arguing and stuff. but come on. Jack Thompson? That's a little low, even for devil's advocate.

    I listened to the interview expecting to be like "FUCK YOU, FUCKER" and then go a ninja spirit quest wherein I would kill him and write some badass-looking kanji with his blood or some shit like that. But he didn't say the batshit insane "video games are responsible for all youth violence" crap that I expected. The closest he came was calling a few games "murder simulators" and instead of "playing" these games, kids "trained" on them. He also said that video games can affect you, which is obviously true because (1) the Army uses them and (2) they're art, and art affects people.

    tl;dr: Seriously, listen to it. He does not actually say a bunch of crazy retarded shit like you'd think he would.

    hello massa, I jar jar binks
    I've overheard someone say "Don't say something is retarded, its not cool to make fun of retards. Just say its gay."
  • denihilistdenihilist tiny, tiny little man live music capitol of the worldAdministrator admin
    edited October 2005
    I really think Rock Star is a fucking cesspool of a game company.

    Grand Theft Auto is super fun though. Strange huh?

    t starfuck, I agree.

  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    Zapf wrote:
    Defender wrote:
    Zapf wrote:
    You know, I don't consider myself to be an expert on US copyright law, but I'm pretty sure Defender is talking shit.

    hes mixing copyright law and trademark law like many other douches on the internet

    I'm repeating what Thompson says. It's his job to know this shit, and I'm taking his word for it that he's right on the legal end, since, you know, it's his JOB, and he's been doing this for DECADES.

    im looking at the us copyright office website and I'm not seeing anything about losing it do to not protecting it. maybe you'd like to cite something other than the crap that spews from jack thompsons mouth?

    Remember the American Greetings thing that happened here at PA? The Strawberry Shortcake comic? A couple news updates later, Tycho came in and explained this exact same thing: If they don't defend their IP when it's infringed, it becomes public domain. So it happened here as well.

    Look, it's this guy's JOB to know this shit. I don't think he's making it up. Especially since it happened here.

    hello massa, I jar jar binks
    I've overheard someone say "Don't say something is retarded, its not cool to make fun of retards. Just say its gay."
  • Penguin IncarnatePenguin Incarnate King of Kafiristan Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    denihilist wrote:
    I really think Rock Star is a fucking cesspool of a game company.

    Grand Theft Auto is super fun though. Strange huh?
    The first two were, San Andreas though pissed me off, "I can now just barely swim, but I still can't climb up ladders. Thank you for pushing the limits, Rockstar."

  • KazhiimKazhiim __BANNED USERS
    edited October 2005
    denihilist wrote:
    Nudity doesn't equal sexual content. It's about time America realized that.

    So true. Fucking Puritans have a grip on society from the grave

    lost_sig2.png
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    Starfuck wrote:
    but, i would rather have rock star around doing what they do rather than have uncle sam step in and start fucking around with this shit. let the industry sort itself out,

    My concern is that fuckheads like RockStar will just abuse the shit out of the system until Uncle Sam gets pissed off enough to step and start fucking around with it, and the industry won't sort itself out on its own fast enough to avoid this.

    Hell, people BOUGHT GTA 1 and 2 for some reason. People bought enough copies of Postal to make a second one. What the FUCK.

    hello massa, I jar jar binks
    I've overheard someone say "Don't say something is retarded, its not cool to make fun of retards. Just say its gay."
  • TarranonTarranon Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    Defender wrote:
    Tarranon wrote:
    man defender. I know you like arguing and stuff. but come on. Jack Thompson? That's a little low, even for devil's advocate.

    I listened to the interview expecting to be like "FUCK YOU, FUCKER" and then go a ninja spirit quest wherein I would kill him and write some badass-looking kanji with his blood or some shit like that. But he didn't say the batshit insane "video games are responsible for all youth violence" crap that I expected. The closest he came was calling a few games "murder simulators" and instead of "playing" these games, kids "trained" on them. He also said that video games can affect you, which is obviously true because (1) the Army uses them and (2) they're art, and art affects people.

    tl;dr: Seriously, listen to it. He does not actually say a bunch of crazy retarded shit like you'd think he would.

    yeah but not to sound like a broken record, it's jack thompson. he has already said so much shit as to make him dead to me. Even if he takes his head out of his ass and apologizes, it will take quite a few months before I even start to listen to whatever he is spewing out of his mouth.

    And what you were talking about with the mods, I don't see any nudity patches being sold on the internet. Isn't that what commercializing means? And even with the blurs taken out, it's basically just a mannequin body. no nipples. no genitalia. so that's nothing to freak over either. As to video games having an effect on people, I think the only thing they've done to me is make me think that it would be pretty nifty to go join the army and do what I do in video games, only to the enemy.

    that last part was a joke. In all seriousness, yeah I probably think guns are a lot cooler than I would have if I never played any army simulation games. Does that make me want to go out and get myself killed over in Iraq by some civilian that's really a suicide bomber? Nah thank ye, suh.

  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    hello massa, I jar jar binks
    I've overheard someone say "Don't say something is retarded, its not cool to make fun of retards. Just say its gay."
  • KazhiimKazhiim __BANNED USERS
    edited October 2005
    The industry can't "sort itself out." Other companies aren't going to come and knock on RockStar's door, telling em to quit dicking around. And a new ratings system SURE as hell won't do shit, Johnny Casual Gamer pays about as much heed to any sort of rating as I pay to Jack Thompson.

    The solution for situations like this in previous industries has been a boycott or govt. intervention. Problem is, a boycott isn't feasable in this situation. And the people like Thompson are only serving to further enrage gamers, rile up supporters, and make video gaming a major political platform that the govt. will be, if anything, quicker to latch onto.

    lost_sig2.png
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    denihilist wrote:
    I really think Rock Star is a fucking cesspool of a game company.

    Grand Theft Auto is super fun though. Strange huh?
    The first two were, San Andreas though pissed me off, "I can now just barely swim, but I still can't climb up ladders. Thank you for pushing the limits, Rockstar."

    The first two?

    I think you mean GTA 3 and Vice City. Those were not the "first two"...go back and try the first two. They suck huge balls.

    hello massa, I jar jar binks
    I've overheard someone say "Don't say something is retarded, its not cool to make fun of retards. Just say its gay."
  • denihilistdenihilist tiny, tiny little man live music capitol of the worldAdministrator admin
    edited October 2005
    [url]http://www.snootysims.com/patch.php[/url]

    That took less time to find than it did to post this message. Granted I found the link on an article about Jack but...

  • KazhiimKazhiim __BANNED USERS
    edited October 2005
    Defender wrote:
    denihilist wrote:
    I really think Rock Star is a fucking cesspool of a game company.

    Grand Theft Auto is super fun though. Strange huh?
    The first two were, San Andreas though pissed me off, "I can now just barely swim, but I still can't climb up ladders. Thank you for pushing the limits, Rockstar."

    The first two?

    I think you mean GTA 3 and Vice City. Those were not the "first two"...go back and try the first two. They suck huge balls.

    You know what the fuck he meant

    lost_sig2.png
  • TarranonTarranon Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    denihilist wrote:
    http://www.snootysims.com/patch.php

    That took less time to find than it did to post this message. Granted I found the link on an article about Jack but...
    that is a dead link good suh.

  • StarfuckStarfuck Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited October 2005
    then what are the options
    is rock star sitting around to get bought out by EA or MS so they an retire?
    and even if they are bought out, any major publisher is going to milk what they do for the money they can make off of it
    we'd see GTA '06 or GTA: The Mars Station or whatever
    i doubt another company would come in, buy them out and just sit on the material because it's "good for the industry".

    really, what options are there at this point
    these games, as childish and immature as they might be (and I like pokemon games) have an audience. an audience that at this point is the mainstream market. people won't just stop buying the games.

    jackfaces
    "If you're going to play tiddly winks, play it with man hole covers."
    - John McCallum
  • denihilistdenihilist tiny, tiny little man live music capitol of the worldAdministrator admin
    edited October 2005
    Defender wrote:

    Yeah that shouldn't be a teen game by the esrb standards. Me, I figure what the hell but I'm out of step with society.

  • denihilistdenihilist tiny, tiny little man live music capitol of the worldAdministrator admin
    edited October 2005
    Tarranon wrote:
    denihilist wrote:
    http://www.snootysims.com/patch.php

    That took less time to find than it did to post this message. Granted I found the link on an article about Jack but...
    that is a dead link good suh.

    I wonder why? EA enforcing it's copyright?

  • kryoptickryoptic Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    Defender wrote:
    Tarranon wrote:
    man defender. I know you like arguing and stuff. but come on. Jack Thompson? That's a little low, even for devil's advocate.

    I listened to the interview expecting to be like "FUCK YOU, FUCKER" and then go a ninja spirit quest wherein I would kill him and write some badass-looking kanji with his blood or some shit like that. But he didn't say the batshit insane "video games are responsible for all youth violence" crap that I expected. The closest he came was calling a few games "murder simulators" and instead of "playing" these games, kids "trained" on them. He also said that video games can affect you, which is obviously true because (1) the Army uses them and (2) they're art, and art affects people.

    tl;dr: Seriously, listen to it. He does not actually say a bunch of crazy retarded shit like you'd think he would.

    He didn't say a bunch of crazy retarded shit, but he wasn't being entirely reasonable(rational?) either. Clearly the ESRB is a problem but it's rather strange how Thompson decided to go after particular game publishers rather than take steps to clean up the ESRB and restricting the sales of games to those of age appropriate to the rating. His comments regarding The Sims and the nudity filter removal is valid, the ESRB should have caught that, but then he goes on about modding, copyright enforcement and collaboration between EA and porn companies with modding the game to include explicit sexual content. I think that he's really missing the point. However, I didn't really find the interview to be all that great so it's kind of hard to accurately discern just what he's trying to say.

  • StarfuckStarfuck Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited October 2005
    i would have jacked off to that at age 12 or so

    jackfaces
    "If you're going to play tiddly winks, play it with man hole covers."
    - John McCallum
  • denihilistdenihilist tiny, tiny little man live music capitol of the worldAdministrator admin
    edited October 2005
    Starfuck wrote:
    then what are the options
    is rock star sitting around to get bought out by EA or MS so they an retire?
    and even if they are bought out, any major publisher is going to milk what they do for the money they can make off of it
    we'd see GTA '06 or GTA: The Mars Station or whatever
    i doubt another company would come in, buy them out and just sit on the material because it's "good for the industry".

    really, what options are there at this point
    these games, as childish and immature as they might be (and I like pokemon games) have an audience. an audience that at this point is the mainstream market. people won't just stop buying the games.

    I would think that the ideal solution is to get a meaningful ratings system in place that is enforced at the point of sale as well as parental involvement.

    Though this has been said for the last 10 years and nothing has really changed.

  • TarranonTarranon Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    kryoptic wrote:
    Defender wrote:
    Tarranon wrote:
    man defender. I know you like arguing and stuff. but come on. Jack Thompson? That's a little low, even for devil's advocate.

    I listened to the interview expecting to be like "FUCK YOU, FUCKER" and then go a ninja spirit quest wherein I would kill him and write some badass-looking kanji with his blood or some shit like that. But he didn't say the batshit insane "video games are responsible for all youth violence" crap that I expected. The closest he came was calling a few games "murder simulators" and instead of "playing" these games, kids "trained" on them. He also said that video games can affect you, which is obviously true because (1) the Army uses them and (2) they're art, and art affects people.

    tl;dr: Seriously, listen to it. He does not actually say a bunch of crazy retarded shit like you'd think he would.

    He didn't say a bunch of crazy retarded shit, but he wasn't being entirely reasonable(rational?) either. Clearly the ESRB is a problem but it's rather strange how Thompson decided to go after particular game publishers rather than take steps to clean up the ESRB and restricting the sales of games to those of age appropriate to the rating. His comments regarding The Sims and the nudity filter removal is valid, the ESRB should have caught that, but then he goes on about modding, copyright enforcement and collaboration between EA and porn companies with modding the game to include explicit sexual content. I think that he's really missing the point. However, I didn't really find the interview to be all that great so it's kind of hard to accurately discern just what he's trying to say.
    yeah but there's nothing behind the nudity bar. And even then, what was ESRB supposed to do? If it could have been removed, it's up to EA to tell them that the option is there. ESRB can't be expected to find every little snippet of every little game that could alter the rating.

  • The Geebs That Got BigtimedThe Geebs That Got Bigtimed Super Moderator, Moderator mod
    edited October 2005
    Wal-Mart checked my ID when I bought Blues Bros.

    Pb6cUzZ.pngTeRnRlj.pnglBMZaaL.pnglm0oV4l.pngsw4UHsU.png
  • StarfuckStarfuck Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited October 2005
    the ESRB is jacked up though
    even with movies

    the stores enforcing the ratings isn't the biggest problem. it's mom and pop nopayattention that just blindly buy a game without checking the rating. it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that if a game/movie has a Mature rating maybe you're 13 yr old shouldn't be playing it. then when billy fuckedinthehead parents find him killing hookers for cash they get all upset that this is a game. many parents are still under the impression that all games are for kids.

    jackfaces
    "If you're going to play tiddly winks, play it with man hole covers."
    - John McCallum
  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    Tarranon wrote:
    yeah but not to sound like a broken record, it's jack thompson. he has already said so much shit as to make him dead to me. Even if he takes his head out of his ass and apologizes, it will take quite a few months before I even start to listen to whatever he is spewing out of his mouth.

    OK. Well, the thing is, I haven't heard everything he's said. This is the first long block of non-sound-bite speech I've had from him, the first time he's been able to speak at length without being taken out of context or attacked or given a spin. And he didn't sound ridiculous. I understand that he's been advocating some borderline stuff (mostly censorship issues), and maybe you're just not able to listen to him anymore. That happens.
    Tarranon wrote:
    And what you were talking about with the mods, I don't see any nudity patches being sold on the internet. Isn't that what commercializing means? And even with the blurs taken out, it's basically just a mannequin body. no nipples. no genitalia. so that's nothing to freak over either. As to video games having an effect on people, I think the only thing they've done to me is make me think that it would be pretty nifty to go join the army and do what I do in video games, only to the enemy.

    The mods that Thompson talks about have erect penes and all the rest.

    Here's a non-Barbie nude woman: NSFW

    I don't know what's being "sold" or what's being used commercially to attract traffic/advertising or whatever. That's just what he said. And so far there've been a few things he said that you guys have doubted that have turned out to be true.
    Tarranon wrote:
    that last part was a joke. In all seriousness, yeah I probably think guns are a lot cooler than I would have if I never played any army simulation games. Does that make me want to go out and get myself killed over in Iraq by some civilian that's really a suicide bomber? Nah thank ye, suh.

    OK, but the Army apparently thinks that games are a useful recruitment tool. And since games are art, I believe that they can be used to communicate a message.

    EDIT: OK, you can't hotlink that image. Hold on...

    EDIT 2: HOST'd

    hello massa, I jar jar binks
    I've overheard someone say "Don't say something is retarded, its not cool to make fun of retards. Just say its gay."
  • kryoptickryoptic Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    Tarranon wrote:
    kryoptic wrote:
    He didn't say a bunch of crazy retarded shit, but he wasn't being entirely reasonable(rational?) either. Clearly the ESRB is a problem but it's rather strange how Thompson decided to go after particular game publishers rather than take steps to clean up the ESRB and restricting the sales of games to those of age appropriate to the rating. His comments regarding The Sims and the nudity filter removal is valid, the ESRB should have caught that, but then he goes on about modding, copyright enforcement and collaboration between EA and porn companies with modding the game to include explicit sexual content. I think that he's really missing the point. However, I didn't really find the interview to be all that great so it's kind of hard to accurately discern just what he's trying to say.
    yeah but there's nothing behind the nudity bar. And even then, what was ESRB supposed to do? If it could have been removed, it's up to EA to tell them that the option is there. ESRB can't be expected to find every little snippet of every little game that could alter the rating.

    That is a hard one to solve. The only thing that I can think of is go through all of the game's assets to find any obvious nudity. Although as mentioned, nudity is not necessarily sexual. And even then, it could be programmatically generated, although I really doubt that it'd be worth the extra effort just to sneak in some boobs.

  • denihilistdenihilist tiny, tiny little man live music capitol of the worldAdministrator admin
    edited October 2005
    Tarranon wrote:
    ESRB can't be expected to find every little snippet of every little game that could alter the rating.

    But that is what a ratings board is for. Or at least it used to be. Interactive media is a new realm and needs new rules to govern it. Emergent behavior makes it impossible to maintain a rating because the game evolves.

    Should the publisher/developer control that evolution so that the rating maintains its accuracy or should the expectation be that the rating is for the game, in box as is without any user manipulation?

    Personally I think it should be the latter and I'm sure that most gamers would agree. Unfortunately, we're not making these laws.

  • DefenderDefender Registered User regular
    edited October 2005
    denihilist wrote:
    Tarranon wrote:
    ESRB can't be expected to find every little snippet of every little game that could alter the rating.

    But that is what a ratings board is for. Or at least it used to be. Interactive media is a new realm and needs new rules to govern it. Emergent behavior makes it impossible to maintain a rating because the game evolves.

    Should the publisher/developer control that evolution so that the rating maintains its accuracy or should the expectation be that the rating is for the game, in box as is without any user manipulation?

    Personally I think it should be the latter and I'm sure that most gamers would agree. Unfortunately, we're not making these laws.

    See, this is where we get problems. I guess there could be a way around it, though...for non-internet games. Shit, man. This is SO HARD to prove. OK, let's look at this: We need to rate Game X. We cannot know, as of when we give the rating, what the "full" content is. So.

    If we have to change ratings later because of "hidden" adult content, we fine the shit out of the company. We also keep several copies of the version of the game that we rated, and if we find that it differs from the version we buy in stores, or if it gets "patched" into pornoland, we fine the shit out of the company.

    Now, if it's a game where some content is always online, like an MMO or something, then they could always hide the porn when we go to look, so that makes some games unratable. We'd need people constantly spot-checking games for porno. God, this is a HUGE task.

    @Kryoptic: Yeah, he was kinda crusading against RockStar/Take Two instead of just trying to solve the problem. They do kind of act like magnets for that shit though.

    hello massa, I jar jar binks
    I've overheard someone say "Don't say something is retarded, its not cool to make fun of retards. Just say its gay."
  • The Geebs That Got BigtimedThe Geebs That Got Bigtimed Super Moderator, Moderator mod
    edited October 2005
    He's less crusading against Take Two/Rockstar than he is trying to implicate the rest of the industry as being exactly like them.

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This discussion has been closed.