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I partially agree with this. In short, when I interview a candidate I don't assume he knows a lot from school. In fact, I'm pretty sure he knows dick. The reality is, though, I have to trust that the school has taught him HOW to learn. If the student has cheated through his exams to get an artificially high GPA, then that undermines that assumption.
The result is that I have a fucking idiot on my team that can't do his job. He or she has wasted my time, my company's money training him, and worse still I have the fire the retard and go find ANOTHER candidate who hopefully didn't cheat his or her way through engineering classes because it was hard.
Is that your photobucket?
Someone had a similar idea, I guess, during this last round of finals. During my hardest test, I asked to go to the bathroom because I needed a breather. I opened a stall and happened to find the notes to everything we had done all semester. I didn't actually use it because I was rushed for time, but that was an impressive stack of paper to be hiding in the bathroom.
The time of night is making me try to read that middle sentence and having trouble.
I understand that you sometimes got text books, and sometimes didn't but the usually needed them? I'm a little lost, you mean you should've had access when you didn't? I'm genuinely confused, not trying to be a dick.
some things changed, though -- I remember an acquaintance snapping in college when I asked him for the third time if I could borrow his notes because I'd been skipping all my classes
I'm still a loser, though
some things never change
no i completely agree with you that it proved your point about cheaters. if they can make it all the way through med school on cheating then holy shit they must be some fucking good at cheating. that'd be unheard of since many of the exams are practical exams where you actually have to... you know... do medical stuff not just write a test.
your grandfather thinks he learned all he knows about medicine from med school?
jesus that has to be some sort of first...
i wasn't saying the guy was right about cheating, i was saying he was right about the fact that most written exams are kind of silly because never in your life are you going to be in a situation where you have no reference, you just have to memorize a bunch of shit to regurgitate it onto a scantron sheet in the span of 2 hours. It's sort of counter-intuitive to how the real working world works in pretty much all professions.
hang on
hang on,
there is more than one dave, holy fucking shit
I can't take any of you seriously when you try and tell me that not memorizing a formula for an exam means I wasn't meant to be in university. This is like Teefs assuming all companies turn into Wal-Mart if they're not unionized. It's a lot of fuckers speaking without having work experience behind them.
It's funny you bring up the doctor example. I have a friend that has just gotten done with his first year at med school. He says that he has yet to learn anything practical, and that most of the stuff he's learned that is practical was learned outside of med school.
asking for notes isn't cheating
yeah i got a lot of med school/ practicing friends
i was supposed to be amongst them but i quit in my undergrad and became some sort of renegade artist.
mechanical?
cause i was referring specifically to heat transfer.
t zonky: Common first year, then specialization next year.
Belongs to Aaneurhythmia, another poster around here. I came across it in the Stale party thread.
oh god this girl almost killed me once cause i borrowed her notes and returned them all out of order
she was soooo anal too
like, used color coded highlighters for her own handwritten nots
Still copying from others, huh?
you're basically taking someone's implied attendance mark
Uh, what. I've been working since I was like 8 years old, when I answered phones and filed papers for my dad's insurance agency. When I couldn't get a real job, I sold candy at school. I shredded papers for my mom's job. I loaded soda machines. I stuffed newspapers into bags. In college, I worked three jobs: two on campus doing graphic design and writing/editing, and one off campus at a movie theater. And I went to school full time. And then I worked at a couple of crappy office jobs while tutoring kids in my spare time. And now I make a ton of money as a real estate appraiser because I REMEMBERED ALL THE MATH I LEARNED IN SCHOOL even though I majored in English. So I guess memorizing those formulas worked out for me.
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Hey this is a sick burn just coming here to say that la~
oh, just saw this
yes, this is what i meant.
Since when does one person design/build a forty story building? Or a bridge? You can't even write a magazine article without it being looked over/edited by someone else. What major doesn't have projects, papers, or oral presentations throughout the years that force you to prove you know something about the class besides filling in little bubbles on a sheet of paper.
I bet there are a lot of a really talented people that cheated through school, and a lot of total fuckwits that muscled through the old-fashioned way (fifteen miles in the snow uphill both ways chased by velociraptors).
I had kids cheating all over my shit in Elementary/Middle/occasionally high school, and I understand the vitriol for those who cheat, because who the fuck do those dudes think they are getting the same reward for less work, right? But I think it's naive to say that someone who cheats his way through college is by default inept in their eventual profession.
LoL: j0hnh4m
Not saying my grandfather learned everything he knew in med school, but he certainly seemed to have learned a lot more than most. He's an old dude, what can I say, apparently things have changed.
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That is generally how I think of it.
If you don't cheat at all, that's something you can be proud of. If you had to, it probably only helped a little bit, at most it is the difference between a C and a D. No one gets through school by relying on cheating, and you aren't going to pass at all if you haven't learned the majority of the material.
So I have no problem with letting people cheat, because no one is suddenly going to get straight A's that they don't deserve. Not possible.
Like if everyone does incredibly poorly for instance, something something.
Actually, I did sink a group of Indians once who were cheating off of me. I had a habit of blazing through SCANTRON tests and turning them in with high scores. I noticed one cheating off of me so I fucked up half of the answers and waited for that guy to go turn in the test. I didn't know they were all cheating off of me. He turned the test in right when I got to the last answer, followed by his buddies. I then erased all of my mistakes and put in the right answers.
They were unhappy, but didn't do anything more than "a bloo bloo" when I walked by and then would be quiet when I looked at them. I helped out one of their girls, though, when she had a flat tire so they stopped being hostile.
There was no other way I could pass art history and I wasn't going to make the financial mistake of dropping it twice. She was not bad looking anyway, in a mid-fourties "Are You Trying to Seduce Me Mrs. Robinson" art teacher kinda way.
BTW, why the hell do they make art history so damn hard? It's like they're trying to get back at the world.
I've never had to deal with an implied attendance mark, all I ever had was projects, assignments and exams. Half the time getting the notes off the internet and not going to the lecture was a better option.
sadly i still remember everything about the Articles of the Confederation. (im CS major) useless.....
if you don't cheat you aren't necessarily not dumb
fin~
sometimes, sometimes not.
what gets me is that you are being tested on understanding the material, and demonstrating your ability to apply that materia.
but if you can't remember the formulas, you can't answer the questions.
so now you're being tested on memorization skills
which aren't relevant, in my opinion.
basically, all the teachers that knew wtf they were doing never required memorization, the ones that didn't know how to teach thought it was a great way to judge progress.
cheating can make a huge difference even if you're an A student
Fantastic
My school seems to know what is up, and haven't been fucking pricks about what to include, they leave basic shit off the formula sheets and include the more complex formulas, so you should've done things with the more basic ones a thousand times already and know them, the harder ones you should understand what they mean and don't give any advantage to someone who doesn't know the rudimentary stuff.
I think it sets a scary precedent... if you're cheating on an exam, then that exam is not accurately reflecting your knowledge and ability. So how do you prove that you know what you're doing? You work, obviously, but what is the point of school and testing if you're just going to learn everything on the job anyway? And moreover, at that point then the only way to tell whether someone knows what they're doing is by seeing whether they fail. Again, I find that scary.
I mean, maybe the solution is to go back to apprenticeships all around?
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woah
If faith is just a silent tribute, mine is just a desperate act.