Power Gamer ++ : Am I Stuck This Way?

MayGodHaveMercy

I have a tendency to love powergaming, having super-badass weaponry, and Armor that, by all rights, shouldn't be allowed. I find that when we powergame though, we end up outgrowing the D&D world rather quickly. It's like, "Hmm, better throw in a few Tarasque clones, so we have a challenge."


TL;DR - I'm looking for tips on how to enjoy playing D&D (3.5e) the proper way, without having super mega awesome characters everytime.

Sub-Discussion: As a DM, when a character a player really likes dies, do you find a way to bring him back, or do you usually "suggest" a re-roll?

Thanatos

In 3.5, you have the option of shelling out to bring your character back, and taking the experience hit, or re-rolling.

Personally, if someone re-rolls, I put them at the point where they'd be if they had raised their character, minus the experience for the adventure where they died, unless they've died multiple times, in which case I let them re-roll at a bit lower than everyone else in order to get out of the death spiral.

An easy way to prevent power-gaming is to stick to what the book gives you. If the players defeat something, give them the treasure out of the book. Limit them to a point-buy system (I personally like about 28 points), so good rolls aren't going to define the character.

Yoshua

Now me, I tend to go for interesting over powerful. If interesting happens to be powerful, then it's just a happy accident for me.

I'd pick to play a necromancer in a Ravenloft campaign in a heartbeat.

I cheer for early haunts in games of Betrayal at the House on the Hill.

Conditional_Axe

MayGodHaveMercy wrote:

I have a tendency to love powergaming, having super-badass weaponry, and Armor that, by all rights, shouldn't be allowed. I find that when we powergame though, we end up outgrowing the D&D world rather quickly. It's like, "Hmm, better throw in a few Tarasque clones, so we have a challenge."


TL;DR - I'm looking for tips on how to enjoy playing D&D (3.5e) the proper way, without having super mega awesome characters everytime.

Sub-Discussion: As a DM, when a character a player really likes dies, do you find a way to bring him back, or do you usually "suggest" a re-roll?

I don't see anything wrong with having good gear, so long as there's still actual roleplaying going on. Especially in D&D.

As to your subquestion, I'd do both. Have them try out a new character, and design an adventure arc that could lead to the old character coming back. It's probably best to talk to the player out of game to see if it's even an option they want to consider.

In a game I ran not long ago, the tank in the party was a hobgoblin samurai. He was disintegrated by the main villain, who then escaped into a Gate, which the party leader impetuously followed him through in order to mete out justice for killing her guardian. Going significantly off book, I decided to make the new plane an alternate reality in which historical events developed much differently. After a few sessions in this plane, they find the hobgoblin, who is now an assassin and generally wants to kill the party. After sufficient roleplay, I turned the hobgoblin back over to the original player, and he rejoined the party. The same character, but radically different stat-wise.

MayGodHaveMercy

Conditional_Axe wrote:

MayGodHaveMercy wrote:

I have a tendency to love powergaming, having super-badass weaponry, and Armor that, by all rights, shouldn't be allowed. I find that when we powergame though, we end up outgrowing the D&D world rather quickly. It's like, "Hmm, better throw in a few Tarasque clones, so we have a challenge."


TL;DR - I'm looking for tips on how to enjoy playing D&D (3.5e) the proper way, without having super mega awesome characters everytime.

Sub-Discussion: As a DM, when a character a player really likes dies, do you find a way to bring him back, or do you usually "suggest" a re-roll?

I don't see anything wrong with having good gear, so long as there's still actual roleplaying going on. Especially in D&D.

As to your subquestion, I'd do both. Have them try out a new character, and design an adventure arc that could lead to the old character coming back. It's probably best to talk to the player out of game to see if it's even an option they want to consider.

In a game I ran not long ago, the tank in the party was a hobgoblin samurai. He was disintegrated by the main villain, who then escaped into a Gate, which the party leader impetuously followed him through in order to mete out justice for killing her guardian. Going significantly off book, I decided to make the new plane an alternate reality in which historical events developed much differently. After a few sessions in this plane, they find the hobgoblin, who is now an assassin and generally wants to kill the party. After sufficient roleplay, I turned the hobgoblin back over to the original player, and he rejoined the party. The same character, but radically different stat-wise.

Oh, I like that. Very nice. See, I have a bit of trouble with on-the-fly DMing, as I'm pretty new at it. I guess the first time my players did something completely unexpected, I was sort of lost.

Can anyone point me to a, uh... well, anything that explains a point buy system? Or is it 1 pt = 1 stat, no matter what? I know in some PC games based (loosely) on D&D, stats get more expensive once you get past 12 or so. For example, from 10 to 11 costs 1 point, but from 16 to 17, you're going to spend 2 or 3...

Conditional_Axe

the dungeon master's guide covers the standard point buy. points start at 8, and are 1 for 1 up until I think 15 or so. I rarely use point buy, so I could be wrong.

Thanatos

MayGodHaveMercy wrote:

Can anyone point me to a, uh... well, anything that explains a point buy system? Or is it 1 pt = 1 stat, no matter what? I know in some PC games based (loosely) on D&D, stats get more expensive once you get past 12 or so. For example, from 10 to 11 costs 1 point, but from 16 to 17, you're going to spend 2 or 3...

Generally, every stat has a base of 8, and you can't go lower than that. Then, you get X points to spend. To increase a stat up to 14 is one point per stat point; to buy your 15th or 16th point is two points per stat point, and to buy your 17th and 18th point is three points per stat point.

I like to go with 28 points with which to buy stats. It's slightly more powerful than the book recommends, without being totally over-the-top.

Litejedi

MayGodHaveMercy wrote:

Conditional_Axe wrote:

MayGodHaveMercy wrote:

I have a tendency to love powergaming, having super-badass weaponry, and Armor that, by all rights, shouldn't be allowed. I find that when we powergame though, we end up outgrowing the D&D world rather quickly. It's like, "Hmm, better throw in a few Tarasque clones, so we have a challenge."


TL;DR - I'm looking for tips on how to enjoy playing D&D (3.5e) the proper way, without having super mega awesome characters everytime.

Sub-Discussion: As a DM, when a character a player really likes dies, do you find a way to bring him back, or do you usually "suggest" a re-roll?

I don't see anything wrong with having good gear, so long as there's still actual roleplaying going on. Especially in D&D.

As to your subquestion, I'd do both. Have them try out a new character, and design an adventure arc that could lead to the old character coming back. It's probably best to talk to the player out of game to see if it's even an option they want to consider.

In a game I ran not long ago, the tank in the party was a hobgoblin samurai. He was disintegrated by the main villain, who then escaped into a Gate, which the party leader impetuously followed him through in order to mete out justice for killing her guardian. Going significantly off book, I decided to make the new plane an alternate reality in which historical events developed much differently. After a few sessions in this plane, they find the hobgoblin, who is now an assassin and generally wants to kill the party. After sufficient roleplay, I turned the hobgoblin back over to the original player, and he rejoined the party. The same character, but radically different stat-wise.

Oh, I like that. Very nice. See, I have a bit of trouble with on-the-fly DMing, as I'm pretty new at it. I guess the first time my players did something completely unexpected, I was sort of lost.

Can anyone point me to a, uh... well, anything that explains a point buy system? Or is it 1 pt = 1 stat, no matter what? I know in some PC games based (loosely) on D&D, stats get more expensive once you get past 12 or so. For example, from 10 to 11 costs 1 point, but from 16 to 17, you're going to spend 2 or 3...

It works as follows: Base 8 in all stats. One point per increase in a stat to 14, two points to get to 15, two more to get to 16, three to get to 17, three more to get to 18, caps at 18. This is all BEFORE racial ability score modifiers.

For example: A human fighter starts off with
Str 8
Dex 8
Con 8
Int 8
Wis 8
Cha 8

Let's say he wants more str, con, dex, a non-negative int, and some wisdom. And he's got 28 points to play with
Str 16 Cost: 10 points
Dex 12 Cost: 4 points
Con 14 Cost: 6 points
Int 12 Cost: 4 points
Wis 12 Cost: 4 points
Cha 8 Cost: 0 points

Thanatos

Point-buy also makes the demi-human races relatively more powerful.

I'm not saying it's good or bad, but anything with a stat bonus gets significantly better than it is with straight rolling. Something to keep in mind.

Litejedi

Thanatos wrote:

Point-buy also makes the demi-human races relatively more powerful.

I'm not saying it's good or bad, but anything with a stat bonus gets significantly better than it is with straight rolling. Something to keep in mind.

But you will find that characters that go against the grain, like orc wizards and halfling fighters, are a little bit more difficult to get "oomph" out of.

Gaddez

A good solution for Players who wind up powergaming, is to put them into RP's that have very little combat, and instead make them play out there characters a little better. :wink:

Athenor

Gaddez wrote:

A good solution for Players who wind up powergaming, is to put them into RP's that have very little combat, and instead make them play out there characters a little better. :wink:

Shame all my players powergamed through roleplaying manipulation and such. =P

Still, not a bad idea in general. The worst of the worst powergamers might leave, but the ones that are reformable will take to it alright.

MayGodHaveMercy

I'm the powergamer in question, here. When I'm not DMing. I definitely think I'm reformable, though. I mean, I think the DM I was playing with, along with the other player (just 3 people), kind of tended towards the powergaming side of things, without meaning to.