Housebreaking Two Puppies

ThrillaGorilla

After nine years and twelve different dorms/apartments/rental homes I have finally purchased a home. With that comes a backyard, and with that comes my dream of finally getting some dogs. I purchased two Corgis from a breed about two months ago, and they are now about four months old. For the most part the dogs are very well behaved and haven't destroyed much. My problem now is I can not seem to get them to understand that outside is where you do your business. I see some small improvements in their behavior like going to the door when they want out, but even then it's iffy. I have yet to learn the difference between I need to go out to mess, I am just sitting here, and I want to go out to play. These are the first dogs I have raised own so I am in need of help.

My main problem is that I am the only person who lives at the house so they are left alone from 8:30 to 6:30 M-F. I have read that this may be too long to crate a dog so I leave them in my master bathroom when I am gone, which gives them a little room to play in. I typically put down newspaper in the area they typically go in, but most evenings I spend 10-20 minutes and half a roll of paper towels cleaning up where they have pooped and then drug the newspaper around, or just pooped in a place where there is no newspaper. I have tried puppy pads, but they don't use them and the filler in those is incredibly annoying to clean up. I keep hearing from people that they should start to get it by now, but it just seems like I am banging my head against the wall. It is looking like crating is my last option, but it doesn't seem right. Maybe I have too much of a bleeding heart...

So I come to you H/A. Has anyone had experience house breaking two dogs at once? Am I doomed to crating the dogs for 10+ hours each day?

Edit: Image added for awwwwww

Gnome-Interruptus

Have you considered getting an anchor or two and leashing them outside during the daytime? Or constructing a dog run?

Also, you might have good luck house breaking them if you make a point to take them outside every hour or two, then make sure they go pee or whatever, then give them a treat when they get back inside.

If you are still having them use paper, you need to stop that as soon as possible. Or maybe start placing paper at the door and when you see them go to use it, let them outside.

ThrillaGorilla

I had thought about keeping them outside, but they tear up my lawn good when they're out (another thing we are working on) so I choose cleaning up the bathroom over that. When I am home we tend to go out about once an hour, and I keep treats on hand so they are awarded as soon as they do their business. I'm wary about no paper at all, but I will try putting some down in front of the door so they hopefully start making the association.

Heir

Make sure to accompany them outside and praise them vocally and with treats as soon as they go (just keep some treats in your pocket).

If they go inside and you catch them in the act, then sternly tell them no. If you don't catch them going, I've always been told to yell at the pee/poop. Supposedly the dogs will learn that it doesn't belong there.


Have you considered leaving them in the kitchen when you're gone? I assume it's tile, so at least it would be easier to clean.

Make sure you use some kind of carpet cleaner that has enzymes that breaks down the scent left by their waste. That will help to stop them from thinking they can keep going in your room because of the smell.

Gaffer

My suggestions:

1). Let the animals out frequently. As puppies their bladders are small and their control of it is still developing. 2). Be patient. Praise and reward proper poop ettiquette and try not to criticize your corgis (smacking or yelling at them) if they have an accident. Positive reinforcement of behaviors is best here. I'd also try learning the signals each dog is giving when they want out. This can be handy in catching them in the act and praising their action -- outside of course!
3). Speak with your vet and/or an animal trainer (or enthusiast) for their strategies. Everybody seems to have a definitive way to approach this problem and many work well.


Good luck!

OremLK

I don't have any experience paper training dogs, but I do know that at four months they're still bound to have a really hard time holding it. Ten hours is a really long time for a dog that age. Even if you crate them, there's a chance they will still go inside the crate because they simply can't hold it in any longer. (You see this kind of thing in the puppy sections of animal shelters all the time.)

They're adorable, by the way. My dog is a 9-month-old Corgi mix and she looks a bit like yours. If it helps, she only pretty recently stopped having accidents, although they became less frequent the older she got.

Quid

I'd recommend an outside kennel. It doesn't have to be especially big, just a fenced in, preferably covered area in the backyard.

In Starscream We Trust

At 4 months they need to be taken out at least every 5 hours. For the first year a general guideline is age in months + 1 for how long they can hold it. Are you able to come home for work, or is there someone you know who can take them out? This will help in their house breaking. At this age it's extremely difficult for a dog of this size to hold out that long.

Also, when you feed your puppies it is important to take them out for a walk around 15 minutes after they eat. This will help establish repetition and the dog will understand that eat --> go outside for potty. Do you have multiple doors that lead to your yard? Try using the same door every time they need to go potty to help reinforce this.

What is your feeding schedule like? Are you leaving food and water out for them while you are gone? One of the things I found out quick when my corgi was a pup was if we left water out all the time he would have more accidents. If you control when you put water down (and walk them soon after) you should see the results you want. I don't know if I would recommend keeping water from them all day long because they're puppies and they are going to be playing though.

Also take treats when you take them to go potty. When they potty outside give them praise (good boy!) and give them a treat. Corgis are a breed that want to make you happy and they'll pick on quick once food is involved.

Kate of Lokys

Honestly... I'm surprised a breeder would have sold you puppies if he knew you were going to be out of the house for 10 hours at a stretch every day. I'd be even more surprised if he didn't ask about that at all. When I adopted my cat from the local Humane Society, I had to fill out a five-page application form to demonstrate both my existing knowledge of pets, and my degree of commitment to them, and one of the most prominent questions on the form dealt with how long I planned on leaving my cat unattended at home on an average day. In my case, it was 1-2 hours: I'm lucky enough to have my boyfriend living with me, and he works from home, so the only time Aleph is left unattended is when he and I go out shopping. If I didn't have him here, I would not have adopted a pet, because there are days when I'm on campus for 8+ hours straight, and that much alone time is a recipe for a lonely, fucked-up kitty. In your case, you have two dogs, which helps a bit with the social/anti-boredom aspects of it, but still.

Most dogs pick up on the basic "do not poop/pee inside" rule pretty quickly. The problem is, yours can't demonstrate knowledge of that because there's no physical way for them to not void their bladders and/or bowels when they're stuck inside for 10 hours straight. Putting them in a crate is absolutely not the solution either, because then they'll just be forced to shit their crates, which will make them all manner of miserable. They probably already know, on some level, that pissing on the newspaper is suboptimal, but they have no alternative.

Is there any way you could come home during your lunch breaks? Failing that, are there any trustworthy neighbourhood kids you could pay $20 per week to let your pups out during their lunch breaks? Failing that, your only other option would be to make sure the dogs have access to the outside world, either by building them a full outdoor kennel, or by enclosing a small area right outside the back door, and using a cat door.

Whatever you do, you cannot expect them to be able to cross their little legs for 10 hours straight. Locking them in a room where it's OK for them to shit themselves is unfair to them, and it sends all manner of mixed messages in terms of housebreaking.

LadyM

Can you come home at lunch and let them out or hire a dog walker? Or how about "doggy daycare"? A lot of grown dogs can't hold their bladders ten hours; the chance of a puppy holding it that long is almost zero.

BTW, make sure you spend time with each individual puppy, playing and training, or else they'll bond with each other more than you and then they'll be more difficult to train.

Trowizilla

You shouldn't have gotten dogs if you weren't going to be home much, especially not young puppies, and ESPECIALLY not two of them.

I don't suppose it'd do much good lecturing you, though: you've already got them, now you have to try to deal with the mess.

You need to either get home yourself or hire someone to take your puppies out in the middle of the day. Their bladders are tiny and it's incredibly unfair to try to make them hold their pee for 10 hours a day. I wouldn't even expect that of an adult human, much less a puppy. Doggy daycare would be a good idea, too. Yes, this will be expensive. If you can't afford it, look into rehoming your dogs while they're still young, cute, and relatively un-fucked-up.

Take them out every hour when you're home, whether they're acting like they have to go or not. When they do eliminate outside, praise them as much as possible. Throw a party over them, pet them, use a high-pitched "baby" voice to tell them how good they are. Taking them out so often is going to be annoying for you, but you'll deal with it.

I know dogs are adorable, but they're also a tremendous responsibility, and if you can't do right by them, you need to find them a new home.

onceling

Yeah, as the others have said, you need someone to come at least once, if not twice while you are gone.

Additionally to help with this problem I recommend 30 minutes of brisk walking with them before you leave in the morning and of course a nice good hour of walking and play time in the evening when you get home. This can help encourage them to realise that there's a time to go potty in the morning on the walk and in the evening as soon as you get home. This will help with them tearing up the lawn and such as well, they sound bored out of their mind.

And no, you can't just throw toys for them in the yard in the morning, they need varied fresh walks in different directions, make it very brisk to tire them out so they sleep for a few hours after you leave. This will help with the loneliness too.

ThrillaGorilla

First, thank you all for the responses. It looks like my best bet is to find a pet sitting service that could take the dogs for a walk during the afternoon so they don't have to be locked up for ten hours and forced to hold it/mess in their area. I've already contacted a few in my area to check on pricing and services. Luckily money is not that big of an issue so this may be the best option. I may also check with family members close by to see if they would be available. If I could come home during my lunch break I would be doing that, I know the situation is not ideal. Good advice about the walking too, I had not thought to take them for one in the morning, but it looks like my morning schedule needs to be tweaked.

To answer some other questions, and maybe get some more tailored advice the dogs are kept in a tiled bathroom and have about 100 sq ft of room to run around in and play (give or take). I feed them on a very strict schedule, once at 7:30 and then again at 6:30 when I get home. After they eat I wait ten minutes and then take them out until they do their business. I give them water on a similar regimen, but normally they get that several times a night after playing, or a few minutes before I plan on taking them out. I do not just leave the water out at night for this reason. I do occasionally let them out by themselves, but it sounds like the advice is to always go out with them so the behavior is reinforced 100% of the time. During the day I leave them with a small amount of water so they aren't parched, but not enough for them to down it all and then go nuts on my tile.

Also, for those who have taken the time to tell me what a horrible decision this was on my part I understand the concern, but I believe I am doing right by the dogs. I knew going into the situation that it would be tough, but these dogs have a great home with lots of love. To say that someone in my situation (unmarried, working full-time) can not raise well-behaved, healthy and happy puppies is ignorant. It can be done, but there are more challenges. The reason I got two was so they would not develop the social problems that typically comes with leaving one dog alone for hour and hours each day. Again I knew this would add some more challenges when it came to training two at once. I am working with them separately to develop good habits, and I have adjusted the way I reinforce their behaviors after doing a lot of research. And like I said in my original post this was not a snap decision. For nine years (I am now 27) I have thought about getting dogs, but I knew with living in an apartment/dorm/rental and transitioning from college to the real world that was not a fair situation to my pets. I understand the huge responsibility that I have taken, and this was not done because I saw some puppies and fell in wuv. Now I am in a stable home, with plenty of space (hardwood and tiling pretty much throughout), a decent sized backyard and the means to give them what they need. Once they get older I will be investing in a doogy-door so they are free to go outside as needed when I am not at home. So please keep the lecturing to a minimum, I am looking for advice on how to handle the situation while keeping the dogs.

Trowizilla

It's good that you're committed to working with them, but dogs require more than love and a big house. They need time and supervision, and the problem you're having right now stems from a lack of them. Of course a single person working full time can raise dogs well, but you're going to have to put a lot more effort into it.

Bear in mind that it's dangerous to leave dogs alone in the yard, particularly smallish purebreeds. They do get stolen, either to be re-sold or for use as bait dogs. Some people think this is worth the risk and leave their dogs outside without supervision every day, but you might want to think about it.

mts

don't leave dogs outside all day

one option since you have a fenced yard is to get a dog door installed, it allows them to go in an out when needed . We rent but have had a dog door since we first got our pup. now i would never not want to have it. THey have models that insert themselves into sliding glass patio doors.

i just read you were waiting for them to get older to get a door. 4 months old is plenty old enough get one. we started ours on the dog door at about that age and they are quick to learn then. our neighbors dogs won't use it when we watch them, so you risk that if you wait for them to be older.

2 dogs will be more work , but honestly they will keep each other company which is good. dogs need to be socialized.
definitely limiting their access at that age is key. it limits area of destruction and clean up if they are still going inside. we used to gate off the pup in the kitchen since it was the only place with out carpet. so good on you there.

routines are key. sounds like you have one which is great. do you leave water out during the day? do they make it through the night without needing to go outside?

you can always try using the bell technique. hang a bell at nose height on the back door, ring it with their paw right before you let them out to pee. eventually they learn that they ring the bell when they need to go out. though corgis are smart and will learn that bell means going out in general and will ring it for that all the time.

the best advice i can give for training is to just be consistent. also try to vary walks and stuff up. i swear my dog has OCD and only wants to walk a certain way, and will refuse to walk any other way.

good luck. make sure you get them out to meet other dogs once they are all vaccinated. enjoy them

supabeast

they are left alone from 8:30 to 6:30 M-F

You should never have been allowed to buy puppies in the first place. Now you need to be responsible and start spending money on the issue. Buy crates, start crate training the dogs, and hire a dog walker to come by and walk the dogs during the day. Once they’re a year old they might be able to go ten hours without going out, or can at least learn to use pads. Until then, you’re going to be spending $20-$40 a day to get someone else to walk them for you.