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If you donate a Kidney to your wife, then get Divorced. can you take that back?

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Posts

  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic I've Done Worse Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    Because organs belong to the people who made them, and they are the ones who should decide what to do with them, yes, even after they die. Taking them out of their bodies when they have not given any instruction as to how they want them to be handled is the equivalent of grave robbing.


    Feral you can lose your house, you can lose your car, you can lose your wife, but please don't lose your mind.
    My parents do not own my organs.

    Moreover Feral isn't saying "Fill out 72 pages in triplicate" he's saying Driver's license apps would have a box on them that says "I do not want my organs taken after I die if I check this box, otherwise go ahead."

    I can deal with having to check a box every 9 years or so if it means even one more person lives who wouldn't.

    Trogg wrote: »
    Not as positive as AIDS and cancer, but positive nonetheless.

    PSN: QuipFilter
  • ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited January 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    Because organs belong to the people who made them, and they are the ones who should decide what to do with them, yes, even after they die. Taking them out of their bodies when they have not given any instruction as to how they want them to be handled is the equivalent of grave robbing.


    Feral you can lose your house, you can lose your car, you can lose your wife, but please don't lose your mind.
    My parents do not own my organs.

    Moreover Feral isn't saying "Fill out 72 pages in triplicate" he's saying Driver's license apps would have a box on them that says "I do not want my organs taken after I die if I check this box, otherwise go ahead."

    I can deal with having to check a box every 9 years or so if it means even one more person lives who wouldn't.


    Whoa, every 9 years?

    And here I thought he was just talking about a one time opt-out detail.


    Fuck that.

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  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic I've Done Worse Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    Whoa, every 9 years?

    And here I thought he was just talking about a one time opt-out detail.


    Fuck that.
    That's pretty pathetic there buddy.

    Do you believe in a bodily resurrection or something and that you'll find yourself in Heaven without a kidney? Because "ewwww" as a reason to let somebody die is pretty shitty.

    Trogg wrote: »
    Not as positive as AIDS and cancer, but positive nonetheless.

    PSN: QuipFilter
  • FeralFeral Who needs a medical license when you've got style? Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    Actually what I'm talking about is one-time dissent or next-of-kin dissent may prevent organ donation.

    So if people really have a religious objection, their family can dissent on your behalf after death.

    But if nobody cares, then nobody cares.

    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
    the "no true scotch, man" fallacy.
  • ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited January 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    Whoa, every 9 years?

    And here I thought he was just talking about a one time opt-out detail.


    Fuck that.
    That's pretty pathetic there buddy.

    Do you believe in a bodily resurrection or something and that you'll find yourself in Heaven without a kidney? Because "ewwww" as a reason to let somebody die is pretty shitty.

    You honestly believe people have no right to keep their organs when they die?


    Tell me, is the only reason you and Feral allow the "opt-out" part of this system so it could have a better chance of passing through congress? Would you really support a system that lets NO ONE opt-out at all if you could?

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  • The CatThe Cat Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited January 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    Whoa, every 9 years?

    And here I thought he was just talking about a one time opt-out detail.


    Fuck that.
    That's pretty pathetic there buddy.

    Do you believe in a bodily resurrection or something and that you'll find yourself in Heaven without a kidney? Because "ewwww" as a reason to let somebody die is pretty shitty.

    You honestly believe people have no right to keep their organs when they die?

    That's not what he's arguing. Talk about things the rest of the thread is talking about, kthnx.

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  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic I've Done Worse Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    You honestly believe people have no right to keep their organs when they die?


    Tell me, is the only reason you and Feral allow the "opt-out" part of this system so it could have a better chance of passing through congress? Would you really support a system that lets NO ONE opt-out at all if you could?
    No, I don't think you have a fundamental right to your organs after you are dead. You're dead. Until we start giving immortal souls rights I don't really think that's an issue.

    And no, I would never force people to donate their organs if they really didn't want to simply as a matter of respect. I do think that if you have that strong an opinion that forcing you to read and then check a box is not an unreasonable request.

    t Feral, you're probably right but if this is bundled in with your first "adult" interaction with the government (getting a drivers license) I'd expect a lot of teenage douchebags to opt out and never reconsider.

    I suppose the family proviso would be sensible in an opt-out system. It pisses me off that we already have the same thing in our current opt-in system. Fucking families that have no respect for members wishes.

    Trogg wrote: »
    Not as positive as AIDS and cancer, but positive nonetheless.

    PSN: QuipFilter
  • FeralFeral Who needs a medical license when you've got style? Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    t Feral, you're probably right but if this is bundled in with your first "adult" interaction with the government (getting a drivers license) I'd expect a lot of teenage douchebags to opt out and never reconsider.

    Yeah that's true.

    I think I need to a look a little closer at how other countries do it. I understand that Australia is an opt-out system...

    ...and The Cat came back!
    Spoiler:

    Cat, do you know how it works in Aussieland?

    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
    the "no true scotch, man" fallacy.
  • ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited January 2009
    And no, I would never force people to donate their organs if they really didn't want to simply as a matter of respect. I do think that if you have that strong an opinion that forcing you to read and then check a box is not an unreasonable request.

    And yet, if you choose to take people's organs when they haven't made their wishes clear, you are basically doing exactly that, forcing the organs to be taken.


    Look man, I don't doubt that your system would save more lives. But sometimes, it's just not about saving lives.

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  • AdrienAdrien Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    You honestly believe people have no right to keep their organs when they die?

    Of course not. You can keep all the organs you can carry!

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  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic I've Done Worse Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    And no, I would never force people to donate their organs if they really didn't want to simply as a matter of respect. I do think that if you have that strong an opinion that forcing you to read and then check a box is not an unreasonable request.

    And yet, if you choose to take people's organs when they haven't made their wishes clear, you are basically doing exactly that, forcing the organs to be taken.


    Look man, I don't doubt that your system would save more lives. But sometimes, it's just not about saving lives.

    I expect adults to take responsibility for their actions and lack of action, yes. I also expect them to make those wishes they fervently want honored known, in the appropriate manner, when explicitly asked.

    t Feral: ARGH, that song is now in my head!

    Edit: To be perfectly clear I am envisioning a system where every adult would, at some point, have had a piece of paper with the choice outlined above on it and that the default would be donation. I suggest using Driver's licenses simply because of how ubiquitous they are. If you never choose to drive (or whatever this is linked to) I would find acceptable having their organs verboten barring other information as to their wishes.

    Trogg wrote: »
    Not as positive as AIDS and cancer, but positive nonetheless.

    PSN: QuipFilter
  • ANTVGM64ANTVGM64 Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    So is there a going rate for a kidney? Cause I mean, I'm a bit strapped for cash and wouldn't mind selling a kidney or a toe or even a couple of my fingers, even a piece of my liver.

  • QuidQuid The Fifth Horseman Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    And no, I would never force people to donate their organs if they really didn't want to simply as a matter of respect. I do think that if you have that strong an opinion that forcing you to read and then check a box is not an unreasonable request.

    And yet, if you choose to take people's organs when they haven't made their wishes clear, you are basically doing exactly that, forcing the organs to be taken.


    Look man, I don't doubt that your system would save more lives. But sometimes, it's just not about saving lives.
    Because this is pretty much off topic for this thread.

    PSN: allenquid
  • The CatThe Cat Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited January 2009
    Feral wrote: »
    t Feral, you're probably right but if this is bundled in with your first "adult" interaction with the government (getting a drivers license) I'd expect a lot of teenage douchebags to opt out and never reconsider.

    Yeah that's true.

    I think I need to a look a little closer at how other countries do it. I understand that Australia is an opt-out system...

    ...and The Cat came back!
    Spoiler:

    Cat, do you know how it works in Aussieland?
    Still opt-in, I'm pretty sure, but its not a simple checkbox on the driver's license anymore, you have to fill out a form and send it to a registry. There's also the Advanced Medical Directive system, which covers pretty much everything you want done with your body re: medical treatment (DNR's, don't want transfusions, organ donation, autopsy - and you can pick and choose which organs they can take, etc). That system is probably the most secure, because kin can't override it, its like a will for your bits.

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  • RchanenRchanen Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    If we treated organs like commodities they would be in greater supply than we have now.

    Possibly, but that extra supply would come largely from desperate people willing to place their health in jeopardy to get out of financial troubles, and that supply would go disproportionately to the wealthy. I'm not sure if we want to create a system in which the poor become organ harvesting plants for the wealthy.

    I do, because I want my SHADOWRUN dammit.

    Where my fucking wired reflexes?

    Toldo wrote:
    Preacher wrote:
    Skinny guys fight till their burger. Screw debates lets have Barack Obama and Willard Romney rumble in the mofoing jungle.
    Obama punches Romney.
    "Okay, now wait a minute. You've had your turn. Let me have a turn. Wait a minute," Romney says.
    Obama punches Romney.
  • RchanenRchanen Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    The Cat wrote: »
    Feral wrote: »
    t Feral, you're probably right but if this is bundled in with your first "adult" interaction with the government (getting a drivers license) I'd expect a lot of teenage douchebags to opt out and never reconsider.

    Yeah that's true.

    I think I need to a look a little closer at how other countries do it. I understand that Australia is an opt-out system...

    ...and The Cat came back!
    Spoiler:

    Cat, do you know how it works in Aussieland?
    Still opt-in, I'm pretty sure, but its not a simple checkbox on the driver's license anymore, you have to fill out a form and send it to a registry. There's also the Advanced Medical Directive system, which covers pretty much everything you want done with your body re: medical treatment (DNR's, don't want transfusions, organ donation, autopsy - and you can pick and choose which organs they can take, etc). That system is probably the most secure, because kin can't override it, its like a will for your bits.

    Spoiler:

    I'd be willing to donate my organs. But I'd demand my naughty bits be given mouth-to-mouth resuscitation.

    Toldo wrote:
    Preacher wrote:
    Skinny guys fight till their burger. Screw debates lets have Barack Obama and Willard Romney rumble in the mofoing jungle.
    Obama punches Romney.
    "Okay, now wait a minute. You've had your turn. Let me have a turn. Wait a minute," Romney says.
    Obama punches Romney.
  • SBoggartSBoggart Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Sounds like a gold digger..... Organ digger? What the hell do you call that? Whatever it is, it's twisted. It's his bodypart, he has the rights to it.

  • QuidQuid The Fifth Horseman Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    SBoggart wrote: »
    Sounds like a gold digger..... Organ digger? What the hell do you call that? Whatever it is, it's twisted. It's his bodypart, he has the rights to it.
    Not really, no. He gave it as a gift. He has exactly zero rights to it.

    PSN: allenquid
  • owijadowijad Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Okay, I get that you guys have moved back on topic, but this really can't be helped.

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  • SpeakerSpeaker Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    Quid wrote: »
    SBoggart wrote: »
    Sounds like a gold digger..... Organ digger? What the hell do you call that? Whatever it is, it's twisted. It's his bodypart, he has the rights to it.
    Not really, no. He gave it as a gift. He has exactly zero rights to it.

    "Stop harvesting me with your eyes!"

    Man, that line has already been quoted like ten times. I know it.

    Being walkers with the dawn and morning,
    Walkers with the sun and morning, we are not afraid of night,
    Nor days of gloom, nor darkness -
    Being walkers with the sun and morning.
  • Bliss 101Bliss 101 Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
  • The CatThe Cat Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited January 2009
    man, I'm going to save all these to my hard drive, and in 6 months I'm not going to be able to explain them to anyone...

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  • DetharinDetharin Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    First im with Cat, Pit full of scorpions.

    Second can we do it Babylon 5 style and whomever stays in the longest gets the kids? Will you follow me into pit of scorpions.

    Third it sucks, poor bastard. As previously stated had he let the bitch die he would be better offer.

    Fourth money is redeemed for goods and services. Gifts are not redeemed for goods and services.

    Fifth rule, and this is the important one. I mean really, really freaking important. Ready? When dealing with women, always, always, 100% of the time, without exception get payment in advance.

    If he was expecting her to spend the rest of his life with him in exchange for the kidney, then he damn sure should have made her spend the rest of her (admittedly short) life with him before he donated the thing. Because once you "give as a gift" woman are no longer obligated to give you anything they promised in exchange for "gifts".

    If I was kidnapped, woke up in a lab, told they were going to replace my vocal cords with those of Tony Jay, and lock me in a sound booth until the day I die I would look those bastards right in the eye and say "Alright you sons of bitches lets do this. This one is for the children."
  • The CatThe Cat Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited January 2009
    gee, deth, if only you'd thought to replace 'women' with 'people', at least you'd be coherently misanthropic. Instead, you're just a miserable misogynistic jackass.

    Stop posting, for the love of god.

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  • TofystedethTofystedeth veni, veneri, vamoosi Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    Sliver wrote: »
    Yes. He totally should have just let her die.

    Shitty motives can still result in positive outcomes. Ideally, he should've saved her life because he loved her even if she didn't want to be with him any more. Barring that, saving her life because he's a selfish doof is the next best thing. Still makes him a selfish doof, though.
    Well, actually, saving her life because he is in a position to save it would be the next best thing.
    Saving her life because of selfish doofery falls somewhere just behind that.

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  • WickerBasketWickerBasket Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Are we still doing the funny movie posters? Am I too late?

    Spoiler:

    "please get on point coward baby magets."

    PSN = Wicker86 ________ Gamertag = Wicker86
  • The Muffin ManThe Muffin Man Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    Quid wrote: »
    SBoggart wrote: »
    Sounds like a gold digger..... Organ digger? What the hell do you call that? Whatever it is, it's twisted. It's his bodypart, he has the rights to it.
    Not really, no. He gave it as a gift. He has exactly zero rights to it.
    And right now its' his WIFES kidney...so...

    And anyway, how does he expect to get this thing back? Wouldn't that kill her?

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  • QuidQuid The Fifth Horseman Registered User regular
    edited January 2009
    Quid wrote: »
    SBoggart wrote: »
    Sounds like a gold digger..... Organ digger? What the hell do you call that? Whatever it is, it's twisted. It's his bodypart, he has the rights to it.
    Not really, no. He gave it as a gift. He has exactly zero rights to it.
    And right now its' his WIFES kidney...so...

    And anyway, how does he expect to get this thing back? Wouldn't that kill her?
    It was already discussed, but he doesn't expect to get it back and probably doesn't expect to get any money for it either. He's just doing this to bring publicity to his situation since he thinks his wife's terrible woman keeping his kids from him.

    They're basically both terrible people.

    PSN: allenquid
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