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Who needed the Klan when you had randomly organized white mobs to lynch uppity negroes and riot through black communities? Then you had the vigilante groups that were the forebears of the Klan that waged campaigns of intimidation against blacks and Northerners.
Yup. Lynchings never happened in the North. Racism also doesn't exist up there.
:?:
Relevance?
This negates what I said how? Oh that's right, it doesn't. Just because bad things were happening up north doesn't mean atrocious shit wasn't happening in the south. And we're talking about the Confederacy, which was the South, so stop trying to change the fucking subject.
Also some stuff is considered 'Southern' that really has no right to be - like the KY Derby. It's in Louisville, which about as southern as St. Louis.
i'd much rather just let you have your opinion while shaking my head at the generalizations.
Actually no. They essentially didn't. And strawmen suck donkey dick.
QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
I think "the Confederacy sucked and being proud of it is nonsensical" and "the Confederate Flag is a symbol of terrible shit, who with any sense wants to be associated with it" are pretty decent generalizations. I don't, however, think those generalizations are applicable to the majority of Southerners.
Yeah when New England has two total lynchings during that time and both are of white guys, I feel fairly justified in saying lynchings essentially didn't happen in the North
QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
your opinion. im not gonna waste time trying to change it, you are pretty set in the confederate = evil, terrorist, traitor, slave owners, rapists and murderers....
Well that's a bit unfair because New England, at the time, did include Connecticut and New York.
But it's more unfair because the Union was bigger than New England.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:US_Secession_map_1865.svg
There's a key towards the bottom middle to explain the colors.
...wow. 91% of all lynchings have happened in the South. o_O
I had no idea that the difference was that huge.
Good idea. Trying to change the opinion of a black dude about the goodness (or lack thereof) of the Confederacy isn't a good use of anyone's time. I like how you castigate me for having unreasonable opinions, then don't even assign the proper opinions to me. For the record, people who supported the Confederacy certainly were traitors to the United States and enablers of slavery or slave owners. Murderers and rapists, sure, a small percentage of Confederates were. Terrorists? Absolutely, if they were involved in violence used to intimidate slaves and black people in the South. And I can't think of one good thing that happened thanks to the Confederacy. As for evil, a lot was done in the Confederacy and in the Confederacy's name, but I generally hesitate to call anyone evil. It's such a nebulous term that it tends to have very little useful meaning.
Because 9% think it's too high, and shouldn't be cut! 9% of respondents could not fully
get their arms around the question. There should be another box you can check for, "I
have utterly no idea what you're talking about. Please, God, don't ask for my input."
Nah, not much bitterness towards them. It might be because they didn't spend the subsequent 500 years grinding black people under their boot. Incidentally, this is probably why throwing out the whole "well Africans sold other Africans to the white slavers" is a poor way to deflect the conversation about American slavery and the actions of white people in perpetuating the institution.
Oh I'm sure he's positively thrilled about the existence of African tribal warfare--can't get enough of it. Jesus Christ, this is a stupid thing to say.
I hadn't really considered that angle, but now that I do, I feel even less bitterness. It's not like living in Africa is generally all that awesome, and many parts of the continent are still suffering the effects of tribal politics. Besides, they got it as badly, if not worse, from white people than American blacks did. I think the African slavers and their ancestors have probably paid their karmic debt by now, with interest.
Besides that, the slavery practiced in the Americas (and maybe Europe and Exodus) was unique, in that no other group made slavery heritable or racial, so that the Africans were actually selling the slaves under the assumption that it'd only last for ten years tops, an assumption that the Europeans quickly decided not to honor.
In addition to the Confederates being traitors, do we really need separate paid holidays for every specific war? Why not one for WWI or the War of 1812? We already have a day for every American soldier who ever died - Memorial Day. Maybe I'll hit up Vegas for the long weekend on Barbary Wars Memorial Day.
...to the shores of Tripoli...
20 on red, and where's that girl with my Long Island?
All my fuckin life I lived a normal fuckin life
Maybe you could, but that would even be more irrelevant.
Edit: Also I don't think that Brahmins could actually buy and sell untouchables. Maybe they could, I'm no expert.
All my fuckin life I lived a normal fuckin life
Well, the reason I even bother to bring it up in these conversations is because I love how the north/south slave debate totally gets recycled over and over while the Native Americans (to whom I have heritage in more than one strain) got fucked a lot more by the American people as a whole, but nobody gives a shit.
You really think that the African kings were such suckers that some Europeans came by and said "We're going to buy these people from you, and take them across the ocean, but we'll totally let them go, honest" and they believed them, and didn't figure it out even after none of them came back for two hundred years?
what you 'brought up' has nothing to do with american indian policy.
arguably the two were of equal badness.
I think being under the yoke of European colonialism may have distracted them a little.
European colonialism in africa didn't take off until after the slave trade was pretty much dead. Even as late as 1800 the europeans only had basically trading posts and bases along the coast. It was not until methods were developed for fighting malaria and tropical diseases that entire nations were brought under colonial rule, for the most part in the 1840s-1900s.
If you're too above the discussion to engage, you're free to not post.
And that's why it's OK to fly the Confederate flag.
A classic line of reasoning use in such all time favorites as "And that's why it's OK to be racist" and "And that's why slavery wasn't that bad." From the makers of "It doesn't count if you're in Another State" and "Just this Once" Rationalizations Inc
QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
Which is of course completely relevant to the discussion, yes siree!
Hey to be fair other States had their own methods of prejudice.
For instance here in good ol' California we basically just focused on Asians and Latinos.
This is in the same vein as "Hitler had a Jewish grandparent", right?