Most of the time, but not all the time, when I garrison a squad inside a building to help take out some orks, when I tell them to exit only half the squad appears and won't react at all to any move orders. I usually end up without enough people to finish the missions.
This happened to me on a few missions in campaign so I just stopped putting units in buildings.
Click find game...? Why would you need a tutorial for multiplayer exactly?
Is this a serious question or are you being sarcastic? Jumping into a multiplayer game after only doing campaign is like showing up for class without doing the reading and getting called on, and it going downhill from there. MP isn't exactly intuitive just starting out, it can be incredibly overwhelming, and though it's easy to say "play a lot of MP games and you'll figure it out" it's probably a turnoff to a lot of people.
Play a lot of AI skirmishes then? That way, at least, you don't embarass yourself too hard :P
I mean that's one way to go about it, but I don't think a tutorial that explains things like getting req, power, upgrading units, etc would do anything but help. Obviously they have more pressing balance issues to work out first, but it might be something to consider for the future.
Think about it - you go from controlling a maximum of 4-5 squads who you specialize between missions to this whole pop cap idea, specializing on the fly, and way more squads to manage. The mechanics of the game change, and there are 3 new races with units that you can't tell the difference between until you run your face into a brick wall in MP for a while (whether against the computer or other players).
MP has a relatively high barrier to entry. Most people here are obviously ok with that, but like I said it probably turns off a fair number of players.
I get what you're saying, but most people who pick this up are already RTS players anyways, so it kind of makes sense that the devs wouldn't put too high a priority on a tutorial.
MegaMek on
Is time a gift or punishment?
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
Yeah but you guys get guns with neat abilities. We get a gun that suppresses doing no damage and a shit AV gun that makes us sitting ducks.
I'm sorry you're not satisfied with your starting gun that takes down a guardian squad in seconds.
Or the fact that the Deff gun allows you to quickly suppress a whole army for your boys by allowing you to teleport to an area while already set-up.
Same for the Beamy Deff, allowing you to pop in and out with AV support if needed.
Really. I feel so bad for you.
You should. I'm not saying the deff gun is without merits (fuck the beamy gun tho.) I'd just like having the option of a gun that Didn't require setup so I could be mobile without feeling like my hero is worthless.
Sonelan on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
Probally not its 8am here and I've yet to sleep. I'd like the option of having a weapon upgrade that didn't require a setup time so I could take advantage of the mekboy's mobility from teleport without feeling like my hero isn't really contributing since his basic gun is so shit.
Sonelan on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
Most of the time, but not all the time, when I garrison a squad inside a building to help take out some orks, when I tell them to exit only half the squad appears and won't react at all to any move orders. I usually end up without enough people to finish the missions.
This happened to me on a few missions in campaign so I just stopped putting units in buildings.
Click find game...? Why would you need a tutorial for multiplayer exactly?
Is this a serious question or are you being sarcastic? Jumping into a multiplayer game after only doing campaign is like showing up for class without doing the reading and getting called on, and it going downhill from there. MP isn't exactly intuitive just starting out, it can be incredibly overwhelming, and though it's easy to say "play a lot of MP games and you'll figure it out" it's probably a turnoff to a lot of people.
It should probably tell you all you need to know about my general skill with these games that I never even thought of that. I'll give it another try tonight!
It never seems to do much of anything. I can plink away at a scout squad or slugga boy squad but anything bigger and the damage seems to become shit. I've had a warlock cap a VP and req point before getting down to half health then come rape my mekboy in the face.
Sonelan on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
edited March 2009
So you want a support hero to be an offensive hero?
I mean, he can:
Suppress
AI
AV
Throw highly damaging, suppressing mines through energy
Teleport
Disrupt a whole army (mega rumblah)
Make an infantry squad INVULNERABLE
Heal his units
So you want a support hero to be an offensive hero?
No but I'd like him to be able to contribute something on offense which he can't really do unless I either A) Take the Deff gun or Take mines and try to gib people with the make the mines all go in one place glitch.
Man I don't want him to do super damage. I just want a weapon upgrade I can use in conjunction with teleport without having to constantly setup or un-setup. Maybe something like the warp spiders filament thing where you can knock people down.
Sonelan on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
edited March 2009
But that's balancing his pros and cons.
If you give him a third option, it makes the other two completely useless. At least right now you have the problem of choice.
It's terrible advice. There is no scenario in which luring your opponent to your base would work or be a good idea. You are losing quite badly if they're in your base.
It seems to me that falling back to your base and having some additional healing and turret coverage would be better than letting your units get slaughtered, especially if the attacking force is strong enough to beat your forces, but not strong enough to take out your base. You also have the benefit of instantly available reinforcements.
I agree that if you've got nowhere to fall back to other than your base, you're screwed. Still, it's the best option in such a situation.
Well apparently I'm a "tank rush noob" and a "full tac spam strat loser." my opponent then switched to his native language and launched into an all-caps tirade that lasted a couple of minutes. I'm pretty sure "puta" means "bitch."
I don't know how useful they are in 1v1's, but they are really not worth it in 3v3's. They die really fast and accomplish very little. Rarely do I see a reason to buy a dreadnought instead of another Tac squad or a wraithlord instead of a falcon.
Against space marines, I don't even bother building vehicles
I get upset, but I just go in a corner a cry for a little while. There's no need to smack people. I don't want to be upset and look like an idiot on the internet at the same time. There's only so much misery the human soul can endure.
Yeah I thought it meant whore too, but google translate can't decide between slut, bitch or whore. I'll assume he meant it in the broadest possible terms and that I am in fact all three. I'm an overachiever like that.
Are you talking about choice between ork heroes or weapons? Because as it is people only seem to use the deff gun. If its a choice about heroes people would still play the kommando and warboss. The warboss in particular since he becomes a beast. And I seem to be one of the few that like the kommando.
You know, for as much as the GFWL voice chat makes you sound like Microsoft Sam and has no PTT function, it has yielded some pretty funny stuff from people who have no idea that it's on. I played a 3v3 where the guy's cat kept jumping into his lap, and he keeps yelling for his girlfriend to come take it away. Must have happened 6 times during the match. Between the cat divebombing his lap episodes, he was desperately trying to convince his girlfriend to get him a sandwich. No luck. When we were all sitting at the score screen, he goes
"Augh, god! This freakin CAT, get it away, it's FREEZING, it's stealing all my heat!"
So I type in chat
"Yeah, get that stupid heatsink away!"
Him: "....Oh god...you can hear me, can't you...?"
Me: "Every word."
Him: "Fo....for how long?"
Me: "Whole match."
Him: "....."
Me: "You ever get that sandwich?"
*So-and-so has left the game*
I hate it when my roommate's cat jumps on my lap in the middle of a match, or just jumps on the desk and walks in front of the screen. She's such a little bitch and only ever does it when I'm trying to focus on the game.
I hate it when my roommate's cat jumps on my lap in the middle of a match, or just jumps on the desk and walks in front of the screen. She's such a little bitch and only ever does it when I'm trying to focus on the game.
Cats are good at finding out where your attention is focused.
Cats are good at finding out where your attention is focused.
Then they block it from you.
This. My cat knows when I start matches and will show up, without fail, during the load screen, leaving me to scream "if you had been here 30 SECONDS AGO I could have helped you. WHY DO YOU DO THIS!?!?"
I disabled the GFWL voice thing because I was sick of being bombarded with static for the whole match from people with badly set up mics, but I do miss hearing parents shouting at their kids to take the trash out. It almost made the ear-bleeding times worth it, almost.
I find it amazing that Microsoft hasn't figured out that people don't like to have their mics on all the time, and still hasn't added a push to talk option.
Just becuase that's how your stupid console works doesn't mean that's how it should work on the PC.
Then again that basically sums up most of the problems with GFWL.
I beat him last night on normal. It was pretty irritating. My army is pretty badass so I roll over most missions at this point, but doing the attack and retreat nonsense for a half hour was less than exciting.
I just don't think the game is really built for that kind of encounter. Cover can't be used, your guys aren't responsive enough to avoid aoe damage, all in all the bosses are the least fun part of the campaign.
I beat him last night on normal. It was pretty irritating. My army is pretty badass so I roll over most missions at this point, but doing the attack and retreat nonsense for a half hour was less than exciting.
I just don't think the game is really built for that kind of encounter. Cover can't be used, your guys aren't responsive enough to avoid aoe damage, all in all the bosses are the least fun part of the campaign.
My halo FC with res gear tanked him easily, the dread spent most of the fight in repair mode since it couldn't avoid the aoe and my devs kept getting chased around by the summoned crap. Cyrus just ran around tossing grenades. My big problem with these kinds of fights are that they have little to no tactics involved, it's mostly a reaction based attrition match. Giving the Avatar 300,000hp is completely and utterly pointless. All it does is lengthen an annoying encounter which is biased against slow moving/fragile ranged units.
Starting my Primarch run now and I am not doing the warboss or the avatar. I don't need more than 1 suit of termie armor anyway since I hate the assault squad.
...at getting drawing everything's attention and getting mowed down? at getting supressed while their jumppacks are on cooldown? at getting torn to bits while trying to tank a boss?
My experiences with them haven't been fun. They don't tank as well as the fc, they don't damage as well as devs and they aren't as good against entrenched positions as Cyrus. Then there's Hellfire Barrage...
I can see someone using them if they didn't spec their fc into melee or if they have no idea what Cyrus is capable of.
If I had any complaint with his weapons it's that you can't return to his basic gun after buying the others.
I do not like the Beamy Deffgun at all however. He can hunt tanks alright but it's frustrating to use a weapon that requires setup against units that can run at you and un-setup you.
Thats why you have jump, but as cake can tell you, the tank will still win.
...at getting drawing everything's attention and getting mowed down? at getting supressed while their jumppacks are on cooldown? at getting torn to bits while trying to tank a boss?
My experiences with them haven't been fun. They don't tank as well as the fc, they don't damage as well as devs and they aren't as good against entrenched positions as Cyrus. Then there's Hellfire Barrage...
I can see someone using them if they didn't spec their fc into melee or if they have no idea what Cyrus is capable of.
They're pretty good at remaining completely invulnerable 90% of the time thanks to a tiny cooldown on their teleport.
My assault terminators could fight off 80% of an entire wave of a defence mission on primarch just by using teleport whenever it was avilable.
Rami on
Steam / Xbox Live: WSDX NNID: W-S-D-X 3DS FC: 2637-9461-8549
It's terrible advice. There is no scenario in which luring your opponent to your base would work or be a good idea. You are losing quite badly if they're in your base.
It seems to me that falling back to your base and having some additional healing and turret coverage would be better than letting your units get slaughtered, especially if the attacking force is strong enough to beat your forces, but not strong enough to take out your base. You also have the benefit of instantly available reinforcements.
I agree that if you've got nowhere to fall back to other than your base, you're screwed. Still, it's the best option in such a situation.
In what situation is your opponent going to purposefully follow you back there to get shot at by turrets unless they have destroyed your map control and know they can crush you under their heel with things the turrets can't enjoy the pleasure of killing?
If I had any complaint with his weapons it's that you can't return to his basic gun after buying the others.
I do not like the Beamy Deffgun at all however. He can hunt tanks alright but it's frustrating to use a weapon that requires setup against units that can run at you and un-setup you.
Thats why you have jump, but as cake can tell you, the tank will still win.
It still sounds like a support hero to me. You're not supposed to expect a brightlance to win in that fight and it costs more.
Goomba on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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BethrynUnhappiness is MandatoryRegistered Userregular
edited March 2009
If you teleport backwards to escape melee, you end up facing the wrong way. Then you have to tear down, and if you still want to do damage to the people who are now behind you, and the melee have given up, perhaps you can spend another second setting up... if the tank/horde hasn't reached you again.
I fully support giving the Mekboy a third weapon to add some sort of mobile utility to his arsenal. Maybe a big wrench so that when he teleports in behind emplacements, he can actually thwack them rather than just kicking in their shins.
Posts
This happened to me on a few missions in campaign so I just stopped putting units in buildings.
Is this a serious question or are you being sarcastic? Jumping into a multiplayer game after only doing campaign is like showing up for class without doing the reading and getting called on, and it going downhill from there. MP isn't exactly intuitive just starting out, it can be incredibly overwhelming, and though it's easy to say "play a lot of MP games and you'll figure it out" it's probably a turnoff to a lot of people.
I mean that's one way to go about it, but I don't think a tutorial that explains things like getting req, power, upgrading units, etc would do anything but help. Obviously they have more pressing balance issues to work out first, but it might be something to consider for the future.
Think about it - you go from controlling a maximum of 4-5 squads who you specialize between missions to this whole pop cap idea, specializing on the fly, and way more squads to manage. The mechanics of the game change, and there are 3 new races with units that you can't tell the difference between until you run your face into a brick wall in MP for a while (whether against the computer or other players).
MP has a relatively high barrier to entry. Most people here are obviously ok with that, but like I said it probably turns off a fair number of players.
Or the fact that the Deff gun allows you to quickly suppress a whole army for your boys by allowing you to teleport to an area while already set-up.
Same for the Beamy Deff, allowing you to pop in and out with AV support if needed.
Really. I feel so bad for you.
You should. I'm not saying the deff gun is without merits (fuck the beamy gun tho.) I'd just like having the option of a gun that Didn't require setup so I could be mobile without feeling like my hero is worthless.
Probally not its 8am here and I've yet to sleep. I'd like the option of having a weapon upgrade that didn't require a setup time so I could take advantage of the mekboy's mobility from teleport without feeling like my hero isn't really contributing since his basic gun is so shit.
What the fuck are you talking about.
It should probably tell you all you need to know about my general skill with these games that I never even thought of that. I'll give it another try tonight!
STEAM
It never seems to do much of anything. I can plink away at a scout squad or slugga boy squad but anything bigger and the damage seems to become shit. I've had a warlock cap a VP and req point before getting down to half health then come rape my mekboy in the face.
I mean, he can:
Suppress
AI
AV
Throw highly damaging, suppressing mines through energy
Teleport
Disrupt a whole army (mega rumblah)
Make an infantry squad INVULNERABLE
Heal his units
AND you want him to be very damaging on his own?
I just think you want one hero to do too much.
No but I'd like him to be able to contribute something on offense which he can't really do unless I either A) Take the Deff gun or Take mines and try to gib people with the make the mines all go in one place glitch.
Man I don't want him to do super damage. I just want a weapon upgrade I can use in conjunction with teleport without having to constantly setup or un-setup. Maybe something like the warp spiders filament thing where you can knock people down.
If you give him a third option, it makes the other two completely useless. At least right now you have the problem of choice.
It seems to me that falling back to your base and having some additional healing and turret coverage would be better than letting your units get slaughtered, especially if the attacking force is strong enough to beat your forces, but not strong enough to take out your base. You also have the benefit of instantly available reinforcements.
I agree that if you've got nowhere to fall back to other than your base, you're screwed. Still, it's the best option in such a situation.
oh internets, you are funny sometimes.
I don't get people who become so upset over a game
I don't know how useful they are in 1v1's, but they are really not worth it in 3v3's. They die really fast and accomplish very little. Rarely do I see a reason to buy a dreadnought instead of another Tac squad or a wraithlord instead of a falcon.
Against space marines, I don't even bother building vehicles
Yeah I thought it meant whore too, but google translate can't decide between slut, bitch or whore. I'll assume he meant it in the broadest possible terms and that I am in fact all three. I'm an overachiever like that.
"Augh, god! This freakin CAT, get it away, it's FREEZING, it's stealing all my heat!"
So I type in chat
"Yeah, get that stupid heatsink away!"
Him: "....Oh god...you can hear me, can't you...?"
Me: "Every word."
Him: "Fo....for how long?"
Me: "Whole match."
Him: "....."
Me: "You ever get that sandwich?"
*So-and-so has left the game*
Cats are good at finding out where your attention is focused.
Then they block it from you.
This. My cat knows when I start matches and will show up, without fail, during the load screen, leaving me to scream "if you had been here 30 SECONDS AGO I could have helped you. WHY DO YOU DO THIS!?!?"
I disabled the GFWL voice thing because I was sick of being bombarded with static for the whole match from people with badly set up mics, but I do miss hearing parents shouting at their kids to take the trash out. It almost made the ear-bleeding times worth it, almost.
Just becuase that's how your stupid console works doesn't mean that's how it should work on the PC.
Then again that basically sums up most of the problems with GFWL.
Currently playing: GW2 and TSW
I just don't think the game is really built for that kind of encounter. Cover can't be used, your guys aren't responsive enough to avoid aoe damage, all in all the bosses are the least fun part of the campaign.
My halo FC with res gear tanked him easily, the dread spent most of the fight in repair mode since it couldn't avoid the aoe and my devs kept getting chased around by the summoned crap. Cyrus just ran around tossing grenades. My big problem with these kinds of fights are that they have little to no tactics involved, it's mostly a reaction based attrition match. Giving the Avatar 300,000hp is completely and utterly pointless. All it does is lengthen an annoying encounter which is biased against slow moving/fragile ranged units.
Starting my Primarch run now and I am not doing the warboss or the avatar. I don't need more than 1 suit of termie armor anyway since I hate the assault squad.
Currently playing: GW2 and TSW
you wont beat him without the cheese
I think Wisconsin should be the new state for this kind of talk.
The Avarar on Primarch is Wisconsin.
I propose that grimdark be made a real word, and the futuristic world of Warhammer 40,000 will always be referred to as such.
...at getting drawing everything's attention and getting mowed down? at getting supressed while their jumppacks are on cooldown? at getting torn to bits while trying to tank a boss?
My experiences with them haven't been fun. They don't tank as well as the fc, they don't damage as well as devs and they aren't as good against entrenched positions as Cyrus. Then there's Hellfire Barrage...
I can see someone using them if they didn't spec their fc into melee or if they have no idea what Cyrus is capable of.
Currently playing: GW2 and TSW
I do not like the Beamy Deffgun at all however. He can hunt tanks alright but it's frustrating to use a weapon that requires setup against units that can run at you and un-setup you.
Thats why you have jump, but as cake can tell you, the tank will still win.
They're pretty good at remaining completely invulnerable 90% of the time thanks to a tiny cooldown on their teleport.
My assault terminators could fight off 80% of an entire wave of a defence mission on primarch just by using teleport whenever it was avilable.
In what situation is your opponent going to purposefully follow you back there to get shot at by turrets unless they have destroyed your map control and know they can crush you under their heel with things the turrets can't enjoy the pleasure of killing?
I fully support giving the Mekboy a third weapon to add some sort of mobile utility to his arsenal. Maybe a big wrench so that when he teleports in behind emplacements, he can actually thwack them rather than just kicking in their shins.