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The Wait Is Over

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    CalliusCallius Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    uh, what

    it just means both black and white ancestry

    again, mestizo is in no more racist than mulatto
    Pip, you do know that the word "mulatto" comes from the word "mule," yes?

    It is actually pretty racist.

    Callius on
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    EdcrabEdcrab Actually a hack Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    I am a deluded lovable douchebag thank you very much

    God I love your delusional douchebagity

    Edcrab on
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    laughingfuzzballlaughingfuzzball Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    TheStig wrote: »
    are we allowed to say "mulatto"?

    is that an okay word?
    if you're vaguely racist yeah!

    What? No good?
    larry-david-pic.jpg

    it's also how hiro describes himself in snowcrash. and nothing he does is wrong

    I have this theory that Snow Crash actually takes place somewhere between 1998 and 2005 and follows the mostly mundane exploits of an aging West-cost weeaboo colored by an all-pervasive delusion.

    oh my god

    I know, your mind is totally blown, right?

    laughingfuzzball on
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    CalliusCallius Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    So, I've never read Snow Crash, but I just read the summary and description of characters.

    God damn that sounds fucking retarded.

    Callius on
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    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Callius wrote: »
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    uh, what

    it just means both black and white ancestry

    again, mestizo is in no more racist than mulatto
    Pip, you do know that the word "mulatto" comes from the word "mule," yes?

    It is actually pretty racist.

    that's a myth and the etymology is extremely unclear
    The etymology of the term is uncertain. It may be derived from the Portuguese and Spanish word mulato (a small mule), which itself is derived from mula, mule; from Old Spanish; from Latin mūlus), by analogy with the mule, which is the hybrid offspring of a horse and a donkey.[3][4][5]

    Some dictionaries and scholarly works trace the word's origins to the Arabic term muwallad, which means "a person of mixed ancestry". Muwallad literally means, "born, begotten, produced, generated; brought up, raised; born and raised among Arabs" (but not of pure Arab blood). Muwallad is derived from the root word WaLaD (Arabic: ولد direct Arabic transliteration: waw, lam, dal). Walad means, "descendant, offspring, scion; child; son; boy; young animal, young one." Muwallad referred to the offspring of Arab men and foreign, non-Arab women. The term muwalladin is still used in contemporary Arabic to describe children of Arab fathers and foreign mothers. According to Julio Izquierdo Labrado[6], the nineteenth-century linguist Leopoldo Eguilaz y Yanguas, as well as some Arabian sources[7] muwallad is the etymological origin of mulato. These sources specify that mulato would have been derived directly from muwallad independently of the related word muladí, a term that was applied to Iberian Christians who had converted to Islam during the Moorish domination of Iberia in the Middle Ages.

    However, the Real Academia Española (Spanish Royal Academy) casts doubt on the muwallad theory. It states, "The term mulata is documented in our diachronic data bank in 1472 and is used in reference to livestock mules in Documentacion medieval de la Corte del Justicia de Ganaderos de Zaragoza, whereas muladí (from mullawadí) does not appear until the 18th century, according to [Joan] Corominas".[8]

    PiptheFair on
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    KazhiimKazhiim __BANNED USERS regular
    edited July 2009
    maybe he just won the mule lotto

    shit was up to like six or seven mules last I looked

    Kazhiim on
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    EdcrabEdcrab Actually a hack Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Callius wrote: »
    So, I've never read Snow Crash, but I just read the summary and description of characters.

    God damn that sounds fucking retarded.

    Well a lot of things do sound retarded in summary but might be pretty good when elaborated upon

    Edcrab on
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    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    that doesn't look very unclear to me Pip

    Centipede Damascus on
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    CalliusCallius Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Pip, read the last paragraph of what you just posted. It says, in no uncertain terms, that the word "mulata" was used to describe mules in 1472. Much closer to use than Muwallad and much closer in english.

    Callius on
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    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    however, the treatment of mulattos was really racist

    but, spanish treatment of everybody was pretty damn racist

    PiptheFair on
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    CalliusCallius Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Edcrab wrote: »
    Well a lot of things do sound retarded in summary but might be pretty good when elaborated upon
    He's a samurai sword weilding pizza delivery boy who works for the mafia and can hack computers.

    ....

    COME THE FUCK ON!

    Callius on
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    EdcrabEdcrab Actually a hack Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    For example, Pip might sound pretty retarded in summary

    Edcrab on
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    EdcrabEdcrab Actually a hack Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Callius wrote: »
    Edcrab wrote: »
    Well a lot of things do sound retarded in summary but might be pretty good when elaborated upon
    He's a samurai sword weilding pizza delivery boy who works for the mafia and can hack computers.

    ....

    COME THE FUCK ON!

    Yes I know but I guess I'm projecting because there is no way of summarising my projects without them sounding even more terrible

    Edcrab on
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    CalliusCallius Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Oh god, Natasha's watching the video about this now.

    Make the pain go away.

    Callius on
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    KazhiimKazhiim __BANNED USERS regular
    edited July 2009
    I've never heard anybody be offended by the term mulatto

    In fact, I'm pretty sure a lot of people don't even know what it means. It has a racist origin, but I can't think of any time I've seen some white guy be all "THEM GOT-DAMNED MULATTOS ARE TAKIN' ALL ER JERBS"

    Kazhiim on
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    CalliusCallius Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Edcrab wrote: »
    Yes I know but I guess I'm projecting because there is no way of summarising my projects without them sounding even more terrible
    well, probably because they are.

    Callius on
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    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Callius wrote: »
    Pip, read the last paragraph of what you just posted. It says, in no uncertain terms, that the word "mulata" was used to describe mules in 1472. Much closer to use than Muwallad and much closer in english.

    the term is used to talk about mules in 1472

    not mixed-race
    and is used in reference to livestock mules

    the term mules, is used to reference mules

    gasp

    PiptheFair on
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    KazhiimKazhiim __BANNED USERS regular
    edited July 2009
    also yeah I read snow crash and it's not a very interesting book

    people are all "OH MAH GAH HE PREDICTED SECOND LIFE AND STUFF" but come on this was in 1992 it's not like he wrote brave new world

    Kazhiim on
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    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Callius wrote: »
    Edcrab wrote: »
    Well a lot of things do sound retarded in summary but might be pretty good when elaborated upon
    He's a samurai sword weilding pizza delivery boy who works for the mafia and can hack computers.

    ....

    COME THE FUCK ON!

    it's not like it's a serious story

    Centipede Damascus on
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    CalliusCallius Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    the term is used to talk about mules in 1472

    not mixed-race



    the term mules, is used to reference mules

    gasp
    Yes, and then it is transfered onto people.

    Do you not see how that works? From Mule to Mulata to Mulatto. It's pretty much one of the more simplistic etymological routes taken.

    Callius on
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    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    yeah, do not attempt to take snow crash seriously and only read the first 2/3s

    PiptheFair on
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    Peter EbelPeter Ebel CopenhagenRegistered User regular
    edited July 2009
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    Callius wrote: »
    Pip, read the last paragraph of what you just posted. It says, in no uncertain terms, that the word "mulata" was used to describe mules in 1472. Much closer to use than Muwallad and much closer in english.

    the term is used to talk about mules in 1472

    not mixed-race
    and is used in reference to livestock mules

    the term mules, is used to reference mules

    gasp

    And now we call a certain class of people mules.

    Peter Ebel on
    Fuck off and die.
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    laughingfuzzballlaughingfuzzball Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Callius wrote: »
    So, I've never read Snow Crash, but I just read the summary and description of characters.

    God damn that sounds fucking retarded.

    It's even more retarded than it sounds.

    laughingfuzzball on
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    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Callius wrote: »
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    the term is used to talk about mules in 1472

    not mixed-race



    the term mules, is used to reference mules

    gasp
    Yes, and then it is transfered onto people.

    Do you not see how that works? From Mule to Mulata to Mulatto. It's pretty much one of the more simplistic etymological routes taken.

    except there is no exact documentation of where it transferred to people and the mullawad theory is much more logical, considering the muslim spanish were far closer to northern africa and means mixed-race

    PiptheFair on
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    CalliusCallius Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    It was like when I was reading Neuromancer. The entire time I was like "this is some pretty chewy bubblegum."

    Callius on
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    AbracadanielAbracadaniel Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    The crazy organic computer orgy in Diamond Age had me scratching my head something fierce.

    Abracadaniel on
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    PonyPony Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    fuckin teenagers

    light em on fire

    Pony on
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    EdcrabEdcrab Actually a hack Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Callius wrote: »
    Edcrab wrote: »
    Yes I know but I guess I'm projecting because there is no way of summarising my projects without them sounding even more terrible
    well, probably because they are.

    My latest project is called Callius and it is about a protagonist who is so goddamn terrible that everyone always talks about how terrible they are

    He's a pizza-wielding hacker who works for samurais and can deliver the mafia

    Edcrab on
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    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    hehe wad

    PiptheFair on
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    KazhiimKazhiim __BANNED USERS regular
    edited July 2009
    let's not forget the part where the sumerians wrote a language-code that is the equivalent of knowing a person's true name or something

    Kazhiim on
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    I'd Fuck Chuck Lidell UpI'd Fuck Chuck Lidell Up Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Callius wrote: »
    So, I've never read Snow Crash, but I just read the summary and description of characters.

    God damn that sounds fucking retarded.
    it sounded awful to me too

    it's actually amazing

    I'd Fuck Chuck Lidell Up on
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    CalliusCallius Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Pip, you think that Muwallad is closer to Mulatto than the word Mulato is?

    Even though the Islamic influence upon the Spanish had dwindled by the time the term became used, mind you.

    Nah, I don't buy that. That's like ascribing the Nordic heritage of English to the Normans instead of the Saxons. Don't make a god damn lick of sense.

    Callius on
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    KazhiimKazhiim __BANNED USERS regular
    edited July 2009
    modern sci-fi has to present a lot on the sleeve in order to convince me that it isn't terrible

    Kazhiim on
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    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Callius wrote: »
    Pip, you think that Muwallad is closer to Mulatto than the word Mulato is?

    Even though the Islamic influence upon the Spanish had dwindled by the time the term became used, mind you.

    Nah, I don't buy that. That's like ascribing the Nordic heritage of English to the Normans instead of the Saxons. Don't make a god damn lick of sense.

    there is still an enormously strong muslim influence in southern spain, and it was very strong in the south in the 1700s

    and even ignoring the origins

    when in your life have you heard mulatto used as a pejorative ever, instead of just a designation of racial heritage

    EDIT: and your analogy hardly works because there are strong ties in english to both the normans and the saxons

    PiptheFair on
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    PonyPony Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    i have never personally heard the term mulatto used as a derogatory term by anyone

    in fact

    i know two separate people who self-identify as mulattos.

    both of which are half-black, half-white

    callius, sometimes man

    sometimes i wonder how you ultra-liberal dudes don't have like high blood pressure problems

    Pony on
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    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    what the fuck is this we are having a legitimate debate without resorting to name calling

    cal, you are a busta

    PiptheFair on
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    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    I don't know, I could swear I've hear mulatto referred to as a perjorative

    but that might have been in a movie

    Centipede Damascus on
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    MeissnerdMeissnerd Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    white people findin' new eggshells to avoid

    Meissnerd on
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    AntimatterAntimatter Devo Was Right Gates of SteelRegistered User regular
    edited July 2009
    are you people talking about cookies in here

    Antimatter on
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    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    man I want some cookies

    PiptheFair on
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